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TRUTH: Somali "pirates" Just Want Asia And Europe To Stop Dumping Toxic Waste On Their Shorelines

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mudesi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:16 PM
Original message
TRUTH: Somali "pirates" Just Want Asia And Europe To Stop Dumping Toxic Waste On Their Shorelines
'Toxic waste' behind Somali piracy

That, boys and girls, includes nuclear waste as well.

2005: Somalia's secret dumps of toxic waste washed ashore by tsunami


Somali sources close to the trade say that the dumped materials included radioactive uranium, lead, cadmium, mercury and industrial, hospital, chemical and various other toxic wastes.
...
In 1997 and 1998, the Italian newspaper Famiglia Cristiana, which jointly investigated the allegations with the Italian branch of Greenpeace, published a series of articles detailing the extent of illegal dumping by a Swiss firm, Achair Partners, and an Italian waste broker, Progresso.


Notice that these so called "pirates" didn't kill the American captain when he tried to escape, like, three times.

Don't follow the propaganda on TV. The Internet will set you free.
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uppityperson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:17 PM
Response to Original message
1. k&r for underlying causes
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LynnTheDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:18 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. Any chance someday America will give a shit about underlying causes?
That would sure make a nice change!
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leftstreet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:19 PM
Response to Reply #2
5. Meh, I'll wait till the movie comes out n/t
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uppityperson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:28 PM
Response to Reply #2
21. as an whole country? I don't know but it would be nice.
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LynnTheDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:30 PM
Response to Reply #21
23. I'd settle for a slim majority,
Although we may be moving that way. I hope.
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pleah Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:19 PM
Response to Original message
3. K&R There always seems to be a story behind the story. n/t
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The Velveteen Ocelot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:19 PM
Response to Original message
4. Maybe so...
But then why don't they hold hostages in exchange for not dumping toxic waste in their water, rather than just demanding money, which they do NOT use to improve the lives of their countrymen?
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doctor jazz Donating Member (474 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:19 PM
Response to Original message
6. Let's all give the pirates a big hand.
RAH RAH we love murdering thugs.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:25 PM
Response to Reply #6
17. ....!!!!
And the idiots who love them, too???

:rofl:

Succinct and to the point!

:thumbsup:
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Raineyb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 09:51 PM
Response to Reply #6
52. I'd call you a moron
but that would be an insult to actual morons.
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Renew Deal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-14-09 01:26 PM
Response to Reply #52
59. You'd call him a moron for telling the truth.
People defending the pirates are defenders of criminality.
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:20 PM
Response to Original message
7. uh, wrong. most of the pirates are simply in it for the bucks.
They don't capture ships and crews and broadcast to the world that the reason they're doing it is to draw attention to this. They're in it for the bucks. duh.
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cbayer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:20 PM
Response to Original message
8. Almost every site on the internet has a different take on the motives of these *pirates*.
A 6 month old article from Aljareerza and four year old article from the London Times are just two of them.
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msongs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:20 PM
Response to Original message
9. partial truth perhaps, plus the joy of raking in millions + having a lark w/shipping nt
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1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:20 PM
Response to Original message
10.  Somali "pirates" Just Want $$$
the real story...
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:21 PM
Response to Original message
11. Don't expect to hear that on M$Greedia
It's all Rah Rah now
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ddeclue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:22 PM
Response to Original message
12. BULL$HIT - THEY ARE IN IT FOR THE MONEY AND THE SHIPS THEY HIJACK HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH ILLEGAL
DUMPING.

YOU DON'T GET TO PUNISH OTHER INNOCENT PEOPLE FOR A CRIME COMMITTED ON YOU.

:argh:
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Fire1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:51 PM
Response to Reply #12
35. Oh no? GITMO!!
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Raineyb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 09:52 PM
Response to Reply #12
54. Tell that to the Iraqis.
I'm sure they'd be interested in that theory.
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Hello_Kitty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:22 PM
Response to Original message
13. But Larry Summers said it was okay to dump toxic waste on 3rd world countries
Because lifespans are so short in them that people will probably die from other causes before the cancer even has a chance to develop. :puke:

Great choice of an advisor there, Obama.
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MADem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:23 PM
Response to Original message
14. Stop shopping this REVISIONIST BULLSHIT. It's not TRUE.
You don't hassle SAUDIS, Indians, and AMERICANS for supposed offenses of EUROPEANS and Italians.

This "excuse" is bullshit.

It's been ripped to shreds HERE: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...


The Somalis didn't kill the pilot because he was their ONLY hope--they were surrounded, out of gas, adrift, and their "peeps" weren't coming to save them, and if they killed him, it would have been FOUR dead instead of three.

Good grief--the propaganda with this line of crap is ten feet deep.

Those Somali pirates are criminals and thugs. Anyone who cannot see that is--and I am being VERY kind in my word choice, now-- obtuse. There is no 'moral equivalency' here.
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NeedleCast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:24 PM
Response to Original message
15. Criminals Usually Do Pretend They Have Some Higher Purpose
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Bolo Boffin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:46 PM
Response to Reply #15
32. The Bush Administration certainly did. n/t
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:24 PM
Response to Original message
16. "Some pirates operating off Somalia's coast claim to act as coastguards "
Yeah, more than 50 acts of piracy in that area this year alone on ships not carry toxic waste, and these pirates are suddenly environmentalists.

I guess gullibility is possible on both sides.

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Crabby Appleton Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:26 PM
Response to Original message
18. Bullshit!
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arcadian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 09:51 PM
Response to Reply #18
53. Fine. I call bullshit on the Maersk delivering "humanitarian aid" story.
In all likelyhood they were delivering weapons.
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Hoopla Phil Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:28 PM
Response to Original message
19. Yeah, sure, that's why they ask for millions of dollars. LOL
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On the Road Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:28 PM
Response to Original message
20. Truth:
Whatever the merits of the issue, toxic waste had absoluely nothing to do with the motives of the pirates. They are poverty-stricken and for some of them, this is a goal mine.
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jpak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:29 PM
Response to Original message
22. Truth: pirates attack ships on the high seas for ransom money
If they were truly concerned with overfishing or toxic waste dumping, they could appeal to the UN or environmental NGOs for help.

Chances are they could have fostered sympathy for these issues if they had Greenpeace dispatch the Rainbow Warrior to the Somali coast and had them deal with foreign vessels engaged in illegal activities.

But they went for the guns and money...and the shit has hit the fan.
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opihimoimoi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:32 PM
Response to Original message
24. Fucking BS CRAP..toxic waste? IF the Pollution was the reason for Piracy..they would demand a clean
Edited on Sun Apr-12-09 05:34 PM by opihimoimoi
up for release of hostages...

I only saw money demanded....them Pirates could give a rats ass about pollution...
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stray cat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:37 PM
Response to Original message
25. Somali warlords are environmentalists - just like the mafia!
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1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:40 PM
Response to Reply #25
27. "environmentalists - just like the mafia!" well, tony soprano was a "waste management" consultant...
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TheCowsCameHome Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:40 PM
Response to Original message
26. These pirates have no clue about world affairs - they're only in it for the bucks.
It's a risky business, as they learned today.
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madaboutharry Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:41 PM
Response to Original message
28. I love this line:
.....so called "pirates"...

Well, what exactly are they if they are not Pirates? Going onto another ship and taking hostages makes them what then?

Cali and the others are right, your assertions here are BS.
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lumberjack_jeff Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:48 PM
Response to Reply #28
33. "So called"... you know, because they look nothing like the dread pirate Roberts.


Real pirates look like this, you know.
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paulsby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 06:13 PM
Response to Reply #28
45. reminds me of south park
"ladies and gentlemen of the supposed jury"

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seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:43 PM
Response to Original message
29. Just Want .... they dont get to kill innocents for their cause. n/t
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lumberjack_jeff Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:46 PM
Response to Original message
30. Give. Me. A. Fucking. Break.
Edited on Sun Apr-12-09 05:51 PM by lumberjack_jeff
What the pirates "just want" is money. It's more profitable to kidnap commercial crews and extort their insurers than to simply kill them and steal their stuff.

Small boat pilots are not so lucky. It's more profitable to kill them, throw the bodies overboard and sell the boat back at the "fishing" port.

The uh... "pirates" didn't kill the american captain because absent the hostage, their lives were forfeit.

http://www.yachtpiracy.org/en/dangerous_regions.htm

The fucking apologists are getting on my last nerve. These fucking pirates routinely kill skippers, crew and families to make a couple of bucks.

It's been at least a month since I've read anything this stupid.
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Uzybone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:46 PM
Response to Original message
31. without a doubt, there are many on DU who are fools
ready to believe anything that portrays the US or Obama in a bad light.

So these environmental activists board cargo ships armed with weapons and demand ransom because of toxic dumping? Can anyone be so stupid to believe that.


Plus: why would they kill the captain when he tired to escape? He was the only thing keeping them alive. Use your damn brain.
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Ian David Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 09:21 PM
Response to Reply #31
49. I'm gonna withhold judgment either way.
Let's wait until Osama Bin Pirate starts releasing tapes on the internets with his manifesto, so we know what they're all about.

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ecstatic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:50 PM
Response to Original message
34. mm hmm. Is there a site set up for donations too?
:shrug:
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1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:54 PM
Response to Reply #34
37. there should be. 3 somali citizens killed in this botched rescue attempt...
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ecstatic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:56 PM
Response to Reply #37
39. umm.. ok... Report back with how much you decide to donate nt
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1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:57 PM
Response to Reply #39
40. i should have included...
:sarcasm:

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ecstatic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 06:07 PM
Response to Reply #40
44. lol. you never quite know on DU nt
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lumberjack_jeff Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 06:24 PM
Response to Reply #37
46. Just send your credit card number to pirates@somalia.gov
The humble, honorable folk will just take what they need to stop the environmental devastation of the world's waters.

Oh... :sarcasm:
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ddeclue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 06:26 PM
Response to Reply #37
47. Not botched. They are dead on purpose as they deserve to be.
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 06:34 PM
Response to Reply #37
48. derangement strikes DU hard.
first of all, they took the captain hostage and were threatening his life. Secondly, it was anything but a botched operation. Yes, it would have been great if they could have just captured the pirates without firing a shot, but better the pirates dead than Captain Phillips.
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Bolo Boffin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:52 PM
Response to Original message
36. Is there any evidence that the money was and is being used to just clean up?
Or are they using a convenient excuse to clean up their reputation?
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alphafemale Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:54 PM
Response to Original message
38. ...and the Crips and Bloods do it for the shelter kittens.
:nopity:
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janx Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 05:57 PM
Response to Reply #38
41. !!!!!!!!
:rofl:
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Dr. Strange Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-14-09 01:22 PM
Response to Reply #38
58. You're being lied to about the Crips and Bloods!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
ALL CAPS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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comrade snarky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 06:00 PM
Response to Original message
42. They started as an ad hoc Coast Guard
Then they found out what fat targets were available in the international shipping lanes and it turned into a money making venture for the warlords.

What do you think happened to the millions in payoffs last year? Do you believe it was used for environmental cleanup or arms funding used by the clans fighting for supremacy?

Started out fairly nonviolent too but that has been changing as well, the violence has been escalating from what I've read.
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Pavulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 06:06 PM
Response to Original message
43. not one picture. Lots of jacking
no proof. The internet is like a cesspool with a few gems in it. You wade through lots of bullshit to find something worth your time.

You posts are feces, btw.

Somolia is a failed state. pirates take money..No contract exists or will exist to clean up anything.

Friend=
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Mike Daniels Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 09:40 PM
Response to Original message
50. They aren't "pirates". They are pirates.
Taking ships over by force or threat of violence is piracy.

And for those who insist on living in fastasy land...."democracy" as pirates practiced it only extended to the pirates themselves. Men from captured shipped were "pressed" into service (wow, sounds a bit like the British navy), people who refused to join up often ended up dead, women passengers were raped and more often then not slaves on captured ships were sold by the pirates for their own profit, marooned and eventually recaptured or killed.

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Prometheus Bound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 09:43 PM
Response to Original message
51. Even AP presents this as a partial explanation for the problem in its reports.
Somali pirates vow retaliation after captain freed

By MALKHADIR M. MUHUMED and MOHAMED SHEIKH NOR 23 minutes ago

...The piracy scourge appears to have evolved partly out of an attempt by Somali fishermen to protect their waters against illegal foreign trawlers who were destroying their livelihoods. Some of the vigilantes morphed into pirates, lured by the large profits they could win in ransoms.

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5juHtL...
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Prometheus Bound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 11:29 PM
Response to Reply #51
56. And the Independent mentions it as background here as well.
High seas drama as American sailors fight off pirates
Bid to steal emergency food aid foiled by son of American anti-piracy expert
By Daniel Howden in Nairobi
Thursday, 9 April 2009

...The origins of the current piracy crisis lie in the collapse of the Somali state in 1991 and the subsequent free-for-all in its coastal waters where foreign vessels have plundered incredibly rich fishing grounds. Initial clashes between foreign trawlers and local fishermen escalated to the point that ransoms began to be paid in the late 1990s.

Illegal fishing has since swollen to epidemic proportions in an industry estimated to be worth hundreds of millions of pounds annually.

Since then as many as 1,200 pirates in an estimated six gangs have emerged. It has become one of the failed state's biggest earners with pirates raking in as much as USD150m last year, according to Mr Mwangura who has been close to many of the ransom negotiations.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/africa/high-sea...
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Prometheus Bound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-13-09 03:47 AM
Response to Reply #56
57. The New York Times includes it as background as well.
Somali Pirates Tell Their Side: They Want Only Money

.....The piracy industry started about 10 to 15 years ago, Somali officials said, as a response to illegal fishing. Somalias central government imploded in 1991, casting the country into chaos. With no patrols along the shoreline, Somalias tuna-rich waters were soon plundered by commercial fishing fleets from around the world. Somali fishermen armed themselves and turned into vigilantes by confronting illegal fishing boats and demanding that they pay a tax.

From there, they got greedy, said Mohamed Osman Aden, a Somali diplomat in Kenya. They starting attacking everyone.

By the early 2000s, many of the fishermen had traded in their nets for machine guns and were hijacking any vessel they could catch: sailboat, oil tanker, United Nations-chartered food ship.

Its true that the pirates started to defend the fishing business, Mr. Mohamed said. And illegal fishing is a real problem for us. But this does not justify these boys to now act like guardians. They are criminals. The world must help us crack down on them.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/01/world/africa/01pirate...
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TroglodyteScholar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-12-09 10:13 PM
Response to Original message
55. The fact that people like you exist on DU is a testament to two facts:
Edited on Sun Apr-12-09 10:14 PM by TroglodyteScholar
A) We are a big tent, and

B) We can't all have functioning brains in our skulls.

:shrug:
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Jennicut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-14-09 01:28 PM
Response to Original message
60. This meme ceased to be taken seriously once they attacked ships that bring aid to other African
countries. Now its just crap. Attacking innocent people who are trying to bring relief supplies to Africa really is so incredibly heroric. Sorry, that is the funniest thing I have heard all day. Yes, dumping waste/taking advantage of the Somali coast was wrong but two wrongs never make a right. And they killed someone on a french boat already. Its greed. I understand the circumstances that many of these people find themselves in but it benefits a few warlords. They hire young kids to do their dirty work.
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Mudoria Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-14-09 01:49 PM
Response to Reply #60
65. That is, if any actual dumping took place.
I have serious doubts about that to begin with. Foreign trawlers yes, although why they would be trawling in polluted waters is another story. Hmmm....
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hugo_from_TN Donating Member (895 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-14-09 01:42 PM
Response to Original message
61. Kids keep dumping trash in my yard. That's why I'm planning to hold up the convenience store.
I just want to raise attention to this littering problem.
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slackmaster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-14-09 01:44 PM
Response to Original message
62. Don't follow the propaganda on TV - Follow Al Jazeera propaganda instead
:crazy:
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anonymous171 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-14-09 01:45 PM
Response to Original message
63. Then they should only hijack European and Asian ships. nt
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HooptieWagon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-14-09 01:47 PM
Response to Original message
64. Oh great. Yet another pity-party for the poor misunderstood eco-crusaders.
If the piracy is a reaction to illegal dumping, then please explain why they have murdered Yemeni fishermen, stolen their boats, hijacked Saudi supertankers, held Filipino crewmen hostage, and most recently hijacked a freighter flagged in St Vincent/Grenadines (which is in the carribean). What have any of those countries done, other than peacefully carrying out commerce? And why have the "noble eco-crusaders" spent their ransom booty on satellite dishes, 4x4s, and more weapons, rather than cleaning up the alleged pollution?

If there is evidence of illegal dumping, then the Somalis should produce it. otherwise, they should quit using it as a lame excuse to commit criminal acts like murder, hostage-taking, and piracy.
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LanternWaste Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-14-09 01:54 PM
Response to Original message
66. You can of course point us to a relevant...
You can of course point us to a valid, peer-reviewed, independent analysis which states emphatically that the proceeds the Somalian pirates have "received" from taking over merchant ships is being used directly for regional eco-reclamation, yes?

And possibly an analysis of precisely how the pirates are using this money to regionally reform the region into an eco-sustainable area?


Boys and girls who tend to inform me that the telly is full of propaganda seem to omit that that the internet has quite a few propaganda sites as well (but I'm sure the sites you link to are independent, valid, and above reproach-- it's merely the ones that contradict yours that are propaganda.... such is the way of the world).
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slackmaster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-14-09 01:55 PM
Response to Original message
67. I want people to stop dumping toxic waste there too
But for some strange reason I don't rob people, or kidnap them and hold them for ransom.
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BulletproofLandshark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-14-09 01:56 PM
Response to Original message
68. Un fucking real.
I never thought I'd see goddamn apologists for piracy on DU.

There is NO justification for piracy, and those Somali pirates should have known what was coming to them when they decided to fuck with one of ours. And the only reason they didn't kill the captain was because he was their only leverage.
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