Should the UK introduce recall elections?

[T_i_B]

Now I know know how aware you are of this, but here in Britain our Parliament is currenttly engulfed in a major expenses scandal, with a hoeplessly lax system allowing many MP's to claim expenses on everything from biscuits and horse manure to cleaming moats at an MP's constituency house. Not to mention the grotesque practice of "flipping" their second residence from one house to another in order to grab as much taxpayer money for themselves as possible.

This thread is a starting point for more info but I must warn you that there are a LOT of corrupt examples to choose from.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=191x27041

Anyway, I was wondering if it might be an idea for the UK to introduce a recall system so that if voters in a constituency where the MP is clearly in it for personal gain and not serving their constituents voters can organise a recall petition and if they get enough signatures, force a by-election where they would have the choice of removing or re-electing their MP.

The Wikipedia link is below. Please let me know your thoughts.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Recall_election

[ezgoingrl]

1. Sounds like some type of strict ethics rules and

swift consequences for violations would be in order.

[T_i_B]

2. Yes, we do need some "strict ethics rules" as well.

The trouble is that it's MP's who made the rules, which just so happened to be so lax that MP's could abuse the system to their heart's content.

What I am proposing here with the recall idea is more of swift consequence for violation. Where it has become clear to the public that their MP is not serving them but is instead in it merely to line their own pockets the public can take appropriate action without waiting for political parties to take action. IMHO, political parties in Britiain are more likely to deselect MP's for disloyalty to the party then anything else.

A recall system would only get put to the test in exceptional circumstances. the trouble at the moment is that MP's abusing the expenses system is such a widespread problem that such steps would probably be the best way of ridding ourselves of the likes of Margaret Moran and ensuring that our politicians actually look out for the people that elected them.

[LeftishBrit]

3. My concern is...

that the recall process would end up being used mainly for people whom the tabloids and similar outfits decided were not right-wing enough on certain key issues: "He CODDLES CRIMINALS! Sign this petition to recall him, and instal someone who supports the death penalty". "She has SHAMEFULLY supported asylum-seekers OVERRUNNING THE COUNTRY! Let us get rid of her!" Etc. More the Rule of the Tabloids than the Rule of Grassroots Democracy.

I would actually prefer something more akin to the American process of impeachment: some sort of special court to try, and on conviction remove, politicians who have seriously abused their offices, even where this might not amount to crime in the strict sense. Of course, we do in theory have an impeachment process (we were probably the originators); but we haven't used it for about 200 years, and the existing court for it is the House of Lords - not necessarily the ideal in a modern democracy. Perhaps a more appropriate tribunal could be worked out and instituted.

[T_i_B]

4. I have thought about that one...

...and if it's done properly then the proportion of an MP's constituents needed to force a recall should be big enough to ensure that entirely partisan campaigns don't get anywhere. And if you look at the American example partisan ideological campaigns such as the freeper campaign to recall John McCain that was going back in 2001 when I first visited that site tend not to get anywhere anyway.

And on another note, I notice that Nick Clegg is now advocating recall elections! I'm quite happy about that as I did actually write to my Lib Dem MP last week with this idea and to see it now being supported by the party leader is at least a start.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2008/mar/06/nickclegg.liberaldemocrats

[muriel_volestrangler]

5. You might be interested in this - reselect.org

http://www.reselect.org/

About this site

Reselect.org has been established by Paul Evans of The Local Democracy Blog, and Common Endeavour, Martin Bright of The Spectator, Sunny Hundal of The Liberal Conspiracy and Mick Fealty of Slugger O’Toole / Daily Telegraph’s Brassneck blog.

It is aimed at people who would like the next election to offer a choice of legitimate honest candidates that are not entirely submerged in The Westminster Village.

The site has been conceived as part of the preparations for PICamp - the political innovation camp, an unconference designed to encourage people to think about gamechanging political initiatives.

It's not exactly what you're saying, but it's still the idea of spreading the number of people who get to say whether a sitting MP is doing a decent enough job.

[T_i_B]

6. Thanks Muriel

I got a reply from my MP about this yesterday (I wrote to him last week advocating recall elections) and his reply pretty much dodged the question.

And here's a Facebook group set up by Sunny Hundal of Liberal Conspiracy which I hope is of some use as well.

http://www.facebook.com/s.php?sid=ccfebf5d6d305b43ac21602b108e12c5&init=q&sf=r&k=200000010&n=-1&q=recall%20MP's#/group.php?gid=76809974117

[T_i_B]

7. And here's an organization set up to camapign for recall elections in the UK

38 Degrees

http://38degrees.bluestatedigital.com/

[eridani]

8. Can't no confidence votes be called just about any old time?

Seems to me that would make recall superfluous.

[muriel_volestrangler]

11. That's when the MPs have no confidence in the PM/government

This would be for when voters have no confidence in an individual MP.

[foo_bar]

9. theory: good, actuality: Schwarzeneggers after every tax hike

I realize the British electorate isn't quite as naive as its USAsean counterpart, at least when it comes to Austrian populists, but the long view, I think, is the electorate robs itself of power by permitting smaller electorates to try to hold snap elections when nobody's looking (e.g., the right in Venezuela, FOX in California), unlike a dissolution of Parliament by Mrs. Sovereign or no confidence maneuver raising the issue to national consciousness, it's essentially a self-imposed "term limit" except terms are an arbitrary length not an arbitrary quantity (not that they aren't already somewhat arbitrary, but it takes more than outrage by the local NewspeakCorp fishwrap to set the process in motion).

[T_i_B]

10. I don't think it would work like that.

For one thing here in Britain the legislature and executive are not seperate so you wouldn't be able to remove the whole government via this method unless they had a majority of 1 seat, in which case they would most likely be calling a general election anayway.

So it would be more likely to be used to remove the more sleazy MP's then to shoot down the whole government. The trouble is that we in Britain have quite a number of MP's who would be liable for this thanks to the many expense fiddles that have been going on.

[muriel_volestrangler]

12. You are listened to by powerful people, T_i_B:

First Clegg:

Finally, we must restore democracy by giving power back to people. Liberal Democrats have been calling for over a year for constituents to have the right to sack their MP if they are suspended for wrongdoing – this must be made law immediately so people can have their say on corrupt MPs as soon as possible.

and now Brown:

Yesterday I spent time meeting young people in Fife and tomorrow I will meet members of the Youth Citizenship Commission to talk about how young people can vote on local budgets, run local youth councils and elect members to a national youth parliament.

I will be talking about how by recall, redress and better representations all local people can have far more influence on local budgets and local decisions, from policing to schooling.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/campaign-for-democracy-brown-vs-cameron-vs-clegg-1691210.html