Ten cars that sank Detroit

[MrPerson]

http://autos.yahoo.com/articles/autos_content_landing_pages/924/The-Cars-That-Drove-Detroit-s-Customers-Away;_ylc=X3oDMTE2ZWZhNmtvBF9TAzI3MTYxNDkEc2VjA2ZwLXRvZGF5BHNsawNkcm92ZS1hd2F5

The global financial crisis is suffocating the Detroit automakers, but the problems at General Motors, Ford, and Chrysler have been festering for years—even when the mighty "Big Three" were earning billions. Aging factories, inflexible unions, arrogant executives and shoddy quality have all damaged Detroit. Now, with panicky consumers fleeing showrooms, catastrophe looms:



There will be plenty of business-school case studies analyzing all the automakers' wrong turns. But, as they say in the industry, it all comes down to product. So here are 10 cars that help explain the demise of Detroit: GM and Chrysler need a multibillion-dollar government bailout to survive, and both could be in bankruptcy by summer if they don't meet tough government demands. Ford hasn't asked for a bailout—yet—but it's bleeding cash and racing the clock to turn itself around.


It was just shitty cars.

[tabasco]

1. And the Vega deserves the top spot.

That POS would make a Yugo look good.

[Carni]

46. I had two of those

POS doesn't quite cover it (and no I didn't choose them or buy them lol)

[obiwan]

51. My friend had a Vega GT.

The oil filter mount (threaded) was an integral part of the aluminum engine block.

Wouldn't you know, they cross-threaded the oil filter on the mount at the factory. It cost my friend hundreds of dollars the first time he had to change the oil.

BTW, GM had to sell the Nova in Latin America under a different name. In Spanish, Nova means "won't go."

Mercury had similar problems with the Caliente. Apparently, "Caliente" is Spanish slang for "Lady Of The Evening."

[Berry Cool]

57. Actually, the stuff about "Nova" = "won't go" is an urban legend.

I never heard the Caliente story, but I wouldn't be surprised if it's a legend too.

I say this only because the REAL boneheaded marketing done in Detroit is bad enough, without crediting them for dumb things they didn't do.

[liberal N proud]

2. Those are cars from the 70's & 80's

And it took that long to bring Detroit down?

[AllentownJake]

3. Actually it has alot to do with it

Remember while they were making those shitty cars. Japan was importing better cars. The impression that it was good to buy American took a big hit.

[NashVegas]

26. My Sister Had *Both* a Mustang II and Later, a Dodge Omni

Kiss of death, or what?

I had a Shadow for a little while, liked it just fine. What I hated about 1980s/1990s Chrysler was the suspension. Eventually they always felt like a box on wheels.

[Berry Cool]

59. My sisters could beat you on that.

Oldest one owned a used Maverick and then a new Omni. Second had a used Pinto with the exploding gas tank.

Oh, and the oldest later got a used Buick LeSabre whose frame just up and broke while we were riding around.

The likely reason for this foolishness was that my mother did the car shopping. She didn't know jack about cars and didn't bother to educate herself before going to a used car lot. Dealers must have seen the word "SUCKER" painted on her forehead when she walked into the place. She was always convinced she had gotten my sisters a deal, poor woman. Yeah, she did--she had them paying off cars that had gone to the junkyard years earlier.

[liberal N proud]

39. I have always owned an American car and

never had quality problems.

Most of it was perceived. The last toyota I drove was piece of shit though. Was glad to get back in my Chrysler.

[MrPerson]

4. There's at least one from the 90's

But the damage was done in the 70s and 80s.

I remember my 1984 Ford Escort. It was a piece of shit.

[hobbit709]

5. 4 of those are from the 90's and on to today.

[obiwan]

52. You gotta start somewhere.

[Zynx]

60. Detroit's decline was slow and painful. It started in the 1970s and they didn't change.

[hobbit709]

6. Let us not forget the Infamous Ford Flaming Deathmobile-the Pinto.

[jdadd]

10. The Pinto wasn't mentioned.....

But the Mustang II was....Mustang II was built on the Pinto platform...:thumbsdown:

[Berry Cool]

61. Used to ride around in the back of my sister's. I remember it well.

Looking back through the hatch to see who was tailgating us with an evil look on their face, wondering how much time I'd have to escape if they rammed us and the thing went up in flames.

[dixiegrrrrl]

7. And Ford's CEO...21 million dollar take home salary, I read.

May have included bonus...dunno.

[MrPerson]

9. That shit can't go on forever.

[greenbriar]

8. My first car was a Vega

hey what was the name of that car that looked like it was a bubble?

lots of windows and kind of round?

[jdadd]

11. AMC Pacer?

[greenbriar]

14. yes, I think it was the pacer

totally ridiculous car

pretty dangerous

[greenbriar]

16. here is the most dangerous car in my opinion

[Mike 03]

24. Aw, my first car was a pacer handed down from my dad.

I LOVED the Pacer. People are way too hard on the car. If you could see what I put my Pacer through in the mid 80s you would be astonished.

[obiwan]

53. The Pacer was designed for the Wankel (rotary) engine...

... which was quite a bit shorter than the standard engine.

When AMC couldn't come up with the licensing money to manufacture the rotary engine, they had to shoehorn their trusty straight six engine which had all 6 cylinders in a row and had been designed in the early 1950's.

When installed, the back two spark plugs were inaccesible by normal means (They were under the dashboard). The engine had to be partially removed in order to change these two spark plugs.

Hilarious!

[Rincewind]

12. AMC Pacer nt.

[htuttle]

18. AMC Pacer

Time named the "glassine bolus of dorkiness" (their words) the worst car of 1975-1989. It was apparently designed by the same madman that designed the Gremlin.

http://www.time.com/time/specials/2007/article/0,28804,1658545_1658533_1658042,00.html

[rucky]

58. mine too

it was a beautiful shade of primer with rust accents

[POAS]

13. What? No Gremlins or Pacers?

[machI]

15. Ten Cars

Toyota Prius
Honda Civic
Datsun Pickup
Mercedes W126 S-Class
Hyundai Sonata
Kia Sorento
Porsche 911
Audi Quattro
Volkswagen Golf


I only wish number 10 on my list would be Public Transportation

[Captain Hilts]

17. And paying skyrocketing medical benefits for current and retired employees. nt

[OwnedByFerrets]

19. Bull Shit

[MrPerson]

21. Read the horror stories.

[jdadd]

20. I do have to give kudos to.....

My ford Taurus lasted 365,000 miles, was still running when I waved goodbye to it.

Also 1981 Ford F-150 188,000 miles, still running strong when I waved goodbye to it.

[Igel]

40. I'm not sure I want our Ford Taurus to last 365k miles.

I mean, it's a '92 (which means it was bought in fall '91), with 46k miles on it. Let's say it's 17 years old.

If it gets to 365k miles at this rate, it has another 117 years to go. (It's on its third set of tires--the first two didn't so much wear out as just crack.)

[SoCalDem]

22. "Generous offers" from non-union southern states

is a large part of why they failed..

Instead of innovating and updating the facilities they had, and the experienced, well-paid workforce, they threw it away in exchange for cheap southern labor, and that was a start towards "saving" even more , by outsourcing..

they learned that they could just toss people away, without looking back, and once out of sight & mind, they could concentrate on stealing away earned benefits of the ones they threw away..all for the almighty profit...except that a whole bunch of people who USED to be able to afford their cars, now could not...and the "new" workforce was not being apid enough to pull themselves out of a deeply ingrained poverty, built up over a century of bad governance & neglect..

[KG]

23. hidebound, overbloated and overpaid management sunk Detriot

the cars are just the result of their arrogance and stupidity.

[Blue_Tires]

30. +1

and too many people assume the foreign automakers never made a poor-selling clunker before...

[Mike 03]

25. I hate it when people make fun of the Pacer. That was one fucking great car. NT

[MrPerson]

27. I loved my Escort to death. But it was a lemon.

[depakid]

37. Ford Escorts in America weren't the same as Escorts overseas

Americans got a bucket of bolts by that name- Brits got a fine handling car.

To this day, it's difficult to compehend why that was.

[Stevenmarc]

28. How could they forget when Ford created the Merkur line

And the saddest part of the story is that Fords creation of a new luxury brand caused Honda to create Acura and we see how that turned out.

[Carni]

47. OMG Those were also horrendous

Not just horrendous but hugely expensive to fix!

[LostInAnomie]

29. I don't agree with the Neon being on there.

I've never known anyone to ever have any trouble with their Neon. For all the bitching that guy does about the three speed, for a long time the Neon was the second fastest production car Dodge had to offer. I've driven quite a few and I've always found them to be fun little cars to drive.

This article seems to be mostly bitching from malcontents.

I do agree about the Aztek. That was the ugliest piece of shit to ever fall out of Detroit's ass.

[GoCubsGo]

34. The Aztec reminds me of....

...Clark Griswold's Wagon Queen Family Truckster. I think the guys who designed it must have seen too many "National Lampoon" movies:

[obiwan]

54. The entire drivetrain of the Neon is used on the PT Cruiser.

The PT is a reliable car that hauls a shitload of stuff while getting reasonable fuel mileage. If you went to a "dumping ground" dealer here in Southern California, you could get a PT brand new with a 5 speed and A/C for $12,000-13,000. Mine averaged 26 mpg and on a good day could get 31 mpg on the highway.

Bad thing is that the car is made in a "maquiladora" in Mexico.

PS The Chevy HHR, which looks a lot like the PT (but is a lot more expensive) is affectionately known by PT owners as the "me too Cruiser."

[Stinky The Clown]

31. I love that framing in the article ..... "inflexible unions" ...... kiss my concessioned-to-death as

[tomreedtoon]

56. Stinky, I think "unconscious unions" is more like it.

They must have known they were building crap vehicles, based on the designs management approved. Why didn't they say anything about it? Didn't they know that by building bad vehicles their own jobs and benefits would be at risk? And on a more spiritual level, did they actually think they were building quality, or did the workers adopt the same "the public be damned" attitude as management?

I have no doubt that management drove the ship into the iceberg, but didn't the guys doing the rowing know it - or try to do anything about it?

[Urban Prairie]

32. Seems that whenever Detroit, and automobiles are a topic on DU

MrPerson has posted or created it, maybe he is a disgruntled former owner of a domestic vehicle or vehicles, or works in the Japanese, Korean, or German automotive related business. "Personally" if people hate Detroit and/or its vehicles, I really don't care, I have owned some of the cars that people dislike, and never had any trouble with them, EVER, and loved to customize them and make mechanical upgrades w/o using computers. I owned a '69 Nova SS 327, and a '72 Camaro Z28 amongst many others, and noticed that some that are still around in good condition or have been restored are selling for BIG $$$ as investments. I really doubt if "classic" Japanese "iron" will ever attain as much of the high-priced collectible status that Detroit iron has, especially if GM, Chrysler, and less likely Ford disappear forever.

I would love to be able to afford one of the classic cars my hometown designed and produced in the late 60s and early 70s, before the cheap gas sipping Japanese automobiles conveniently appeared after the Arab oil embargo in '74, with no tariffs slapped on them, and no legacy costs and medical insurance burdening their product development and improvements. The Woodward Cruise each August in metro Detroit takes me back to the days of pocket change being enough to fill my gas tank, and REAL ground-rumbling horsepower instead of fuel injected and computer aided.

[obiwan]

55. How much money did your mechanics make off you over the years?

Study mechanical engineering and tell me Detroit iron was well designed.

Daily drivers of these makes are long gone.

Detroit's mantra during this period?

"Planned Obsolescence."

[rollingrock]

33. And if it weren't for Japanese competition

we'd still be driving those Vegas, Gremlins, and Pacers to this day because Detroit would have had no incentive to improve their crappy products.

[Doremus]

35. There was a Cadillac model in the late 70s or early 80s that

was basically a glorified economy model.

I watched an interview with a former GM exec who said that car ruined the Cadillac brand.

[Stevenmarc]

36. The Cimarron

[cherokeeprogressive]

44. The Cadillac Cimarron was a glorified Chevy Cavalier. I helped build them.

I worked at the South Gate, CA GM plant until the day it closed. That's where they were made. We laughed our asses off at the sticker price that was double that of the Cavalier. The day the plant closed, we had something like a 200 day supply of Cimarrons sitting at the plant.

Memories... That day, when I got to work, there was a HAND LETTERED cardboard sign over the door. LAST SHIFT it said. On my way home, I stopped at the Navy recruiting office, and began the process of joining.

[Barack_America]

38. I knew the Neon was going to be on there.

I had one of those.

Piece. of. shit.

Worst car I ever owned.

[Bigmack]

41. Corvair? nt

[daleo]

42. They should have included the Hummer

That's a good example of the mentality that sank Detroit.

[IDemo]

43. I loved my Mustang II

or "Cobra II". It had a 302 V8, with just an Edelbrock manifold and a Holley 650 carb added for a little extra performance. Never had a speck of trouble with it and it was a joy to drive.
Goofy looking as all get out, I know, but I liked it.

[BlooInBloo]

45. Any such list lacking the Nova is stupid... Fiero should be on there too.

[Carni]

48. Fieros--what great braking systems

And so fabulous in rain and snow NOT!

[kwassa]

49. This is a fairly bullshit argument.

the writer ignores the changes the Big 3 have made in improving their quality in the past 15 years. It took them a long time to lose market share, and it will take it a long time to get it back, but as an analysis this is weaker than many others that have been written.

Yes, they screwed up in the '70s, but most of it is simply that is costs the foreign companies less to build cars, hence they can build higher quality for lower cost to the consumer. It is mostly about globalization of industry, which has destroyed all kinds of manufacturing in the United States, in many different industries. It is about the basic labor wage plus benefits.

[kwassa]

50. This is a fairly bullshit argument.

the writer ignores the changes the Big 3 have made in improving their quality in the past 15 years. It took them a long time to lose market share, and it will take it a long time to get it back, but as an analysis this is weaker than many others that have been written.

Yes, they screwed up in the '70s, but most of it is simply that is costs the foreign companies less to build cars, hence they can build higher quality for lower cost to the consumer. It is mostly about globalization of industry, which has destroyed all kinds of manufacturing in the United States, in many different industries. It is about the basic labor wage plus benefits, or lack thereof in non-union auto plants.