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UN torture investigator: Obama has broken International law

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grahamhgreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-19-09 12:35 PM
Original message
UN torture investigator: Obama has broken International law
Edited on Sun Apr-19-09 12:41 PM by grahamhgreen
http://rawstory.com/08/blog/2009/04/18/un-torture-inves...

"The United Nations top torture investigator has suggested it is illegal under International law for President Barack Obama to announce that the United States government has no intention of prosecuting low-level CIA officers who carried out torture sanctioned by the Bush Administration."

Also:

http://www.reuters.com/article/politicsNews/idUSTRE53H1...

"VIENNA (Reuters) - President Barack Obama's decision not to prosecute CIA interrogators who used waterboarding on terrorism suspects amounts to a breach of international law, the U.N. rapporteur on torture said.

"The United States, like all other states that are part of the U.N. convention against torture, is committed to conducting criminal investigations of torture and to bringing all persons against whom there is sound evidence to court," U.N. special rapporteur Manfred Nowak told the Austrian daily Der Standard.

Nowak did not think Obama would go as far as to seek an amnesty law for affected CIA personnel and therefore U.S. courts could still try torture suspects, he said on Saturday."


- This would seem to indicate that to by NOT prosecuting, Obama is acting criminally: "amounts to a breach of international law"...
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lostnotforgotten Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-19-09 01:19 PM
Response to Original message
1. Kick - Obama Is No Better Than Bush Now
eom
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WilliamPitt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-19-09 01:26 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. BWAH HAH HAH HAH HAH HAH HAH HAH
That was awesome.
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lostnotforgotten Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-19-09 06:41 PM
Response to Reply #2
11. I Did Not Think You Stooped To This Level Of Troll Behavior
eom
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anigbrowl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-19-09 06:52 PM
Response to Reply #11
13. Yes, you continue to set the standard for this.
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WilliamPitt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-20-09 03:40 PM
Response to Reply #11
25. You are both lost *and* forgotten...
...if you think a post like that wouldn't get a reaction like mine.

Bye. :hi:
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-19-09 05:09 PM
Response to Reply #1
9. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
lostnotforgotten Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-19-09 06:42 PM
Response to Reply #9
12. Thank You, Well Said
eom
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Juche Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-19-09 01:27 PM
Response to Original message
3. If it takes turning Obama into an international criminal, so be it
I voted for him in 2008 and donated a good amount of time and money, and intend to do the same in 2012. But I am not an obamabot. If he wants to put himself at risk of prosecution by refusing to uphold our own laws then that is something he has to live with.

He is better than Bush though. Far better. For one thing he is closing gitmo and he released the torture memos.
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-19-09 03:43 PM
Response to Reply #3
6. Quite. He is upholding and has restored more law than * has... never mind current chaos,
regarding Pakistan and such...
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Cowpunk Donating Member (572 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-19-09 03:27 PM
Response to Original message
4. For some reason a song popped into my head when I read this.
Jordan Minnesota by Big Black(lyrics by Steve Albini)

This is Jordan, we do what we like
This is Jordan, we do what we like
Stay with me, my five year old
Stay with me, play hide and seek
Stay with me, my five year old
This is Jordan, we do what we like
And this will stay with you until you die
And this will stay with you until you die
And I will stay with you until you die
And this is Jordan, we do what we like
And this will stay with you until you die
And this will stay with you until you die
This will stay with you until you die
And I will stay with you until you die
Suck daddy, suck daddy, suck daddy, etc
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maryf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-19-09 03:41 PM
Response to Original message
5. K&R
Thanks for this... :hi:
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-19-09 03:46 PM
Response to Original message
7. Yes, as some of us tried to point out last week: it is a crime in itself
not to prosecute torture under the Geneva torture convention which is also now our law.

The thing is, of course Obama and his team know that. They seem (to me, anyway) to be trying to give themselves some time and space -- to get a handle on the situation. It's hard to blame them for that.
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ConcernedCanuk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-19-09 04:53 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. I and millions of others hope you are correct in your contention that Obama is biding his time
.
.
.

There is good reason why Bush has been compared to Hitler, and so goes the assessment for his "underlings" - although I suspect Cheney was the real leader.

They deserve to go the way of the genocidal Germans of WW2.

I don't think the USA has a chance of recouping World respect until the war criminals are brought to justice.

We are waiting . . . .

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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-19-09 05:15 PM
Response to Reply #8
10. I agree with all of that and am no lover of the "keeping his powder dry"
argument that drove me mad after Kerry's election was stolen.

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Tierra_y_Libertad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-19-09 08:17 PM
Response to Original message
14. Application of the law against torture should not be an act of political convenience.
But, one of declaring common human decency.
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diamidue Donating Member (606 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-19-09 08:45 PM
Response to Reply #14
18. Amen!! Beautifully said! Absolutely agree.
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unkachuck Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-19-09 08:36 PM
Response to Original message
15. I've heard....
...this somewhere before....

"...the United States government has no intention of prosecuting low-level CIA officers who carried out torture sanctioned by the Bush Administration."

....isn't that similar to the old Nazi argument, '...we were just following orders...'?
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Orwellian_Ghost Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-19-09 08:38 PM
Response to Original message
16. K&R
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EndElectoral Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-19-09 08:41 PM
Response to Original message
17. C'mon Barack...this decision is the moral one. Don't equivocate on this one
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flyarm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-19-09 09:31 PM
Response to Original message
19. It was in the BBC as well!! here..........
Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/2/hi/americas/8006597....

Published: 2009/04/19 00:01:02 GMT

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/8006597.stm


CIA torture exemption 'illegal'
US President Barack Obama's decision not to prosecute CIA agents who used torture tactics is a violation of international law, a UN expert says.

The UN special rapporteur on torture, Manfred Nowak, says the US is bound under the UN Convention against Torture to prosecute those who engage in it.

Mr Obama released four "torture memos" outlining harsh interrogation methods sanctioned by the Bush administration.

Mr Nowak has called for an independent review and compensation for victims.

"The United States, like all other states that are part of the UN convention against torture, is committed to conducting criminal investigations of torture and to bringing all persons against whom there is sound evidence to court," Mr Nowak told the Austrian daily Der Standard.

The memos approved techniques including simulated drowning, week-long sleep deprivation, forced nudity, and the use of painful positions
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tigereye Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-19-09 09:38 PM
Response to Original message
20. hmm, wonder if there is some benefit to considering the effects of US law
on this topic, before we worry about international law.
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-19-09 09:40 PM
Response to Original message
21. It would help to read the U.N. Rapporteur's full statement
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maryf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-19-09 09:42 PM
Response to Reply #21
22. full information is always good, nt.
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Hydra Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-20-09 09:42 AM
Response to Original message
23. Laws in America are for the little people
So are the taxes.

I suppose I should just get in line with the lockstep. "Glory to the Empire!" and all that.
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guruoo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-20-09 11:15 AM
Response to Original message
24. You'll never catch it until you quit listening to what he says and
Edited on Mon Apr-20-09 11:21 AM by guruoo
start watching his hands.




"Most importantly, there should be a comprehensive investigation undertaken by an independent body.
Whether by a special investigatory commission created by Congress or by a special investigatorthere
are different approaches. But it is quite important that the victims receive compensation. That can
be measures taken for rehabilitation, residence permits, and other approaches. Finally this should
be offered to the victims by the government, but it should also be something that can be obtained
through access to the court system. Then there must be a criminal justice path: there must be a
search for evidence which inculpates individuals. That could be individual torturers or those in the
chain of command, who directed the process. But that is a question which should be approached only
after a comprehensive investigation."

http://balkin.blogspot.com/2009/04/un-rapporteur-on-oba...
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