5th-Graders Accused of Sex in School

[RC]

5th-Graders Accused of Sex in School
By MARY FOSTER Associated Press Writer
The Associated Press - Wednesday, April 04, 2007
NEW ORLEANS

Five fifth-grade students face criminal charges after authorities said four of them had sex in front of other students in an unsupervised classroom and kept a classmate posted as a lookout for teachers.

The students were arrested Tuesday at the Spearsville school in rural north Louisiana, authorities said. Two 11-year-old girls, a 12-year-old boy and a 13-year old boy were charged with obscenity, a felony. An 11-year-old boy, the alleged guard, was charged with being an accessory.

>SNIP<

The class, which had around 10 other students, was alone for about 15 minutes, he said.

>MORE<

http://www.in-forum.com/ap/index.cfm?page=view&id=D8O9F...

* * * * * * * * *

15 minutes? 11/12 yo? These kids had to have done this before. I'm surprised they did not charge the girls with prostitution. I do not think criminal charges are warrented here. There are better ways to handle this.
Why does everything that offends someone have to be criminal with possable jail terms?

[Maine-ah]

1. wtf

[ixion]

2. criminal felony charges seem a bit much...and what's a 13 year-old doing in 5th grade?

[bigscott]

4. no child left behind

more than three times I guess

[wakeme2008]

3. LOL they are only guilty of Poor Taste IMHO

[cgrindley]

68. WTF! Serious felonies were committed

you cannot have sex with a child, even if you are a child. The adult in loco parentis is legally responsible. This was rape among other things.

[acmavm]

5. Not saying that all kids have intercourse in front of their classmates

but if they start charging kids who explore the wild and wonderful world of sex, they won't have to worry about leaving anybody behind. Most of them will be in jail.

[MUAD_DIB]

6. You don't think that this is a serious matter?

I'd say that this instance is a little different than putting cuffs on a six year old.

At the very least these kids should be expelled for their actions.


I would hope that, at the very least, the parents of these kids are mortified.

How would you feel if you were the parent of one of these kids?

[acmavm]

11. Ease up. Of course it's serious but by the same token do I

think they should have been arrested? F**k no. Expelling them would be an appropriate reaction, maybe some counseling to see what would make them act out like that. What the school did was not right.

Are you always this hyperactive?

[MUAD_DIB]

18. Dude. No offense. My post wasn't hyperactive. Ease up on the coffee.

The last time I checked school wasn't the place for sexhibitionism of any type. I also didn't imply that they should be arrested.

My word were expelled.

[mudesi]

25. Are you kidding?

Expelled, for what, exactly? As a result of them living in a puritanical home and society, in addition to a lack of education on the subject thanks to conservative, religious indoctrination, they don't know any better. They are not mentally mature enough to even comprehend what they did, and therefore did nothing wrong.

Who is really to "blame" for this situation, the children or their parents and the politicians they vote for?

[gollygee]

26. What 11, 12, and 13 year olds do you know?

What 11, 12, and 13 year olds don't know this - if they don't know they're too young to have sex, they certainly know they shouldn't be doing it in public. Maybe that's why they had a lookout, eh? They obviously knew it was wrong or they wouldn't have bothered with that.

[mudesi]

28. I want you to do a thought experiment

Think back to when you were 13 years old. It is extremely hard for many people to do this, but try. I want you to try to remember the things that went through your head when you were 13 years old. Try to remember your maturity level, your thought processes, your world views. What were your favorite TV shows? What were your interests?

These kids are just that: Kids. They were never taught about sex. They don't know about it's consequences or the emotional maturity that is required of it. They are victims of an upbringing that kept them ignorant, and I find it shocking that they were charged with a crime.

They need to be educated, not punished.

[MUAD_DIB]

31. Buddy. Leave the bleeding heart at the door. Will you?

Were the kids having sex in the classroom?


End of discussion. Actions have consequences.

[dysfunctional press]

38. how is it the end of the discussion...?

they were in 5th grade, not high school.
the teacher that left the class alone for 15 minutes is more responsible for what happened than the kids.

[gollygee]

40. Certainly the teacher bears responsibility as well

but a group of 11, 12, and 13 year olds ought to be able to be alone for 15 minutes without public sex.

[dysfunctional press]

41. apparently not.

i wonder if they have sex ed in that school district, and at what grade/age level it kicks in.

[gollygee]

42. They obviously knew what they were doing was wrong

or they wouldn't have had a look-out.

I agree with early sex ed, but even without sex ed they certainly knew they were having sex, they knew they were in public, and the fact that they had a look-out shows they know they were doing something wrong.

[dysfunctional press]

43. when left to their own devices- kids do lots of things that are wrong

and they're generally smart enough to have a lookout as well. because this time it involved sex, people are acting like the world is coming to an end.

it isn't.

[gollygee]

44. The world isn't coming to an end

They need to be held accountable. They're old enough to know better. 8-year-olds engaging in sex play in public - well I wouldn't expect them to know better. But 11, 12, and 13 year olds certainly are old enough to know better.

They don't need to go to jail. They don't need to be charged as adults. But they need consequences to their actions.

[MUAD_DIB]

51. But this is Amurka. Nobody takes responsibility here.

[mudesi]

62. No they aren't

11, 12, and 13 years olds are not old enough to know better, especially when nobody bothers to teach them about the birds and the bees.

[MUAD_DIB]

69. Sorry to burst your bubble, but the article doesn't say anything about

if they were or weren't old enough to know better. And since they had a lookout it probably goes to show that they did indeed know better.

I was pretty smart as an 11 year old: smart enough to know better. Maybe you weren't.

[MUAD_DIB]

50. But, But, But... they were the victims!

Seriously. Why is it that nobody is ever expected to be responsible for their own actions?


I'm pretty sure that when I was 11 that nobody was having sex in the classroom.

[MUAD_DIB]

45. Ding! Ding! Ding!

Why is that so hard to understand?

[mudesi]

59. Consider the reasons why

These are not grown, mature adults who know better than to have sex in public. Ask yourself why they did what they did. My inclination is to believe that they don't know what sex is all about because nobody bothered to tell them. They probably learned it from pornography. This story represents a massive failure on their parents' parts in regards to teaching them about sex, and I'm not at all surprised that it happened in a largely puritanical, religiously brainwashed state.

Punishment will only teach them that sex is "wrong". They need to be educated, not imprisoned.

[MUAD_DIB]

71. Why did they have a lookout?

I love excuse ridden Amurka..

[gollygee]

7. Wow! 11, 12 and 13?

Times have changed since I was in school!

I have no idea what should be done. Do they have an alternative school program? I'd get them out of the regular school anyway. I guess I'm ok with criminal charges - they're minors and I'm sure they'll be charged as minors, and having sex in public is against the law. They broke the law and it isn't like minors are going to get life in prison for having sex in public, but they'll be assessed. I'd want them to be talked to because when kids that young are that sexually adventurous there sometimes is abuse in the background.

[acmavm]

12. Don't be too sure. A 12-year old girl got a few years for

just pushing a hall monitor. (That was in Texas, wasn't it?)

And yep, there's a possibility of some abuse in the family. There's also the possibility of cable t.v., Grand Theft Auto, or music videos.

[gollygee]

13. Well I certainly wouldn't want to see any kids locked up for a few years

yes I read about that and that's an awful situation. I think it's unusual - which is why it made the news - and the judge who passed that sentence needs to be taken off the bench as he appears to not be able to separate his personal prejudices from his duties as a judge.

However, when kids break the law they should be charged. As minors, not as adults. Sex in public is against the law and warrants some investigation.

Obviously they might not have been abused, but it's possible and hopefully an assessment would shed some light on that.

[acmavm]

20. It's not an abberation, this sentencing kids as adults crap has

been going on for quite some time now. It was highlighted a couple years back when that 13-year old Florida boy (black of course) was tried for as an adult for murder and got a life sentence. Do you recall that one?

When it comes to the legal system in this country and the way it's stacked against some people and loaded in favor of others, no one should trust it including kids (or maybe especially kids).

[gollygee]

23. The fact that it isn't perfect doesn't mean that people shouldn't be arrested when they commit crime

crimes.

Having had sex in public - in front of other 11-year-olds who might not have been as sexually aware - is a crime and they need to be held accountable for it. They shouldn't be detained for years - in fact they shouldn't be detained at all IMO. But they should go through that system so that a proper investigation can be done, and they should have to be assessed to see if there is abuse in any of their backgrounds.

I agree that the legal system is a mess, and I think that minors should never be charged as adults. But that's not the issue here. I didn't see anything about them being charged as adults. The juvenile system is the right place for them.

[acmavm]

30. They may not have been charged as adults, but one was

charged with a felony. Which is ridiculous when you consider that we adults are shoving sex down their throats like crazy with t.v., radio, movies, video games, music, whatever. That's why kids kill. They are fed that shit for entertainment and its hard to understand why something that's entertainment should be so damn bad in real life.

Someone needs to talk to these kids and it sure as hell ain't anyone in our 'justice' system.

[Ghost in the Machine]

39. It's all part of the desensitization of the next generation. Violent sex..

violent video games, violent music, violent movies, violent t.v. shows. It's all part of grooming the next generation to live in a world of war, anarchy and violence.

ASSIMILATE NOW!


Ghost

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

Kids kill because we're shoving sex down their throats?

You sure it isn't because of GM corn?

[Wednesdays]

8. Yeah, toss 'em all in the slammer

and throw away the key. That'll solve everything.

[Ezlivin]

9. Hell, who needs recess anymore?

My sweet jesus have things changed since I was a lad.

Good thing we're teaching these kids abstinence, right?

[Name removed]

10. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[coffeenap]

14. More information is needed. Are we sure it was consensual?

What if the girls were coerced? Forced? Intimidated?

[ChickMagic]

16. One of my coworkers told me something that blew my socks off

He said that when he was 12, he had a girlfriend who was 11 1/2 (that seems to be a big deal - I'm 11 AND A HALF!)

Neither had been sexually abused. He said after they'd been going together a few months they started having sex, and had sex every single day for a year and a half. They both remembered it fondly. He's a really great guy, very humble and sweet and very responsible.

I was in shock after hearing that. I didn't even know what sex was at that age.

[coffeenap]

22. It doesn't surprise me that much. I had a steady boyfriend from

age 12 and if we weren't happy with the way things already were, we could have done the same thing. (It felt wrong, though, so we didn't.)

[ChickMagic]

37. It sure shocked me, sheltered as I was.

Sex talk was completely verboten in our house.

[Matariki]

17. why, because girls are always victims?

why jump to that conclusion?

[coffeenap]

21. Nope, just because they were younger and because I don't

want to assume it was all just as told to us by our notriously untrustworthy media.

[moc]

15. Crap. I have a 5th grader.

However, I can't imagine dd's class being left alone for 5 minutes, much less 15. The class next door is only separated by a movable wall, so if one teacher has to leave, they can open the wall and both classes can be watched by a single teacher.

[xchrom]

19. lol -- we always did that stuff in somebody's garage when i was that age.

school would have given everybody the heebeejeebees.

[dogday]

24. Way too long to leave kids unattended

Criminal charges are not the answer... Education is the answer... My daughter is in the 5th grade and she attended the Sex Education class given by the School Nurse.. They know a lot at this age...


Good parenting and education is essential in preventing behavior like this...

[treestar]

47. But then who'd have thought they'd have sex?

boggles my mind!

Throwing paper airplanes, yeah. But sex?

It's enough to turn me into one of those old fogeys saying "What has the world come to?"

[mudesi]

27. None of them did anything wrong

Every single one of them, both the boys and the girls, are victims of sexual repression in a puritanical society. None of them committed any crimes and none of them did anything wrong. They don't know any better.

[ulysses]

32. ...

Every single one of them, both the boys and the girls, are victims of sexual repression in a puritanical society.

They don't sound terribly repressed to me.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

52. Charging them with a felony doesn't sound repressive to you?

Does to me.

[joe_sixpack]

65. Why always assume sexual repression?

Isn't it possible that our society is over stimulated by sex? I think it's more likely the cause of two inexperienced kids getting it on in school, than thinking they're doing it because their poor young blooming sexuality is repressed.

[slackmaster]

29. "unsupervised classroom"

[verse18]

33. Children have sexual impulses that kick in hard around puberty.

If left unsupervised long enough, children will start to experiment and explore. It's only natural. That's why responsible adults need to start providing kids with sex and reproductive education at an early age.

[slackmaster]

34. Yes, all that is true

And not leave a room full of hormone-charged kids unsupervised for more than a few seconds at a time.

[Initech]

35. All I have to say is - holy crap!

[slackmaster]

36. This never would have happened in my generation, at least where I grew up

We were taught better manners as children.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

46. LOL

Yeah, right.

[slackmaster]

48. Laugh if you want, I am being perfectly serious

I cannot imagine any of my peers at age 11 or 12 behaving that way.

(I'm 49 BTW, grew up in the '60s and '70s.)

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

49. Oh, I'm sure you're serious.

But you're perfectly wrong.

[slackmaster]

53. WTF are you talking about?

Kids having sex did it discretely.

I was there, you weren't.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

54. So you're saying they were having sex all the time...

which the adolescent pregnancy rates from the 60's and 70's certainly supports, but they just didn't get caught? Riiiiight.

As somebody who's taught kids from the fifties through the nineties, I can certainly say they've been having sex in the broom closet and under the stage, and in the bathrooms, and the classrooms, and the lab stock rooms, and every hidey-hole imaginable from time immemorial.

[slackmaster]

56. NO, I am saying they didn't FUCK in class in front of other students

BTW, what the hell are 11- and 12-year-olds and a 13-year-old doing in FIFTH grade? Are they retarded, or just fuckups?

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

58. Sure they did.

Kids these days are the same they were those days. You just weren't aware of it.

"Are they retarded, or just fuckups?"

The kids are fairly normal. The retarded fuckups are the ones charging them with a felony. I'd like to think that the people surprised by "kids these days" are retarded fuck ups too, but I can't. Since time immemorial there have been grumpy old farts whining about "kids these days." So they're fairly normal too. Although I'd like to think that as adults they should know better.

[slackmaster]

60. If they had done it in class, I think I would have at least heard about it

But in any case, I wish to thank you for reminding me of one of several reasons I don't ever want to have children of my own.

[joe_sixpack]

66. There was a limiting factor back then.

I went to an inner city school in Chicago. Definitely not a prude haven. As boys of that age feeling primal urges, we sure would have acted on them. The limiting factor was that thankfully girls the same age were a little more reluctant to give us the chance. Since boys that age freely exchange stories, and most exaggerate, we would have gladly told of exploits "under the stage" in "the broom closet" etc. I don't think sex in school was as rampant as you indicate. Sex and school together would seem a turn off. When we finally began to round the bases it was more likely in a home where parents were gone for awhile, a car, a park, or some friends garage or basement. And I don't remember anyone having such a desire to "do it" in front of other people, but perhaps that was just the way things were in our city, I could be wrong.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

55. What happened to "expelling from school" as punishment for outrageous transgressions?

It used to be the rule for maximum punishment. Vandalism, hurting other people... expelling is clasically the "death penalty" equivalent for schoolchildren. Why do we have to haul them to JAIL now?

[Lilith Velkor]

57. THIS! IS! SPARTA!!!

Something like that.

[gollygee]

61. School isn't a free zone

if you break the law on school grounds you can be held accountable by the justice system for breaking the law. If it's against the law outside of school, it's also against the law in school.

I think age has to be taken into consideration. Like the thread about a 5 or 6-year-old who had a tantrum and was arrested. Kids that age have tantrums and aren't always able to control them. She was arrested for "resisting arrest" but a kid that age wouldn't understand that concept, and wouldn't necessarily be able to pull herself together even if she did. Obviously, that is over-the-top.

But 11, 12, and 13-year-olds are old enough to understand they shouldn't be having sex in front of other kids (at 11 many of the other kids in the class wouldn't even have hit puberty). I don't think they belong in jail, but they should be held accountable for their actions. Being charged as juveniles - charges that won't carry over to when they're adults - and being allowed to remain in school is probably less harsh in the long run IMO because they'll still get an education. I don't like seeing kids get kicked out of school unless they're a danger to other kids.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

63. Do you advocate sending students to the P.D. at every fistfight?

After all, it's assault. It would get you in fistcuffs if it happened in the street and somebody called the cops. Ditto for intentionally breaking anything in the school - vandalism, a violation of the law too.

[gollygee]

64. it depends on the severity

Kids fight, including teenagers- they have less impulse control. But if they're fighting to the point of causing serious injury, then yes I think the school should call the police. Ditto for vandalism - a little vandalism isn't a big deal - you can make the kids clean it up themselves - but if it is severe enough to cause significant property damage, then yes, again, the police should be called.

My mom was a teacher and there was a teacher assaulted when she was there - a kid picked up a chair and hit the teacher with it. There were people who thought that kid shouldn't have been arrested for assault because he was in school and the thought was that transgressions don't count or something when kids are in school. I'm in firm disagreement with that.

Kids caught having sex and trying to be discrete - I'd talk to them and not make that big of a deal of it. But having sex in front of other kids, including some who probably haven't hit puberty at that age. The other kids weren't necessarily a willing audience to it. Doing it in front of the other kids increases the severity level.

[cgrindley]

67. Their parents are the ones who need locking up

what the hell is wrong with parents today? why can't they control their children? How broken do you have to be to not instinctively know that having sex at school is wrong?

[shadowknows69]

70. Somebody's parents not minding the internet usage?

i didn't even know what an orgy when i was 11