I wonder how close religious ownership of marriage ties with their opposition to gay marriage

[MrScorpio]

My point is that the outcome has very little to do with any racial component, rather than the latest interpretation of the struggle between religiosity and secularism in America. The Church clearly wants to take control of the question about who should marry by taking ownership of marriage itself.

And nothing can be more Un-American as this.

The Church, per se, is using the definition of marriage as a tool to control society. It's one of many number of tools used in the modern era, such as their opposition to abortion and removal of recent endorsements of religion in government, the false interpretation of religion as a foundation for the establishment American government, the fight to install intelligent design in the public schools and heavy participation in the political arena.

Unlike the Middle Ages, the church cannot coerce the population into membership and fealty to its hierarchy with the threat of torture and wholesale slaughter.

But, they still can use fear and intimidation.

They clearly see most homosexuals are hostile to religious control. Not that I have the numbers in front of me, but I would hazard a guess that homosexual participation in religious organizations is significantly lower that what one would find with heterosexual participation.

Ever since the establishment of the church, their entire life's blood has been to stem the tide of secularism by any means necessary. Secularism kills religion. Just look at Europe, church membership is at an all time low. Churches in the United States see this, and despite the overwhelming participation of Americans in religious activities, they understand that once stagnation occurs, a religious recession is not far behind it.

Such the fear is that homosexual marriage would spell doom for the church.

The depiction here is that homosexuals as biologically incapable of growing the church. i.e., the argument that homosexuals do not represent a value added, rather than an avenue towards dreaded stagnation. How can people who are incapable of having naturally born children within the confines of their bond help bring in new young minds to influence and new bodies to exploit?

They insist that homosexual marriage cannot be part of any natural plan: God does not allow same sex copulation to produce offspring, thus it not grow his church. Lack of growth would bring stagnation.

Regardless, of the fact that heterosexuals would still continue to marry, have children and fill churches in America, it's quite clear that the Church is deathly afraid of people in their pews not bringing in fresh faced pups to the party. That whole sexual reorientation industry is a prime example of that.

Without membership growth, their influence on society would wane, and right behind that the loss of the churches themselves.

It's been quite clear that many a person around here is upset that African-American support for Prop 8 was so extensive. Again, rather than adding a racial component, understand that the percentage of religious participation in the black community is higher than what it is in the general population. Support for the measure cuts across all racial demographics is centered in support from people who are fighting for religious influence and against secularism in general.

Don't mistake a demographic statistic as a notion that African-Americans are out to get gays. That blacks have somehow forgotten the wrongs done against them and now since the tables have turned, they would rather be oppressors.

Despite a commitment to religious freedom in America, I know full well that the American religious hierarchy does not respect those who want freedom from religion. Despite this, not all churches see this the same way.

The key to ensuring the right of gays to marry should rely on Constitutional rather than dogmatic preeminence. That the church does not dictate the rule of law. If you want church going blacks on your side, you must key your strategy in the notion that this is purely a civil rights issue rather than a religious concern. Ally with national civil rights organizations, many of which have connections to the black church. Change the mindset that churches should not have any part in restricting the civil rights of any American.

By using the best ideals of American life, we all ensure that no one is left to suffer from discrimination.

Discrimination of any kind is completely Un-American.