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LeftHander Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-27-09 12:57 PM
Original message
Young People succumbing to flu....?? (added)
Edited on Mon Apr-27-09 01:50 PM by LeftHander
How many of the young people who have died from the flu in Mexico City already had damage to immune system from AIDS? I am sure the HIV infection rates are high in a city suffering from drugs and poverty.

This flu picture is very incomplete and the media is fanning the flames of panic.
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Marrah_G Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-27-09 12:59 PM
Response to Original message
1. ..........
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aquart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-27-09 01:00 PM
Response to Original message
2. Ignorance is bliss, eh?
Can't manage to read more than a headline?
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LeftHander Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-27-09 01:15 PM
Response to Reply #2
9. Yeah that is it...
I just feel that MSM CONFIRM swine virus in all deaths before reporting it as a pending pandemic.

How many are not swine related at all? How many are opportunistic pneumonia?

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targetpractice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-27-09 01:22 PM
Response to Reply #9
11. What kind of confirmation do you want?
Autopsy reports?

The suspected Mexican deaths are being reported based on medical observation re: circumstances of deaths in hospitals. Do you not trust the doctors reporting from the scene?

This is an unfolding situation... and like similar events in the past the number of "confirmed" cases will lag behind the "suspected" cases for some time to come. But, it's likely that most of the suspected cases will eventually be confirmed.
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LeftHander Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-27-09 01:31 PM
Response to Reply #11
13. Some first hand accounts from BBC
Doctors say they DON'T have the equipment or tools to know for sure that those counted in the tallys from Mexico, OVER THE PAST THREE WEEKS...were actually swine flu.

So you have a doctor in a clinic somewhere in the middle of Mexico City recall that people died of respiratory illness...and looking back three to four months they add that to totals...seems like people are needlessly exaggerating the threat.

Plus comparison to the Spanish Flu are pretty unfounded. That flu had a estimated mortality rate of 2.5-5% with 20% getting it to some extent. That flu was also a rapid killer. Many times withing the first 48hrs.

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targetpractice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-27-09 01:41 PM
Response to Reply #13
19. I think you misread those accounts...
From the accounts I read from that same source... Doctors on the ground think the official death tolls are underestimates.

Comparisons to the Spanish Flu are not unfounded... both are strains of H1N1 influenza!
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-27-09 01:54 PM
Response to Reply #19
23. The underestimate could also be a lag in official reports
hell, right now the WHO places infectious rates in the US at 40 and CDC at 20

It is how you do you the reporting

CDC uses confirmed, WHO suspected, two slightly different models

And yes they can drive you nuts
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damntexdem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-27-09 01:37 PM
Response to Reply #9
17. Mexico doesn't know how many people got sick, so has no actual mortality rates.
The rates could be lower than it appears.

And many who have died did not receive timely treatment so did succumb to pneumonia.
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kestrel91316 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-27-09 01:51 PM
Response to Reply #9
21. WHO and CDC are not going to report AIDS deaths as swine flu.
Edited on Mon Apr-27-09 01:51 PM by kestrel91316
The young, healthy adults being killed by swine flu are YOUNG AND HEALTHY. Their immune systems are overreacting to the virus, and they are apparently developing cytokine storm, which kills them.
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-27-09 01:31 PM
Response to Reply #2
14. If anyone would be an expert on that, it's you.
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htuttle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-27-09 01:01 PM
Response to Original message
3. Google 'Cytokine storm' FTW
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LeftHander Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-27-09 01:10 PM
Response to Reply #3
6. thanks for the info...articles I read say nothing about this storm...
They just seem to be stirring up panic.

From what I have been reading only a handful of respiratory deaths in recent days is attributed to and confirmed swine.
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Toucano Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-27-09 01:02 PM
Response to Original message
4. As I understand it, it is the opposite.
Compromised immune systems may fair better.

It is believed this strain is deadliest among people with GOOD (better, I guess) immune systems.

The process is called cytokine storm.

This is not confirmed, however.
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Posteritatis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-27-09 01:03 PM
Response to Original message
5. Denial is awesome! (nt)
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-27-09 01:11 PM
Response to Original message
7. Would you care to give me some actual data?
(and by the way, you'd be wrong)
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LeftHander Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-27-09 01:20 PM
Response to Reply #7
10. WHO info....
So the news is reporting: 100 plus dead of swine flu, thousands sick. This seems to be somewhat different than the official reports.

http://www.who.int/csr/don/2009_04_26/en/index.html

Also as of 26 April, the Government of Mexico has reported 18 laboratory confirmed cases of swine influenza A/H1N1. Investigation is continuing to clarify the spread and severity of the disease in Mexico. Suspect clinical cases have been reported in 19 of the country's 32 states.
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-27-09 01:40 PM
Response to Reply #10
18. Your HIV claims that is what concerns me
You are making a connection that is not there... and that is the FUCKING POINT
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LeftHander Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-27-09 01:49 PM
Response to Reply #18
20. wasn't a claim it was a question....
Did the doctors confuse any opportunistic pneumonia AIDS death(s) with swine flu in GUESSING how people died in recent weeks.

What I am getting at is that young people do not die of flu (barring a very nasty one like Spanish flu as I learned today)

Who is making the conclusions that young people are dying of a swine flu similiar to the Flu of 1918?

Answer: The media is.
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-27-09 01:53 PM
Response to Reply #20
22. That also happened in 57 and 68
what do they have in common?

Oh yes a certain cascade in an otherwise healthy individual
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targetpractice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-27-09 02:10 PM
Response to Reply #20
24. Exaggerated immune response caused by H1N1 is known...
Edited on Mon Apr-27-09 02:12 PM by targetpractice
Yes, young people do die of H1N1 infections in disproportionate numbers. And, doctors are not "guessing". It seem like you are, though.

An exaggerated immune response (cytokine storm) in young adults is a known phenomenon in H1N1 and H5N1 infections. The immune system attacks cells in the lungs (where the virus replicates) and causes damage. Fluid then leaks into the lungs causing death by pneumonia.

Read about it... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cytokine_storm
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Occam Bandage Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-27-09 01:11 PM
Response to Original message
8. I bet Karl Rove actually killed them with his bare hands,
then paid the Mexicans to say it was the flu.
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madrchsod Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-27-09 01:28 PM
Response to Original message
12. how many young people have died in the united states?
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LeftHander Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-27-09 01:32 PM
Response to Reply #12
15. Zero of 40 cases.....ages not known....nt
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thewiseguy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-27-09 01:35 PM
Response to Original message
16. Yea those 9 year olds all had AIDS
Edited on Mon Apr-27-09 01:35 PM by thewiseguy
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Varner911 Donating Member (13 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-27-09 02:12 PM
Response to Reply #16
26. HA! Gallows humor.
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Varner911 Donating Member (13 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-27-09 02:12 PM
Response to Original message
25. A facile comparison. The young are dying...not a good sign.
I am extremely agitated by this pandemic of death.
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