To the folks who were trashing Bill Maher after Friday's show:

[Cetacea]

You sure you are on the right forum?

[Drunken Irishman]

1. What were they saying?

[Cetacea]

4. What a "prick" he is and so on. Of course not mentioning

that he gave perhaps the most succinct and accurate trashing of the republican party ever (as seen in the video that is currently on the front page).

[RoyGBiv]

2. Who's Bill Mayer?

You mean Bill Maher?

I trash Bill Maher all the time 'cause his act is obnoxious.

He has some opinions I agree with a great deal of the time. Occasionally when he directs his obnoxiousness toward people I loathe, I find humor in it. Overall, though, he's just obnoxious ... and not particularly original.

And, yes, I'm in the right forum.

[Cetacea]

3. Some fair reporting would be nice for the HBO-less

Is all I am saying.

[RoyGBiv]

6. Fair reporting of what?

Yeah, he generally does have a rant or some bit he does that makes me want to stand up and applaud.

Most people I have seen commenting on his show Friday have simply picked on the fact he's a jerk. And he is, or at least the character he plays on television is. (I don't know him personally and so allow he may be a wonderful person in real life.) The fact he offers opinions and smack downs many of us here tend to like doesn't mitigate that. Hell, back in the day, I liked some of Dennis Miller's rants when he had an HBO show. The episode he had with Robin Williams was one of the funniest things I think I've ever seen. But Dennis Miller is still a prick.

[Cetacea]

5. And, arer you sure?

[RoyGBiv]

7. Sure of what?

Do you really want to throw down on whether I belong here?

Really?

Because I think Bill Maher is a jerk? Is this your standard?

[Cetacea]

9. I am more interested in why you think that.

And why it is more important than some of the right-wing bashing he did last night. i am mostly curious, especially after all of the Rush talk this past week and the Fairness and so forth.

Also, many people in that thread saw the show and were confused as to why he was being a "prick" in that particular show.

He's not original but really, after Bach, who is?

[RoyGBiv]

12. Confusion ...

The "confusion" confuses me too. As I made clear in my reply, Maher is always a prick, and as I've said repeatedly now, the fact he has opinions I like doesn't mitigate that. Anyone who expresses shock that Maher has acted like an asshole hasn't really paid too much attention to him and probably only likes him because he said something they like.

I don't know whether his persona is "more important" than his anti-right-wing rants. Regardless, I'm not and never have been one to fall into the cult of personality based on the opinions someone expresses. I know a number of people with whom I agree politically who I wouldn't cross the street to piss on if they were on fire. A person can be and often is unlikeable but still express thoughts many of us find agreeable.

Consider John Forbes Nash, for instance. The guy was an utter shit. But, his story is inspirational, and he did and said and wrote things that are worth being read and heard and remembered. He was still a jerk most of the time.

[Cetacea]

17. I understand why you would feel that way and sometimes agree.

I really didn't mean to make this personal (sorry) I mm just a bit burned around the edges right now. I am livid about how much publicity Rush got this past week and his ratings have gone up too. We on the left have so little when it comes to left-wing media presence. Yes, there are some great liberal talents but how many people watch MSNBC and Comedy Central late at night? Or hear Mike Malloy and the other great radio hosts?

There was a long and viscous thread here a few months ago that trashed Randi Rhodes for ever. Mostly because she is rude to her callers (as if these bastards on cable and radio aren't?)
My guess is that in order to survive these daze in that market you have to be a bit like that or you lose your gig.

Babbling...
So when I read that thread I got a bit more depressed thinking that Maher was tilting right or something to that affect There was no mention of the wonderful diatribe that he gave in his New Rules.

I need to stop watching cable "news".

[RoyGBiv]

23. Now that it's not personal ...

My thoughts on Maher are varied.

Back in 2001 I was a (non-traditional) college student who regularly watched Maher's network show Politically Incorrect. I loved the concept, the idea that someone would have a talk show of sorts that pulled no punches and didn't seek to be correct all the time according to a certain political ideology's version of correct. A professor one day made some comment about a historical event that he prefaced with the comment, "Many of you will not find this politically correct," after which I told him he should go on Maher's show. (The professor was opining about Germany in WWI and suggesting that had Germany won that war, or at least had the US not entered it, the racist ideology that brought Hitler to power never would have found a foothold and WWII never would have happened the way it did ... quite the politically incorrect thing to say.)

And then 9/11 happened, and Maher made his comment about courage.

I defended Maher then and still do to this day. I stood up in class and suffered the ire of every last person around me, one person in particular calling me a traitor who should be taken out and shot right after my "hero" Bill Maher.

I say all that to say this ... I have realized since that day someone wished death upon me for standing up for what Maher said that while Maher was correct, the way he presented himself and the timing of it revealed that he was an unmitigated ass for saying it the way he did at the time he did. He, rather clearly in my view, was trying to provoke and trying to get ratings for his struggling show that was even before then under fire from right-wingers and left-wingers alike and not attracting the kind of sponsorship that would continue to fund its continued broadcast. He needed to get attention, and attention he got ... right up to being thrown off the air.

The only reason HBO has him now is because of that incident and because he has marketing guys and agents who were able to sell it to a broadcast medium that can weather controversy better than an advertising funded network.

I will not back away from my view that what Maher said was accurate, but there is more to being a public voice than accuracy. One can be accurate and not be a jerk, and the way Maher went about that whole thing was the ultimate in being a jerk.

As for Rush ... well, he's getting a lot of press in part because he's being put on the spot by the Obama administration. Obama and company aren't backing down from him like others have, and one thing that means is that we're going to hear a lot from and about him for awhile. As long as the strategy remains true, that's fine. On the whole, he's becoming the subject of *mainstream* ridicule. I can deal with hearing from and about him a lot more as long as that's the case.

[WCGreen]

24. Fuck he was just trying to get in Erin's pants...

[RoyGBiv]

26. I do not doubt that ...

... at all. :)

[paulsby]

31. do you understand the difference

between being a prick and having a political belief one agrees with?

those are not mutually inconsistent.

some of the most humane, wonderful, caring, intelligent, compassionate people i know have VERY VERY different views than me.

i also know some amazing pricks, who happen to agree with me politically.

there is NO correlation.

bill maher can be RIGHT (which i believe he is quite often) and still be a prick.

heck, michael moore is pretty well accepted by people who have worked with him or under him, as a TOTAL prick. does that make his movies any less relevant?

[sandnsea]

8. I know, I thought it was good

and the people he was rude to, he needed to be rude to. He didn't need to venture into the Steve Irwin thingy, but other than that, it was a good show considering what he was contending with.

[Cetacea]

10. Thanks. From the clip I saw on DU, it appeared that

he had a bad panel.

[devilgrrl]

11. Oh, I know. Wasn't that f-ed up or what?

How about that New Rule about the GOP anti-government BS?

[upi402]

13. Saint Bill is watching you

and making a list right now!

Be vewy vewy cawefulllll!!!!
:hide:

[billyoc]

14. Yes. Maher is a libertarian and a class enemy.

Having a quick wit doesn't change that.

[Syrinx]

19. Maher isn't an economic libertarian

The extent of Maher's libertarianism is that he wants marijuana to be legal.

[billyoc]

20. That's not the extent of his libertarianism.

[Syrinx]

21. what is?

[billyoc]

22. At a minimum, he's for privatizing Social Security.

BTW, nobody is called a libertarian just because they want to legalize pot, that would be fucking ludicrous.

[Syrinx]

25. it would be just as ludicrous to describe Maher as a libertarian, period

He's against drilling in the Alaskan Wildlife Refuge. He's in favor of Kyoto. He wants the government to keep our water and air clean. He rails against the pharmaceutical companies. He supports gun-control laws. He's solidly pro-choice on abortion. He supported Nader in 2000, and Obama in 2008. He's on the boards of both NORML and PETA.

He sounds fairly liberal to me. Not straight down the line liberal -- he supports the death penalty for example. But he is certainly more liberal than libertarian.

He pisses me off sometimes, but he is not libertarian in the sense of Ron Paul, or the Libertarian party. More along the lines of "give me some weed and whores" libertarian.

[RoyGBiv]

27. Weed and Whores Libertarian ...

:spray:

:rofl:

Yup ... that about describes him I think. :)

[Syrinx]

28. thanks for the support Roy!

You know, I might be one of them, too. :)

[RoyGBiv]

30. I was gonna say ...

I can identify with that.

I once thought I was a libertarian, pretty much for that reason. :)

[RoyGBiv]

29. delete

wrong place

[billyoc]

32. Well, then, tell him he's ludicrous. Did you think I pulled that label out of my ass?

He's a SELF-DESCRIBED libertarian.

[Syrinx]

33. I know that Maher has described himself as "libertarian"

But he just means that wants weed and whores. He's the farthest thing from a far-right "libertarian."

[ConcernedCanuk]

15. Now there's one thing I miss about not having TV - Bill Maher's show was one of my favorites

.
.
.

"Politically Incorrect" if I remember right

oh yes, he can be abrasive sometimes,

but I think he has an interesting point of view of our fucked up world

I put him up there with George Carlin and Jon Stewart.

Should mention Dave Letterman and Jay Leno while I'm at it

Imagine that gang in the White House?

Let's throw Richard Pryor and Bill Cosby in there for good measure

What a country that would be!!

[beac]

18. "Real Time" shows are usually up on YouTube by saturday morning.

That's how I've been watching the show since going TV-free.

Here's the link to Part 1:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QxTJKZCQUfI&feature=channel

[Sen. Walter Sobchak]

16. People also complained when he threw those screaming assholes out

Alot of people got pretty upset when he threw the screaming 9/11 "truthers" out after they disrupted a taping.