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Crazy Dave Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-01-09 11:08 PM
Original message
"NO HEALTH INSURANCE FOR YOU!!!"
Better 50 million plus Americans be without health insurance than to "hurt the private insurance plans" I guess.

Don't know the whole story and maybe there's more to it than just one sentence in an article but it sounds pretty fucked up to me.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/05/01/ben-nelson-pla...



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Orrex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-01-09 11:12 PM
Response to Original message
1. The 50M+ are bad news, but they're not the whole story
I suspect that a similar number of people are insured but still can't afford health care.
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Crazy Dave Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-01-09 11:18 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. The commercial where the guy that has health insurance says...
"It wasn't like having health insurance, it was like having a coupon" for his medical costs.

Just like the last time I had a $7000 claim, my $200 a month health insurance only paid $1900 90 days after the hospital threatened to have a collections agency come after me.
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Orrex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-01-09 11:23 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. I hear about shit like that all the time, and it infuriates me
My wife recently had to go to the ER, and the bill was a little over $1900. At the moment, our income level allows us to pay a vastly reduced amount.

However, due to a filing error, I also got a notification from my former insurance carrier; since I'm no longer covered by that plan, they denied the claim of course. But the total amount that was billed to the insurance company was $330.

WTF?!?
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Crazy Dave Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-01-09 11:29 PM
Response to Reply #6
8. The good or the bad of it 'cause I'm not to sure....
Is that after the $1900 was paid the hospital immediately and eagerly "wrote off" the rest of the bill.

Were they being nice or was I overcharged to begin with....?
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crazylikafox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-02-09 12:16 PM
Response to Reply #8
21. You were being grossly overcharged.
That's how it works. The insurance company pays very little, but the little guys with NO insurance get billed the ENTIRE AMOUNT and the hospitals go after them with collection agencies to collect the whole thing. The whole system is SO FUCKED UP.
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imdjh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-01-09 11:41 PM
Response to Reply #1
11. That's me.
Edited on Fri May-01-09 11:41 PM by imdjh
I have health insurance. I pay for it. And the other night, I laid in my bed and risked death (seriously), holding off before I would go to the ER. Why? Because what I had I have had before, and I made it through. It costs me $500 to go to the ER if they don't admit me, and up to $2500 the first week if they do. The last time this happened, I told my doctor about it, and he called me an idiot and ordered me to go to the ER if it happened again. I'm pretty sure he can afford the big bucks on the maybe. He did agree to give me a back up script so I can self medicate in advance of a massive infection. And don't get me started on having to ask someone I pay to deign to do what I want him to do. I despise that doctors control access to all functional drugs, but that's not going to change.
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Lithos Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-01-09 11:14 PM
Response to Original message
2. The private plans suck
They are becoming nothing more than some protection against catastrophic events. I work for a major corp and have essentially the top of the line insurance they offer (so large, they have several tiers), and it sucks rocks. it is essentially worthless to me.

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bluebellbaby Donating Member (275 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-01-09 11:21 PM
Response to Reply #2
5. Yup...my step dad still works at 73 to keep the insurance coverage
And the co-pays for medication is outrageous...

When I was home for Easter I picked up one of my Mom's prescriptions...the co-pay was $179...

They spend well over $10,000 a year on their co-pays just for medicine...

It's crazy...

And the point that 50 million doesn't reflect the true nature of what's going on here is sooooooooo true!


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imdjh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-01-09 11:42 PM
Response to Reply #5
13. Your mom is COPD?
Edited on Fri May-01-09 11:43 PM by imdjh
I only ask because that's exactly what the "co-pay" is on those disk inhalers my mom needs.
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bluebellbaby Donating Member (275 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-02-09 12:13 AM
Response to Reply #13
15. Yes...actually...wow...
And my Mom...after 60 years...quit smoking...finally...cold turkey to boot...

She says that she hasn't needed the inhaler for about a week now...

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Crazy Dave Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-01-09 11:24 PM
Response to Reply #2
7. Yes and people with insurance still go into bankruptcy and lose their homes
If a family member has a terminal or long term illness

Then the insurance company gets to cancel their policy after they're broke and they can't afford to pay their premiums anymore
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obliviously Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-01-09 11:37 PM
Response to Reply #7
10. I know someone
who died from a health problem and his insurance company canceled him.
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Crazy Dave Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-02-09 09:22 AM
Response to Reply #10
16. So sorry to hear that friend
And welcome to DU :hi:
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obliviously Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-02-09 12:10 PM
Response to Reply #10
20. He was cancelled and then died.
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obliviously Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-02-09 12:20 PM
Response to Reply #20
22. I have to be honest here.
I am not particularly happy about national health care. That being said something has to be done. We have two major hospital chains that own the largest Hmo's in oklahoma the decisions they make regarding care most often reflects their finances not the patients well being. I had an emergency room visit that lasted three hours last october. the actual time they were administering care was 1 hour. They took three ex rays a cat scan and blood work.the total cost for me FOUR THOUSAND DOLLARS that is obscene. I have no insurance. With these practices they are forcing the hand of the government!
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imdjh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-01-09 11:44 PM
Response to Reply #7
14. And there are people on Medicare and Medicaid at the same time too.
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-01-09 11:15 PM
Response to Original message
3. Emergency Health Care Briefing With Howard Dean
Urgent update on health care: Next week, Congress will begin making the actual decisions about whatll be in a health care reform bill.

Meanwhile, conservative groups have launched a new assault on the presidents proposal, including a million-dollar ad campaign claiming that health care will be rationed and bureaucrats will decide the treatments you receive.1
If real people like us dont get involved in this health care fight now, it could all fall apart. So were holding an emergency online briefing on Monday night at 9 p.m. ET with Dr. Howard Dean to make sure were all ready for the fight ahead, called What we all need to know to win on health care this year.

http://pol.moveon.org/deanforum/index.html


http://www.lightupthedarkness.org/blog/?p=143

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imdjh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-01-09 11:35 PM
Response to Original message
9. When is someone going to call these whores on their game?
When are the media people going to IMMEDIATELY turn to a Bill Nelson and say, "How much are they paying you to work against the interests of the American people? How are the AMA, the insurance companies, and the pharmaceutical companies getting to you?
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Dogmudgeon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-01-09 11:41 PM
Response to Original message
12. This issue isn't dead yet
Let's press the Democrats who voted with the banks. They all have their reasons for voting "nay" -- well, let's present them OUR reasons that they should vote "yea".

I'm sure we can persuade most, if not all, of them to vote with our interests next time.

--d!
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mmonk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-02-09 09:27 AM
Response to Original message
17. The protection racket controls too many in the Halls of Congress.
The people DO NOT COME FIRST. Everything has to be run through the corporations that control the US government.
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Crazy Dave Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-02-09 09:36 AM
Response to Reply #17
19. It's unbelievable but it's 100% true
That 7 people in a board room have direct access to our members of congress and the senate and they get more rights and protections than 7 million of their own voters and constituents.
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Half King Donating Member (27 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-02-09 01:03 PM
Response to Reply #17
25. Then we need to do something.
Analyze your spending. To the extent possible, eliminate money sent to a "corporation". Stick with mutual companies, credit unions, family owned businesses, and open air markets.

Maybe it is not the way "Walmart" is operated, maybe it is in the way Walmart is structured.

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mmonk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-02-09 01:30 PM
Response to Reply #25
26. I don't mind sending my money to a corporation at the end
Edited on Sat May-02-09 01:30 PM by mmonk
of the healthcare chain like a hospital or a Doctor's group. What I mind is health insurance companies being a guaranteed middle man that determines access and costs while profiting and padding politicians election war chests and telling Americans any other approach is socialism (as they get to profit from legislation that requires we pay their damn asses). By the people for the people is the greatest lie ever told now.
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OwnedByFerrets Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-02-09 09:36 AM
Response to Original message
18. And one would think that big corporations would WANT
a single payer system, but it turns out that most dont. WHY? Because if their employees cant go elsewhere for employment because they wont qualify for another health insurance plan, it benefits the employer and they can continue to pay less in wages.
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Half King Donating Member (27 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-02-09 12:57 PM
Response to Reply #18
23. A little more to it.
For the big companies, the concept of "self-insurance" is the ticket.

Here is how it works.

You have one thousand employees. The cost of comprehensive health insurance would be twelve million dollars a year. You deduct twelve million dollars a year from your employees' paychecks and you get to deduct that same twelve million from your payroll tax obligations.

Now, you run along and find an administrator, which just happens to also me an insurance company. You give them the twelve million bucks, and they pay claims through negotiated payments with providors that have also banned together in doctor groups to negotiate that same payment. The administrator agrees to administer the plan up to the twelve million bucks at a "percentage allowance" called the "administrative fee". Here in North Carolina there is currently a little uproar about the Teachers Health Insurance through Blue Cross. Seems the actual amount of that "administrative fee" is unavailable to the legislature. If claims go over the twelve million, then you have to pay. If the claims and the administrative cost of the plan is less than twelve million, well then you pocket that differance and carry it forward as "self insurance reserve funds".

So, you run it right, with real actuaries and sharp accountants, well soon you have a rather large "self insurance fund" in which investment income is taxfree and accumulates taxfree. Why, with good claims administration and proper investment, within ten years in a labor intensive business, you can tap that self insurance fund to purchase the outstanding shares of the company. Then, well you gut that company, selling off assets for cash--and in the process eliminate the liability buildt within the insurance fund. Soon enough, everyone is laid off, the company is in bankruptcy, and you--once merely an employer in a publicly held company, now have amassed a huge private fortune--and the best part, you used the money of those poor employees to do it. Risk--humpf, that's is for other peoples money.

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OwnedByFerrets Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-02-09 06:42 PM
Response to Reply #23
27. THank you for that....I had forgotten that part of it.
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PassingFair Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-02-09 01:00 PM
Response to Original message
24. www.standwithdrdean.com
www.standwithdrdean.com

Time to get busy.

No public option = no health care reform
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