What happened to Democratic Underground?

[EmilyAnne]

Is there any clinical explanation for what has happened here?
I am really surprised at what I have since Obama's Special Olympics joke.

Since when do Democrats demean a minority demographic for getting their feelings hurt about an offhand comment?
Yes, Obama's comment was a mistake. Its not a big deal. He apologized. I was never "outraged" by the comment.
Sure, based on some personal experiences it hurt my feelings momentarily. Still, I never once thought that Obama said it in an attempt to hurt or demean anyone.
Obviously, it wasn't a mean-spirited comment in the least. Just a mistake.

The thing that has me actually on the point of being truly outraged for the first time on DU is the constant bashing of people who were hurt.
Calling them fakers, people who are just looking for any reason to be outraged, people who are babies, whiners, humorless PC police who don"t REALLY care about disabled people.

This is bizarre.
The majority of DUers posting about this are acting as is if there is absolutely, positively no way in hell that any person could have been legitimately hurt by Obama's comment. Even worse, some are celebrating the comment as such a "refreshing" thing. "Its so nice to have a president who can just be himself." "Its great that he isn't a slave to those horrible, phony, PC obsessives."

This is the kind of stuff I would expect to see on Free Republic any time a sexist, homophobic or racist comment is scrutinized.

Obama apologized because he mistakenly said something that was hurtful to some people.
Having a brain and a big heart, he immediately apologized.
The end.
He will be forgiven by most people who were hurt and then he will continue to work on behalf of disabled Americans.

However, its the dismissive, mocking and sometimes downright MEAN attitude that I have been seeing on DU that has me both upset and confused.

[leftstreet]

1. Skinner ran out of bumperstickers and has been handing out crack n/t

[beac]

8. Wait! There was crack??? All I got was some cheap gin and a bottle of No-Doz.

:mad:

[keroro gunsou]

80. meh

all i got was a lousy box of boxed wine someone stole from the lounge....

now since i haven't seen or heard what the president said last night that's gotten everyone's collective panties in a wad, i won't comment on that. however, i will comment on the reaction. smart people, can, and often say some of the most mind bogglingly stupid things from time to time. context is everything.

now to go see what all that hubbub is about... *wanders off to you tube*

[EmilyAnne]

9. I wonder if Skinner would get on the band wagon, saying such things about these people who were

legitimately offended. I seriously doubt it.

[LostinVA]

86. I know he doesn't allow "retard" and "retarded" on here -- he told me so in a PM last year

And, teh Mods are great about deleting their usage. I LOATHE those terms.

[Kajsa]

100. Thank You, LostinVA!

I didn't know that Skinner and the mods have an official stance
on the use of those phrases.That's very good info to have.

YES, 'retard' used as a put down is the 'N' word to disabled people.
I know, just ask my son.

Thank you for understanding that and spreading the word.

:yourock: :pals:

[LostinVA]

106. I alert every single time I see it -- I HATE it

[Kajsa]

121. Thank you!

:hug:

[lumberjack_jeff]

122. Me too. n/t

[PatrynXX]

313. actually

actually saying the term "N" word is also offensive. on some it's worse than saying the word. One should just refer to it as a racial epitaph.


But bashing other Dems isn't all that cool. Republicans are breaking their own Ronald Reagan rule, we don't need to act like them.

[LostinVA]

333. Who here is bashing Dems??? I don't see anyone in this thread doing that

:wtf:

[EmilyAnne]

413. Thank you so much, LostinVA. You get it. n.t

[Usrename]

244. What about Freeptard?

It seems like it would be offensive too. Is it? :hide: Does a jury have to be convened?

[jeff30997]

249. The jury is out and...

From now on you have to spell it Freepturd. :D

[tosh]

275. That is sooo much better!

:thumbsup:

[Usrename]

396. I think we have a winner!

:thumbsup:

I want to thank the jury for their careful deliberations.

[TWiley]

250. What about Republitarded?

[LostinVA]

255. Honestly? I don't like that, either

Though I don't tend to alert on it.

[Jackpine Radical]

339. Morans?

There has been a sort of political-correctness infinite regress over the years. At one time, three levels of cognitive disability were recognized: Idiot, imbecile, and moron, corresponding roughly to the current labels of severe, moderate, and mild mental retardation. Years ago, when I worked a lot with developmentaly disabled people, there was a national association, the AAMD: American Association on Mental Deficiencies. This was subsequently seen as insensitive, so they changed their name to AAMR, substituting the word "retardation" for "deficiencies." By the time they did this, however, the rest of the world had already moved on to"developmental disabilities," quickly followed by "cognitively challenged," "differently abled," and a host of other more politically correct terms.

[LostinVA]

395. "Retard" is not acceptable

[Jackpine Radical]

400. ...and never was.

[rtassi]

274. "Outrage" and "Offense" like everything else ...

are choices ... with no real legitimacy ... containing no purpose or constructive properties ... serving only the mind identified ego.

"what you resist persists"

peace
rt

[Mithreal]

308. "what you resist persists" What about Gandhi? nt

[GentryDixon]

49. That reminds me. I haven't received my bumper sticker.

Nor my crack!:7

[OhioChick]

207. Priceless....

:spray: :rofl:

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

2. ...

:nopity:

[EmilyAnne]

3. Wow. Perfect example here. I can't believe this.

[LostinVA]

87. Not a surprise at all

[lumberjack_jeff]

116. He's training in the hope that being an asshole will become an olympic event.

[Midlodemocrat]

119. I foresee a medal sweep.

[omega minimo]

149. the 50 meter dasshole

[lumberjack_jeff]

167. Buttathalon. n/t

[omega minimo]

172. LOL

:rofl:

Troll Vault


(NOT ACCUSING anyone, what else rhymes????)

[TLM]

317. How hateful....

Your use of the term asshole is highly hurtful and insensitive to those suffering from colorectal cancer.

Maybe you should think more about your choice of words, and not use the victims of this horrible disease as a foil for your insults?

[LostinVA]

335. Making light of this is neither funny nor clever

[TLM]

341. How does one make light of something that's already so ridiculous.

The hyper-PC language garbage is already so completely foolish and ridiculous, that my "making light" of it, is like farting in a sewer.

[QC]

365. Ignored is neither funny nor clever. n/t

[EmilyAnne]

414. You're a real gem, TLM. Why does it make you so angry for someone else to have a sensitivity where

you do not?

Its a very strange thing that I notice in a lot of people.
If a black person sees racism where another person does not, the response is often anger and an unwillingness to see that the offended party is truly offended. And then personal attacks against the offended person along with ridiculous claims that now people can't say ANYTHING without offending someone.
Why? What's it to you?

[L0oniX]

11. ...

[EmilyAnne]

24. The thing is if I told you about my personal involvement in the Special Olympics and what it means

to me. If I told you about the person that I loved and cheered on many years ago, you would feel like an asshole.
Or maybe not, who knows.
At this point, I don't care if you do feel bad.
You simply don't deserve to know anything about her story.
I really can't believe this.
All of you taking this position are being such assholes.

[L0oniX]

79. How about I tell you mine. A rock band I was in used to play for dances for mentally handicapped

organizations for free every year. You prejudging me is what I'd call being an asshole.

[omega minimo]

158. so you waited til after the gig to imitate their dancing?

:popcorn:

[HughMoran]

279. That was uncalled for

:wtf:

[omega minimo]

311. Actually

(did I forget the :sarcasm: ?)


Actually his comments, hostility and thing about the band as if it means something make that a reasonable question.

Did he answer "No"?

Did he say it warmed his heart to see the kids having fun?

NO. Two people who took it seriously replied and he didn't.

His other posts show his arrogance toward others,

If he doesn't get the concept, you think there was no one in that band making jokes? Not likely.

He said they played once a year,

Like that meant something.

For free!! :hi:

[Reterr]

303. Good grief

:thumbsdown: :eyes:

[EmilyAnne]

175. Yeah. Some of my best friends happen to be African-Americans. And my uncle is gay.

Give me a break. Please, tell me this is a put-on. Tell me that you don't really think this way.

[L0oniX]

180. I don't care what the hell you think ...I just don't care. I don't care at all.

I won't even care if you put me on ignore. I don't care if you believe me or not. I just don't care at all. pffft

[omega minimo]

208. At least you're consistent

Don't care about nobody else :banghead:

[CTyankee]

98. Thank you. You are doing a good thing. n/t

[TLM]

321. Then that makes you a hypocrite...

"At this point, I don't care if you do feel bad."

And yet you demand everyone else censor their words and alter their behavior to ensure that you never feel bad.

[EmilyAnne]

389. Said directly to a person who can defend himself, who was being a jerk. To state that someone's

feelings were hurt is not censorship, you idiot.
Are you Ann Coulter?
My demand to censor and alter behavior by stating how I feel and why I think some people are selfish assholes?
Wow. Its like 1984 here.

[livefreest]

251. NOT COOL

[Uzybone]

4. Every other week since I've been here

there is always someone lamenting the state of DU. This board ain't changed much IMO.

Some always take the opinions of a few and use that to justify a screed in which they say this board has changed. It's old.

[GoneOffShore]

10. Hammer meet nail.

Thank you.

[TWiley]

21. I think it has changed .... a whole lot in the past 6 years.

We used to be more united against bush, and there was more activists who acually did something besides bitch.

Now it seems that DU has become more split into warring little factions. Guns, Religion, Sexuality, Education, Peace, or even Environmental issues seem to be discussed with more anger, and less tolerance.

[Uzybone]

36. I can't disagree with the splintering and the decline in civility

that part has definitely gotten worse.

[marshall]

66. It's a natural evolution

Your summary is on target in my opinion. Bush united disparate people to this site with a common cause. He is no longer president and the Democrats control both houses of Congress. The entire dynamic of our country's politics have changed, and it's only natural that the dynamic here would hcnage as well.

[omega minimo]

155. Also a natural regression of decades of poisoned political discourse, screen anonymity, ADD &

lack of reading comprehension.............

A nation divided by media mindfucking, sharp elbowing each other and mindblown by a politician who reminds us after decades of 'Greed Is Good:"

We're All In This Together.

[Mithreal]

310. ADD does not belong in this list. See Thom Hartmann.

Omega, did you misspeak?

[omega minimo]

312. Probably.

i used it as shorthand for "shortened attention span" to fit in the top line.

Both have become so epidemic, I thought it would make sense. :hi:

Thom is the best, altho I haven't heard him on ADD.

[Mithreal]

319. He has ADD and has written books on it. I have ADD as well.

I figured it was a misspeak, take care : )

[omega minimo]

328. Thank you.

:thumbsup: I'll do some googlin'

[TLM]

344. How very offensive and hypocritical of you....

ADD is a learning disorder... so let me get this straight.

Making fun of people with attention deficit disorder is OK... but mentioning the special olympics in a offhanded comment is a horrible offensive insult to human dignity?

[omega minimo]

352. how very confused and confrontational of you......

Are you trying to be mixed up or just mixed up?

"Making fun of people with attention deficit disorder is OK... but mentioning the special olympics in a offhanded comment is a horrible offensive insult to human dignity?"

"Making fun"? Far from it.

"mentioning the special olympics in a offhanded comment is a horrible offensive insult to human dignity?"

Who and what the hell are you talking about? Not me. Read my OP in GD if you want to know what I think about that.

I've already been called on the ADD reference (by someone a bit calmer than you) if you don't mind reading the posts above yours.

[TLM]

367. Sorry i couldn't hear you ....

...over the sound of your screaming hypocrisy.

" so you waited til after the gig to imitate their dancing?"

[omega minimo]

369. Willful ignorance. Your choice.

:thumbsdown:

[TLM]

377. Your use of the term ignorant....

Your use of the term ignorant... is very insensitive to those who live with or know someone who sufferers from a learning disorder.

Your words have hurt me deeply and you should apologize for attacking the most vulnerable among us.

Isn't poutrage fun.... weee pay attention to me.

[omega minimo]

384. Rinse and Repeat

:crazy:

[TLM]

334. I disagree...

I've been here since 03 and I haven't seen much of a change either.

There's always been a core of moderates who basically agree on most issues and a fringe of extremists who disagree with everyone but other extremists.

The funny thing is that extremists are the same, regardless of which end of the spectrum they fall on... in that they are all thriving on anger. Be it a far left wacko or a far right wacko, they seem to find anger to be like a security blanket. They feed on it and spread it around. They look for things to get angry about. For an extremist, being offended to anger is usually not a genuine emotional reaction, but rather a tactical choice.

[sandnsea]

38. Yep. There have always been freepers and purity trolls

and chronic malcontents who never have a good thing to say about anybody to the right of mao tse tung.

[Missy Vixen]

40. I've been here since 2001

Feel free to check my profile.

In the meantime, I used to say that this site hadn't changed. It has, and it's accelerated over the past two years.

>Some always take the opinions of a few and use that to justify a screed in which they say this board has changed.<

The wheels started coming off the bus the day Reagan died. I am no Reagan fan. At the same time, the stuff I read made me sick to identify myself with this site. The comments have gotten progressively worse since. The ability to hide behind a keyboard makes bullies out of those who'd slink away if you met them IRL.

There are several here I am fortunate enough to be friends with in that real life I spoke of. There are others here that, due to their demonstrated intolerance and bigotry, I wouldn't go out of my way to speak with.

It's the difference between those who are adult enough to put themselves in someone else's shoes, and those who aren't. When we act like those we despise, we become them.

[Vanje]

345. Agreed

This "member since 2001" sees it too. There has been a recent change here at DU.

[omega minimo]

354. Yes we all know how empathetic you are

"t's the difference between those who are adult enough to put themselves in someone else's shoes, and those who aren't."

[LostinVA]

88. No, it has chenged ALOT in the last 12-14 months

[SoCalDem]

115. Amen.. I find myself suddenly able to stay away for longer and longer periods of time

I used to check it constantly to see who was here, and what they were saying, but not so much anymore..

Lots of the oldies have moved on, and so many angry people seemk to have shown up, ready to "fight" on any side of any issue..just to fight.. So much heat..so little light:)

[glitch]

202. "So much heat, so little light"

couldn't agree more.

[omega minimo]

209. yet drawn back

like moths to a flame :think: :hi:

[glitch]

211. True, but not so much as I used to be.

Perhaps that's a good thing ;) :hi:

[omega minimo]

213. aye matey

:hi: it's a big world out there

[Control-Z]

I agree with your time frame.

Before that, this bleeding heart liberal seldom worried about stating an opinion. Compassion was celebrated here. It was one of the greatest distinctions between us and them.

[HughMoran]

283. I said the same in other words below

I completely agree - this happens all the time here.

Nothing to see here - move along peeps...

[NeedleCast]

304. Its The Way of the Message Boards

Even if a board remained nearly totally unchanged (as DU has) over many years, there'd still be someone getting outraged over something and posting a screed about how the board has gone downhill.

[monmouth]

5. DU is starting to sound like Morning Joe, getting intolerable...n/t

[WHAT]

247. the shildren feel a need...

to express themselves?

oops (shrug)

anyway, probably sold 2003, 2004 fer sure

what I mostly see is a proliferation of subsets (kinda a divide and conquer gone astray) but it's not like in the olde days where a rent in the fabric of discussion was like a pool of blood under a dead body, more like a super-imposed circulation system over-riding a prime objective ...a change in the over-arching architecture of circulation, if you will.

the body politic might be arching its...neck coming into something superseding old geography.

it's the fact that the form is changing, not the discussion, that seems important. it's like evergreen to deciduous, even to odd ...it's an evolutionary shift in the flowering of thought that is forming...out of control, i think. the architecture is more important than the bull shift

prehaps...i've been reading here for a long time and i miss what i see as lacking but stagnate is less interesting as fresh, so, probably a failed experiment in social engineering.

and allthelil' darlings on a new morning with their clever hats and spring bouquets might go unrecognized in the brightness of a genuine equinox despite the contrivance of the 'passe

the fact that du has devolved and might win an award that every one knows is only less than third best because it is supported by the mediocracy of shildren

progress will elbow its way forward under an arbor of its own making fragrant

[EFerrari]

6. People feel entitled, no, obligated, to share their reactions on the intertubes

as if they were precious jewels. Too bad keyboards work faster than brain cells.

I don't think it's DU. :shrug:

[Davis_X_Machina]

15. 90+ threads started on this topic...

...in less than 24 hours.

All with unique insights unavailable in any of the other 89 threads. No overlap. No drive-bys.

[EFerrari]

18. We're very special, what can I say.

lol

:hi:

[BurtWorm]

26. I noticed that as well.

Not one word wasted on this vital subject.

[EmilyAnne]

29. All with the same idiotic responses bashing anyone who way have been hurt. All of them.

I looked. Yes, I have been following this more closely than other topics on DU because I was hoping these opinions would be exceptions rather than the norm.

[TWiley]

252. People are angry, and they look for opportunites to express it

They read something wrong into a posters comment to justify their pent-up lambasting. Lots of strawman and red herring activity also.

[Mithreal]

318. And political education so poor while talking politics face to face considered uncivil

My sense is that people are just less inhibited, not so much coming to DU to look for ways to vent anger.

Reading something wrong into a poster's comments is more of a symptom of the pain that is out there and the expectation that DU is supposed to be an oasis from the insanity.

A lot of folks were never taught how to identify and counter a logical fallacy, let alone to never use them.

[omega minimo]

420. "A lot of folks were never taught how to identify and counter a logical fallacy, let alone to never"

"A lot of folks were never taught how to identify and counter a logical fallacy, let alone to never use them."

That may be the Best. Post. Ever. Run it as an OP, fill it out a bit. That's briliant. We have lots of generational threads and conflicts. That point is key.

With today's financial news, I've been thinking a lot about

:yourock:

"Reading something wrong into a poster's comments is more of a symptom of the pain that is out there and the expectation that DU is supposed to be an oasis from the insanity."

Well put, only problems arise when people think it's their own personal private privileged oasis from their own version of the insanity. When it's not, they PROJECT.

[TahitiNut]

31. Every bowel movement is a matter of pride for the permanently infantilized.

"Oh! Look at my doodoo, Mommy!!"

I doubt they know much of the world beyond toilet training. :shrug:

[EFerrari]

32. Then maybe Skinner should be sending out Pampers when we get to 1000 posts

and not bumperstickers.

:rofl:

[truedelphi]

39. Please - as an almost elderly almost incontinent person

I am OFFENDED.

I am not yet ready to wear Pampers. (Unless I laugh too hard.)

[Bonobo]

148. +1.

Dead on.

[NJmaverick]

7. If one tries hard enough nearly every statement could find a group to claim outrage

I think people are getting a little tired of the tyranny of those that play the PC game. There is a certain spine chilling loss of freedom that comes with these ideas.

[EmilyAnne]

14. Oh, great. So, when it comes to the Special Olympics, well, enough is enough.

Yes, brilliant. Loss of freedom to what??? Say something in error and then apologize for it because you acknowledge the legitimate hurt you accidentally caused?
The tyranny of the families of people who have participated in the Special Olympics who just love to play the PC game?

You really have no idea what you are talking about here. I'm sorry if that sounds arrogant. I have no doubt in my mind that there are many experiences you have that I would be clueless about.
In this circumstance, you are wrong.

[NJmaverick]

61. It's not the group, it's the outrage over a non-issue

It's the chilling loss of intellectual freedom, that is akin to what was witnessed in the novel 1984

[EmilyAnne]

62. WTF?

Its just like 1984 for the families of disabled people who have participated in the Special Olympics to have their feelings hurt?

Its a chilling loss of intellectual freedom to realize that you said something that inadvertently hurt someone's feelings and apologize for it?

To think the comment was stupid and to understand that some people were legitimately hurt by it is equal to outrage?

What are you talking about here? Who are you taking aim at?
People who get their feelings hurt about something are in essence practicing censorship by expressing their hurt?

[NJmaverick]

67. Please explain exactly what was the horrible thing Obama said?

Anyone can claim their feelings are hurt. What is important is that people are capable of enough critical thought to be able to judge the validity of the offense.

[Zenlitened]

71. Good grief.

:wow:

[omega minimo]

81. he's talking about the "intellectual freedom" to not give a shit

:thumbsdown:
similar to the anti liberalism that followed the multiculturalism of the (most recent) progressive era, that Limbaugh the Hut built his career on. Dittoheadism has filtered into the mainstream.

[NJmaverick]

95. The idea that you find intellectual freedom abhorrent is disturbing, to say the least

[omega minimo]

112. oh please. Not even a halfassed misdirection of what I said.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=5297723&mesg_id=5298552

[TLM]

349. Some people can;t cope with other people being free to offend...

It's funny if you ask these PC folks what they think of a white southern racist that's "offended" by an interracial gay couple... they'd say he's wrong and his offense is an indication of his hatred, racism, and inability to cope with the sexual freedom and racial equality of those around him.

Yet when a PC language nut is offended by someone using the term retarded or in Obama's case referencing the special olympics in relation to the way Jay was praising his attempt at bowling... they expect the world to change and people to censor their language so they won;t be offended.


They don't seem to grasp that intellectual freedom is not defined as the freedom to conform to their myopic idea of what is or is not offensive to a given group.


The ability to have and use emotionally extreme and shocking or offensive ideas and words is part of being able to conceptualize and the meaning and scope of the world we live in. To remove those ideas by trying to change the language is new speak... the controlling of thought through controlling the language that can be used to express and communicate thought.

[omega minimo]

391. You're right about one thing

"... the controlling of thought through controlling the language that can be used to express and communicate thought" is important on a discussion board, to prevent jerks from "cheapening the quality of discussion for everyone." (As DU Admin puts it).

It happens anyway. The framework helps though. If someone has something to say, they can find a respectful way to say it.

If you arrive in the thread acting like a clod, people might think you have nothing to say. That's not "newspeak" that's manners.

Newspeak is "collateral damage" that affects every family in this nation the same way. "Friendly fire." "Downsizing." "Team leaders." "Financial derivatives."

You want to "ask these PC folks what they think of a white southern racist that's "offended" by an interracial gay couple..." you might have to think and reread carefully before posting.

If you have a problem with those who oppose "hatred, racism, and inability to cope with the sexual freedom and racial equality of those around him" then Son, you on the wrong board, eh?

[Midlodemocrat]

408. +1

Watch out. He might call you retarded because he doesn't believe there is anything wrong with that word. :yowza:

[omega minimo]

78. Actually it's the serial bullies and their groupies that resemble 1984 Two Minutes Hate mindlessness

and yes it is chilling.

[Midlodemocrat]

104. It's hardly a non issue to people personally affected by a child

or a family member with cognitive or physical disabilities. Frankly, I understand mistakes happen and that Obama is human, but his comments were absolutely cringe worthy.

It's only within the last generation that doctors stopped insisting that parents of 'Mongoloid' babies institutionalize them for the 'good of the family'.

When the President makes an off handed remark like he did, it shows that those of us who work with special needs children are still fighting an uphill battle with acceptance.

[LostinVA]

110. Where the hell have you been all day?!

[Midlodemocrat]

113. Working. Just responded to your PM.

And, trying to finally get the laptop up and running again. Jeebus. What a PITA. Plus, I can't get the wireless printer to work.

I hate technology.

[omega minimo]

120. It's good to see what you consider "cringe worthy." Makes a difference when you can relate, I guess

"When the President makes an off handed remark like he did, it shows that those of us who work with special needs children are still fighting an uphill battle with acceptance."

Well put :toast:

[Midlodemocrat]

129. I consider an attack on the most vulnerable cringe worthy.

But some folks just like to pick a fight based on words that don't affect their standing in society, so to them I say, suck it up.

[omega minimo]

133. Makes a difference when you can relate, I guess

:thumbsup:

[Midlodemocrat]

135. Words, discriminatory behavior against the most vulnerable?

Yeah. That matters.

Somebody with a stick up their ass about a word that has no bearing on anyone's treatment? Not seeing it.

:thumbsup:

[omega minimo]

141. Good example of having it both ways

:yourock:

[TLM]

355. Care to quote the "attack"?

What attack on the most vunerable are you talking about?

[NJmaverick]

128. well as a rule I feel better when I am on the other side of issues, from Rush Limbaugh

in this case:

Now, the fact that he can make this joke about Special Olympics people, there's no question that's something very mean to say, and it's not the first time. He made a joke about Nancy Reagan and seances. I'm telling you, this man is angry and he has a chip on his shoulder, and his wife does, too. They are some angry people. They're really angry.

http://www.rushlimbaugh.com/home/daily/site_032009/content/01125106.guest.html

[Midlodemocrat]

130. Well, that didn't take long.

:rofl:

Jesus, you can't make this stuff up.

[NJmaverick]

131. So you have no problem teaming up with Rush Limbaugh

well to each their own

[Midlodemocrat]

132. LOL. Keep going. What else ya got?

:rofl:

[LostinVA]

136. I was wondering where my Oxycontin went to, dammit!

[Midlodemocrat]

137. I'm sorry. I couldn't hear you over the roar of the dittoheads.

[LostinVA]

142. Have you booked to the DR yet???

[Midlodemocrat]

144. Yup. But that douchebag travel agent fucked up the tickets.

[LostinVA]

150. Just don't fly Oceanic -- they are total DBs

[Midlodemocrat]

151. Yeah, but that guy in seat 6A? Total hottie.

[LostinVA]

154. Even I think he's hot -- and has the cutest dimples

It's creepy you know what seat he's in. I'm calling 911.

:scared:

[NJmaverick]

171. How can I win? You have Rush Limbaugh on you side

:eyes:

[Midlodemocrat]

191. Epic

Fail.

And it's your side.

:eyes:

[TLM]

361. It is not that they are teaming up with rush...

it is that they are the same kind of opportunistic poutrage phonies... who take something inconsequential and try to blow it out of proportion into something they can use to feign offense and click their tongues in disapproval.

[Two Americas]

397. such a malicious and dishonest attack

You have just smeared hundreds of the best DUers with the most underhanded, cowardly and malicious attack possible.

Just who is it that is an "opportunistic poutrage phony?"

I am one of the people here who has been a target for these same smears and attempts at character assassination. Care to come out of hiding and actually debate any of the issues? Let's have the courage and integrity to debate in an honest and open way, and then let the members here decide for themselves who is "taking something inconsequential and trying to blow it out of proportion" and using that to "feign offense" and "click their tongues in disapproval."


...

[Midlodemocrat]

406. +1

[Two Americas]

327. so he controls you

Whatever he says, you will take the supposed opposite side.

That is exactly how the right wing propagandists are controlling and steering Democrats, while they think they are actually opposing the right wingers. The right wingers are defining this supposed "opposition," telling people what they should be saying and doing in opposition to them, controlling them.

People think that the right wing propaganda is intended to "rally the right wing base," and think that they can watch and listen to it and not be affected. But most of the right wing propaganda is actually aimed at liberal lurkers, and is designed to lure them into false battles and into taking weak positions, and to then turn on their own allies and attack people when they take left wing positions.

People are taking the "liberal" positions, and are "rejecting" the right wing positions in a very shallow and simplistic way, but what they are failing to see is that they are allowing the right wing propagandists to define the battle and assign the roles in that battle, and are in that way controlling and steering the liberals who watch TV and take it seriously.

The effect that the right wing propaganda is having on Democrats and liberals and progressives is far greater and far more destructive then the effect it is having on any "base" or on the general public. It turns liberals into puppets on a sting, weak and predictable, dancing to the tune of the right wingers, playing out a role that is being assigned to them, and reading the lines that have been given to them.

If Limbaugh does not want liberals to take a certain position, all he needs to do is to take it himself.


...

[Patchuli]

342. He said that??!

This after that bloated bag of hot gaseous odour made fun of Michael J. Fox and insinuated that he was faking his illness? Jeepers creepers! That man has no morals whatsoever. The only "angry people" I see are the sore loserman neo-con nutbags!

[Control-Z]

160. "his comments were absolutely cringe worthy"

That is exactly what I did when I heard it. Cringe. And then I cringed a few times more, just thinking about it.

[Grinchie]

234. You mean "He isn't Sponge worthy"

Damn media has you guys yammerin like a bunch of hens. Remember the depression anyone?

Next thing you know Nerds will take offense when Obama tells us of the smart nerd in if IT department.

Some of the best comedy in Seinfeld took dead aim at people with all manner of disabilities. Yes, it's droll, but it is funny. It's funny at you can laugh off a frightening possibility that you could be that disabled person, and you don't fall into a depressive state.

Anyone who took offense is looking for attention, and may be utilizing the condition to garner it.

[EmilyAnne]

236. Hey, look everyone! Its an asshole! Read as the asshole reveals himself in the following line:

"Anyone who took offense is looking for attention, and may be utilizing the condition to garner it."

So succinct, yet such a revelation. How DOES he do it?

[Control-Z]

260. I never said that

I took offense, and I have no question that our president's intent was not about hurting anyone. But, I cringed when I heard the comment because I knew there would be people hurt by it, and I imagined that President Obama probably realized that too, the moment it left his mouth.

I've been guilty of making a similar comment in the past. No sooner I spoke did I realize how insensitive it sounded. And I was immediately and honestly sorry.

I don't need the media to tell me how to think. I watched the show and drew my own conclusions.

[omega minimo]

315. "Anyone who took offense is looking for attention, and may be utilizing the condition to garner it."

:wow:

[TLM]

353. Oh bullshit....

"When the President makes an off handed remark like he did, it shows that those of us who work with special needs children are still fighting an uphill battle with acceptance."


You are confusing the notion of acceptance with the notion of "never being mentioned or referenced in any form that is less than 100% positive and glowing and complimentary."


The fact you think that referencing the special olympics as a place where praise is abundant, means retarded or disabled people are somehow being ostracized shows how ridiculous this whole phony poutrage is.

Quite frankly it is the PC nuts who seek to neutralize the language and hide reality behind a barrage of overly clinical terminology to blur and soften the truth, who have to work on being more accepting... particularly of reality.

If you have no problem with retarded people, then why the need to hide behind terminology like cognitive disability? If there is nothing wrong with being retarded, then there is nothing wrong with the word retarded. But the folks who try to present themselves as the most accepting, are the same ones trying to mask their own issues with a word salad of emotional neutralized cynical terminology and PC bullshit.

[Midlodemocrat]

407. The word 'retarded' is verboten, Sparky. Not just here but in the

real world in which I live. To state that there is 'nothing wrong with the word retarded' simply shows your ignorance on this matter.

Perhaps you should leave this thread and let the grownups discuss this. :thumbsup:

The acceptable term is not 'retarded' as you so mistakenly believe, it is cognitive disability. Learn it. Live it.

[Vanje]

348. No one is saying you cant offend disabled and minorities.

Go wild. Let your inner asshole shine its light for all to see.
Just don't be surprised when people are disappointed and hurt by it.
And don't be surprised when people call you on it.

You dont even have to care, but if you're going to act like an asshole, people are going to call you an asshole.

[TheEuclideanOne]

299. That term "Spine chilling" is blatantly offense to the spineless people out there

How dare you use it. If I wasn't so spineless, I would call you out on it. Boy, DU has changed!!! I am so offended I won't come back for 5 minutes. Good Day Sir!

[TLM]

346. Exactly...

There is this desire to control thought through language, and it is built on this inane notion that people should never be upset or offended.

So they seek this bland emotionally neutered language... an attempt to remove the ideas and thoughts that one particular group finds offensive.

[closeupready]

12. First of all, DU is NOT liberal. In many ways, it is conservative, or at least

it has a sizeable number of conservative and conservative-leaning members.

[EFerrari]

16. DU is actually pretty liberal. But that isn't always reflected

in the posts of active members.

[closeupready]

17. Right, and it depends on the issue, I suppose.

n/t

[EFerrari]

23. More than political orientation, imho, it's about how people interact

with stuff, like information and others. DU has authoritarians just like any other community. :shrug:

[leftstreet]

28. Disagree. The 'conservative' element is just the loudest

If you follow the 'views' and 'recommendation' numbers on threads, I'd say the least prolific posters, and the lurkers, are VERY left.

[closeupready]

107. And, since they are so often out there alone defending an unpopular stand, tenacious.

n/t

[TLM]

357. Tell me, is censoring language a conservative or liberal ideal?

Which side is generally pushing the idea of "watch what you say" and supporting censorship to control thought?

[Vanje]

398. You're not being censored

You're being called out as an asshole.

[WI_DEM]

34. That is so silly. By far there are many more left wing (Not democrats) but left wing progressives

on this site than any conservatives. The thing is that many on the far left think that being a liberal is not left enough.

[closeupready]

102. Yeah, I suppose that's a valid point.

n/t

[caseymoz]

293. Conservatives wouldn't say that !

You take some of the "conservative" posts here, put them in pertinent commentaries on conservative posts and see what they say.

I have to admit I've very puzzled about what you've written.

[closeupready]

362. Well, though I wouldn't post that claim now, after having reflected a bit,

at the time I did post it I had in mind some of DU's hawkish members, who generally favor military intervention just about everywhere we (or our powerful allies) have problems in the world. Illegal immigration is another hot button issue that brings out the more conservative among us here.

But anyway, like I said, I take back my overgeneralization. Cheers. :hi:

[TLM]

356. There is nothing liberal or conservative about standing up to PC language bullies.

It is simply a matter of intellectual freedom and honesty.

[Vanje]

358. Oh. You are being bullied.

A pitiful victim .

When you post like an asshoile, the bad old PC bullies call you an asshole.

Terrible injustice.

[TLM]

378. And see how the bullies behave...

And see how the bullies behave... in derisively attacking those who dare to call attention to their hypocritical behavior.



Call someones poutrage phony, and you're a monster for dismissing their hurt over obama's brutal and vicious attack on retarded children.

Yet point out that PC language bullies attack anybody for using non-newspeak and suddenly you're mocked as an asshole playing the victim.

How quickly the tables turn when someone holds up a mirror to hypocrites.

[EmilyAnne]

415. This is total nonsense. No one wants to police language here. If you act like an asshole, you get

called an asshole.

A brutal and vicious attack on retarded children did not occur.
A brutally ignorant response on your part did occur.
And I celebrate your right to be an asshole.
Carry on!

[MercutioATC]

13. I believe it's backlash to the "Obama can do no wrong" tone

that's been prevalent here.

But I agree, Obama made a minor gaffe and he apologized for it. I may be extremely disappointed with him for a few reasons, but this comment isn't one of them.

[ErinBerin84]

19. I was offended by the remark.

I don't really think people should make fun of people for being offended, but at the same time, I don't think that people should be called out for having a different reaction other than offense. A lot of people who weren't offended have ties to the disabilities community, so I am not going to pretend to have some moral authority. Whatever. The internet is often not tolerant of other people's opinions, and I'm sure that's as true at DU as anywhere else. Some of the broad brushing on BOTH sides of this argument though pisses me off, seems just a way for certain types of posters to attack each other by proxy (your op isn't an example, but there are others).

[WI_DEM]

20. The fact of the matter is this is really not a democratic site. This is a progressive left-wing

site. There are lots of people who are way to the left of Obama. May have voted for him as the best of the two main choices but in there hearts believe fervently in the politics of Ralph Nader, Dennis Kucinich, etc. Obama has never pretended to be a left winger. He is a mainstream democrat, somewhat to the left of center, but not left enough for many posters here. I think some of us democrats who came into DU thinking this was a democratic site get a little frustrated at all the abuse Obama (some of it is warranted) gets. It does make it hard to be here at times. I've often believed it more representative that Democratic Underground change its name to reflect that it really isn't a democratic party website, it probably would be less confusing to true democrats and Obama supporters on this site. It seems to me that on DU, Obama is not very popular but in the country at large he has a 67% favorable rating. It's especially high with Democrats.

[Starry Messenger]

22. It's been this way for awhile.

Were you around for the Warren debacle? That's when the wheels fell off for me. :shrug: Talk about "dismissive, mocking and downright mean"...I put about 30 people on ignore who were people I actually liked during the election. This place showed its ugly side during that whole thing. Last night did not surprise me at all. I wonder about the future of this place all the time.

[CreekDog]

25. Who has been doing that? It certainly isn't widespread.

If anything most posters did criticize the words Obama used.

What people are reacting against is that it spawned 18 threads. I can't think of anything that's spawned 18 threads within hours.

People are reacting against overreacting to this especially in light of the apology Obama gave almost immediately.

People make mistakes, Obama is a human being. He made a mistake. He apologized. What else can he do?

[EmilyAnne]

33. That is all true. I have no problem with Obama. He didn't mean to hurt anyone. I know this.

DU has been on a nonstop Free Republic style bash-fest since last night, dismissing the remotest possibility that someone may be legitimately hurt.
That's what I find disgusting.

[Zenlitened]

72. And they're at it, even in this very thread.

I'm convinced some of them are Griefers, getting their online kicks by upsetting people.

:puke:

[LostinVA]

145. Oh, I totally agree with you

I know that you've been on the short end of some anti-gay remarks, so you can empathize.

[Zenlitened]

159. Yep, it's an all-too-familiar DU Syndrome, unfortunately.

Someone expresses pain from a minority point-of-view... and the Griefers, True Believers & Other Useful Idiots rush right in to make a bad situation worse.

Oy. :eyes:

[Midlodemocrat]

117. No. He didn't. I think he genuinely misspoke.

What bothers me is that that particular comment is the one that leapt to his mind first, rather than something which wouldn't hurt the most vulnerable amongst us.

I work with special needs kids. Well, that's not the right word. I volunteer in their classrooms every week. It's humbling. And, I watched last night because I was hoping that the interwebs were wrong. I was sad that they weren't.

[humbled_opinion]

320. That is such an interesting point.

Why did that comment jump right up there, has he said it before?

I asked people that very question and you know the sample said that was a very typical comment to explain how poorly one does at a particular sport.

Some people defended him saying it and tried to make a logical inference out of the comment.

So my take on it was, although it is mean spirited and thoughtless it is a standard cultural response.

So what can we do to fix it?

That should be the focus of the gaffe, and with Obama I think it will be, I am sure he feels terrible about it in hindsight and not just because of the political fallout, he most likely has reflected on the comment looked at his beautiful healthy children and broke down, fell on his knees and thanked God for his good fortune.

At least that is how I hope he behaved.

[TLM]

364. What a load of crap....

"rather than something which wouldn't hurt the most vulnerable amongst us. "


Really so who was hurt? Where all the special needs kids you help, complaining about how hurt and offended they over Obama's comment?

No, because "the most vulnerable" as you so crassly phrase your emotionally manipulative BS, are not the ones making a big "hey pay attention to my poutrage" stink over this comment. People like you are the ones making the stink and trying to present your behavior as somehow protecting the weak. When all you're really doing is patting yourself on the back and trying to get attention with phony poutrage.

[AndrewP]

163. I think you are right on. It was a dumb remark and he is sorry.

It's NOT alright to say what he said, and there are a group of people that he offended.

He also understands what he did wrong, and he has attempted to make amends.

the end

[TLM]

363. Who was hurt? Seriously?

"dismissing the remotest possibility that someone may be legitimately hurt."


Yeah, because his comment wasn't hurtful, derisive, or insulting in any context.

He referenced special olympics as a reaction to Jay's excessive praising of his attempt at bowling. Is it not 100% true that praise is abundant at the special olympics, for everyone regardless of ability? How is that hurtful at all?

He wasn't insulting retarded kids or making fun of them or anything... he simply compared the level of praise Jay was giving to special olympics.

At worst it is a joke that's not particularly funny... but there's nothing mean spirited or hurtful in that comment at all. So the people who show up acting like Obama got on TV and ridiculed the retarded, are clearly phony. Saying he viciously attacked the most vulnerable people, is clearly bullshit spin from people with an agenda.

[EmilyAnne]

393. You are refusing to accept reality for some reason.

If he mentioned parents cheering on a little kid, that would be different.
If he mentioned parents cheering on a little league team, that would be different.
Some people who have a personal connection to the Special Olympics have been through this kind of stuff over and over again.

We've been hearing the Special Olympics jokes and the "retard" jokes for years.
We've been hearing people trying for their best impersonations of "retard" voice for years.
The funny voices and laughable athletic ability of our loved ones often come with some other things that the jokers don't know about.
Things like difficult to manage physical pain, rapid, inevitable physical degeneration, shortened life spans and even emotional pain when they are bullied and teased by children in their mainstreamed classrooms.
Yes, all of it can give you thick skin.
Like my aunt always said about some of the crankiest people who came through her checkout lane, "sometimes I think these people need a kid with Down Syndrome. When your thirty five year old daughter has painful arthritis, needs another enema because of her obstructed bowels that cause painful, bleeding stools, but still wants to you to play Barbies with her, you realize that waiting in line at the grocery store isn't all that bad."

So, yes, thick skin and all doesn't completely protect us at all times. Sometimes, a comment hear or there can hurt. A comment about the Special Olympics, while something we've been hearing for years, can have a particular effect when it comes from the President of the United States on the fucking Jay Leno show.
It doesn't matter that we knew the intentions of Obama. It still hurt because it touches an old wound. Sorry that such a thing pisses you off so damn much.
Obama is fine. He was forgiven before he even apologized. I support him completely and happily recognize all his progressive policies that benefit the disabled.

The absolute assholish belittling of some innocent people who were sincerely hurt by the comment is the disgusting thing that I see over and over again on this site. Now pat yourself on the back for being a part of it!

[Behind the Aegis]

27. No change.

It has been like this for a long time. You have now had your eyes opened to the abject meanness and hatefulness that some posters here thrive upon and others, well, they do it from time to time depending on the topic.

[burythehatchet]

30. they usually excuse themselves as "people are too sensitive", or

"no matter what you say someone gets offended". They should be ignored. This is, after all, a room full of strangers. The creeps you would run into on the street are the same as you might run into here. For me, its the xenophobia that's most cutting. You can either fight back or have a thick skin or both. But asking a group of relative strangers for understanding is a no go, UNLESS it effects them personally. Then they understand.

Just drop it; you might be lookin for love in all the wrong places. :)

[omega minimo]

161. and then there's that whole

"DU Rules are based on respect" thingie.................

[EFerrari]

35. Btw, do the little freakers ever ask "what happened"?

:)

[Zenlitened]

37. I think, in this case, you're seeing a small but vocal band of True Believers...

... who simply will not/cannot bear the slightest bit of criticism of Pres. Obama.

They will lash out at ANYONE for daring to criticize, they will deny any merit to the criticism, and they will inevitably begin a campaign of slandering the critic or critics.

Today, it's the disabled community's turn. Certainly, the GLBT community has felt the incendiary wrath of the True Belivers and their cohorts in this whole exercise, the Useful Idiots. Also on the TB's list... liberal economists. Anyone whoever had a kind word for Hillary Clinton (with the exception of Pres. Obama himself, ironically, although maybe they consider him a "puma" too). And I'm sure there are others I'm omitting.

The bottom line is, the True Believers will brook no discussion of conflicting points of view, because -- in their world -- such points of view are actually attacks!!1 that must be put down with Massive Retaliation, Scorched Earth and, if all else fails, Mutual Assured Destruction.

:crazy: :dunce: :crazy:

[FLAprogressive]

42. That is a VERY good name for them.

[EFerrari]

43. But it truly comes from both directions, imho.

People who think that they need to control opinion or behavior -- which is why I used the term "authoritarians" up thread.

For example, it's one thing to read someone expressing their hurt feelings over this incident. It's another to read someone browbeating Obama about it. Similarly, it's one thing to read someone expressing their worry that Obama will be hurt over this. It's another to read someone telling everyone else to STFU.

In the first case, no matter the side, it's just honesty. In the second case, it's an attempt to control and that's unlovely and unpleasant.

[Zenlitened]

156. I agree, it can come from many directions. But the OP...

... seemed to be pointing out a scenario you omitted: People being browbeaten for expressing their hurt feelings.

That's the piece, IMO, that's so poisonous. And it happens a lot, with many of the same names showing up over and over when there's a chance to rub salt in the wound. Some are just Griefers, who delight in trying to upset people. Some are just obnoxious, thoughtless creeps. Together, they take a bad situation and make it infinitely, DUrifically worse.

[EFerrari]

197. Well, that's not okay. I agree. n/t

[ErinBerin84]

45. eh

as I've said upthread, people in the other forum, who HAVE criticized Obama, just choose not to criticize him for this because they claim not to be offended. I disagree with them, but I am not going to call them Obama fanatics for not taking offense to this. One of them said that they found the "Giethner is doing an outstanding job" to be even more offensive, which I think is a fair point. I think only a pretty small minority defends Obama on EVERYTHING.

[LostinVA]

89. Exactly -- good post

[HughMoran]

282. Sadly, there are some who will reflexively defend the President no matter what he does

For the majority of us who are somewhere in the middle between the bashers and the defenders, there's an awful lot of wasted energy involved in the back-and-forth between the groups. I always feel compelled to pick sides - except in this case where I hid all the threads on the topic.

[H2O Man]

41. Interesting question

and thoughtful OP.

What happened to DU? First, I suspect that in the context of the threads about Obama's "Special Olympics" statement, there are three groups of people: (1) those who express feelings of being offended; (2) those who say they were not offended; and (3) people who read the threads, but choose not to participate in the discussions.

Both Groups 1 and 2 include a relatively wide range of people, from those who were actually offended to those who attack Obama daily; from those who think it was an unwise statement but is being taken out of context, to those who react to what they view as insincere outrage. And both groups have a few people who could politely and accurately be called "shit-stirrers," who might be a good fit for your request for a clinical explanation .... they have issues that are expressed but not resolved on an internet discussion forum.

This issue is but one of many that has resulted in "discussions" that tend to highlight the more obnoxious people here. But they are, I suspect, a minority. They are just louder than others.

[byronius]

243. Frankly, as long as you're still posting, sir, all is well with the Democratic Underground.

Such a study in primate programming. A whirling mass of human words from many spirits -- I never get bored.

Consider, learn, Move On.

This is a new thing on Planet Earth, is it not? These surging electrons, unbound by geography?

[Reterr]

298. H20 Man on the money as usual

You nailed it H20 Man...

[Marrah_G]

325. You missed a group

Group 4: Those who get offended by those who expressed feelings of being offended.

Personally I think it was a simple mistake, I had never even heard the term before, but I would never call people names, question their "loyalty" or act like a jackass towards someone who's feelings were hurt over it.

[H2O Man]

405. I think they

are included in the sub-group I identified as "shit-stirrers." They are those who have issues that are too frequently expressed, and never resolved. A percentage of this sub-group may indeed be "disruptors" looking to create fractures in the democratic left. More, however, are people who have been crushed by life, and who have had their sense of compassion fractured.

[Marrah_G]

411. Ahhh- gotcha!

[Vanje]

409. And another missed group :

I call them "Random Nonsense Generators"

[Rosa Luxemburg]

44. we have GOP troublemakers here (can't keep them out it seems)

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

46. It came true. You're lookin' at it.

[unblock]

47. this site was built on collective disgust at anything the president ever uttered.

we had eight years of it! sometimes it takes a while to adjust!

[EFerrari]

53. That's a very good point.

:)

[EmilyAnne]

48. I'm calling myself out here with a copy of my own response from another thread.

Its too painful for me to write anything else about this.
"Obama was mocking the way adults overpraise children? Holy shit in hell.

Is that what the Special Olympics is? A forum for adults to get together and overpraise their children.
You are really off base here.

The comment touches a very sensitive spot in some people.
People like me.
People who have loved someone who had Downs Syndrome, for example. Someone who was good and sweet and full of nothing but love and kindness and, yes, got cheered by her overindulgent parents and siblings when, lets face it, I guess she really was a crappy athlete when it came down to it.
And it was always fun to hear other kids and even adults trying to mock the stupid way that she talked or take her glasses off her face because they were so hilariously thick that they must be passed around and tried on by everyone.
No harm done.
I mean, she was a "retard" after all, so its not like she even noticed.

Now I just sit around waiting eagerly for any moment that I can relive some of the sadness, some of the pain involved with living with, loving and then saying goodbye to a person like this.
I love to dwell in such a place because it makes me feel so good about myself. So much better than anyone else.
Thanks for calling me out. You really have my number."

I'm done.

[treestar]

50. It's the way we were raised

In America. We are told to keep a stiff upper lip and never let anyone know if we are hurt, because it is deemed to show weakness. I remember as a child being told not to be so sensitive, etc.

But if you don't mean to offend and someone says they are offended by what you did not mean as an offense, it is confusing and can be hurtful also. In fact it makes you angry, an injustice always does, and this is one.

We know Obama didn't mean to hurt anyone's feelings. We also want him to have some space to do the HUGE job he has to do without picking him to death over relatively small things. I would ask those offended to please forgive him and move on. It's not like he's a Republican wanting to cut services or a malicious Rush Limbaugh type actually really making fun of disabled people.

[TLM]

366. There is a huge difference between being sensitive and being opportunistic...

I see some expressing offense and hurt who are simply looking for whatever they can find to attack Obama... it's transparently opportunistic, to feign heartfelt agony over these insignificant comments as a means of laying out another attack on obama. Now i have no problems with legit criticisms of obama, yet i see those who question the legitimacy of this latest attack being painted as just not understanding the plight of those poor unfortunates who are cursed with being close enough to a retarded person to have had their whole universe torn asunder by obama's evil and hateful comments.

Personally, I think most of the outrage over this comment is phony BS and I see people saying that obama's comment was a hateful and discriminatory attack on the most vulnerable. That's just bullshit. There's no reality at all in that description. That's someone purposefully distorting what was said, which begs the question....for what purpose.

I don't see how it could be taken as offensive, unless you wanted to take it that way... like rush did.

[kiva]

51. Because some people are more sensitive toward

perceived slights to Obama than to any other issue or group. I read most of the threads about this last night, and nowhere did I see anyone say they thought the president was cruel or nasty. A few, like your OP, felt this was a thoughtless comment he should apologize for, but that was the extent of the criticism. The response by many posters was exactly what you have stated--a blanket denial that anyone could/should/ought to be hurt by Obama's statement; several posters identified themselves as disabled or having a disabled family member hastened to say that they weren't offended, so how dare anyone else be?

I agree that this issue has been resolved--the president apologized, and the majority of the world has moved on; here, however, there are still many threads in GDP that wail about DU's treatment of Obama by those oversensitive whiners. As for me, I love having a president who will admit a mistake, and move to correct it. And thank you for posting your well-worked OP.

[mzmolly]

52. Where did any minority group express

hurt feelings? Did I miss something? :shrug:

[EFerrari]

54. Maybe. I've read posts by DUers whose feelings were honestly hurt.

And their posts were very different from the superheated DUDQ posts.

[mzmolly]

199. I saw the comment

and have "special needs" people in my family. I can only speak for me, but I wasn't offended in the least.

[EmilyAnne]

56. Yes, you apparently did. I'll make it clear. The participants in the Special Olympics and their

families are a minority groups. Some of them did get their feelings hurt. One of them was me.
I was not outraged.
I never bashed Obama.
I knew that it was an accident and he would realize that hurt was caused and apologize.
Why? Because he is a good and decent man with a big heart.

Too many posters on DU continue to dismiss the feelings of people like me as phony, whining, just being outraged for the hell of it, etc.

[mzmolly]

198. A single offended person does not a "group"

make.

[rhett o rick]

55. I appreciate your disdain for those that are too eager to bring fault to Pres. However,

starting your post off with "What happened to DU", isn't, in my opinion, the way to get a decent discussion started. If you don't like what some posters say, I say ignore them. Or if you want to respond to them do so without implying that all of DU has gone to hell. There have always been and will always be posters on here that will attack just about anything just to stir up an argument. And I don't think that is always bad. But if there are posters that are offensive to you, don't respond or you will just be encouraging them. You can even put them on ignore.

[EmilyAnne]

60. Sure. At this point its very personal for me and I feel like I have to defend people I know and

love.
When there is such total, unapologetic stupidity written by people who you assumed shared your basic opinions about basic human decency, well, you just want to address it and try to defeat it.

[rhett o rick]

63. I understand. What I am suggesting is that when you run into people that are "unapologetically

stupid", put them on ignore. Don't let them ruin your day. Some are trying to ruin your day. You can't change them.

[uppityperson]

75. Why did you call someone a fucking moron when they asked for accepted term?

Question: what's the current accepted term for the "mental retarded."

You replied "fucking moron". Why do that to someone asking a serious question?

[EmilyAnne]

181. Because the person was being a moron. Come on.

To paraphrase: "Oh, golly gee. Little ole sensitive me just wants to know what we're supposed to call 'these people' now. And this is for my article I will be writing about the Special Olympics poutrage, btw. "
Yes. The poster was being a fucking moron. An inept moron who wanted to show off his own stupidity. Too bad.

It reminds me of the assholes who are always sincerely just wonderin' what those black people want to be called NOW.

"Jeez. We used to call 'them' negros but now I guess 'they' want to be called African Americans. Little ole sensitive me just wants to get it right, you see.

"What do they want to be called NOW. Jeez. We used to call 'them' orientals but now 'they' want to be called asians."

Please. such bullshit is astounding.

[uppityperson]

235. Having read a bunch on DU today, that one seemed like a serious question

seems a bunch of the replies were not, but it is an ok question to ask.

[TLM]

370. You do know that moron is a clynical term...

mo⋅ron   –noun
2. Psychology. a person of borderline intelligence in a former classification of mental retardation, having an intelligence quotient of 50 to 69.


Moron is a term that was clinically used to describe those with mental retardation.

The fact you toss off terms like moron, while simultaneously attacking others for insensitivity, shows you to be a phony.

You are supposedly hurt by obama's insignificant comments about special olympics, but have no problems using a classification of retardation as an insult to directly attack someone.


No wonder people see through your "hurt."

[unapatriciated]

265. The acceptable term for my son, who is physically disabled is.....

Michael.

[Midlodemocrat]

419. .

:applause:

My son's name as well.

[TexasObserver]

57. Agreed. Anyone who can't understand why it offends some ...

It's important to recognize that events such as this one has several levels of response, and they're all reasonable ones.

Anyone who knows the struggle for acceptance that the retarded and their families daily experience understand why the comment is unhelpful. Such families lament the comment because it does hurt those who must hear too often about the short bus or the special olympics. The fact that they hear "moron," "idiot," or "retard" wielded as clubs daily in America doesn't help. To me, failing to understand the response of that group is like failing to understand why blacks react to being called the N word, why gay men respond to being called the F word, or why women respond as they do to the C word.

We should all accept the genuine hurt of the people in the above group.

Next are those who think using such comments as "special olympics" are wrongheaded and not appropriate for progressives. While among that group, I'm not highly offended by the president's comment. It happened. It's unfortunate. He apologized and said he'd make amends. That works for me. I think that's a position shared by many here, and expressed by many here.

As you note, the problem is the silly reaction of those who think anyone's response except theirs is inappropriate. In a term, it's pig-headed. They believe their point of view - that this is silly and not worthy of discussion - is the only one which should exist. Best to ignore them, if not put them on ignore.

[yowzayowzayowza]

58. "Same as it ever was...

Same as it ever was...Same as it ever was...Same as it ever was...
Same as it ever was...Same as it ever was...Same as it ever was...
Same as it ever was..."

:hi:

[FudaFuda]

59. Thanks for posting this.

I was offended by Obama's crude joke. It wasn't 'faux outrage' ... I just felt insulted by it. My youngest child was severely impaired and passed away about a year and a half ago, and I didn't need that from the President. But what I've gotten here today for expressing that has been much worse, and made me pretty angry. Well, it's DU - I was told the day of my first post to 'wear a cup.' But its nice to know some DU'ers aren't on the 'he can do no wrong' bandwagon.

[Name removed]

372. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[JohnnyLib2]

64. Thank you.

Good points.

[MadBadger]

65. How am I supposed to react when a DUer says that Obama doesnt think the mentally disabled are people

[NJmaverick]

68. I have come to expect that sort of dishonest hyperbole from the Obama bashers

[progressivebydesign]

99. give me a fucking break... Obama said they aren't people??? Where's that quote??

I must have missed it. If you listen to the Leno interview, he was referring to what Leno said.. and the way that Leno was condescending about the score. Though i think it was an ill advised comment to make, he was getting on Leno's case for being patronizing about his 129 score as though it was the special olympics.

I just love watching people just run from outrage to outrage. My god.. people must have the most insulated lives ever.

[MadBadger]

101. I know, its ridiculous. Some DUers are inferring that Obama doesnt think they are people.

[lumberjack_jeff]

125. Hyperbole drift: First they were "saying" now they are "inferring"

What was said? How did you respond?

Only once we know that can we answer your question.

[MadBadger]

139. First it was inferring, than it was saying: At the link, look at post 22,23,31

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=5293967&mesg_id=5294095

[unapatriciated]

273. it was a crude joke at the expense of others....

much like the science teacher who refereed to my son as rash-boy in class instead of his name.
He did this constantly even after he was informed that it was due to illness (dermatomyositis) not poor hygiene.
When you use that type of humor it does give the appearance you view the disabled as non-people or less than you.

We are all guilty of being thought-less in our words and deeds, the difference is how we re-act when called on it.

The science teacher re-acted like the bully he was and continued his behavior.

Obama's reaction was to acknowledge his mistake and apologized.

It doesn't make it hurt less but acknowledges the hurt and allows for forgiveness.

[TLM]

374. Nope it was nothing like that....

"much like the science teacher who refereed to my son as rash-boy in class instead of his name."

Nope, in fact obama comment was nothing like that at all. Obama's comment was a self deprecating comment that referenced the special olympics in the context of abundant praise. While what you describe is a direct personal attack on a child ridiculing his medical condition.

The fact you think those two things are even in the same ballpark, shows how distorted and unrealistic your views on this situation are.

[EmilyAnne]

184. Hmmm.. Let's see. A DUer says something that expresses hurt feelings about something that someone

said and apologized for because (drum roll) it hurt some people's feelings.
What is a DUer to do?

I know!
Call them babies for having their feelings hurt!
Great idea!
Whatever you do, don't you dare acknowledge their sensitivity as being in any way legitimate.
I mean, some people may try to reassure the person about Obama's true intentions and remind them of his policies that greatly benefit the disabled.
But, that person doesn't deserve any sort of sympathy nor reassurance.
That person can clearly only be a whiner who is so happy to have something to pretend to be outraged about.

Brilliant!

[omega minimo]

340. With all DU respect

Where have you been that this is a surprise or big change?

"However, its the dismissive, mocking and sometimes downright MEAN attitude that I have been seeing on DU that has me both upset and confused."

On any number of topics/groups/persons.

My original answer to your OP question was "a pecking order."

Has it never seemed so to you?

Thanks for an interesting thread.

[TWiley]

253. Try listening to Mr Obama instead of Sara Palin

[omega minimo]

337. ask if they've actually seen the Leno Obama interview

:thumbsup:

[krabigirl]

69. I've always been a left libertarian..I vote Democratic, though. I don't like the PC stuff.

I have nothing against the mentally ill. Heck, I suffer from anxiety. But his statement was not intended to be cruel.

[LostinVA]

92. "I have nothing against the mentally ill. Heck, I suffer from anxiety"

:wtf:

[Midlodemocrat]

108. Epic

Fail.

:eyes:

[Caliman73]

242. Perhaps not...

The problem is that he equated his low score to the performance of people with mental and physical developmental disabilities. The pejorative nature of using "retarded", "lame", and other terms to describe poor performances can easily lead to the dehumanization of members of the population. Special Olympics was developed because people with Developmental Disabilities were often excluded from participating in youth and adult recreation. No one wanted to play with disabled people so leagues for people with disabilities were started so that they could have the experience of participating in sport and feeling like winners. For people to use Special O as a denigration of their performance is an insult regardless of intention. I am glad that the President realized that he had stepped over the line of respect. Words can be used to oppress and we do have to be careful.

[cali]

70. OK, why did you just call someone a fucking moron in another thread?

[uppityperson]

73. I was posting just as it was deleted. shame on her indeed.

[EmilyAnne]

187. Oh, such shame. I am so ashamed. I should have been sensitive and helpful to that innocent little

OP that just wanted to know, gee whiz, "what are me supposed to call these people NOW?"
I should have made sure the person knew the proper word to use so as not to (tee-hee) hurt anyone's feelings.
He needs to be "PC" in his essay that bashes the phony "poutragers" who got so upset about such a non-issue.

I am so ashamed.

[LostinVA]

256. Yeah, that stuck out to me, too

"I think this is all poutrage and want to make fun of it and those most hurt by it, but I want to do it with the term those people I don't think were hurt by this are called by those wanting to appear sensitive, even though my essay will be insenitive to their hurt."

:wtf:

[EmilyAnne]

186. I responded to you up thread, but I want it to be known that, yes, I called a person a bad word.

That poor "fucking moron" just innocently wondered what 'they' want to be called NOW. So as, you know, to not offends them (tee hee) when writing an article about.......

the Special Olympics POUTRAGE! What a great question. Such sensitivity. Such a progressive. Kudos.

The only way this very sensitive person could find out was by asking the very sensitive DU board. God knows the information is not available anywhere on the internet.
God know its so respectful to ask a question about the appropriate "PC" terminology so you can use it to scoff at these crazy, whining, PC babies who care about "these people" (what are we supposed to call 'em, again?)

[SoCalDem]

74. Our sweet little DU is having growing pains

DU2001-2002-----newborn..all goo-goo & smiles


DU2003-2005-----toddler...learning to walk, happy-go-lucky


DU2006-2007-----adolescent, eager to learn, and tell what it learned, forming strong opinions


DU2008-2009----belligerent, angry, moody teenager..ready to smack you in the mouth if you disagree..a lot of sighing, and rolling-of-eyes..(might be packing heat)

[Joey Liberal]

76. We grew a pair

Since when do Democrats demean a minority demographic for getting their feelings hurt about an offhand comment?
Yes, Obama's comment was a mistake. Its not a big deal.
---------
We are not afraid to call out our President when he screws up.

[EmilyAnne]

188. Hey- I think you totally misread my post. I agree with you 100%. I am pissed off at the

overwhelming number of DUers who are belittling the people who were legitimately hurt by the comment.

[Joey Liberal]

286. I stand corrected

I did misread it and I apologize.

[uppityperson]

77. I too am upset at those who dismiss negative terms for others.

I do not see so much "the constant bashing of people who were hurt" but posters denying the feelings of those who view a term as negative. If you find it offensive for me to call you a (pick a term), and let me know, I will not use that term.

It upsets me when others don't do the same.

[ruggerson]

82. I guess you missed gay people being demeaned here for speaking out against being

repeatedly being thrown under the bus.

And the sad thing is it's the exact same people bullying those who were hurt by Obama's offhand joke.

I agree with every word of your OP.

[LostinVA]

94. And the same demaning, marginalizing use of "poutrage"

[Midlodemocrat]

96. +1

[JohnnyLib2]

152. Yup.

[Mithreal]

83. K&R nt

[Butch350]

84. Everybody reading this now...

...has said something insensitive without thinking at one time or another - so stop making a f**king big deal
out of what the president accidently said without thinking but then apologized for it. (cry babies)

[LostinVA]

97. "so stop making a f**king big deal out.... (cry babies)"

:eyes:

[omega minimo]

111. Yes, "reading this now." Would you say it to their faces (or loved ones who may have disabilities)?

Ah, there's the rub.

[Midlodemocrat]

153. Funny. I've never been on National TV. Had I been, I would sure

as shit watch what I said about a very vulnerable group of Americans.

[EmilyAnne]

173. Jesus Christ! Who is making a big deal about what he said? I am making a big deal about the

dismissive, insensitive people like you. This has nothing to do with Obama. He acknowledged that people were legitimately hurt because he is a decent person capable of feeling empathy.
You, on the other hand...

[TLM]

379. dismissive, insensitive people like you

So being dismissive and insensitive is wrong, unless you're doing it by calling someone a fucking moron? Then it is OK?

[EmilyAnne]

385. The "moron" can defend himself. Give me a break. He was just one of many DUers who went out of

his way to start a thread to belittle the feelings of people who were legitimately hurt.

Now, please tell me how much of an asshole I am for momentarily having my feelings hurt, how phony and whiny my family is for taking the comment as an insensitive jab.
We have been waiting so long for a good reason to be outraged and thanks to Jay Leno, we got one.
Because, see, having your feelings hurt and saying something about it is the same thing as being TOTALLY OUTRAGED!
We all ran into the town square, tore off our clothes and set our hair on fire!!!

Poor Obama was totally bullied by us to apologize.
He had too cave in to our petty PC tantrums.
Now, our agenda of censorship of anything that hurts our feelings has been carried out!
Soon enough, our bid for a constitutional amendment stating that we have the right to go through life without ever being offended will be a success!

Of course, our methods have been quite radical!
I clearly heard my aunt say," ouch. I know he didn't mean it, but that hurt."
Crazy language!
My mom said it made her feel bad because it reminded her of my cousin who had Down Syndrome. She figured he would apologize because she was sure he didn't mean it.
What a whiner.
Me?
Well, I was so radical in my pursuit of a fascist, PC agenda.
When I heard the comment, I selfishly allowed my brain to conjure a particularly painful memory involving my cousin, her participation in the Special Olympics and her recent, sudden death.
That's how radical I was. That's how bad I wanted to be OUTRAGED!

[LostinVA]

85. I completely agree -- it has been rather shocking to me

I haven't even wanted to post something like your OP because I know I'll be attacked as a "hater," or have that fucked up, demeaning, Freeper word "poutrage" thrown about. I honestly think :"poutrage" should be a banned word on here.

And, I have just LOVED the "retard" "jokes" on here today. Thumbs up to the Mods for taking care of those quickly.

[TLM]

380. Exactly the problem...

"I honestly think :"poutrage" should be a banned word on here."

And what other thoughts and ideas would you ban?

This is why so many hate the PC, book burning, ban the word to erase the thought, mentality of the fringe left.

You would ban the word, because it perfectly describes and exposes the ridiculousness of this behavior.

Ban what you can't refute.

[specimenfred1984]

90. Big camaros! Hillary's a traitor! Code Pink Sucks! Pelosi's a traitor!

DU's gotta collect money from those people so hatred is A-OK and as long as the cash keeps flowing.

[EFerrari]

114. I bet you think you're SOOOooo superior.

[specimenfred1984]

165. Don't think, KNOW!

I can't help it, was born that way!

[omega minimo]

210. he thinks he's got big camaros

:bounce: :bounce:

[progressivebydesign]

91. Perhaps we're all on PC overload. If I was OUTRAGED!!! by every perceived slight, I'd be dead.

I'm sorry.. but life sucks sometimes, and if the worst thing in the world you hear is a non-joke comment like that, then consider yourself lucky.

[Missy Vixen]

109. Again, it's easy to ignore if you're not walking in that other person's shoes

What may not seem like a problem for you might be a soul-killing comment for someone else.

EmilyAnn has a legitimate complaint. President Obama screwed up; he's offered an apology. I'd like to think that those that were offended by his comment will accept it. In the meantime, how many times here have some who believe that "PC" just abrogates their right to "free speech", said something ugly, and will not apologize for a comment that would lose you a friend (or worse) IRL?

[EmilyAnne]

189. And you are so right! It really was the worst thing in the world I have ever heard!

I have been saving up for this moment because I am only allowed to have my feelings hurt once in my lifetime.
I am glad that such a compelling reason finally came up! Lucky me!

Oh, wait.
Actually, like I said in my OP and every time I have tried to reason with certain people, I was never outraged at Obama.
I never thought he said anything with bad intentions and immediately knew that he would apologize because he is good person capable of feeling empathy.

I AM outraged at the idiots on this board who are belittling the feelings of the people who were legitimately hurt.
There is a big difference.

[spoony]

241. I don't think it's a matter of feeling offended by any possibly offensive comment

but rather respecting that others, who have issues in their lives relevant to what was said/written, can be offended by a comment. I don't think any of us can feel the impact of everything that offends everyone, but we can feel that they are offended. My take, anyway.

[LostinVA]

257. Exactly!

[Uncle Joe]

93. I thought the apology was a sign of his grace and empathy, something of which

has been sorely lacking over the past eight years, the apology was a sign of inner strength.

Bush the Least never had that kind of courage or maturity, to the contrary, he would take joy in other people's suffering.

Had it been Deadeye Dick, an apology would have been expected from the Special Olympics contestants and their families for getting in the way of his joke.

Kicked and recommended.

Thanks for the thread, EmilyAnne.:thumbsup:

[omega minimo]

103. "apology would have been expected from the Special Olympics.. for getting in the way of his joke"

"Had it been Deadeye Dick, an apology would have been expected from the Special Olympics contestants and their families for getting in the way of his joke."


:rofl: He'd tell to "go fu##" themselves.

Good one, Unca Joe

[nichomachus]

105. But there are people

who scrutinize every word of every post to find out "Gee, how can I be offended by this? There must be something in here I can read as being offensive."

This was a wretched excess of the liberals in the '70s and, in fact, it was other liberals who invented the term "politically correct" as a way of poking fun at the permanently offended.

Somewhere along the line, some people tend to lose their sense of humor.

[Uncle Joe]

134. This is true, but I don't believe the Special Olympics are made up of those people.

I believe President Obama understood that as well and that's why he was quick with his apology.

Regarding the term "politically correct" it seems to me this phrase has been turned on it's head as part of an Orwellian propaganda campaign, but those words need to be taken back to their logical place in the English Language.

The term "politically incorrect" might make a nice title for a television program but in real life practice you end up with Presidents like Bush the Least. You just can't get more "incorrect" than him, and this was in large part because incorrectness was glorified by the corporate media when informing the American People as to what was important in choosing a President.

Does anybody still give a shit about whether the President is someone they should want to have a beer with or not?

There are legitimate times to apologize and times not to, but I don't believe we should walk on eggshells, worrying about being labeled with that term, instead we should glory in it. "You're damn straight, we support Presidents who are correct!" And if the corporate media has a problem with that, they can go Cheney themselves.

[omega minimo]

174. That's true? Ya really think so?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=5297723&mesg_id=5299368





You actually do get it:

"Regarding the term "politically correct" it seems to me this phrase has been turned on it's head as part of an Orwellian propaganda campaign" to humiliate people from trying and encouraging others to pay attention to language matters and show respect, even when they may not directly relate -- but at least consider how language matters.

The "accusation" of "political correctness" was intended to turn the clock back on the progressive era, one of the many tools the bastards employ.

Designed to mock and marginalize those who use aware language, portray them as if they (and anyone inclined to do the same) "walk on eggshells, worrying about being labeled with that term."


See how that worked? :hi:

[omega minimo]

168. Classic Bullshit Line By Those Who Don't Want To Consider Ramifications Of Their Own Behavior

"But there are people who scrutinize every word of every post to find out "Gee, how can I be offended by this? There must be something in here I can read as being offensive."


How absurd is that? There are people who would rather not be distracted and detracted by the willful ignorance and belligerent behavior of those who are stuck in such selfishness they have to project that sort of insane accusation.

Since the detached or willfully ignorant can't or won't get the concept of looking at how language matters, that's how THEY would have to get the concept: LINE BY LINE,

Instead of simply showing respect.

BS #2

"This was a wretched excess of the liberals in the '70s and, in fact, it was other liberals who invented the term "politically correct" as a way of poking fun at the permanently offended."

No, it was Right Wingers and their hangers on (including the willfully ignorant) who pointed a finger at academia, when multicultural studies were peaking, to humiliate "ivory tower" liberals and academics into backing down from awareness of use of language.

"Political Correctness" was and always has been intended to ridicule acting as if language matters; to shame people who simply show respect, even when it wasn't convenient or personal to them.

[TLM]

375. Exactly....

They act like obama was giving a policy speech on his new "exterminate the retards' program. In this thread his comment is described as an attack on the most vulnerable. Absolute BS.

Oh god, obama referenced the special olympics as a place of abundant praise.... gasp, I'm so hurt that I'll call someone a fucking moron as a chastise them for insensitivity.

[Kajsa]

118. Thank you, Emily.

As the mother of a disabled young man,
I thank you for speaking out.

:)

Pres. Obama realized his mistake and apologized for it.

To berate those whose feelings were hurt is unconscionable.

[QC]

123. Bullies have been allowed to take the site over and run amok. n/t

[Bluebear]

127. Bingo. nt

[noamnety]

124. Three things

1) people of various minority/oppressed classes have been aware of this on DU for a long time. We've lost a lot of women who used to post in the feminist forum because of the continued mocking and belittling of people speaking out against sexism here. GLBT people have been hurt repeatedly by similar responses. Same with race issues. Same with overweight people.

2) the entire country has been sliding right. DU hasn't been exempt from that - the attitudes toward immigrants is a good case study.

3) people were more in touch with their ethics when there wasn't a conflict of interest between those ethics and support of Obama. Now the folks who were sure we had to pull out all troops suddenly think that leaving them there longer must be right because they trust Obama. Things we knew were wrong if Bush did them suddenly become not so wrong. Cognitive Dissonance: The theory of cognitive dissonance proposes that people have a motivational drive to reduce dissonance by changing their attitudes, beliefs, and behaviors, or by justifying or rationalizing their attitudes, beliefs, and behaviors.

[lumberjack_jeff]

126. "people were more in touch with their ethics when there wasn't a conflict of interest"

very true.

[omega minimo]

138. "reduce dissonance"

so if a new idea about what might be worth considering as a change in awareness/behavior to avoid offending others, doesn't fit in someone's head with existing belief/attitudes/habits, bingo! time to react with a "a motivational drive to reduce dissonance by justifying or rationalizing their attitudes, beliefs, and behaviors."

Great post. #1 is ongoing and the OP must have missed all the "dissonance" of past years. Maybe b/c people leave or are marginalized and topics, when they appear openly, are soon flamed and later locked.

#2 the habits and forms of open discussion have changed in the nation in general, coincidentally over the same time frame Limbaugh clones and Dittoheads have taken over airwaves.

Buzzwords and knee jerk reactions have become prominent. All the more reason that language matters.

:yourock:

[Two Americas]

140. things are coming apart

There are great historical forces at work now, and we are on the verge of massive social upheaval. That is making people nervous. We are too close to things to fully notice the changes, but things are shifting and shifting fast. We will look back in a couple of years and wonder what the hell happened. People are having trouble keeping their balance, their footing, and so they look around for scapegoats to blame for their discomfort. Everything is unraveling, and people are resisting facing that. All hell is about to break lose, and people are getting a little frantic and irrational. That frantic mood now dominates DU - like a herd that has been spooked and is about to stampede. People were hoping against hope that if Obama won, we could relax and feel good after years of stress and fear. They are angry that this is not happening, and are looking for someone to blame.


...

[JerseygirlCT]

143. I agree with your take on what happened.

I'm not sure at all why people would be outraged at others whose feelings were hurt by the comment...

[KoKo]

146. DU is split between the "Politically Correct," "Advocates for Everyone" and Disruptor Repug Trolls..

And...it's hard to wend one's way through those gateways. Sort of walled off communities, they are. Or, "Gated Communities" if you will.

One can't be seen to make any kind of comment without being judged for a nuance. Especially when one has so competing political forces looking into one's soul thinking they see one thing or the other.

IMHO....for whatever.

[Generator]

147. TO HELL in a HAND basket

Wake up and smell the coffee, sister.

[omega minimo]

157. A pecking order

[Ladyhawk]

162. I left here because of the lack of civility.

I'm not sure why I've been posting occasionally again...what the fuck is wrong with me?

[LWolf]

164. Nothing happened, other than

your expanding awareness that DU is partisan, and that the primary function of the board is to support, NO MATTER WHAT, the party, especially a Democratic president.

Obama could say or do almost anything and find defenders at DU.

And, of course, the best defense for some is not fact or logic, but offense, including personal attacks.

[chill_wind]

166. I've always associated the unbridled ridicule of sensitivities

of various minorities and demographic groups as the domain of the Coulter, Malkin and Limbaugh breeds, ever railing at their oppressed freedoms to vilify liberals under the guise of protesting 'political correctness'. Dismaying to catch even mild but unmistakable whiffs of that gig anywhere at DU.

[omega minimo]

177. Very well put

:toast:

[ShortnFiery]

185. Funny, I have the same revulsion to people who try to play "moral nannies" on the Net.

It's a little freaky but it must be a rush of self-righteousness for some people when they can place THEMSELVES "above it all."

We all make mistakes. The good people try to improve ON THEIR OWN.

As the mother of a teenager, I KNOW that lecturing ANYONE receptively on their mistakes is not only non-effective but it makes the self-anointed moralist look "preachy" if not "damn irritating" to be around.

Go figure. :shrug:

[chill_wind]

190. There's all kinds of intolerance on the NET, I guess.

You kind of make my case for its many flavors with your own angry "policing" example in post 182.

[EmilyAnne]

195. This isn't about Obama's comment. Yes, everyone makes mistakes.

The assholes who refuse to express any amount of empathy for the people who were legitimately hurt by the comment need to be called out.
This is such a personal issue to me at this point that I will probably be banned soon enough.
But, too bad. I am defending people I love.

[omega minimo]

212. OTOH having some self awareness and self control makes it easier for others to tell the Dittoheads

and FReepers from the sane people and not have to sift through the willfullly ignorant. :thumbsup:

Some resist b/c they don't want to take responsibility for themselves.

[TLM]

376. Yes exactly....

I disdain this mentality of trying to use some perceived moral high ground as emotional manipulation to ridicule and demean people into conforming to their narrow view of what thought is acceptable.

I see the same people who are crying about being hurt and offended by the insensitivity of others, turning on a dime and calling people fucking morons. They spew just as much hate, if not more, than those who they are scolding. They just soak it in this sickly sweet syrup of holier than thou superiority.

They set themselves up as some moral authority, then use their state of being offended by you as some litmus test of your acceptability.

[billyoc]

169. Remember, the most radical revolutionary is a conservative the day after the revolution.

You ain't seen shit yet.

[chrisa]

170. I wouldn't worry about it. nt

[Number23]

176. I like this OP

Obama apologized because he mistakenly said something that was hurtful to some people.
Having a brain and a big heart, he immediately apologized.
The end.

One would think...

[UTUSN]

178. Nope. He's an O.K. human, but not totally enlightened. n/t

[Political Heretic]

179. It's called a cult of personality and we're living through it.

It will pass. :(

[ShortnFiery]

182. Wow, you have truly made the rounds on your QUEST to express self-righteous indignation.

Congrats, you've had your say - over and over and OVER AGAIN.

Sorry, it won't take.

Now you can mercifully stop beating that *dead horse?* :eyes:

[EmilyAnne]

192. Sorry. Its personal now. I am absolutely disgusted. If acknowledging the legitimate offense taken

by some perfectly innocent people makes me self-righteous, then damn.
I guess I should be sainted for achieving such a seemingly unattainable level of basic empathy.
Give me break.

Hell yes I am making the rounds on this issue.
This isn't a dispute on policy or cabinet selections.
This is a dispute about what should be the most basic human ability to feel empathy for others who have been hurt.

[BostonMa]

194. Wow, nobody has yacked more then you on this topic

[EmilyAnne]

196. So true. I must, like, really care or something. Wow, it might even be, like, totally

personal.
I'm just THAT fucking weird about stuff that just doesn't even matter.

[upi402]

183. It was not good, but the house is on fire right now. n/t

[EmilyAnne]

193. Obama is tending to that house fire as well as he can, in my opinion.

People who are belittling the families of disabled people who are sensitive and got their feelings hurt are my problem here.
Obama is good man with a big heart and the ability to feel empathy with the people that he accidentally hurt.
I can't believe so many people on DU are not capable of that kind of empathy.

[upi402]

203. You are a very good person IMHO. n/t

[Lerkfish]

200. want to really see this in effect here? start a thread about fat people

the amount of people that think overweight people deserve the abuse that gets heaped on them is stunning. Same mechanism: You should have a thick enough skin to allow me to abuse you without complaint, because if you complain, then you're a frickin wimp.

I'm just sayin.

there are people like that here: one who denigrate and THEN decide that they are the only ones who decide if anyone is offended by their own bad behavior.

[Gabi Hayes]

201. this, for one example:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x5299895#5299994

[EmilyAnne]

232. Wow. That was pretty disgusting.

[Doctor_J]

204. Many DUers are Hate Radio addicts

that pretty much sums it up

[Laura PourMeADrink]

205. All I can say is Lighten Up. My god. It is absolutely Absurd to think he

was literally demeaning anyone. No one, not even he, is perfect. Better spent energy worrying about something important

[EmilyAnne]

227. This is becoming pathologic. Like I said. Its not about Obama.

Obama didn't mean to offend. No shit.
The people who have once again shown up on this very thread to belittle the people who were legitimately hurt are assholes.

You don't treat people like that.
Do you remember the disgusting cartoon about the stimulus package with the monkey?
People can argue back and forth about the intention of the "artist."
At some point, whether people were willing to give him the benefit of the doubt or not, they should ALL agree that there is a legitimate reason for some people to be hurt by the cartoon. The people who said that black people were just faking outrage? A bunch of assholes.

See my point?
Same with Rick Warren's prayer at the Inauguration. An argument about why Obama allowed it to happen or what should be done about it is one thing.
To argue that all of GLBT and their families and friends who were hurt by Warren's presence are a bunch of whining babies who need to lighten up? That is being an asshole.

So , once again. Obama is not the problem here. Is a good person who made a mistake and apologized for it because he understands the hurt that it caused to some people. People on DU who refuse to believe that anyone could have possibly had their feelings hurt by the comments? They are assholes.

When people get their feelings hurt, try to reassure them, try to understand why they may be hurt, try to legitimize their feelings. Hell, just ignore them.
So many on DU went out of their way to actually belittle the feelings of these people. They are assholes. Period.

[leftofthedial]

206. Ferfucksake.

The Obama already did the mea culpa make nice. Now he'll have a couple of "them" come bowl in the basement of the White House.

Can't we all just get along?

[EmilyAnne]

231. Wow. You are a very nice, sensitive person capable of great empathy.

Of course Obama said he was sorry. He is a good person. That is what good people do when they accidentally hurt someone's feelings.
The particular assholes on this board, unfortunately, are not only incapable of acknowledging that some people were hurt, but are actually belittling these people, calling them names, denying that they have any legitimate reason to have been hurt.

[leftofthedial]

248. What is our sentence for Obama having hurt some people?

Two days of this? Three? A week?

[Kaleva]

214. There is no difference between the radical right & left

Both groups are consumed by hate and anger.

[EFerrari]

215. What does that have to do with this thread?

[Kaleva]

217. The author is outraged by the constant bashing of those

who were hurt by President Obama's comment.

[EFerrari]

218. And? Sorry, what does that have to do with the "radical" right and left?

[Bluebear]

216. Is that so.

[Divine Discontent]

295. exactly, Bluebear - you know who they meant as much as I do - any of us who are fighting for a cause

whatever that cause may be - we're 'radical left' because there's something we're upset about so we're, what was it? Oh, yes, filled with HATE and ANGER!


what an ass that poser is for sayin that!

you on the other hand.... :hug:

[bjobotts]

219. Sorry, but anyone who was bothered by that comment needs to get a sense of humor.

[bjobotts]

220. It was obviious there was no hurtful intent behind it and shouldn't have gotten a second look.

[bjobotts]

221. I am disabled but feel it petty to be bothered by something so trivial.

[bjobotts]

223. And I resent your comparison to Free Republic...not even relative

[gulliver]

222. Jiacinto left. Hasn't been the same since.

[espiral]

224. re:

I was pretty surprised at those threads, too. I thought that a leftist-friendly forum would certainly show more sensitivity about such matters. I was mistaken.

[valerief]

225. Thanks for your concern in bringing it up again. Ignore! nt

[EmilyAnne]

228. Another asshole revealed! Wow! I hope you don't ignore me before you read my response. You are

selfish scum.

[QC]

230. I dunno, I thought it was real nice of her to prove your point for you. n/t

[OwnedByFerrets]

226. Dont forget the many "operatives" that not only come here

to post divisive statements, but they are also known to frequently call the liberal talk shows to try to splinter the progressives. Just a thought for ya.

[EmilyAnne]

229. I know there are some, but a lot of these posters were people that I really admired. People who I

really counted on during the primaries to help me understand a lot of issues that the undecided voters in my neighborhood had concerns about. I was the neighborhood captain for the Obama campaign in the primaries and, after working literally from 9am to 10pm every day for over a month, when I finally got home the first place I visited was DU. Some of the most respected posters from that time have really surprised me, to say the least.

[OwnedByFerrets]

290. Yes, you are right. And there are some who have really

surprised me also. Some days it is hard to come here and that is a shame.

[Grinchie]

233. I'm with Seinfeld, Comedy is Cruel.

And we know that Seinfeld was the Funniest show on television.

Get over it. Be honest with your disability, and don't try gain support and influence via your diability. You'll just weaken yourself.

I'm kind of interested how many people who are in the special olympics were actually watching the show and actually caught it, because I sure didn't. No, this is another attack from the Repugs.

[LostinVA]

258. "et over it. Be honest with your disability, and don't try gain support... via your diability"

:eyes:

[Onceuponalife]

237. for everyone so offended

by the "haters" and "griefers", if you are so bugged by hearing opinions different then yours, there's a little something here at DU called the "ignore setting" so you don't have to be scarred by those gosh darn mean posters. Use it. Problem solved.

[Grinchie]

238. Special Olympics will get a big donation boost from this.

All the free publicity.

[L. Coyote]

239. I just watched "The Hunting of the President" MUST SEE for perspective on today.

It is starting all over again.
The wingnuts are hunting Obama!!

And I'm seeing people throw stones here.
Get a ******** life, and get some perspective.

Think Kenneth Starr and his band of Arkansas Project jackals
lying to prepare for GW Bush stealing the Executive, FCS!!!!!

Deja DU: Bush vs. Gore, the 'Arkansas Project,' the USA firings, and the Swiftboat Admiral
Jun-02-07 - http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x1029113

[Reterr]

300. No kidding.eom

[Dystopian]

240. Thank you...KandR

I've not read any of the threads...one can miss a lot in a day.
I only knew that he said it and that an apology would be forthcoming.
As far as DU, something at this point to be expected. Sad indeed.
I'm sorry that you were compelled to write this, yet there's hope as I found it on the greatest page.
peace~

[deacon]

245. A Bush administration hangover. The last administration drove deep divisions

intentionally, intentionally causing furor. And the GOP segment still remains the same. The still offer NOTHING but criticism because they are on the wrong side of every mainstream issue. They want failure. The media remains the same because if they don't have a scandal, they create one. Neither have any interest in anything excepts themselves.

So yes, it is time to put the brakes on. Take a step back and lose the knee jerk reactionary stuff. Bush deserved different scrutiny because of arrogance and mean spirited policies they drove. All this ballyhoo is,is a way of trying to blame obama for everything-it's all HIS fault. 'Look what a horrible man he is!' stuff.

He had a slip of the tongue. Thats it.

[slay]

246. I agree - the reaction to this has been completely bizarre and overblown

Kind of like earlier today on DU when I was trying to talk about how Eliot Spitzer had written a great article about how AIG was at the center of this bullshit with loads of details and insight and you know what response I got? I'm sure you do. It was "I can't get past his hooker fetish." UNFREAKINREAL! Had nothing to do with what I was talking about at all. Sigh. Very disappointing to find out DU members get soooo caught up on petty stupid shit. Oh well... :shrug:

[anniebelle]

254. Where was the outrage when Limpballs was mocking Michael J. Fox

and when they were wearing their fucking purple band aids to show their thanks to our vets (John Kerry and Max Cleland) for their service? Sorry, but I'm not moved by their "indignant uproar". I had a child that was retarded (severely, died when he was 38) and worked around them most of my adult life and let me tell you, people can be cruel, but Barack is not one of them. The right-wing nuts are going to latch on to ANYTHING they can and throw it out there as red meat to their low i.q. "base" and see how many turds float to the top to come on teevee shows and their stupid radio shows and tell everybody how this awful ni-ni- er uh exotic president has indeed "FAILED". So I'm staying off cable shows except Keith, Rachel, Jon and Steve, where you will find all the news that is fit to be broadcast. This has been my policy since the 2004 election, and my head is much clearer without so much garbage floating around from the cable clap-trap. Just a suggestion.

[LostinVA]

259. WHERE WAS THE OUTRAGE??? You were obviously not on here, were you?

IT WAS ALL OVER TEH FUCKING PLACE.

Clueless.

[EmilyAnne]

382. You missed my point completely. And by the way, Keith Olbermann covered this Special Olympics

comment.

I do believe that most of the media people harping on this could care less.
I also believe that people like Rush Limbuagh do not get taken down in the media for their intentionally hateful remarks.
I know that Obama is not a cruel person.
People on this site defending the comment by saying that anyone who was hurt needs to "get over it," "get a life," "stop faking outrage," "get a sense of humor," etc. just plan suck.
Obama himself does not defend it because, as you said, he is kind.

[ejbr]

261. I am guessing that this "MEAN" attitude has always been here

Even people responding to this thread don't seem to "get it". Being a gay black man with no disabilities, I am at an advantage of "getting it" because so many people did not, or do not, get some of the offenses that require the unaffected to actual THINK about why there might be a problem.

Maybe this has already been pointed out, but for Obama to claim that poor bowling = Special Olympics = funny is the same as laughing at a disabled person bowling. Period. Would these so-called progressives laugh at a disabled person bowling? Probably not, but laughing at their expense is acceptable.

Apparently, progressives can be intellectually lazy too.

[humbled_opinion]

323. I also noted...

that when he said those comments many people laughed in the studio, now was that just PC generated laugh/applause or were those laughing in some cultural dementia that made that comment seem to be OK?

[ejbr]

373. Some thought it funny, others were probably mesmerized n/t

[kstewart33]

262. Perhaps any "meanness" stems from a deep frustration.

I'm frustrated at all the piling on Obama. Seems it was just a few months ago, that we were all deliriously happy that he was elected. But since then, when he's tackling the greatest financial crisis in our collective lifetimes, the guy can do nothing right.

He's wrong about this, about that. We're getting almost as bad as the Repubs.

And now, there's the relentless criticism because he told a bad joke that he immediately regretted.
Breaking news guys: our President is human.

It was a joke. A very unfortunate joke. But that's all.

And when Maria Shriver says that he's hurt millions around the world, well, I just want this nonsense to stop.

I'm sorry that millions around the world are feeling hurt, but frankly, I'm not losing any sleep over it. Because there are far more serious, no tragic, problems to lose sleep about.

If you see that as insensitivity or being mean, so be it. I see it as a clarion call: Can we assume alittle perspective here and get back to the problems that are also hurting millions around the world in terms of lost jobs and foreclosures?

[rucky]

263. This is the typical PC debate of the week.

I've been here since 03, and don't see how this flamewar is any different from the last 50

[Toasterlad]

264. DU Specializes In Telling Minorities How They're Allowed to Feel.

Or didn't you pick up on that during the Rick Warren controversy? It wasn't enough that some people weren't offended by the nomination; they had to tell gay people that WE WERE WRONG TO FEEL OFFENDED.

We get told how to feel here all the time. That's why this is hardly a shock. Since I'm not disabled, I would never make the mistake of thinking I can understand how a disabled person would feel about Obama's remarks, let alone tell them they're crazy to feel that way. But to many DU assholes, anyone who doesn't agree with their view of things is an idiot, even if that person knows WAY more about the issue than said assholes.

[Starry Messenger]

268. Excellent summation. n/t

[QC]

271. Yes, that's pretty much the shape of things. n/t

[Bluebear]

302. As usual, you summarize it elegantly.

[Buzz Clik]

266. Christ, am I glad this has been a busy week for me.

I guess I missed the latest shiny distraction.

[Alcibiades]

267. I have a brother with Downs

No outrage here, but I have not had to care for him. I can understand the upset, tho I don't agree with it personally.

[dem629]

269. I think it's more about the overreaction by the PC speech police.

And just for the record: If you don't like the way something is said, don't say it. Don't like a certain person on TV/radio, don't listen.

If you'd like to start applying speech codes, you can kiss freedom goodbye because such standards are ALWAYS subjective, and anyone could shut anyone else down with a simple claim of outraged offense.

Plus, my sig is true, too, so I'm going with that and dismissing the effort to control speech.

Get over it.

[JohnnyLib2]

270. Those who want to, and are willing, will learn from this go-round.

Others don't want to and will not learn.

I'm speaking from long years of direct contact with the folks who look forward to Special Olympics.
Our local group can always use volunteers and I'm sure others can as well.

[TankLV]

272. Glad I missed it - sometimes it's good to stay away for a bunch of days or even weeks...

[BR_Parkway]

276. Nothing new - obese, gay and other groups who get offended are

routinely told they are being too sensitive or that we have no right to feel outrage about something that we think is offensive

[HughMoran]

277. There is a reason I decided to hide all threads on this topic

I saw some of the comments where people went out of their way to defend and/or use as an excuse to attack the President and thought to myself "these sorts of situations never work out" and hid all threads on this topic. Unlike you however, I'm not surprised at all - this happens all the time here.

[Individualist]

278. It's an issue of progressives vs. DLC/NDC supporters.

[BobRossi]

280. It has been taken over by brown shirted party shills.

"My party right or wrong" is the prevailing wind.

[Marrah_G]

281. It's been going on for a year now

It only happens because it's been allowed to go on for so long.

My post will probably be deleted, but it is the truth.

[NNN0LHI]

284. Just don't lose sight we are on an anonymous Internet chat site

We have no idea who most the people who are posting here are or what their actual agenda really is.

Christ, we have people proudly posting Ron Paul insanity here. Whats that tell ya?

Don

[Torn_Scorned_Ignored]

285. What, you didn't get a Heart?

:shrug:

[opihimoimoi]

287. Its the PUB TROLLs who come here to make twoubles...n/m

[Fearless]

288. The difference is that we know that Obama meant no malice with the comment.

That's all.

[EmilyAnne]

381. But any people who have any legitimate sensitivities related to the Special Olympics should have

INSTANTLY known Obama's intentions and had no problem at all with the comment.
If they did have hurt feelings, they are just looking for an excuse to be outraged?

To have expressed their hurt feelings they are attempting to control people's speech?

These are the lines of "logic" that I have a problem with. Especially on DU.

[Fearless]

394. Agreed.

[Gman]

289. Here's the point: You know up front that Obama does not think badly

about anyone. That's not his nature. We already know that about him. So it's just wrong to treat this as anything but a self-deprecating joke gone awkwardly wrong. He acknowledged the mistake and he apologized. Afterwards he know doubt said, "Oh shit, I can't believe I said that!"

It's no big deal because he didn't mean it in a disparaging way. And we know that because we know Obama's not like that.

[RedCappedBandit]

291. DU is no longer the tight knit community of progressives it once was. nt

[FReepaholic]

292. "He apologized. I was never "outraged" by the comment. "

>>He apologized. I was never "outraged" by the comment.

The reason you are not outraged is because you know he "meant well". He has a good heart. He is kind, He is compassionate. He cares. At worst it was a lame attempt at self deprecating humor. If Bush had the same thing you would have blown a gasket, because as we all know, he is a mean, cruel, unfeeling, uncaring, selfish, greedy warmongering SOB with nothing but contempt and malice toward the "little people". And he would have meant every word he said.

[progressoid]

294. Well, I'm PRACTICALLY PERFECT IN EVERY WAY, so I'll have to sit this one out.

[1776Forever]

296. I like what you said about "Having a brain and a big heart, he immediately apologized."

I think that says it all. We all have things like this that we say at times that may hurt someone's feelings. I am a large woman with an illness that contributes to my weight problem. I hear a lot of people on TV and elsewhere make jokes about obese people, and no one apologizes for that "joke". It is something that we all must face if we are really a mature person who is trying to do the right thing for all our community and the disabled both mentally and physically are a part of that community along with those who are over weight. None of us are perfect and we all must remember that fact if we want to move on from school yard kidding days.

Peace ~ :toast:

[dbackjon]

297. Welcome to the World of GLBT DU'ers...

[libodem]

301. How the hell did this make the front page

for me to click. Fuck this!

[Patchuli]

305. Personally, I referred to a poster as a whiner

for repeatedly spamming one thread with how "SHAMEFUL" President Obama was for making his somewhat careless remark. My reaction was not to the persons for being offended, but to that particular person because the spamming looked like whining. You don't need to keep screaming in caps and attacking the Pres over and over. That does look like whining and/or trolling. If my feeling on that particular person's posting offends you, oh well.

[man4allcats]

306. In one respect at least, there is regrettably little difference between DU and Free Republic.

I refer to the fact that the high school cheerleader contingency exists here just as it does there. "Our team right or wrong. Rah Rah Rah!" Well, it's an open discussion board. You get all kinds. As long as people don't break the rules, they can pretty much post any stupid thing they want. As for Obama, on those few occasions when it becomes necessary, at least he has the good sense to extract his foot from his mouth and apologize. When did we ever see a Thugger do that?!

[October]

307. It's been like this for some time...

It can be as rude, sarcastic, shallow and unfeeling as the freeper site(s). On many occasions, it has caused me to wonder if the right wing has infiltrated. Seems that way. It's not what it once was.

[sam kane]

309. people in their 40s

I would guess that a lot of us who grew up in the 70s with the Special Olympics line as one of the standard lines in kid culture. Really pathetic line that it is, revealing of American culture in general.

I get exactly were it came from, and Obama is right to find it indefensible. The people who defend it are really confusing, I agree.

[omega minimo]

322. It also seemed self-deprecating. I had to find the video to see what he actually said.

That doesn't make the phrase appropriate. But he was making fun of himself, with dry wit and smart enough to know (after he did it) it could hurt others.

[SlingBlade]

314. This is Democratic Underground

I am a Progressive Democrat, Progressive first Democrat second.
We are not perfect, Democratic Underground is not perfect

But one thing is for sure, Of all the highways, Byways and Back Alleys
on the Internet Superhighway this is the one place I feel at home.
I’ve been here almost from the beginning and I can tell you if you or any other
group feels this strongly about some off hand remark made by our President,
President Obama, Then you have a literal Universe in which to take it

But Not Here !

This aint Free fucking Republic and it aint no fucking “Hey why cant we all get along site”

Anyone who cant deal with that, Get the fuck outta my neighborhood.

Sorry, But that's the way I feel, Its been too long, Too long listening to this
bullshit, I’m not taking it anymore, Especially not here.

So off with you, Your choices are legion

(Edited to clean up the language)

[omega minimo]

326. Good points. What's your interpretation of

The administrators of Democratic Underground are working to provide a place where progressives can share ideas and debate in an atmosphere of mutual respect.

Every member of this community has a responsibility to participate in a respectful manner, and to help foster an atmosphere of thoughtful discussion. In this regard, we strongly advise that our members exercise a little common decency, rather than trying to parse the message board rules to figure out what type of antisocial behavior is not forbidden.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/forums/rules_detailed.html

[SlingBlade]

347. Reply to Dispatches from the Looney Bin

Couldn't agree more with Skinner.
Also couldn't agree more with the purpose of this site and it’s
message that this is a forum for Democrats and Progressives.

Democrats and Progressives !
Not disaffected right wingers who have finally come to the conclusion that even they cannot be associated with a Party and philosophy that has degraded itself to the point of making the Nazis look good.

I make no apologies, This apparent new genesis which makes it fine to criticize all things Democratic and progressive is not lost upon me our the other war dogs who still remain.

Any Questions, See my last post, It explains precisely where to put it :)

[omega minimo]

350. So you ignore the Rules and the question. How convenient for you.

:thumbsdown:

[EmilyAnne]

390. "All things Democratic and Progressive" of course includes anything that may slip out of the mouth

of a Democrat or Progressive.
Because I continued to insist that, actually, some people were legitimately hurt by the comment that Obama himself apologized for, I am criticizing something included in "all things Democratic and Progressive."

Because people continued to insist that any of the legitimately hurt people are "potraging," "looking for any reason to get upset," whiny babies," "humorless," etc......"all things Democratic and Progressive" are being honored.

Awesome!

If you have actually read my posts in this thread and the other posts attacking my premise, and you actually think that I am a disaffected right winger, then you are living in a bizarro world.

[EmilyAnne]

388. l love you too! Its so great to finally reach your limit. Enough is enough, right?

Reading a post that claims that some people were legitimately hurt by Obama's off hand comment must be the last straw!
Its all too much to bear to read such a thing.
Especially when you already KNOW that there is no way that it can possibly be true.
No one's feelings were REALLY hurt and even if they were, those people are whiny babies who simply want to be OUTRAGED!

As for me, I "feel THIS strongly" about Barack Obama's statement that I took the radical approach of (are you sitting down) responding to people laughing it off by saying, hey, actually some people were legitimately hurt.
What an extreme, undermining things to say!

[TLM]

316. How offensive... you owe an apology!!!

"Having a brain and a big heart, he immediately apologized. "


Your comments are hurtful and insensitive to the thousands of Americans suffering from hypertrophy, otherwise known as an enlarged heart.

Maybe you should take your hateful mockery of heart disease somewhere else?


:sarcasm:

[BrklynLiberal]

324. I agree with you on both points.

Pres Obama had no ill-will in his heart.
and
I believe that DU is suffering the inevitable symptoms of a system that evolves and changes.
Entropy...which is an index of the tendency of a system toward spontaneous change is irresistible.
DU, as an organism is changing, and there are those of us who may or may not be happy with the changes.


http://www.nexialinstitute.com/social_entropy.htm
According to the Second Law of Thermodynamics, the entropy of a naturally occurring system always increases. If we use this statement to help to understand a human society, a question arises immediately: Why is human society not chaotic on the whole?. The answer appears to rely on society’s own ability to create organized systems and sub systems by using intelligence. Let us take any well defined human society for our analysis. A nation or any major political unit will do. We know that there are rules that must be obeyed by all people in such a system (at least in theory). These are the political laws that they obey. In<4> this way, political, economic, cultural and social rules must (or should) be well defined and assembled in theory and practice in order to avoid / prevent totally chaotic systems. To the extent that these laws are observed and followed by the individuals within the system, the system will be orderly, “regular” and avoid chaos. Those individuals who do NOT obey the laws introduce disorder / chaos into the system. Thus the disorder is a precise measure of expressed disagreement with and dissatisfaction with the rules / laws of the society. All these variables may configure a social response, that is to say, a degree of dissatisfaction or satisfaction with the current system. As a matter of fact, if the social rules are arbitrarily applied in favor of minorities, the social entropy will increase with time more rapidly, compared to other social systems where justice favors no one and applies to everyone, particularly to large majorities. Those who do not obey are criminals, and must be dealt with as such. This forces conformity to the laws, the rules of behavior, and applies a correction / motivation to prevent chaos.

One of the key points for a rapid increase of the social entropy is the degree of civil disobedience, expressing information about internal dissatisfaction and encouraging chaos and giving rise to the eventual “birth” of leaders in a particular scenario. Consequently, we may see that social disorder comes from social dissatisfaction, hence social entropy exists and may be calculated if we are able to deduce mathematical relationships for it. Fortunately for us, we did not have to dig too deep in order to find it.

<snip>

Apparently, there are two ways for a political system to force to an apparent social order, which is by being honest and open, giving voluntary compliance with rules, or by making use of the force, which is characteristic of dictatorial regimes; but the last one works only for a very short period of time; because DSb will start increasing leading undoubtedly to the social dissatisfaction.

Human society has coined several sayings which is a sophisticated way of stating the second law of thermodynamics: remember for example: “There is no political malady which will last 100 years, and there is nobody who will go along with it”(simply because social entropy increases). Would you please remember Montesinos and his “partner” as an pathetic example?. Or remember the disorder of Alan Garcia before that?, just to rely on the Peruvian case.






http://matei.org/ithink/2008/12/12/a-social-entropy-vision-of-wiki-collaboration/
A social entropy vision of wiki collaboration

Posted by Sorin Adam Matei on December 12th, 2008 | Article had 115 views

Despite the fact that diverse and equal participation of members is considered to be the essence of true online communities, no compelling index has been proposed to measure the degree of diversity in terms of contributions of content to online social environments. The primary purpose of the paper is to reintroduce to the communication field a tool particularly suited for measuring diversity and equality of participation. This paper argues that the notion of social entropy, as defined in information theory, can be applied to measure participatory diversity and is especially suitable for characterizing online groups. Adopting social entropy researchers can better and more systematically (i) estimate participatory diversity of online communities or groups; (ii) compare different online groups in terms of participatory diversity; (iii) evaluate changes of contribution over time; (v) understand online interaction dynamics at small and large group scales.

[NAO]

329. DU'ers frequently get their panties in a bunch

DU'ers frequently get their panties in a bunch. The causes are (usually) legitimate, but the reaction, and the subsequent hijacking of the discussion of the entire progressive agenda, is out of proportion.

I can't really cite instances without risking re-creating the phenomena, but it has happened lots before.

OK, I'm thinking of one instance...the last general election, in which progressives had the biggest victory they've had in years, and yet suffered a devastating, heart crushing blow in more than one state on a particular culture war driven ballot measure. The victory celebration was dampened because of this particular defeat. Worse, not much else was discussed for days (weeks?). And then again when a certain "Pu**s* Driven" bigot was chosen to speak at a public event...there have been dozens of these type of things every year since I've been at DU.

If you are a person who is moderate and gently accepting of the status quo, while patiently working on gradual, imperceivable change, you will probably be more at home on the discussion board over at the DLC. But most DU'ers are not like that...hence the outbursts.

However, these outbursts are self-correcting, and with a little time things come back into line.

[flvegan]

330. The doctor said I wouldn't have so many nose bleeds if I kept my finger outta there.

[KG]

331. i remember when i had to walk to DU! in the snow! barefoot! uphill! both ways! by gum!

you little bastards get off my lawn!

[tjwash]

332. whippersnapper. Skinner used to beat us with a leather belt, and we were grateful.

nt

[NAO]

336. Clinging to Religion & Guns, Nancy Reagan Seances, and Special Olympics

"Clinging to Religion & Guns", Nancy Reagan Seances, and Special Olympics.

I think that covers ALL of Obama's major gaffes

Now, truthfully, loved the "religion and guns" statement, although I feared it might hurt Obama.

And I laughed my ass off about the slam of Nancy Reagan's superstitions.

Now the "Special Olympics" reference was BOTH "out of line" AND a part of ordinary discourse. The attention given to the gaffe will definitely have an effect of raising consciousness about this particular issue. And the process of raising consciousness has the effect of taking these type of BOTH/AND neologisms out of polite discourse.

[mitchtv]

338. Thanks Emily Anne, I agree

as a member of a group that is often demeaned and derided by both DU'rs and Democrats. I have seen people with legitimate(to Me) gripes about Obama or the Party get smothered by STFU threads from the Obama cheerleader set, who may not even disagree with you but cannot tolerate that Obama can be wrong about things occasionally, much less criticized for it. It was a stupid joke made for a laugh, It was bad taste, he apologized. That alone belies the fact that some were insulted.

[Vanje]

343. self delete nt

[davidinalameda]

351. welcome to my world

when the Warren thing was going on, you had people telling those of us who were upset about it to basically sit down and shut up

then you have the attacks on people of faith

contrary to popular belief DU is not some safe haven

[EmilyAnne]

412. I remember that very well, david. I also remember when the "monkey" cartoon about the stimulus

package was being discussed on this site and in the MSM. Over and over again, there were people who absolutely refused to see why anyone would be hurt by the cartoon.
That's my problem.

People dismiss anyone's hurt feelings as mere posturing. Some fool on another thread said that people who were upset by the Down Syndrome joke should be "slapped to death." Obviously, a goofy hyperbole. Still, why the inability to simply say that while it didn't bother you, you can see why some people feel bad?

It makes some people so angry when another person has their feelings hurt about something that does not bother them. I will never understand why.

One weekend when I was in college, my 15 year old twin brothers visited.
My roommates and I had a great time introducing them to Austin.
One night, one of my brothers referred to something as being "so gay."
One of my roommates who was gay said, "excuse me?"
So my brother, of course, turned bright red and felt so bad, going on and on about how the word didn't have anything to with homosexuality, it just meant dumb, etc., etc.
Finally, my roommate said that he knew my brother didn't use that expressions to offend gay people, but now that he knew that it does, why not just stop saying it?
My brother stopped his attempts to explain and apologize and just said "ok. I'll stop."
And that was the end.

Now, if my brother had gotten angry because my roommate took offense to a comment that clearly wasn't meant to offend, I would have been really disappointed in him.

[Hello_Kitty]

359. Too late to rec this but you are spot on.

The whole thing about encouraging sensitivity is not to make people walk around on egg shells. It's expecting people to behave like mature and decent people who take responsibility for their actions and statements. President Obama demonstrated exactly how to handle the situation: He realized he was insensitive and apologized for it. A less mature person would stamp his feet and whine about people being "PC" and come up with a bazillion excuses for why what he said wasn't offensive and the problem lies with the overly sensitive people who were offended. Whenever someone tells me I'm over-sensitive my response to them is typically, "no I'm not over-sensitive, YOU'RE an asshole."

[EmilyAnne]

416. Thank you. n/t

[Dollface]

360. You are right. He made a mistake and he needed to apologize. No dodging or justifying or other

childish behavior.

Some people choose their political party like they choose their favorite sports teams. You talk them and they are die hard Dem's but the most anti-progressive unliberal stuff comes out of their mouths.

[McCamy Taylor]

368. Some folks at DU seem to want Obama to be as all powerful as W. Can not figure out why.

Power corrupts.

[Skittles]

371. I hear you, Miss Emily

I'm sick of the holier than thou attitude of many DUers who take any kind of negative feelings towards Obama as some kind of fascism.

[Joanne98]

383. Well it sure has been a great distraction. Mission accomplished!

[EmilyAnne]

386. Exactly as we planned it, my dear. My family and I have been waiting for so many years to have

something to have our feelings hurt about.
Thank heavens that Obama said what he did.
By the way, having your feelings hurt and saying something about it is the same thing as being OUTRAGED!!!!
Obama's apology is the same thing as CENSORSHIP!
He is a victim of our selfish, phony PC tantrums (tantrums = saying something like, "ouch. That hurt. I know he didn't mean it, but ouch.")

Of course, none of us have cared about anything else politically, socially or ethically until Obama's comment.
We believe that nothing else is as important as our feelings and we hope to completely undermine every progressive movement by the very radical, selfish act of saying that we momentarily had our feelings hurt.

[omega minimo]

392. an invitation

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x5300040

[dbt]

387. They obviously let a shitload of the wrong people in.

But it's like Jagger said back in 1967:

"Sold out? Sure we sold out. But we did it for a hell of a lot of money."

[pecwae]

399. It explains why many

members who have been around for a while have decided not to donate. It also explains the absence of many longtimers.

[QC]

403. You've noticed that too, eh?

[bridgit]

401. For me there's always been a conceited, mean spirited component of DU...

that seems to enjoy little more than offering the most asinine comments and display their own personal ignorance through the ignore feature while cliquing (and yes that's spelled right) round and right through a DU that offers them an 'adult' toy, busy box experience did I mention under pretense of what they think is Lib/Pro?

[QC]

402. Very true, but lately that element is setting the tone for the whole place.

Most of the ugliness here is the work of only a few very nasty people who would have been thrown out a few years ago but are now allowed to run amok. That's the big change.

[bridgit]

404. Oh I agree. Not saying we're going regional here perish the thought but I've seen Gone Baby Gone

Where half the world tells the other half to, "Go fuck your mother!" and the crafty girls with the beasty boys north south east west whatever their orientation or claims to sensitivity they hear it as a term of endearment

[omega minimo]

417. "degrades the quality of discussion for everyone"

The worst of them, it's hard to tell if they know they are (acting like) crazy hypocrites or not. The self righteousness of the worst vandals is unbelievable.

Is there some purpose, some entertainment value, some........?

[Ladyhawk]

410. My Farewell Post to DU, Reposted

I posted this when I stopped participating actively on DU:

____

Why I am leaving DU: a better explanation and a fond farewell.
Posted by Ladyhawk in The DU Lounge
Tue Jun 27th 2006, 12:20 AM
There are some very high quality people at DU, so I figured you deserved a better explanation than the one I gave you a few days ago. I've made some good friends here. Many of you defy the nature of the beast (Internet forum) and retain a high moral standard no matter what. I truly admire you. I especially admire your ability to persevere despite stresses and setbacks. I'm sorry if the abruptness of my post hurt any feelings.

I'm going to have to take a break from DU and politics, perhaps a permanent one. My basic sensitivity, my chronic illnesses and other stresses are making it difficult for me to function in day-to-day life. They are making it hard for me to maintain civility in personal relationships and especially on Internet forums. I don't like who I am when I become an ass on an Internet forum. If I do return, it will be in a limited manner. No more GD.

I thought it might help to educate you a bit about the basic nature of the 15 to 20% of human beings who are highly sensitive by nature. I've always detected a difference between my basic nature and that of most others. I was born that way and I've been that way my whole life.

http://tinyurl.com/eqs3a

Hypersensitivity...you say that like it's a bad thing...

On her website and in her book, The Highly Sensitive Person, Dr. Elaine Aron notes:

If you find you are a highly sensitive person, or your child is, then you need to be aware of the following points:

* This trait is normal--it is inherited by 15 to 20% of the population, and indeed the same percentage seems to be present in all higher animals.
* Being an HSP means your nervous system is more sensitive to subtleties. Your sight, hearing, and sense of smell are not necessarily keener (although they may be). But your brain processes information and reflects on it more deeply.
* Being an HSP also means, necessarily, that you are more easily overstimulated, stressed out, overwhelmed.
* This trait is not something new I discovered--it has been mislabeled as shyness (not an inherited trait), introversion (30% of HSPs are actually extraverts), inhibitedness, fearfulness, and the like. HSPs can be these, but none of these are the fundamental trait they have inherited.
* The reason for these negative misnomers and general lack of research on the subject is that in this culture being tough and outgoing is the preferred or ideal personality--not high sensitivity. (Therefore in the past the research focus has been on sensitivity's potential negative impact on sociability and boldness, not the phenomenon itself or its purpose.) This cultural bias affects HSPs as much as their trait affects them, as I am sure you realize. Even those who loved you probably told you, "don't be so sensitive," making you feel abnormal when in fact you could do nothing about it and it is not abnormal at all.

http://www.hsperson.com /



The DU Rules:

3. Civility: Treat other members with respect. Do not post personal attacks against other members of this discussion forum.

4. Content: Do not post messages that are inflammatory, extreme, divisive, incoherent, or otherwise inappropriate. Do not engage in anti-social, disruptive, or trolling behavior. Do not post broad-brush, bigoted statements. The moderators and administrators work very hard to enforce some minimal standards regarding what content is appropriate. But please remember that this is a large and diverse community that includes a broad range of opinion. People who are easily offended, or who are not accustomed to having their opinions (including deeply personal convictions) challenged may not feel entirely comfortable here. A thick skin is necessary to participate on this or any other discussion forum.


Folks break the civility and "no personal attacks" rules all the time on DU. It's expected. The rules are practically ignored with the expectation that some of one's posts will be deleted. Hell, I've broken the rules numerous times myself. Breaking the rules of civility is necessary in order to defend oneself. Flamewars have become--or perhaps have always been--normal on Internet forums, and especially in DU's General Discussion forums. I've often wondered what it is about the anonymity of the Internet that leads us to behave in this manner.

One of the reasons I participated here for so long was I hoped the lack of civil discourse in GD would "toughen me up." Maybe it helped some, but I can't change my inherited nature, which is that of a highly sensitive person. So, according to the rules, I really don't belong on DU because I am hypersensitive. I freely admit it. It makes things difficult in some ways, but in some ways it's a gift. It tends to go along with an artistic and thoughtful nature, both of which I possess. Unfortunately, the stress of being a highly sensitive person in this society tends to impinge upon the positive aspects of the trait, curbing creativity and creating defensiveness. That part of being highly sensitive totally sucks.

After I left in a huff, I realized I had, for the most part, stopped posting original threads in GD for fear of being flamed. I also realized I had stopped posting anything that might get me flamed. I went against the grain once again and shouldn't have been surprised at the result. Sensitive folks probably aren't too keen on sharing any observations that run counter to GD "norms."

In effect, the DU rules disallow highly sensitive people--perhaps 15 to 20% of the population--but hell, they also disallow flamewars and GD is perpetually combusting. I ran across this as I was posting:

When I'm bored, I go to DU just to post flamebait

I think GD would benefit by the participation of more sensitive people, but I don't think that is very likely to happen.

Hell...maybe no one belongs on Internet forums. Why do we behave the way we do? It's just sad. All Skinner et al. can do is delete posts as they are alerted and occasionally tombstone someone who flagrantly breaks the rules repeatedly without saying "I'm sorry" in just the right way. This isn't an indictment of the admins. I think they do a hell of a job considering the number and types of people who post here. What I have trouble with is the environment created by anonymous Internet forums in general. There's something about them that makes us behave differently than we would in real life.

I don't like who I am when I fight back on Internet forums. Maybe it's my basic sensitivity. Maybe it's shame left over from my fundy upbringing. In the end, it doesn't matter. I don't enjoy fighting. Others openly claim they enjoy flamebaiting and arguing. I don't understand that. They probably don't understand me, either.

When I posted that I was leaving, I'm sure there were a lot of "don't let the door hit ya where the good Lord split ya" type of posts. There were probably copycat posts mocking my decision, posts saying, "Don't you hate when someone has to be a drama queen and announce they are leaving? Fuck, just do it!" So, hey, I didn't read the thread. Can you blame me? I don't plan to read this one, either, so feel free to express yourself however you like...not that anything I say would stop you.

I imagine the majority of you behaved in a more civilized manner. To you, I bid you a fond adieu. I may return if I can find my footing again, but I won't try "toughening up the GD way" anymore. It doesn't seem to work.

As for my stupid decision to vote for Mr. Bush in the 2000 election, yes, it was a mistake. I have felt a lot of guilt over it. Luckily, my vote didn't change anything because I live in California, which voted for President Gore. Had my state swung red, I would feel even more guilt than I do now.

However, I cannot in good conscience accept too much guilt, for there were mitigating circumstances, which I spoke of in several posts.

In the thread of which I speak, most posters issued a blanket condemnation of anyone who voted Republican. Some gave us "year-2000 losers" a break; some condemned anyone who had ever voted Republican for any reason. The general consensus was, however, that anyone who voted Republican shared a huge amount of blame...some even said 100% of the blame. For awhile after the 2004 election, I felt that angry with anyone who voted for Bush, but finally decided it was pretty hypocritical of me to point a finger at them when I had my own share of life mistakes (hello...year 2000?). I might even say the same of some of you who are still blaming voters. Yes, some of them really fucked up, but if they wake up and decide to help, are you just going to throw their vote back in their face and say, "Screw you!"...or are you going to accept their help which is so desperately needed?

There are stages of grief and one of them is anger. Maybe some of you need to feel the anger for awhile longer before you can let go of the grief, but in the end, we are all human. We all fuck up. No one can stand entirely blameless. Hey, maybe you could have made just ONE MORE call on behalf of Kerry, eh? No one can entirely shoulder the blame, either. Maybe in 2004, "Mary Sue" voted for Bush in Ohio...but what if she sees her error and decides to make up for it as best she can? Will you go on blaming her? Or will you accept her much-needed help? This entire planet is in so much trouble. How much self-righteousness can we afford?

I don't know the answers to these questions. I still feel a lot of anger as I go through my own grieving process. My entire family is wrapped up in the process. Also, I have a problem trusting people who have proven their untrustworthiness by past behavior. Finding the right balance is very difficult for me. Perhaps you find yourself in similar circumstances.

I just wanted to leave you with some things to think about...or not...as you see fit. Adieu, DU.

[stubtoe]

418. Lotsa disruptors. n/t