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ruggerson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 10:10 PM
Original message
Top gay in the administration says ENDA, DADT, and DOMA have no chance at this point
Edited on Sun Jun-14-09 10:22 PM by ruggerson
http://www.americablog.com/2009/06/top-gay-in-administration-says-enda.html

(I don't know if I would have written the headline as is, but I"m just reporting it):

"Top gay in the administration says ENDA, DADT, and DOMA have no chance at this point (and then, he lies to boot)

John Berry, the openly gay head of the Office of Personnel Management, did an interview today with Kerry Eleveld of the Advocate. It's horrifying. I have to parse it for you. I'm simply astounded that they let him speak publicly, and that he let himself be used like this.

1. Berry suggests that Obama may wait until his second term to do anything on gay rights.


BERRY: Now, I’m not going to pledge -- and nor is the president -- that this is going to be done by some certain date. The pledge and the promise is that, this will be done before the sun sets on this administration – our goal is to have this entire agenda accomplished and enacted into law so that it is secure.

THE ADVOCATE: Does that include a second term? A lot of people have talked about DOMA being pushed back until a second term.

BERRY: I say this in a broad sense -- our goal is to get this done on this administration’s watch.


2. The president does not have the option to oppose existing law, at all, no exceptions, zero, nothing -- Berry claims. That's a flat out lie, as we showed earlier with the essay by former Clinton White House special assistant Richard Socarides.


BERRY: This president took a solemn oath to uphold the Constitution of the United States and he does not get to decide and choose which laws he enforces. He has to enforce the laws that have been enacted appropriately and that he has inherited. It would be wrong for me or any of our community to advise him to lie or to shirk his responsibility. He’s doing his job.


The president can ask DOJ to oppose laws in cases where there are important political and social issues at stake. Period. We've proven that they're lying about this, it's no longer debatable.

Oh, and where in the Constitution does it say that the president is required to compare our marriages to incest and pedophilia? We still haven't heard an explanation for that one. Nor have we heard an apology.

3. Did you catch how Berry said, above, that if we asked the president to file a brief opposing DOMA, we'd be asking him to "lie"? (First off, Berry admits that Obama owns the brief - so no more of this, "it was the lawyers" - it's Obama.) Anyway, so asking Obama to oppose DOMA in the brief would be asking him to "lie." What the hell is that supposed to mean? You mean the president was telling the truth when his brief claimed that gay marriage is like incest? He actually believes that? When the president claimed that Loving v. Virginia has nothing to do with our battle for marriage equality, he was saying he really believes that somehow the civil rights battle of African-Americans is different, better, than ours? Obama really believes that it's unfair to ask straight taxpayers to pay for our spousal benefits when we already pay for theirs? Obama thinks DOMA doesn't discriminate against gays? That it doesn't deny us benefits? That it's good for America in these tight budget times?

We're now to believe that Obama actually agrees with the bigoted crap that the White House let the DOJ put in that hateful brief? WTF?

4. We shouldn't be bothering Obama with our pesky complaints, we should be busy rallying votes for overturning DOMA on the Hill:He has made clear that he stands for the repeal of DOMA. It will be part of this administration’s agenda to accomplish that act. We ought not waste energy and angst attacking him when we should be focusing the energy and effort on getting 218 votes in the house and 60 votes in the Senate, and that’s where we ought to target the energy and the strength of this community and this president is with us, this is our agenda and it’s his agenda.Yes, we should be lobbying Congress over DOMA. But what about YOU? What do you plan to do about DOMA? All we've heard is that the president still supports repeal, but we haven't heard one thing about him lifting a finger to help? Writing a brief detailing why DOMA is good for the country does not help us convince Congress to repeal it.

5. And best of all, the White House, Berry tells us, thinks we currently have no chance of getting ENDA, DADT or DOMA. Whoopee!


The Advocate: And what about “don’t ask, don’t tell,” is that being pushed back?

Berry: We don’t have the votes to do Hate Crimes right now, we don’t have the votes to do ENDA, how are we going to get “don’t ask, don’t tell?


Yes, how are we going to get Don't ask Don't Tell? Clearly the White House doesn't think we stand a chance.

Anybody still think these people are committed to doing something, anything, to help us secure our civil rights?"
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rcrush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 10:19 PM
Response to Original message
1. That headline is a little lol.
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ruggerson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 10:20 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. indeed it is
:)
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QC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 10:25 PM
Response to Original message
3. "Obama may wait until his second term to do anything on gay rights."
If he keeps betraying loyal constituencies, there won't be a second term.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 10:45 PM
Response to Reply #3
17. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
donco6 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 10:52 PM
Response to Reply #17
23. "First" opportunity?
Where've you been?
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WillParkinson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 11:21 PM
Response to Reply #17
36. Cut and run?
Like Mr. Obama has done with his campaign pledges to the Gay and Lesbian community?

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liquid diamond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 11:27 PM
Response to Reply #17
42. I've been saying this for weeks. If they believe things are bad under
Obama, think of how much love and support they'll get from a Republican president. You remember how Bush embraced the gay community, right?

:sarcasm:


It's not like Obama has abandoned his pledge to be an advocate for the gay community, he just has other pressing priorities. Oh, please spare me the walking and chewing bubble gum at the same time analogy. Our president has a lot on his plate.
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imdjh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 11:55 PM
Response to Reply #42
47. "Where ya gonna go?"
I realize this is your analysis and not your brag, so don't take this personally - I don't give a damn about Clinton or JFK or Franklin Roosevelt or anyone who has come before. This is about Obama.
I have had enough. Telling me "second term" doesn't cut it anymore. Where am I going to go? Same place I have always gone- to work, to dinner, to bed, to work, to dinner, to bed. I'm not giving my all on a maybe ever again. Fool me once.
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rcrush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-15-09 12:37 AM
Response to Reply #47
50. I dont like that response either.
I mean just because the establishment only presents you with two options during the election doesnt mean you have to take it.
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donco6 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-15-09 07:33 AM
Response to Reply #42
57. Yeah, we know. We've heard this lame excuse a hundred times.
And it's no more effective than the first time.
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imdjh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 11:55 PM
Response to Reply #17
48. check the numbers from the last election, yes... we.... can tank Obama in 2012.
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BzaDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-15-09 04:48 AM
Response to Reply #48
53. Go for it.
If you somehow succeed (and believe me, you won't), you'll be running back to the Dem party so quickly that you would vote for Ben Nelson if he were our nominee in 2016 (just like Nader's vote share got cut in ten from 2000 to 2004).

The way to move the party to the left is to win primaries. The sooner people realize that the choices in an election are between the winners of primaries, and not some imaginary viable third choice, the better.
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Sapphocrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-15-09 01:15 AM
Response to Reply #17
51. Would you really like that? n/t
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-15-09 01:43 AM
Response to Reply #17
52. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
BzaDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-15-09 04:50 AM
Response to Reply #52
54. In case you didn't notice, the poster was replying to someone who was threatening not to vote D.
Edited on Mon Jun-15-09 04:50 AM by BzaDem
No, it wasn't explicit, but that doesn't make it any less obvious.
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NMMNG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-15-09 07:04 AM
Response to Reply #54
56. I know very well what he was saying
And I'm tired of the threats, browbeating and other BS. "Yeah this candidate sucks but s/he's better than the Republican" just isn't good enough any more. Anybody who wants my vote has to earn it from now on.
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QC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-15-09 09:06 AM
Response to Reply #56
59. They want us to be the Log Cabin Democrats.
No.
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theHandpuppet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-15-09 06:09 AM
Response to Reply #3
55. Riiiiight
As if a lame duck President would be able to push through an entire list of civil rights legislation for GLBT citizens. If we have to wait around for a second term, it will just translate into 8 years of nothin'.
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cliffordu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 10:29 PM
Response to Original message
4. ...
Edited on Sun Jun-14-09 10:31 PM by cliffordu
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ruggerson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 10:35 PM
Response to Reply #4
7. I emailed the WH starting a month before the brief was released
I also posted in GD-P that a brief was coming down and we should all email the WH to ask the President to NOT have his administration take a stand for DOMA.

There wasn't, uh, how shall I put this, much interest in my post.
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rpannier Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 10:43 PM
Response to Reply #7
15. The reason for that is simple
Why bother getting ahead of the curve and letting the administration know how you feel, when you can spend countless hours bitching on a web site about how Obama and his administration hate Gays
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cliffordu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 10:46 PM
Response to Reply #7
19. I missed that, I have been in and out lately....
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ruggerson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 10:38 PM
Response to Reply #4
11. why'd you scrub your post clifford?
now my response is hanging out there twisting in the wind. :)
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cliffordu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 10:45 PM
Response to Reply #11
16. I misread it......And I have been on kind of a hair trigger lately and wanted
to give a reasoned supportive response, instead of something that could be considered snark....

(I have a relative in hospice and am a wreck....)...

Great post by the way....
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ruggerson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 10:46 PM
Response to Reply #16
21. I hope they get better
:hug:
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cliffordu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 10:52 PM
Response to Reply #21
24. Thanks -
:hug:
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QC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 10:52 PM
Response to Reply #24
25. I'm s sorry to hear about that.
I've been there, and it's tough. You are in my prayers.
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cliffordu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 11:05 PM
Response to Reply #25
30. Thanks...
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bigjohn16 Donating Member (747 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 10:33 PM
Response to Original message
5. So we wait for a second term and then what?
He says he doesn't want to tackle such divisive issues because it may hurt Democrats in 2014 and 2016.
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QC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 10:37 PM
Response to Reply #5
9. That's the way the game has always been played in the past, so yeah. n/t
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donco6 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 10:42 PM
Response to Reply #5
13. I think we're the left wing's "abortion".
They dangle it out there to raise some funds from the poor suckers, all the while knowing they have no intention of slaughtering this cash cow.
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waiting for hope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 10:43 PM
Response to Reply #5
14. Then when? I am so tired of that
excuse - hurting Democrats in future elections. There may not be a base for him to offend by the time 2012 rolls around. With six states now recognizing same sex marriage, this is a good a time as any. And really, divisive issues? The Employment Non-Discrimination Act, Don't Ask, Don't Tell and Defense of Marriage as divisive sending more troops into Afghanistan and Pakistan or Torture? Divisive issues is a code word for Progressive Issues, imho.
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donco6 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 10:35 PM
Response to Original message
6. Holy Sh*t.
How will the next headline read, "Top Ex-Gay in the administration . . . " "Ex-top-gay . . . "
Former top gay now a big fat bottom . . . "?
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QC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 10:38 PM
Response to Reply #6
10. Maybe we will soon see an interview with the administration's pushy, demanding bottom. n/t
Edited on Sun Jun-14-09 10:40 PM by QC
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ruggerson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 11:05 PM
Response to Reply #10
29. I didn't realize Clay Aiken had formally accepted a job with them.
:hide:
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QC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 11:06 PM
Response to Reply #29
31. Actually, they say that Clay is a fierce top.
(I hope his topping is fiercer than a certain someone else's advocacy.)
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JI7 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 10:36 PM
Response to Original message
8. "top gay"
i don't think most people know who he is.
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ruggerson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 10:40 PM
Response to Reply #8
12. pretty pathetic that the "top gay" in this administration
manages personnel.
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Chipper Chat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 10:46 PM
Response to Reply #12
20. Just out of curiosity.....
Is there a "bottom gay" in the administration?
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ruggerson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 10:48 PM
Response to Reply #20
22. well if the "top gay" manages personnel
I think we can safely say the "bottom gay" is either a sous chef or the guy that cleans the bowling pins.
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imdjh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-15-09 12:00 AM
Response to Reply #12
49. That's the top out gay. Just like corporate America- top out gay is VP in HR.
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1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 11:16 PM
Response to Reply #8
34. they have some school out in miramar, california. i believe his callsign was "goose"...
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AntiFascist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 10:45 PM
Response to Original message
18. The President needs to look to Jerry Brown as a role model...
State AG Jerry Brown has no problem enforcing Proposition 8. Prop 8 went into effect immediately after the election and gay marriages were immediately halted. This has not prevented Jerry Brown from voicing his opinion and working extremely hard to overturn the proposition, even all the way to the Federal Supreme Court. We aren't asking the president to work as hard as Jerry Brown, but he has given us very little so far.
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merh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 10:56 PM
Response to Original message
26. This is disappointing if it is correct, Obama may not get that 2nd term
if he keeps waiting to keep his campaign promises and if he ignores civil rights issues.

I have problems with them ameriblog relying on Richard Socarides. If Socarides is such an opponent to DOMA, why did he let Clinton sign it - why did he, as Clinton's special assistant, let Clinton sign this blatantly unconstitutional legislation.

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donco6 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 11:21 PM
Response to Reply #26
37. It's all about expediency.
And all about what price you do or do not have to pay when pushing someone under the bus.
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QC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 11:24 PM
Response to Reply #37
39. It's pure political calculation: there are more homophobes than homosexuals
in the world, and when the only thing one cares about is the numbers, well, we see where that reasoning leads.
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donco6 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 11:27 PM
Response to Reply #39
41. Yeah - so much for doing something just because it's right.
What do they call that? Oh yeah, *principles."

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msongs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 10:59 PM
Response to Original message
27. CHANGE we can believe in. yeah right nt
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ruggerson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 11:01 PM
Response to Original message
28. I don't buy that they don't have the votes RIGHT NOW to do ENDA or DADT
Both passing ENDA and repealing DADT are supported by VAST majorities across the country. NOt just majorities, not just super majorities, but we're talking 70-30 in the case of DADT and 80-20 in the case of ENDA.

They don't have the votes?

Bullshit. They don't have the will or the courage - and Obama doesn't have the leadership qualities to push them.
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charlie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 11:11 PM
Response to Original message
32. Second term, hmm?
This man's path from Illinois to the Senate to the Presidency can only be described as meteoric. He certainly understands the importance of moving quickly while windows of opportunity are open. He certainly didn't let anyone tell him he was too unknown, too black, or too green to be President.

Do it this term, Mr President.
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OPERATIONMINDCRIME Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 11:14 PM
Response to Original message
33. The Amount Of Over Exaggeration Here Lately Is Staggering.
I feel so much for Obama right now.
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QC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 11:16 PM
Response to Reply #33
35. Do You Really Think That He Reads This Site?
I Am Inclined To Doubt That.
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OPERATIONMINDCRIME Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 11:26 PM
Response to Reply #35
40. Wow. You Need To Get Out More.
You seem so involved in your world that you are unable to see that it is larger than DU alone. This is not a DU outrage, and you can be certain that Obama knows about it. The charges are bullshit and each time I see the misguided hatred thrown at him, a good man, I feel for him. Guess that comes with the job though...
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donco6 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 11:27 PM
Response to Reply #40
43. So how are they bullshit exactly?
Just curious.
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QC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 11:34 PM
Response to Reply #40
44. Sometimes Outrage Is Justified. n/t
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donco6 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 11:22 PM
Response to Reply #33
38. You don't want to know what I'm feeling for Obama right now.
And it has nothing to do with puppies.
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konnichi wa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-15-09 09:23 AM
Response to Reply #33
60. "over exaggeration"...? Is that sorta like The Department of Redundancy Department?
:silly:
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Skittles Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 11:35 PM
Response to Original message
45. they never had a chance
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Starry Messenger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-14-09 11:43 PM
Response to Original message
46. Well, now we know who's been writing that script.
I wondered when they were going to roll Berry out. Sigh. :(
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dsc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-15-09 07:36 AM
Response to Original message
58. that was a wretched interview
He should have been pinned down on the contents of that brief and not been permitted to just argue the existance of it.
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xchrom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-15-09 09:43 AM
Response to Original message
61. not a top i care to meet right now. nt
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