Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

Pakistan calls on U.S. to halt air strikes.

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (1/22-2007 thru 12/14/2010) Donate to DU
 
rug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 06:08 PM
Original message
Pakistan calls on U.S. to halt air strikes.
ISLAMABAD (Pakistan) - PAKISTAN urged President Barack Obama to halt US missile strikes on al-Qaeda strongholds near the Afghan border, saying on Saturday that civilians were killed the previous day in the first attacks since Mr Obama's inauguration.

Pakistani security officials said eight suspected foreign militants, including an Egyptian al-Qaeda operative, were among 22 people killed in Friday's twin strikes in the Waziristan region.

But the Foreign Ministry said that the attacks by unmanned aircraft also killed an unspecified number of civilians and that it had informed US officials of its 'great concern'.

'With the advent of the new US administration, it is Pakistan's sincere hope that the United States will review its policy and adopt a more holistic and integrated approach toward dealing with the issue of terrorism and extremism,' a ministry statement said.

'We maintain that these attacks are counterproductive and should be discontinued,' it said.

http://www.straitstimes.com/Breaking%2BNews/Asia/Story/...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
tekisui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 06:11 PM
Response to Original message
1. This is interesting:
Asif Ali Zardari, the Pakistani president, and General Ashfaq Kayani, the chief of Pakistan's military, met David Petraeus, the US Central Command chief, in Islamabad on Tuesday to discuss ways that the US could assist the country in combating extremism.

http://english.aljazeera.net/news/asia/2009/01/20091231...

Petraeus meets with Zardari on Tuesday, drone strikes come on Friday. I wonder what was said between the two.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tyne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 06:16 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. Maybe they should
spend their energy rounding up their terrorists.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Fire Walk With Me Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 06:18 PM
Response to Reply #2
5. If we know where they are, why can't Pakistanis round them up
and completely avoid civilian casualties?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
lonestarnot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 06:51 PM
Response to Reply #5
22. Perhaps Pakistan said no.
:shrug:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
kenny blankenship Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 07:14 PM
Response to Reply #5
24. No
Edited on Sat Jan-24-09 07:37 PM by kenny blankenship
The situation in Pakistan is much more precarious than generally admitted in US media. The coastal city of Karachi is already partially under the domination of Pakistan's version of the Taliban. (Which means they probably have some form of resupply route over the sea) In certain sections of Karachi they rule the streets. They are the police --with checkpoints and the whole deal, especially after dark. The "Taliban" presence in Karachi is a dagger point at the throat of the country: do the wrong thing and they will push the dagger in. Meanwhile their mountain base, the entire border province of Waziristan, is beyond the reach of the govt. in Islamabad. The tribal people in the hill country don't necessarily view themselves as owing allegiance to the government in the lowlands, which makes for an exploitable division. Throughout history colonialists and insurgents alike have been able to identify and exploit the tension between highlander tribes and the dominant group of the country which tends to live in the flatland near the water. The British found tribes they could "work with" in Malaysia. We exploited tensions like these in Vietnam, Laos, and Nicaragua. In S.E. Asia we exploited the resentments of the Hmong people. In Nicaragua we exploited the resentments of the Miskito tribes. As we all know, the US exploited the same kind of division in Afghanistan, backing tribes in the hills against the Soviet backed government in the flatland. This time the hillbilly vs. flatlanders split is being used against us. Pakistan is much more advanced than Laos or Cambodia were in the 1960s, but like them it's also a country that can't control all of its border territories. Pakistan has deployed as many as 90,000 men into Waziristan and have been pushed out. They have garrison points there but they don't exercise control over the areas in between. To control a large area you need a road network, to move force around, to police the area, and to resupply your garrisons. In Waziristan the road network consists of two highways over which convoys of army trucks can travel. They wind endlessly in mountains and there are 10,000 chances for an ambush. Convoys of 50 men in armored vehicles and trucks disappear in Waziristan never to be seen again. Actually the men turn up frequently, but their heads do not. This places a certain drag on Pakistani military morale. The government has enough on its hands with possible heads of state being assassinated, former heads of state posing a constant coup d'etat danger, and so forth that it doesn't feel strong enough to keep kicking the hornet's nest in Waziristan. They don't want the US coming in, since they do not want to become another Iraq. About the best they can manage is to cordon the area off, which is in its way a backhanded acknowledgment of the real problem. The real problem is that Waziristan like Afghanistan exists in a perpetual dark ages. When you try to change the people living there you just end up killing them, and they kill you.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Fire Walk With Me Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 07:20 PM
Response to Reply #24
25. Damned if we do, damned if we don't.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
kenny blankenship Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 07:51 PM
Response to Reply #25
26. The Fubar in Pakistan is like baklava: more layers than you can count.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
WillYourVoteBCounted Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 08:11 PM
Response to Reply #26
31. Why only 2 Recommends?
It seems to me that we need to quit meddling in other countries.

After all, didn't we help Pakistan go nuclear?

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 06:17 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. Good question.
This story cites unnnamed sources in the Foreign Ministry. Either there's a schism in the Pakistani government or whatever was contemplated Tuesday became unexpectedly messy on Friday.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
lonestarnot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 06:36 PM
Response to Reply #1
12. Probably not enough or the wrong stuff apparently.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
TahitiNut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 09:03 PM
Response to Reply #1
37. It's entirely conceivable that the Pakistani leadership gave secret approval for the strikes ...
... while expressing dissatisfaction just short of hostile condemnation publicly, in order to keep the political lid on in a nearly autonomous region (tribal area) like Waziristan.

We must always remember that Pakistan, like other countries in the Middle East and South Asia, has borders that reflect a British colonial rule ... borders that helped perpetuate a political instability of the indigenous population which facilitated colonial rule. It's the same ol' "divide and conquer" strategy of old. With the advent of reactive nationalistic inclinations, such a condition serves autocratic interests in opposition to democratic interests. Global corporatism strongly favors autocratic regimes in resource-rich or strategically-located countries. (They're easier to bribe and control.)



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waziristan
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
FatDave Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 11:06 PM
Response to Reply #37
38. That makes the most sense.
A deal was made between the Pakistani government and the US on tuesday. We attacked these targets with their knowledge, possibly based on information they provided, and we are providing them with deniability.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tekisui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 09:06 AM
Response to Reply #38
44. That game can only last so long.
More strikes and more denials will wear out any cover the Pakistani government has.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 06:18 PM
Response to Original message
4. THe US does not have the right to be bombing anywhere
in Pakistan - that is an act of war. This is so whether I support the President or not.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 06:19 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. Particulary if the Pakistani government doesn't want to be bombed.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
lonestarnot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 06:37 PM
Response to Reply #4
13. Aren't the 9/11ers hiding in those parts?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bigtree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 06:56 PM
Response to Reply #13
23. this appears to be an attempt to strike out at the resistance to U.S. presence in Afghanistan
Edited on Sat Jan-24-09 06:57 PM by bigtree
. . . at the Pakistan border.

The standard practice of the military is to label the individuals they kill from the air as 'militants', in much the same way they initially claim everyone in Iraq they kill is 'insurgent'. But, I'd bet my house that there's absolutely no connection between the claimed targets of these attacks and the perpetrators, or orchestrator of 9-11.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
lonestarnot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 08:03 PM
Response to Reply #23
28. I don't know what the fuck to believe, we've been lied to so many fucking times!
:grr:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
WillYourVoteBCounted Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 08:09 PM
Response to Reply #28
30. Afghanistan could be Obama's Vietnam
we need to let sovereign countries alone.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
lonestarnot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 08:12 PM
Response to Reply #30
32. Someone didn't leave us alone on 9/11/2001.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
WillYourVoteBCounted Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 11:32 PM
Response to Reply #32
39. oh, so lets go bomb the hell out of another country
there's no other possible way to deal with this, nooooo.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
stillcool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 02:01 PM
Response to Reply #28
45. Me neither...but Musharraff has been..
taking heat for quite a while now, with the not so subtle murmurs that he is on his way out. I don't even attempt to discern any truth any more. Body counts is the closest I come to facts, and even those are manipulated.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Canuckistanian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 06:20 PM
Response to Original message
7. This shit has got to stop
If the US has intelligence that Al Qaeda is operating in Pakistani locations, that information should be shared.

And if a strike is warranted, the Pakistanis should agree with that assessment.

As the situation stands now, the Pakistani military would be justified in shooting down US drones or warplanes.

This is an outrageous assault on Pakistan's sovereignty.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tan guera Donating Member (256 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 06:47 PM
Response to Reply #7
17. Let's not forget
that Pakistan has nukes. The drone attack was foolish, dangerous and MOTS bush policy.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
WillYourVoteBCounted Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 11:33 PM
Response to Reply #17
40. and we helped them get Nukes
the Drone attack was done on Obama's watch
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
WillYourVoteBCounted Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 06:21 PM
Response to Original message
8. This is George Bush Styled Behavior: US attacks any sovereign country we want
I thought we were going to respect the sovereignty of other countries?

Pakistan protests US drone attacks

Politics 1/24/2009 4:04:00 PM

ISLAMABAD, Jan 24 (KUNA) Pakistan Saturday lodged strong protest with the United States over the latest missile attacks on its territory, which came only days after Barack Obama was sworn in as the 44th President of the US.
President Asif Ali Zardari met with the US ambassador, Anne Patterson, and strongly condemned the unilateral US missile attacks, official sources told KUNA.

At least twenty people including near ten Arab militants were killed Friday evening in two US missile attacks in South and North Waziristan tribal agencies.

Sources said that the President conveyed Pakistan's concerns to the US regarding unabated missile attacks in the bordering tribal region, which are creating disturbance in other parts of the country as well.

He said only Pakistani forces are allowed to take action against militants in their territory. He hoped that the new US administration will stop the drone attacks.

(end) amn.ajs KUNA 241604 Jan 09NNNN


So do we continue the George Bush NeoCON policies of attacking other countries?

What if another country fired missiles into ours? Would that be ok?



Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
lib2DaBone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 06:29 PM
Response to Original message
9. Halt? Hell, we're funding both sides of the war....
Viva La Haliburton!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
lonestarnot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 06:34 PM
Response to Original message
10. You've had about 8 years Pakistan, time ran out on you I guess.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 06:36 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. I see, there's a time limit on sovereignty.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
lonestarnot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 06:39 PM
Response to Reply #11
14. No, the taliban and 9/11ers are purportedly hanging out there aren't they? And didn't they do the
Edited on Sat Jan-24-09 06:46 PM by lonestarnot
World Trade Centers with help from the Saudis and bushitlers? OBL is a Saudi and when they let him run away, didn't he go there where we are bombing?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 06:44 PM
Response to Reply #14
16. No they were proportedly hanging out in Iraq.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
lonestarnot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 06:47 PM
Response to Reply #16
18. No the ones who left the mountain at Torra Borra (sp?) went to Pakistan.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
kenny blankenship Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 11:47 PM
Response to Reply #10
42. Which was Nixon's reasoning in invading Cambodia
Edited on Sun Jan-25-09 12:09 AM by kenny blankenship
But that turned out ok...

It can seem justified a thousand times over, it may seem like the only solution to an important problem, but that doesn't mean it will work out like you want it to.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Stinky The Clown Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 06:42 PM
Response to Original message
15. I hope I don't run out .........
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
rug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 06:47 PM
Response to Reply #15
19. There's always two sides to sending armed drones into civilian populations.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
lonestarnot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 06:49 PM
Response to Reply #15
20. LOL
:popcorn: I want to see what I can learn here.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
tan guera Donating Member (256 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 06:50 PM
Response to Reply #15
21. Obama's silence on this
is ominous.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Occam Bandage Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 07:58 PM
Response to Original message
27. Occam Bandage calls on Pakistan to actually govern its country. nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
lonestarnot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 08:04 PM
Response to Reply #27
29. Does anyone do that there?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Occam Bandage Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 08:47 PM
Response to Reply #29
34. There is no government currently exercising any degree of control whatsoever
in the border region. Not Afghanistan, not Pakistan, not the United States.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Tierra_y_Libertad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 08:14 PM
Response to Original message
33. It's the continuation of a failed policy in a lost war that will start another war.
The geniuses at the Pentagon and the politicians never fail to throw kerosene on a raging fire.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
WillYourVoteBCounted Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 11:35 PM
Response to Reply #33
41. yep, like Vietnam to Lyndon Johnson
Obama should remember that lesson.

No one has been successful in invading and CONQUERING these middle eastern
countries.

They will expel us as they have done to all invaders from various countries.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
RB TexLa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 08:51 PM
Response to Original message
35. In other news: US calls on Pakistan to establish and moniter it's borders
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
janx Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-24-09 08:53 PM
Response to Original message
36. Yeah, right... n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bvar22 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 01:44 AM
Response to Original message
43. I don't know what to believe, but I DO know this:
We will NEVER be able to Bomb Our Way to Peace in this region.
Lets try something else.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
NNN0LHI Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jan-25-09 02:05 PM
Response to Original message
46. Perhaps we will find bin Laden hiding in his magic cave in Pakistan?
:crazy:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Fri Aug 22nd 2014, 04:56 AM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (1/22-2007 thru 12/14/2010) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC