Had to have a serious financial talk with my kids yesterday.

[Mother Of Four]

Long and the short of the background is we had a couple and their child stay with us for about a month and a half. Originally they were only supposed to be here for 7-10 days.

Contributions to the household- 20$
Debts incurred from them being here- an additional 35% added to all our "functioning bills"

We are still recovering, and the county fair started.

It broke my heart to have to tell the kids no.

This is what I need help with, my older three understood- but my 12 yr old daughter didn't. She clouded up, and expressed how much she still wanted to go. Then she asked me "Mama does this mean we're poor now? Do we have to move?"

I was stunned, no we don't have to move baby girl- it's just that we don't have play money anymore. (I've been poor. Slept on a mattress with no sheets as a smaller child, older brothers so my hand me downs were all boy clothes. Wood stove in the living room when we couldn't afford heat. Out shooting rabbits in the yard, and by the creek etc.) I've NO CLUE how to explain to her what "Poor" really is. When you have to eat Alpo over biscuits because that's all you can afford as a child, how do you tell that to your children? All she's seen of my childhood is the house my Stepmom has now, which is huge. (Long story, went from poor to well off through my childhood)

How do I explain this to her in a way she understands?

We have enough to pay the bills-
We have enough to eat-
We have enough to afford things like internet, phone and movie channels.

But we don't have enough to do things like we used to. Roller skating or bowling 2x a month. Extra money for school dances. Eating out. We are doing the "free" things like play dates, swimming and walking- but it's going to start getting cold soon.

I've cushioned my kids as much as I could over the years, and taught them patience. There have been many times I've had to tell them "Not now" but even if it took 2-3 months to get it, eventually I did my darndest to give it to them. I've had to tell them "No" before but it was rare.

This little girl is the baby, a preteen and I'm having to tell her "No" outright when she's seen her brothers and sister get many of the things she's asking for.

This is killing me.

[lostnotforgotten]

1. Let It Be A Lesson In Political Choices - The Country Chose Badly And We Got Bush

eom

[hedgehog]

2. You are a blessing to offer refuge to a family in need. I don't know if you profess

to be Christian, but your behavior is what Christians should aspire to. If I were in your situation, I'd tell my daughter that we were given the chance to offer a home to the Holy Family and we gave it.

[lumberjack_jeff]

3. Parenthood is an inexact science.

I think we do kids a disservice when we insulate them from economics and the need to make choices. Heaven knows, I haven't always succeeded in this regard.

I see two kinds of kids: a) the kids who have always had everything they want without the responsibility of earning it, or b) kids who have little because the parents are either irresponsible or unskilled at managing their own finances. (I put my own kids in category a. I don't claim to be an expert at parenting)

The only kids I know who take their responsibilities seriously, who work hard and value their belongings are those in category B. We like to think that we lead kids by example, but too often, the kids see the wrong example.

I did take my youngest to the state fair this year. It was a big, big treat.

"No" shouldn't cause you distress, imho.

[grasswire]

4. she's at a good age to begin to understand industriousness

1. You might want to find several of those books at the library about girls of earlier and different times who were plucky and clever when the family fell on hard times. I know there are a couple of series of those books.

2. It might be helpful for her to know that she is neither alone nor does she have it as bad as many girls. This might be a good time to examine the fact that American children are infinitely more rich than most of the children in the world, and it has been at the expense of some of the world's children.

3. She actually could earn some of her own spending money by being a mother's helper or a dog walker or something like that. Nothing feels better than contributing to the revenue of the household!

4. This really is an opportunity for her to grow, if guided. She may never again live in that world we lived in, the years of boom. It's your job to prepare her for what may be. Teach her every skill you know. How to garden, how to fix things, how to keep a home and cook, how to get along in the world.

5. Your attitude will mean a lot. If you feel guilty or sad, she won't be well served. Today is what it is. You can give her the tools to ride the wave or not.

[galileoreloaded]

6. Best post in six months.....n/t

[yardwork]

5. My family took in a troubled teen for a few weeks when I was a freshman in high school.

The experience has stayed with me all my life and helped me understand so many things about the world.

I'm sorry that your children have to miss the fair this year, but the experience you gave them - of opening your home to people in need - will enrich the rest of their lives in ways they can't even imagine now.

[MadinMo]

7. I know exactly what you mean.

I have two 15 year olds, and while they are pretty good about helping to find the least expensive item on the store shelf, they still have the I WANT ITs and sometimes don't understand the need for differentiating between I WANT and I NEED.

We have been relatively comfortable until recently. Mr MadinMo is a retired teacher and I work full time and have the family benefits (health insurance) from my job. We live on a small farm and can raise a good veggie garden. We are thinking of having a few animals and are trying to decide which ones to get that we could actually get the kids to eat. We heat primarily with wood.

But the weekly trip to the grocery store has been killing us. As have the gas station fill ups. As soon as I pay off the Discover card, I find Mr MadinMo has been visiting Amazon and the auto parts store, in addition to buying gas for his vehicle (silly man). In his defense, he is not buying fluff books --- he is building a library of books detailing various routes of self production of alternative fuels, self reliance, etc. And he has been working with MrMadinMo Jr on refurbishing a vehicle for Jr to drive once he is licensed.

Anyway --- I understand how hard it is to explain financial hardship to your kids. My parents NEVER talked to me about their financial situation when I was growing up --- we always had enough -- enough food, and when I needed clothes I got them. Not in abundance, but enough. So I don't know, by example, how far to go in explaining this to kids. But I think it is necessary.

I think a 12 year old is old enough to see something in black and white. Can you show her a simple outline of the income and outgo? Can you include her in some manner of assisting the family in cutbacks --- like making sure lights are turned off, cutting coupons, helping make meals from scratch, etc? Ask her to make choices --- do you want to go to the fair today or have lunch money next week? That sort of thing? She is old enough to know that things are different now --- not POOR poor, but different. At least for now, hopefully.

:hug:

[pnwmom]

8. When I was ten, my mother started asking me for help balancing her checkbook.

(This was pre-calculator days, and I was the arithmetic genius in the family.) That was an eye opener, and I don't think it hurt me. But I think it's one reason I'm more cautious about money than a couple of my younger sibs.

Yes, your daughter's older siblings might have been able to do some things before that she can't do. But you're all in the same boat now. (This really isn't so different from what a lot of families have, in reverse. My youngest child lives in a better house than my oldest did through most of her childhood, because our circumstances have changed. But the oldest doesn't think she was deprived.)

There's nothing shameful about having to carefully manage money, or having less money to spend than you did in the past, or than some family does down the street. And all our children need to learn that money or things does not equal love.

[Mother Of Four]

9. Thank you for your kind responses-

You all have given me alot to think about, and some good ideas.


:hug:

[4 t 4]

10. If part of your financial problem

is from helping those people out...let her know that. That will help shape the type of person she will be. If she's like her MOM, it will be a better world for having her (and you) in it.

[babydollhead]

11. I'm an artist. When I have work we enjoy ourselves

we go to a movie or out to eat. We buy socks and under ware. everyone gets either a pair of jeans or a shirt. We shop for food and even get juice. I told them that the way to tell if we have money is to look at my hair, if it's cut nicely, and colored, we have money. If they give me time to do my art, and watch how people love it when it's installed...they are also taking part in the earning experience by helping out around the house(the house is the first and main fatality of being busy doing art and raising kids.

[adamuu]

12. You did the right thing.

:grouphug:

[ibegurpard]

13. You are teaching your children valuable lessons

Living within your means is a lesson that I'm sure many people wish they had learned.

[seabeyond]

14. i have a 10 and 13 yr old. i have been talking to them since 3 about cost and saving.

i took my kids to the fair two years ago and told them that was it. one shot. the cost is outrageous. i wont consider what we spent that night but was NOT gonna be a yearly thing. i have been talking to kids about earning a living, cost of things, crap put out, commercials manipulating for us to buy and the lies in advt, what is happening with our economy.

just getting a coke after school is a consideration. not only cause they are not healthy, but cause there goes three dollars and NOT gonna happen every day, ... once twice a week that is it.

moderation, moderation, moderation....

i have well stopped buying them things. they earn money adn have to use theirs for their wants. they get bday, xmas and kid day (i made up for a i love you and good kids you are). and that is it. BOOKS are the only thing i dont say no to. cant.

DONT feel guilt. being conservative and responsible is NOT guilt inducing. THINGS are NOT important.

i have the money to do that stuff and i dont do it. we do fast food no more than once a week, more like every two weeks and have hit a restaraunt twice in a year, last year. nad htey know it is cause i wont spend the money on it

i guess the big difference is i have NEVER cushioned my kids from reality. i want them to learn. i want them to know how hard to earn money and how easy it is to spend

my 13 yr old started an account just for car. he is at $1000 now and is so proud. he does not want to spend and waste money

my youngest has learned he gets disappointed and not to just spend cause he has the money but wait until it is something he really wants.

dont coddle. dont ever ever feel guilt about what you can or can not afford. just love......

[seabeyond]

16. and btw.... at 12 yrs old, i would have my sons reading this thread of yours

so they would hear how you felt and how the other people see this. wouldnt hurt her at all to see different perspectives adn think about it or have a discussion with you

time with you. bonding and connecting, so much more

[guitar man]

15. I was the youngest of four kids

And I was just about the same age, around 12, when deregulation hit the trucking industry and my Dad was laid off long term from his good union trucking job. He wound up driving indy for about 1/3 of what he had been making and we were hurting. So I have pretty much stood in her exact shoes.

I can still remember what it felt like, but I didn't know why exactly. All I can offer is, sit her down and explain it as best you can, and let her know it's temporary, it's not going to be that way forever, that things will be better soon and you all will be able to do some things again.


Then tell her to get off her lazy butt and get a job like my Dad told me. (J/K);)


Bless your heart, if I wasn't so broke from paying a traffic ticket this week I'd send those kids some money to go to the fair, I remember looking forward to the county fair all year long.

:hug:

[Selatius]

17. When I was a child, I used to buy food with food stamps my mother gave me.

At the time, I realized that money was tight, so I ended up having relatively little compared to many other kids my age. If I didn't have video games, I usually just went outside to play in the back yard or go exploring in the woods nearby. There was a recreational trail that was near the old house that a lot of bikers and joggers used, and some of my cousins and I used to use it.

At the time, I didn't know what food stamps were, just that I recognized that if I gave the guy at the register those things, then he'd give me the food I put on the counter. I thought it was just like money, and in practicality it is, but I didn't realize later on that in some quarters, there is a negative connotation associated with food stamps, that people who use them are inferior and lazy and are wasting taxpayer dollars.

Thinking of that makes me angry because I know my mother was none of those things when she took care of my sister and I by herself. Dad was the lazy one, though. He walked out the door years ago.

I guess the moral of the story is you don't necessarily have to take your kids to the fair if you can replace it with something else that is equally fun, like a nature walk on a recreational trail at a public park or something.

[AzDar]

18. I'm the Mom of two boys, ages 5 & 12. Most days it seems I haven't the foggiest idea as to what I'm

doing as a parent; you just kind of do your best to teach them what you think they should know and wait to see what happens.
I do know this: you can't really go wrong when you have a parent who is a living example of compassion and kindness, and your kids seem to have that in spades.:hi:

[Geek_Girl]

19. When I was a child living with my mother we lived below the poverty line

I remember eating allot of spam and potatoes as a pre-teen and having to prepare my own meals while mom worked. I never thought of asking for much. I guess now that I do alright my kid has everything a kid could want. Trips to disney (she's only 5 and we've been there twice), a large room filled with toys and games and a downstairs family room filled with toys and games as well as a private school education.

Funny thing is I walk around with holey underwear and worn out clothing. I don't get my hair done very often and I go without because I don't want to pay for it. But I don't even blink an eye when shelling out for a pair of 40.00 jeans for her. Sometimes I think there's something really wrong with me and I worry that a day will come that I can't afford those things for her. But the reality is when that day comes it may not be a bad thing, because then she'll learn those material possessions are not that important.

[Realityhack]

20. Time to volunteer?

Some exposure to those who actually ARE far worse off might help in demonstrating were things stand.

[TXDemGal]

21. Great responses here

I know how much it can hurt not to be able to give your kids the fun stuff they want.

This could be a time for the whole family to come together and brain storm some solutions.

Like: would they be willing to give up the movie channels if it means being able to go roller skating or bowling?

Can your 12-year-old make up a flyer advertising her (as mentioned) mother's helper or party assistant services? At her age, she probably is eligible to take the babysitting certification course from Red Cross. A Red Cross certified babysitter should be able to take in some pretty good money on weekends if there are still people around who can afford to go out. ;)

All the kids can be helping to make decisions about which things get priority for buying over other things (i.e., "wants" type stuff).

Keep fighting the good fight & hang in there.

[uppityperson]

22. You sound like you are raising your kids with really good standards.

It hurts to have to tell them no, to have to skimp and all that. Learning that just because something is like it is now doesn't mean it will be like that forever is a good thing to learn. Good times come and go, so do poor times. Our society is based so much around consumption, that it is really good to teach our children that that is not what is important, is not what makes you happy.

Brainstorm what you CAN do for a special outing that won't cost. Or figure out a way for her/you to put away even 25cents/wk for next yrs fair, giving you something to look forward to as well as learning saving when you have little.

Taking in others, helping them out, does take time, effort, money which may be already in short supply. But learning that this is a good thing to do is also a good thing.

Good luck to you and yours, I wish for peace and happiness.

[seabeyond]

23. but but but.... it doesnt hurt to say no. i have been saying no for 13 yrs, lol, i feel no pain

it really doesnt, and i wish we would get over this as parents.

i dont hardly get that.

but i like your post.

i am just hearing this thought from parents, and really.... i dont get it.

i tell my kids often enough, far from perfect. can tell exactly where i lack as a parent, and that is ok..... we are all perfectly imperfect. i dont strive for perfection. and things dont buy the love or respect. so all that is so unimportant to me.

[ProdigalJunkMail]

24. wow...i just talked about this concept with my wife last night

how DO you help a young one (my three are all under 6) understand what is going on??? I am sorry you are having to deal with this and I fight like hell to not have to for our family. you can bet your sweet ass that i will give up my 'luxuries' LONG before they have to give up theirs (as I am sure any loving parent would do)!

if you come up with something to help them understand...PM me, please!

sP

[kath]

25. Check if your library has (or get from Interlibrary loan) the book "Material World: A Global Family

Portrait" by Peter Menzel - very eye-opening book.
http://www.amazon.com/Material-World-Global-Family-Portrait/dp/0871564300

Also second the recommendation that she could do dog-walking, mother's helper/brief babysitting, etc. in order to make some extra money.

[Mother Of Four]

26. To everyone who answered-

Fantastic ideas and wonderful support thank you-

We had another talk, then I let her read the thread as one suggestion stated, and it opened her eyes some.

The guts of our talk:

What we are going to do is at Halloween, Thanksgiving and Christmas get her involved in the donations we normally do that she doesn't see. (Old halloween costumes to the boys and girls club on the south end, Help baking and getting things for the food cafe on Thanksgiving and Christmas etc) Bringing plates to the FF, EMS and PD that has to work those nights locally as well.

I sat her down and asked her why she felt so bad, to clarify for myself. Just to let you all know, she's not a greedy child. She's got a heart of gold.

She said she felt bad because it was going to be her first year that she was tall enough to ride the "big" rides and she had been looking forward to it.

I told her that next year will be more fun, because then we can make the effort to save up for it. She agreed.

I also explained to her like some suggested, that the reason we were still recovering was we had spent our resources to help another family. That if we hadn't helped that family out now, who knows what kind of situation they would be in. (The next nearest they could have a home opened was more than 30 miles away, with gas the way it is and them having to not only work here- but come check their dogs twice a day it would have killed them money wise and they didn't have money to spare. They were newly weds trying to set up household, and they found mold in their old mobile. So the whole thing had to go.)


She said she understood that, but her brother and sister had gotten to do things that she can't. That she wasn't "mad" she was feeling left out. Ahhh I said, but think of what they are going to have to miss this year. We can't afford all the football and basketball games, and extra money for school dances.


_-_-_-_-_

Again, I appreciate the effort and support. It's hard to think clearly when you feel your not doing your job providing. I know intellectually we are, but inside emotionally I go "meh"

I do want to stress again, that I don't have greedy children- It's just that I've cushioned them from having to worry about money. I don't think that it's right to taint a childs joy in life with it. Some may not agree, but I'd much rather watch my children laugh and play without having to think about "Can we afford a present?" when they have a birthday etc.

I suppose those days are over though, they have ALL gotten older. No more babies, and almost all young ladies and men :cry: