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This is ILLEGAL: 1st Brigade Army Combat Team to begin US tour on Oct 1

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eowyn_of_rohan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 09:47 PM
Original message
This is ILLEGAL: 1st Brigade Army Combat Team to begin US tour on Oct 1
Edited on Tue Sep-23-08 09:49 PM by eowyn_of_rohan
This has been posted elsewhere on this site, mostly buried in other threads. I feel it deserves its own thread. This issue is huge, and frightening, yet is getting hardly any attention. To use the Army forces on U.S. soil in this way is illegal.

Whoever, except in cases and under circumstances expressly authorized by the Constitution or Act of Congress, willfully uses any part of the Army or the Air Force as a posse comitatus or otherwise to execute the laws shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than two years, or both.

Title 18, U.S. Code, Section 1385

For those who are unfamiliar with what they are planning for October 1, 2008:

ARMY TIMES
http://www.armytimes.com/news/2008/09/army_homeland_090... /.
Brigade homeland tours start Oct. 1

3rd Infantrys 1st BCT trains for a new dwell-time mission. Helping people at home may become a permanent part of the active Army
By Gina Cavallaro - Staff writer
Posted : Monday Sep 8, 2008 6:15:06 EDT

The 3rd Infantry Divisions 1st Brigade Combat Team has spent 35 of the last 60 months in Iraq patrolling in full battle rattle, helping restore essential services and escorting supply convoys. Now theyre training for the same mission with a twist at home.

Beginning Oct. 1 for 12 months, the 1st BCT will be under the day-to-day control of U.S. Army North, the Army service component of Northern Command, as an on-call federal response force for natural or manmade emergencies and disasters, including terrorist

It is not the first time an active-duty unit has been tapped to help at home. In August 2005, for example, when Hurricane Katrina unleashed hell in Mississippi and Louisiana, several active-duty units were pulled from various posts and mobilized to those areas.

But this new mission marks the first time an active unit has been given a dedicated assignment to NorthCom, a joint command established in 2002 to provide command and control for federal homeland defense efforts and coordinate defense support of civil authorities.

After 1st BCT finishes its dwell-time mission, expectations are that another, as yet unnamed, active-duty brigade will take over and that the mission will be a permanent one.

Right now, the response force requirement will be an enduring mission. How the chooses to source that and whether or not they continue to assign them to NorthCom, that could change in the future, said Army Col. Louis Vogler, chief of NorthCom future operations. Now, the plan is to assign a force every year.

...They may be called upon to help with civil unrest and crowd control or to deal with potentially horrific scenarios such as massive poisoning and chaos in response to a chemical, biological, radiological, nuclear or high-yield explosive, or CBRNE, attack.

...The 1st BCTs soldiers also will learn how to use the first ever nonlethal package that the Army has fielded, 1st BCT commander Col. Roger Cloutier said, referring to crowd and traffic control equipment and nonlethal weapons designed to subdue unruly or dangerous individuals without killing them.

Its a new modular package of nonlethal capabilities that theyre fielding. Theyve been using pieces of it in Iraq, but this is the first time that these modules were consolidated and this package fielded, and because of this mission were undertaking we were the first to get it.

The package includes equipment to stand up a hasty road block; spike strips for slowing, stopping or controlling traffic; shields and batons; and, beanbag bullets.

...The brigade will not change its name, but the force will be known for the next year as a CBRNE Consequence Management Response Force, or CCMRF (pronounced sea-smurf).

I cant think of a more noble mission than this, said Cloutier, who took command in July. Weve been all over the world during this time of conflict, but now our mission is to take care of citizens at home ... and depending on where an event occurred, youre going home to take care of your home town, your loved ones.

...Should personnel be needed at an earthquake in California, for example, all or part of the brigade could be scrambled there, depending on the extent of the need and the specialties involved.

...I dont know what Americas overall plan is I just know that 24 hours a day, seven days a week, there are soldiers, sailors, airmen and Marines that are standing by to come and help if theyre called, Cloutier said. It makes me feel good as an American to know that my country has dedicated a force to come in and help the people at home.

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avaistheone1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 09:50 PM
Response to Original message
1. Do you think this force is being sent here because the Bush admin
is planning to steal our money for Wall Street? Or is it because they plan on not having an election
or stealing the election and they know people are going to be really pissed off.
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eowyn_of_rohan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 09:56 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. All are possibilities
I lean towards your 1st and 3rd suggestions, but there also is another staged "high terror alert", which lends credence to your 2nd idea.
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StopTheNeoCons Donating Member (608 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 11:03 PM
Response to Reply #3
22. Operation Garden Plot is activated, say goodbye to your freedom
The United States Civil Disturbance Plan 55-2

The following information was obtained under the Freedom of Information Act. The original printing was of June 1, 1984. The information herein is UNCLASSIFIED and does not come within the scope of directions governing the protection of information affecting the national security.

It took a little more than three years to obtain a full copy of Operation Garden Plot from the U.S. Government, and was done so under the freedom of information act for unclassified documents. The implications within the full context of this document should make the hair on the back of your head stand on end!!!!!

In this document signed by the Secretary of the Army, is hereby assigned as DOD Executive Agent for civil disturbance control operations. Under Plan 55-2 he is to use airlift and logistical support, in assisting appropriate military commanders in the 50 states, District of Columbia, and the Commonwealth of Puerto Rico and US possessions and territories, or any political subdivision thereof.

The official name of this project is called "Operation Garden Plot."

Under this plan for the deployment of Operation Garden Plot, the use of CIDCON-1 will be mandatory. This direct support of civil disturbance control operations is to be used by the Army, USAF, Navy, and Marine Corp. with an airlift force to be comprised of MAC Organic Airlift Resources, airlift capable aircraft of all other USAF major commands, and all other aerial reconnaissance and Airborne Psychological Operations. This is to include control communications systems, aeromedical evacuation, helicopter and Weather Support Systems.

If any civil disturbance by a resistance group, religious organization, or other persons considered to be non-conformist takes place, under Appendix 3 to Annex B of Plan 55-2 hereby gives all Federal forces total power over the situation if local and state authorities cannot put down said dissenters.

Annex A, section B of Operation Garden Plot defines tax protesters, militia groups, religious cults, and general anti-government dissenters as Disruptive Elements. This calls for the deadly force to be used against any extremist or dissident perpetrating any and all forms of civil disorder.

Under section D, a Presidential Executive Order will authorize and direct the Secretary of Defense to use the Armed Forces of the United States to restore order.

2 TAB A APPENDIX 1 TO ANNEX S USAF CIVIL DISTURBANCE PLAN 55-2 EXHIBIT POR:SGH, JCS Pub 6, Vol 5, AFR 160-5 hereby provides for America's military and the National Guard State Partnership Program to join with United Nations personal in said operations. This links selected U.S. National Guard units with the Defense Ministries of "Partnership For Peace." This was done in an effort to provide military support to civil authorities in response to civil emergencies.

Under Presidential Decision Directive No. 25, this program serves to cement people to relationships between the citizens of the United States, and the global military of the UN establishments of the emerging democracies of Central and Eastern European countries. This puts all of our National Guardsmen under the direct jurisdiction of the United Nations.

Section 3:
This plan could be implemented under any of the following situation:

(1) Spontaneous civil disturbances which involve large numbers of persons and/or which continue for a considerable period of time, may exceed the capacity of local civil law enforcement agencies to suppress. Although this type of activity can arise without warning as a result of sudden, unanticipated popular unrest (past riots), it may also result from more prolonged dissidence.

This would most likely be an outgrowth of serious social, political or economic issues which divide segments of the American population. Such factionalism could manifest itself through repeated demonstrations, protest marches and other forms of legitimate opposition but which would have the potential for erupting into spontaneous violence with little or no warning.

(2) Planned acts of violence or civil disobedience which, through arising from the same causes as (1) above, are seized upon by a dedicated group of dissidents who plan and incite purposeful acts designed to disrupt social order.

This may occur either because leaders of protest organizations intentionally induce their followers to perpetrate violent acts, or because a group of militants infiltrates an otherwise peaceful protest and seeks to divert it from its peaceful course.

Subsection C: (2) Environmental satellite products will be continue to be available. (d) Responsibilities. Meteorological support to civil disturbance operations will be arranged or provided by AWS wings.

The 7th. Weather Wing (7WW) is responsible for providing / arranging support for Military Airlift Command (MAC) airlift operations. The 5th Weather Wing (5WW) is responsible for supporting the United States Army Forces Command.

(3) SITUATION. Civil disturbance may threaten or erupt at any time in the CONUS and grow to such proportions as to require the use the Federal military forces to bring the situation under control.

A flexible weather support system is required under control. A flexible weather support system is required to support the many and varied options of this Plan.

ANNEX H: XXOW, AWSR 55-2, AWSR 23-6, AFR 23-31, AR 115-10, AFR 105-3.

Subsection B:

Concept of Environmental Support. Environmental support will be provided by elements of Air Weather Service (AWS) in accordance with refs a-f. The senior staff meteorologist deployed int the Task Force Headquarters (TFH) will be the staff weather officer (SWO) to the TFH.

Centralized environmental support products are requested in accordance with AWSR 105-18. (4) Weather support is provided by weather units located at existing CONUS bases or by deployed SWOs and / or weather teams to the objective areas.

(5) Support MAC source will be provide in accordance with the procedures in MARC 103-15. MAC forces will be provided in accordance with the procedures in AFR 105-3.

(a) Air Force Global Weather Central: Provides centralized products as requested.

REFERENCES : JCS Pub 18 - Doctrine for Operations Security AFR 55-30, Operations Security

1. GENERAL Opposition forces or groups may attempt to gain knowledge of this plan and 'use that knowledge to prevent or degrade the effectiveness of the actions outlined in this plan. In order to protect operations undertaken to accomplish the mission, it is necessary to control sources of information that can be exploited by those opposition forces or groups.

OPSEC is the effort to protect operations by identifying and controlling intelligence indicators susceptible to exploitation. The objective of OPSEC, in the execution of this plan, is to assure the security of operations, mission effectiveness, and increase the probability of mission success.

2. RESPONSIBILITY FOR OPERATIONS SECURITY (OPSEC):

The denial of information to an enemy is inherently a command responsibility. However, since the operations Officer at any level of command is responsible to his commander for the Overall planning and execution of operations, he has the principal staff interest in assuring maximum protection of the operation and must assume primary responsibility instibility for ensuring that the efforts of all other staff elements are coordinated toward this
end. However, every other individual associated with, or aware of, the operation must assist in safeguarding the security of the operation.

3. OBJECTIVES:

a. The basic objective of OPSEC is to preserve the security of friendly forces and thereby to enhance the probability of successful mission accomplishment. "Security" in this context relates to the protection of friendly forces. It also includes the protection of operational information to prevent degradation of mission effectiveness through the disclosure of prior knowledge of friendly operations to the opposition.

b. OPSEC pervades the entire planning process and must be a matter of continuing concern from the conception of an operation, throughout the preparatory and execution phases, and during critiques, reports, press releases, and the like conducted during the post operation phase.

4. Specific operations orders and standard operating procedures "MUST be developed with the awareness that the opposition may be able to identify and exploit vulnerable activities.

Reference Material:

Released under Freedom of Information Act on March 30th, 1990. All material presented here has been declassified and supersedes USAD Operations Plan 355-10 of July 16, 1973. Information released by USAF under supervision of Alexander K. Davidson, BRIG. GEN, USAF, Dep. Director of Operations.

APPENDEX 5 TO ANNEX E TO USAF CIVIL DISTURBANCE PLAN 55-2 Annex Z. Other References: 10 United States Codes 331,332,333,8500,1385, MARC 105-1, MARC 105-18, AR 115-10, AFR 105-3, PDD-25.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Additional backup documents will be found on another site at

http://www.cafes.net/mo/Gardenplot.htm

That is a good site to read this type of material. Lots of curious stuff.

If I can give anyone credit for this great file, I give to the guys in the "cafes". Thanks, guys.

Please notice that your "faithful" political servants did not tell you about this law. But they wrote and passed it. It took someone about there years to find it. And they had to force it out into the open. Congressman Gonzalez admits that it exists. Gee, thanks a lot, you guys.

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undergroundpanther Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 11:39 PM
Response to Reply #22
31. I wrote unknown news about
operation garden plot. It couldn't be verified. But what they are doing with the military,sounds like it.Garden plot done under a different name still means the same damn thing..kiss freedom goodbye.
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eowyn_of_rohan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 05:24 PM
Response to Reply #31
120. Op Garden Plot AKA Civil Disturbance Plan 55 2 - here is the Army Field Manual
US Army Field Manual FM 3-19.15, Civil Disturbance Operations

Warning - Reading this may cause you to start drinking...

www.fas.org/irp/doddir/army/fm3-19-15.pdf

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Miss Chybil Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 12:13 AM
Response to Reply #22
37. Hmmph! I guess the National Guard wasn't good enough.
Oh yeah. They're in Iraq.
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Undercurrent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 02:11 AM
Response to Reply #22
50. Yes, the John Warner Act essentially overturned Posse Comitatus
Operation Garden Plot is loaded. The trigger can be pulled anytime, for any reason deemed a threat to the US by dictator Bush.

A lot of folks, including myself have been trying to spread the word about this threat to others, and the media since the Warner Act was passed. The warnings are by and large falling in deaf ears. I've been called a conspiracy theorist, etc. But it's no theory that the Bush Crime gang has put these measures on the books, and can activate them at their calling.


--

In October 2006, Bush signed into law the John Warner National Defense Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 2007. Quietly slipped into the law at the last minute, at the request of the Bush administration, were sections changing important legal principles, dating back 200 years, which limit the U.S. government's ability to use the military to intervene in domestic affairs. These changes would allow Bush, whenever he thinks it necessary, to institute martial law--under which the military takes direct control over civilian administration.

Sec. 1042 of the Act, "Use of the Armed Forces in Major Public Emergencies," effectively overturns what is known as posse comitatus. The Posse Comitatus Act is a law, passed in 1878, that prohibits the use of the regular military within the U.S. borders. The original passage of the Posse Comitatus Act was a very reactionary move that sealed the betrayal of Black people after the Civil War and brought the period of Reconstruction to an end. It decreed that federal troops could no longer be used inside the former Confederate states to enforce the new legal rights of Black people. Black people were turned over to the armed police and Klansmen serving the southern plantation owners, and the long period of Jim Crow began.

During the 20th century, posse comitatus objectively started to play a new role within the bourgeois democratic framework: as a legal barrier to the direct influence of the powerful military establishment and the armed forces over domestic U.S. society. It served to some degree as an obstacle against military coups and presidents seizing military control over the country. (However, National Guard troops have been legally available to the ruling class for use inside the U.S., and there have been other loopholes to the prohibition of the use of armed forces domestically, as in the mobilization of Marine troops during the 1992 L.A. Rebellion.)

So the changes to posse comitatus signed into law by Bush are extremely significant and ominous. Bush has modified the main exemptions to posse comitatus that up to now have been primarily defined by the Insurrection Act of 1807. Previously the president could call out the army in the United States only in cases of insurrection or conditions where "rebellion against the authority of the United States, make it impracticable to enforce the laws of the United States in any State or Territory by the ordinary course of judicial proceedings." Under the new law the president can use the military in response to a natural disaster, a disease outbreak, a terrorist attack or "other condition in which the President determines that domestic violence has occurred to the extent that state officials cannot maintain public order."
http://www.inteldaily.com/?c=117&a=1431



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dchill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 02:34 AM
Response to Reply #50
57. Or - for any reason deemed a threat to the US dictator, Bush.
Hell, he didn't even have to use a signing statement.
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clear eye Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 03:04 AM
Response to Reply #50
59. I don't believe the trigger will be pulled until Obama is President
Edited on Wed Sep-24-08 03:48 AM by clear eye
and the new dictator will be Pailin with Cheney/Rove over her shoulder, and Big Oil money bankrolling it and getting all the loot in return. This is probably a response to what much of Big Oil sees as the potentially fatal threat of the Green Revolution. They just won't go down w/o a fight, and these guys have lots of weapons to fight with, including, apparently, the ability to set in motion the destruction of the U.S. economy.

On edit: Remember Cheney is commissioning and promoting these laws, and he has no loyalty to Bush. Many DUers have commented that Cheney and Rove are not behaving as though they think they're leaving power.
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readmoreoften Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 06:23 AM
Response to Reply #59
69. I'm afraid they'll get him during the lame duck period. Last month I'd've thought that was nuts.
Of course it's very likely that they are going to steal the election though. This isn't a midterm without central tabulators. RFK jr. even said as much.
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clear eye Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 11:46 AM
Response to Reply #69
106. The sad thing is that none of this had to happen.
It's not like the endless Iraq occupation, the destruction of the economy through deregulation, and the unconstitutional snooping and repression of protest have been caused by a natural disaster. Things only got this far because our elected representatives have refused to impeach a lawless and vicious administration. I occasionally wonder if our members of Congress feel, after the anthrax incidents, that they are under threat of death and aren't able to summon the necessary transcendent courage. If things head the way they are trending there will be so much pain for all of us.
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glinda Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 01:33 PM
Response to Reply #59
112. Exactly-Palin Wired For Brutality
She was chosen because she is "Brutal". She is "WIRED", as she says, to be brutal. (maybe wired by speed also) This combined with her extreme Religious Beliefs makes her a "killer without conscience". She is dangerous and it is a huge mistake for the media or someone to not be pointing this out.
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Naturyl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 05:36 PM
Response to Reply #112
123. I'd have to agree with that analysis.
She is a hardcore, killing "lesser beings" with her own hands.

And we, my friends, are another form of "lesser beings." We can be shot from helicopters, too.
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Blarch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 03:47 PM
Response to Reply #59
117. If Barack is President...
then how would Palin/Cheney become dictator ?

A coup ?

Never gonna happen.
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lynnertic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 08:07 AM
Response to Reply #50
79. sure that's still in effect? I thought that was rescinded last year. n/t
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onenote Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-25-08 08:34 AM
Response to Reply #50
138. the provision you refer to was repealed restoring posse comitatus law
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dixiegrrrrl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 10:18 AM
Response to Reply #22
89. Keep in mind that "civil unrest" can be staged by the gov.
as has been done so recently in Mn. during the Repug convention.
A false flag event could "trigger" the need for martial law.
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eowyn_of_rohan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 10:22 AM
Response to Reply #89
90. Yes. Not only do they provide instigators to commit acts of violence
they whip the peaceful protestors into a frenzy with illegal arrests and inhumane treatment
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Porschenut1066 Donating Member (348 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 10:50 AM
Response to Reply #22
98. Bush as Dictator - but called "Protector of Democracy"
May 2007 Bush signed an Executive order which became law without any media coverage at all. It was published on the Homeland Security site but without any special notice.
Basically it said this:
"In the event of a national emergency (which the President defines and declares) The President becomes in charge of all three branches of government, all law enforcement, and all military until the danger is past." (the president decides when the danger is over)

Are we looking at the first stage of the "national emergency"?
It is well known that the US wants to use Georgian Air bases if they attack Iran. The US was training the Georgian Army in Battle Field tactics.
Interesting enough one of McCain's lobbyist advisers went to Georgia as an adviser to the Georgian President just before the Georgian attack on the Russian UN Peace keepers and the shelling of the capital of South Ossetia (spelling). The Russians found several dozen US citizens in military type uniforms (mostly African Americans) among the dead. The US put out that those US citizens were mercenaries and not officially part of the US Military. The Russians confiscated their equipment including Humvee and weapons.
Was this adventure going to get us into a war with Russia and therefore create the atmosphere needed for a "National emergency"?

Or is an attack by Israeli jets against Iran enough to start the "National emergency" since Iran has said that any action by Israel could not happen without US approval. (Bush met Israeli PM a month ago and they agreed that any action against Iran must happen before the end of the Bush term)

I don't know exactly what the Neocons will do to retain power but their philosophy is that once you acquire power holding on to it is all that matters and there is nothing barred to keep power, since the "ignorant masses" will not realize they are being deceived.

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clear eye Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 02:38 AM
Response to Reply #1
58. It sounds like Cheney expects the economic Depression created by the bailout's destruction
of the dollar to give an opportunity to do what the economic power elite narrowly missed doing during the Great Depression of the 1930's--convince many that democracy has failed, that Congress must be removed, and that a President with totalitarian powers must be put in place. This time Communism has been discredited as an alternative so the newly poor in urban areas won't go that way. The continual warfare pump is being primed by antagonizing Russia, and a Russian response to provocation that Cheney's bunch will claim is being mishandled by Obama will be the trigger. The likelihood of success depends on which way the Pentagon goes.

I believe Rove is grooming Palin as our new President/Leader. She has just the combination of stupidity, outsized ambition, and sadism in a "I'm just folks" package which attracted Rove to Bush. She can keep the religious right on board and has even less regard for the Constitution than Bush. I'm not saying that this will succeed, but a close observation of Cheney's attempts to sew up the rights to oil pipelines around the world--Iraq, Alaska, Asian Georgia, etc., and the odd behavior of Rove in his destructive coaching of McCain, while he protects and grooms Palin support this as their projected scenario. Elements of big oil are in a fury over the looming green revolution, so the same oil interests that Cheney is fronting for in the pipeline rights acquisitions are ready to bankroll the velvet coup.
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midnight Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 06:45 AM
Response to Reply #1
73. Yes.
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TomInTib Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 09:52 PM
Response to Original message
2. "our mission is to take care of citizens at home"
I imagine that depends on one's definition of "take care of".

We are screwn....
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eowyn_of_rohan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 09:58 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. Does Olbermann know about this? I assume so
but I am going to email this link to him, with the slim hope the MSM will address it
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dana_b Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 11:42 AM
Response to Reply #4
105. probably, but I e-mailed Rachel too. n/t
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Generic Brad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 10:57 PM
Response to Reply #2
19. I would like a definition of "citizen" as well
Somehow I suspect this administration does not consider us citizens in the usual sense.
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clear eye Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 03:37 AM
Response to Reply #19
60. Yeah. Whenever they speak, they seem to describe us as the enemy. n/t
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JohnyCanuck Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 08:55 AM
Response to Reply #2
82. "our mission is to take care of citizens at home"
I give that statement 10 points for unintended irony.
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Sabriel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 11:35 AM
Response to Reply #2
103. Yes, they're just here to "help" us
I thought we had first responders for that in our communities. And if not, then that's where we should be concentrating our efforts...on helping, not on establishing military control.
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peace13 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 10:04 PM
Response to Original message
5. Interesting that they use a unit that has spent more than 50% of their time in Iraq.
These people will have experience in offing women, children and men that refuse to stay off the streets. This is not good.
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eowyn_of_rohan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 10:09 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. exactly
Are any of these troops among those who have been given experimental drugs, to dull the senses, and obliterate the moral compass?
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undergroundpanther Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 11:45 PM
Response to Reply #7
33. Yes!
The drugs are an attempt to "cure " PSTD,by removing the soldiers conscience.Human beings do not readily take to killing other human beings.Something was in the way .So the military, this bothersome thing in human beings it made soldiers miss their targets,the soldiers were not psychopaths by gum,and the military had to do something about that..That thing in the way was the moral compass and to turn a human being into a gun under command who asks no questions and does not think ,that moral compass HAD to be removed.
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Hestia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 12:53 AM
Response to Reply #7
41. ...and they have been told that we didn't support the troops by doing another Vietnam!
First it was Blackwater, now it is combat troops. Something big has to be coming down the pike to do this. This should on Obama's to do list when he is inaugurated - disbanding this order forthwith!
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clear eye Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 03:56 AM
Response to Reply #41
62. Obama is on record as saying that he will continue to give gov't contracts to Blackwater
I hope he's just throwing them off-guard, not that he really doesn't understand the threat.
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shadowknows69 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 09:20 AM
Response to Reply #5
84. These guys are trained and have learned
to be on a hair trigger in an urban setting. Bad things are going to happen.
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stillcool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 10:08 PM
Response to Original message
6. What about this?
The Posse Comitatus Act


2006: On the Eve of the Midterm Elections, PCA Nullified

Recently, Congress passed a controversial bill which grants the President the right to commandeer Federal or even state National Guard Troops and use them inside the United States. This bill, entitled the John Warner Defense Appropriation Act for Fiscal Year 2007 (H.R. 5122.ENR), contains a provision, (Section 1076) which allows the President to:

...employ the armed forces, including the National Guard in Federal service, to...

1. restore public order and enforce the laws of the United States when, as a result of a natural disaster, epidemic, or other serious public health emergency, terrorist attack or incident, or other condition in any State or possession of the United States..., where the President determines that,...domestic violence has occurred to such an extent that the constituted authorities of the State or possession are incapable of maintaining public order;
2. suppress, in a State, any insurrection, domestic violence, unlawful combination, or conspiracy... <3>
http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Posse_Comita...
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avaistheone1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 10:12 PM
Response to Reply #6
8. This is very troubling. It is amazing that Congress voted for this.
Yet Congress can not bother to investigate caging, and election/voter machine fraud.
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eowyn_of_rohan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 10:41 PM
Response to Reply #8
11. is is troubling, and stunning
Edited on Tue Sep-23-08 10:42 PM by eowyn_of_rohan
Kucinich lists among his Articles of Impeachment, #s 22 & 23 CREATING SECRET LAWS & VIOLATION OF THE POSSE COMITATUS
PRoves bush violated the Posse Comitatus act before it went into effect in the fall of 2007.
i am disgusted that Congress passed this and even more disgusted that not enough of us knew it was happening

This in effect SILENCES our ability to assemble and protest
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bdamomma Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 10:52 PM
Response to Reply #8
14. is Congress aware of the NSPD-51
Edited on Tue Sep-23-08 11:03 PM by alyce douglas
another issue that has not been mentioned.

http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2007/05/2007050...

this site may also be beneficial

http://www.armytimes.com/news/
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Marie26 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 10:44 PM
Response to Reply #6
12. That was rescinded
in the 2008 Defense Bill, thanks to Sen. Leahy. But it's striking that Sec. 1076 uses the same exact phrases as this new mission.
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eowyn_of_rohan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 11:21 PM
Response to Reply #12
28. Wow - the plot thickens. Thank you
I have a research assignment here...
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Marie26 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 11:41 PM
Response to Reply #28
32. Sure
I wanted to double-check & make sure that was actually repealed. The 2008 Defense bill did repeal the changes to Posse Comitatus & basically set the law back to the way it was.

Wikipedia:

Recent legislative events
HR5122 also known as the John Warner Defense Authorization Act was signed by the president on Oct 17, 2006 John Warner National Defense Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 2007. Section 1076 Text of Hr5122 is titled "Use of the Armed Forces in major public emergencies". Removing the legalese from the text, and combining multiple sentences, it provides that: The President may employ the armed forces to restore public order in any State of the United States the President determines hinders the execution of laws or deprives people of a right, privilege, immunity, or protection named in the Constitution and secured by law or opposes or obstructs the execution of the laws of the United States or impedes the course of justice under those laws. The actual text is on page 322-323 of the legislation. As of 2008, these changes were repealed, changing the text of the law back to the original 1807 wording, under Public Law 110-181 (H.R. 4986, Section 1068)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posse_Comitatus_Act#Recent...

Congress Quietly Repeals Martial Law Provision - http://www.inteldaily.com/?c=144&a=6175
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Snazzy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 03:43 AM
Response to Reply #32
61. just checked too
Amazing we had a victory I never heard of on this, thanks to Leahy.
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clear eye Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 04:02 AM
Response to Reply #32
63. So that supports the "illegal" in the OP title. n/t
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Marie26 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 08:52 AM
Response to Reply #63
81. Totally
But then things like legal/illegal have become a sort of technicality anymore.
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eowyn_of_rohan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 09:09 AM
Response to Reply #81
83. We deserve answers from Congress - this issue needs a bright light shined upon it
These madmen must be stopped
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Hestia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 12:54 AM
Response to Reply #6
42. Wasn't there a signing statement that did away with Posse Comitatus after Katrina?
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Rosa Luxemburg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 11:30 AM
Response to Reply #6
102. Well, let's just hope Obama is president and Democrats are majority!
if not we are doomed
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eowyn_of_rohan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-25-08 09:33 AM
Response to Reply #102
140. Which means as many of us as possible must help locally to assure voters
are being registered, to observe or monitor at the polling places, to convince the disillusioned to VOTE and that their vote matters, and to do whatever we can to help assure this election is not stolen.
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Graybeard Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 10:33 PM
Response to Original message
9. Pieces in place for October surprise?
Some domestic incident, perhaps racial, that ignites protests across the country? This administration is capable of the most ugly possibilities.
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clear eye Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 04:08 AM
Response to Reply #9
64. Russian retaliation for provocation, and start of new military action
while economy starts to crumble, and oil is choked off to provide justification. That would create a fair amount of chaos.
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The Stranger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 10:38 PM
Response to Original message
10. Roger Cloutier must be one of the fucking stupidest things on the planet.
I mean those quotes -- they must be fabricated. Nothing could be that stupid.
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eowyn_of_rohan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 10:45 PM
Response to Reply #10
13. He sounds brainwashed - if he actually said this
It makes me feel good as an American to know that my country has dedicated a force to come in and help the people at home.


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NNN0LHI Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 10:53 PM
Response to Original message
15. I sure hope they don't "help" us like they "helped" the Iraqis
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bdamomma Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 10:56 PM
Response to Reply #15
18. and if those soldiers are suffering from any mental health
disorders, not a very comforting thought.
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rucky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 10:54 PM
Response to Original message
16. October? Surprise!
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shanti Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 02:19 AM
Response to Reply #16
54. alrighty then!
;)
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Hatfield Donating Member (33 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 10:55 PM
Response to Original message
17. Link is Dead
Did anyone by chance get a screen capture? I've done a google search and haven't found any reputable sites that are covering this story.
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Marie26 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 11:02 PM
Response to Reply #17
21. google cache:
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eowyn_of_rohan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 11:05 PM
Response to Reply #21
23. gone too! At least on my heavily firewalled computer
I have the full text - should I post it here?

INTERESTING that it has disappeared. Who is worried about what, here?
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Marie26 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 11:08 PM
Response to Reply #23
24. Looks like
it was moved - the article appears (for me at least) here: http://www.armytimes.com/news/2008/09/army_homeland_090...
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eowyn_of_rohan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 11:18 PM
Response to Reply #24
27. yep-that works
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readmoreoften Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 11:28 PM
Response to Reply #17
30. It was in the Army Times and on Democracy Now.
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Subdivisions Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 02:21 AM
Response to Reply #17
55. This has happened on every thread about this deployment. Here:
ArmyTimes.com - Brigade homeland tours start Oct. 1

You have to have the "/" on the end of the URL. I think DU's software is stripping it off so you have to format the link.
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Naturyl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 05:42 PM
Response to Reply #55
124. When did we become a "homeland" anyway?
I do not remember this incredibly fascist-sounding "homeland" term ever being used outside the context of jokes before 9/11.

Now we have an Army brigade doing "homeland tours?" Ugggh...
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dgibby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 08:37 PM
Response to Reply #124
126. just more Nazi talking points! nt
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Fumesucker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 10:57 PM
Response to Original message
20. As we have seen with the FISA vote and telco immunity..
It is apparently Constitutional to retroactively make the illegal legal.

So the fact that this may be an illegal act at this time really means very little.

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Canuckistanian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 11:14 PM
Response to Original message
25. I think the key words here are "uses" and "execute the laws"
And by that I mean, stationing the soldiers in the US is unusual and scary, but USING them as an agent of the government against US citizens OR using them for domestic law enforcement is ILLEGAL.

So they're NOT doing anything wrong as long as they're staying on base.

But - the very SECOND they're deployed OUTSIDE of their base FOR ANY REASON would be a clear breach of Title 18.
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undergroundpanther Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 11:56 PM
Response to Reply #25
35. It already happened
When they took my neighbor away disappeared him, the day after Xmas.
He was three houses down from mine.
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bertman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 12:17 AM
Response to Reply #35
38. whoa, undergroundpanther, please elaborate. Is he a Mooslem? Or just a terrist?
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undergroundpanther Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 04:59 PM
Response to Reply #38
119. neither
I don't know why they sent in all these agencies with army people running in formation across my front lawn carrying ak 47 type rifles with full packs even canteens.FBI was there,the whole shebang.
I asked the dude on my lawn who had blocked my driveway wtf was going on,the told me my neighbor was suicidal.I told him I don't believe it.
I say this because I have had EMT's called on me because I have been suicidal, and they don't send the troops to haul me away.

Like I said, he was disappeared,I don't know why he was taken or where..But there was a small 1 paragraph blurb in the back pages of the local paper stating the same horse shit about suicide.
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bertman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 07:13 PM
Response to Reply #119
125. Well, you know, everything changed on 9-11, so I think it's SOP now that they send out combat-ready
platoons of cops to make sure a person with suicidal tendencies doesn't hurt himself.

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undergroundpanther Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-25-08 03:40 AM
Response to Reply #125
132. I know
it makes no sense.But than again bush is fucking evil and crazy.
and the longer the majority of people hide their heads in the sand and play little Eichmann's and are too scared of being called tin foil to see there IS something very foul going on,then they will be too late to do shit when their door gets busted in.Than it will be too late for all of us.
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Recursion Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 11:16 PM
Response to Original message
26. Garden Plot has been around since the 60's
Edited on Tue Sep-23-08 11:16 PM by dmesg
There are always combat units under Northern Command stationed in the US.

Maybe I'm missing the big deal here?
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eowyn_of_rohan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 11:23 PM
Response to Reply #26
29. More from the Army Times blurb - does this help?
It is not the first time an active-duty unit has been tapped to help at home. In August 2005, for example, when Hurricane Katrina unleashed hell in Mississippi and Louisiana, several active-duty units were pulled from various posts and mobilized to those areas.

But this new mission marks the first time an active unit has been given a dedicated assignment to NorthCom, a joint command established in 2002 to provide command and control for federal homeland defense efforts and coordinate defense support of civil authorities.

After 1st BCT finishes its dwell-time mission, expectations are that another, as yet unnamed, active-duty brigade will take over and that the mission will be a permanent one.

Right now, the response force requirement will be an enduring mission. How the chooses to source that and whether or not they continue to assign them to NorthCom, that could change in the future, said Army Col. Louis Vogler, chief of NorthCom future operations. Now, the plan is to assign a force every year.
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BrklynLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 11:50 PM
Response to Original message
34. Scary stuff. Very scary.
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misskittysister Donating Member (28 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 11:56 PM
Response to Original message
36. Coincidence?
I started seeing a small blurb mentioning this info about the army unit about two weeks ago and wondered a bit at it...then, suddenly, we get word about the alarming midnight meeting last weekend concerning the possible disruption of the nation (and world's) economy. I'm not at all at ease with conspiracy theories, but looking back it sure seems like someone was preparing for some trouble to be brewing in the streets of the country. Very scary stuff, all the way around.
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TxBlue Donating Member (472 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 12:21 AM
Response to Original message
39. K&R
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bertman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 12:24 AM
Response to Original message
40. Annex A, Section B calls for the DEADLY FORCE to be used against ANY EXTREMIST OR DISSIDENT
perpetrating ANY AND ALL FORMS OF CIVIL DISORDER.

Civil disorder, as in demonstrating against an unpopular piece of legislation or a giveaway of 100's of billions of $$$ to the superrich?

Use of deadly force. This is beyond scary.

Nazi Germany redux.


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clear eye Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 02:04 AM
Response to Reply #40
49. Is this on Kos? Anybody post it on the Obama blog,
DFA blog, or other Democratic sites? You're right OPer, this needs to be broadcast far and wide. Has anybody sent it to Thom Hartmann?
:scared: :scared: :scared: :scared: :scared: :scared: :scared: :scared: :scared: :scared: :scared: :scared:
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bedazzled Donating Member (584 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 07:19 AM
Response to Reply #40
75. they mention peaceful protests that are disrupted by infiltrators also
so they can basically kill innocent civilians

some kind of nightmare...
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eowyn_of_rohan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 07:53 AM
Response to Reply #75
77. and guess what - they often provide the infiltrators
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shadowknows69 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 09:21 AM
Response to Reply #40
85. Kent State X1000
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low_phreaq Donating Member (362 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 01:09 AM
Response to Original message
43. Some pics of the non-lethal weaponry they might use
Got these from an earlier thread on this topic:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...





http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Active_Denial_System
The Active Denial System (ADS) is a non-lethal, directed-energy weapon developed by the U.S. military. It is a strong millimeter-wave transmitter used for crowd control (the "goodbye effect"). Informally, the weapon is also called pain ray. Raytheon is currently marketing a reduced-range version of this technology. The ADS is currently being considered for deployment in the Iraq War.
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guruoo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 01:25 AM
Response to Original message
44. Do they really want to raise the stakes to the point where they risk
lighting the candle?
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low_phreaq Donating Member (362 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 01:50 AM
Response to Reply #44
46. If they think they can profit from it, I wouldn't put it past them.
Sure, the balance sheets might get a little bloody, but it's all about the bottom line for these crooks and their pals. Hey, war is war, and profit is profit. Doesn't matter where. They can sell to both sides - active denial systems to the military and conductive mesh shielding suits to the rebels. Escalate. Repeat.
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guruoo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 02:12 AM
Response to Reply #46
51. Profit? They can't take it with them.
Edited on Wed Sep-24-08 02:16 AM by guruoo
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low_phreaq Donating Member (362 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 02:18 AM
Response to Reply #51
53. Unless they take the money and run... n/t
Edited on Wed Sep-24-08 02:21 AM by low_phreaq
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guruoo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 11:17 AM
Response to Reply #53
100. Run where? Dubai? UAE? Paraguay?
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dgibby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 01:49 AM
Response to Original message
45. Thank you!
I really appreciate you posting this. Hopefully, we can keep it going this time. Google "Northcom", Raytheon, non-lethal weapons. The Northcom sites are VERY interesting! Scary stuff!
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low_phreaq Donating Member (362 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 01:54 AM
Response to Original message
47. A YouTube video on this
MARTIAL LAW OCT. 1, 2008 - WHAT WILL YOU DO ???
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I6DRz1I7c6I
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clear eye Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 01:59 AM
Response to Original message
48. It really does sound like preparation for a fascist takeover
Has Cheney's fingerprints all over it. Will be handy to forcibly remove Congress for some trumped-up reason, or to quell protests by an outraged citizenry.
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reggie the dog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 02:16 AM
Response to Original message
52. war on drugs set the precedent
The Army, and the Marines have been used to rip up cannabis plants since at least the 90s when my friend participated in such missions as a Marine in Hawaii.
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low_phreaq Donating Member (362 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 02:28 AM
Response to Original message
56. Executive Order of September 11, 2008
For Immediate Release
Office of the Press Secretary
September 11, 2008

Executive Order: Executive Branch Responsibilities with Respect to Orders of Succession

By the authority vested in me as President by the Constitution and the laws of the United States of America, it is hereby ordered as follows:

Section 1. Policy. It is the policy of the Federal Government to ensure that each executive branch agency can perform its essential functions and remain an effectively functioning part of the Federal Government under all conditions. Accordingly, each agency shall take all appropriate actions to establish, maintain, and, as necessary, revise an order of succession, or to propose presidential action to establish or revise an order of succession.

<snip>

Each agency for which presidential action is required to establish an order of succession shall draft a proposed order of succession if no such order exists and, not later than 30 days from the date of this order, send such proposed draft order to the Counsel to the President for review and comment.

More...
http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2008/09/2008091...

Translation: The president's lawyers want to make sure the "right" people are in line when the shit hits the fan.
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liberalla Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 04:56 AM
Response to Reply #56
66. "revise an order of succession"
OMG :mad:

Accordingly, each agency (each executive branch agency) shall take all appropriate actions to establish, maintain, and, as necessary, revise an order of succession, or to propose presidential action to establish or revise an order of succession.

No more Nancy Pelosi 2nd in line I guess? Just because it's in the constitution, that don't matter t'all, right?
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eowyn_of_rohan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 06:24 AM
Response to Reply #66
70. and they get only 30 days to do it - deadline is 2 1/2 weeks from now.
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MiniMe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 07:38 AM
Response to Reply #56
76. First of all, it is directed at agencies, the government is not an agency
Second, it is for for positions such as cabinet positions where a President has to nominate somebody, or take an action if the president has to do something for succession to take place. I don't think we have too much to worry about with this, it doesn't change Presidential succession. There is an order that already exists for that, it is the Constitution.

"Each agency for which presidential action is required to establish an order of succession shall draft a proposed order of succession if no such order exists and, not later than 30 days from the date of this order, send such proposed draft order to the Counsel to the President for review and comment."
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tavalon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 04:43 AM
Response to Original message
65. Posse Comitatus is so Passe
Not to make light. This is another chunk towards becoming a recognizable fascist country. We are already fascist but it's still a state secret, granted not a well kept secret but still a secret.
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FlyingSquirrel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 05:04 AM
Response to Original message
67. ALL PART OF THE PLAN, PEOPLE....
Edited on Wed Sep-24-08 05:04 AM by FlyingSquirrel
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OakCliffDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 06:07 AM
Response to Original message
68. K & R Crowd control with non-lethal weapons. Wonder why the need to practice that on Americans
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readmoreoften Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 06:29 AM
Response to Reply #68
71. "Non-lethal". Well except when they tase you until your heart stops. Hit you in the eye with a bean
bag pellet at point blank range. Until you get trampled to death when the microwaves go off at the rally.
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OakCliffDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 06:43 AM
Response to Reply #71
72. I was thinking more along the lines of what happens when Bush suspends the elections
The only purpose in having the Army control the Citizens is when the Government is oppressing us.
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readmoreoften Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 06:56 AM
Response to Reply #72
74. Oh yes. Clearly.
It could be the suspension of elections.
It could be the theft of the election.
It could be false flag race riots started by the neoconservatives after the theft of the election.
It could be false flag race riots started by the neoconservatives after the assassination of the president-elect.
It could be a planned economic crash and subsequent overt fascism.
It could be a genuine crash they foresaw.
It could be in response to a false flag terror attack.
It could be in response to a nurtured LIHOP style attack.
It could be anything, but it will be something.

It could happen in October, November, December, or January.
It could even happen after that.
But it will happen.

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dgibby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 10:38 AM
Response to Reply #74
94. Uh, you forgot pandemic flu!
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clear eye Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-25-08 01:46 AM
Response to Reply #74
131. Thank you. You nailed it.
So the important thing is to get this new horror of a law repealed so that the subsequent violent repression will be illegal and a basis for removing the perpetrators from power--assuming a large part of the armed forces still stands on the side of a republic. Going by many Generals' barely disguised digust with the Iraq occupation, I think they will.
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clear eye Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-25-08 01:38 AM
Response to Reply #72
130. I wish I could remember where I read it, but Cheney has said that
the gov't has to be ready for wide-spread protest when all the neocon changes they want to make are enacted or they haven't gone far enough. Probably on one of those neocon websites while he was out of gov't. They look to be anticipating something like Mexico where there was such doubt about their last Presidential election <http://www.democracynow.org/2006/9/6/mexico_court_decla... > that the "defeated" party established a parallel gov't for a month, expecting to be able to overturn the results. The huge protest camps were at first tolerated, but eventually disbanded with the usual Mexican gov't brutality.

I wouldn't be surprised if it is not the Presidential election that gets stolen, but many Congressional races and even some of the 11 gubernatorial ones. Easier to stamp down and maintain a media blackout on scattered protests than a general countrywide one. Can anyone explain to me why Congressional Democrats haven't acted against the required caging lists and the electronic voting and tabulating machines during the past two years? I always come up blank when I try to figure that out.

Like everyone else on this thread, I think the largest point is that it is now law to allow deployment of active duty military units to use deadly force against "dissidents". What horrible thing they plan to do that would bring us all out into the streets is secondary.
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nichomachus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 07:54 AM
Response to Original message
78. Does this mean the US has its own "surge?" n/t
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Larry Ogg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 08:49 AM
Response to Original message
80. Congratulations America, your faith in venal politicians will finally pay off
As the conquers of Bagdad, Fallujah, and Kandahar will soon be coming to a neighborhood near you! And they will be spreading Democracy with Apache gunships and daisy cutters. Of course, this is to make us all safe from the inevitable economic collapse and the Constitution loving liberal terrorist who managed to actually figure out what is really going on. And thusly, their refusal to concede to the god ordained new world order economic elite, will be met with the shock and awe of our foreign policy turned domestic

Its just to bad people like Kucinich are unelectable

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progressoid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 09:32 AM
Response to Original message
86. Hmmm....We should have sort of National Guard or something for this kind of thing.
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dgibby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 10:41 AM
Response to Reply #86
96. National Guard is no longer under purview of state Govs,
now controlled by Bush. Guard will be activated as part of reg. military.
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paparush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 10:43 AM
Response to Reply #86
97. Maybe even a well regulated Militia or something.....
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1776Forever Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 10:06 AM
Response to Original message
87. Questions that arrise include how a combat troop will react to "homeland" duties - link from CNN..
Edited on Wed Sep-24-08 10:08 AM by 1776Forever
Family of U.S. soldier in dark about 'non-hostile' death
Sept. 18, 2008

http://www.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/meast/09/18/iraq.soldier....

BAGHDAD, Iraq (CNN) -- Darryl Mathis waits in his Pensacola, Florida, home for the body of his 24-year-old son to return home from Iraq. Mathis, a military veteran himself, was seething with anger Thursday as he spoke about the death of Army Staff Sgt. Darris J. Dawson.

Dawson and Sgt. Wesley Durbin, 26, are said to have been shot and killed by another U.S. soldier on Sunday at a base south of Baghdad.

(snip)

Darryl Mathis (father of Darris) said Friday that he may consider hiring a lawyer, so he can "get to the bottom of this."

His wife sobs as she says her stepson's death was foreshadowed by a phone call he made to her from Iraq.

"He said that he was more shaky sometimes of the soldiers than of the enemy, because of the young guys over there."

She said she asked him, "What in the world do you mean? You're afraid of your own soldiers?"

" 'These kids are trying to fight a war they know nothing about. ... They're jumpy. ... They're more scary than the enemy,' " she said he told her.

"And I said, 'Oh, God,' " said Maxine Mathis.

Since learning about the her stepson's death, Maxine Mathis said, she has forgiven the shooter "with all of heart."

She said she knows that he and his family too must be suffering and hopes to meet him when he's ready so she can "just ask 'Why?' "

On any given day, CNN receives dozens of detailed news releases from the U.S. military, including those announcing U.S. military casualties. In the cases of Dawson and Durbin, there was no mention of their names, and the releases were terse.

............

These kind of things are occurring too many times and we are not offering the help these men need when they return home. I give them all my utmost regard but feel there are a lot of unanswered questions.

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L0oniX Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 10:17 AM
Response to Original message
88. O yea keep supporting the troops even when they are going to be used ...
to protect the rich and powerful when the people revolt and rise up.
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smoogatz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 10:31 AM
Response to Original message
91. The key clause is "except in cases... authorized by the Constitution or act of Congress."
That's a broad exception. Patriot Act, anyone?
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AngryOldDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 10:32 AM
Response to Original message
92. The Army Times link has gone AWOL.
Their words, not mine.

I wonder why?
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eowyn_of_rohan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 10:36 AM
Response to Reply #92
93. For some reason they moved it - here it is
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AngryOldDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 10:40 AM
Response to Reply #93
95. Thanks... n/t
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Rosa Luxemburg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 11:28 AM
Response to Reply #93
101. Who in congress approved this? Write your Senators and Reps
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eowyn_of_rohan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 12:06 PM
Response to Reply #101
108. Yes. I am going to write also to Kucinich and Leahy
I would like to see this discussed on the MSM - maybe Olbermann would dare to tackle it. This needs to be known by as many Americans as possible, as soon as possible.
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dgibby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 11:07 AM
Response to Original message
99. Related topics to google:
Northcom, shadow government, biological/chemical warfare, chem trails, non-lethal weapons, microwave weapons, for starters. Lots of stuff about this on Alex Jones' site-no matter if you think he's tinfoil hat or not, he has covered this for a long time. Reading this stuff would cure narcolepsy! :nuke: :scared:
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earth mom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 11:39 AM
Response to Original message
104. This freaks me out way more than the credit crisis on Wall St.
:tinfoilhat:
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Birthday Donating Member (224 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 11:51 AM
Response to Original message
107. In the same way we made calls, wrote letters, sent emails,
for a stay in the execution of Troy Davis, we need to attend to this, also. Please forward the information here on to your senators, friends, family members, television stations, public radio station, etc. This must be on the front page (along with good news about Obama), and a part of everyone's conversations. Let this not happen to a sleeping nation.
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eowyn_of_rohan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 12:25 PM
Response to Original message
109. CONGRESSIONAL CONTACT LIST HERE:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

Let's shine a beam on this nefarious plan!
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dgibby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 12:32 PM
Response to Original message
110. I sent this to Rachel Maddow today
Since she has discussed items I've sent her before, I think she's interested in our concerns and listens to us. Even if she doesn't use it, it can't hurt to spread the word.
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dana_b Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 12:34 PM
Response to Reply #110
111. me too!! maybe she'll pick it up.
:thumbsup:
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Lerkfish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 02:46 PM
Response to Original message
113. link goes to a 404 page not found page for me...
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eowyn_of_rohan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 05:27 PM
Response to Reply #113
121. new link at post 93
don't know why they moved it
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Lerkfish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-25-08 06:39 AM
Response to Reply #121
136. thnks!
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Irish Girl Donating Member (265 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 03:19 PM
Response to Original message
114. smelling an overwhelmingly stinky fish ...
Edited on Wed Sep-24-08 03:23 PM by coincidenceor...
Forget economic collapse. this should be THE most important news being discussed right now. The Bush Dynasty rose to power by funding Hitler and Prescott Bush was directly involved in a fascist plot to overthrow FDR, before a very patriotic American named Smedley Butler blew the whole thing wide open. (Research into Prescott Bush, Smedley Butler, The Business Plot, and the McCormack-Dickstein Congressional Committee). Now Bush intends to deploy troops to our streets and has been quietly building FEMA Concentration Camps all over the place. (Research into "Rex 84")

We as Americans have a responsibility to protect our Constitution and our children's future from these cockroaches. Please make this topic heard because time is running preciously short.

How Bush's grandfather helped Hitler's rise to power
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readmoreoften Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-25-08 04:09 AM
Response to Reply #114
134. Welcome to DU!
:)
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JerseygirlCT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 03:39 PM
Response to Original message
115. What are they planning for October?
What is it that's going to require crowd control on a level like this?

I know it's very tin-foil-hat of me, but this is scary!
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lame54 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 03:46 PM
Response to Original message
116. There may not be an election
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WhiteTara Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 04:48 PM
Response to Original message
118. I told my congressman about this
last night. We'll see what they have to say about it.
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dgibby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 08:43 PM
Response to Reply #118
127. Good for you!
I'd tell mine, but it's Lindsay Graham, so I'd probably be disappeared ricky tick!
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Naturyl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 05:31 PM
Response to Original message
122. Aw shit...
Army deployed stateside? No posse comitatus? Not good.

Not good.
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Imagevision Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-24-08 08:59 PM
Response to Original message
128. There could be something to the YouTubes of Bush canceling the election and
sending in the national guard to keep things calm and orderly. it's been on YouTube for more then a year and the troops have been training for this mission for one year.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Np_eszYfOB0
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Algorem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-25-08 01:00 AM
Response to Original message
129. how many soldiers would this be?
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readmoreoften Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-25-08 04:14 AM
Response to Reply #129
135. Only around 4000. Not that many. I suppose not enough. Depending on their back up.
Will it be 1000 in NYC, 1000 in San Fran, 1000 DC and 1000 spread elsewhere in addition to standing police local force, FEMA, and a few National Guard taking orders from the feds instead of their governors?

Actually, that might be enough.
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Lerkfish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-25-08 06:40 AM
Response to Reply #135
137. with the new microwave crowd control devices, it would be enough.
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eowyn_of_rohan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-25-08 09:16 AM
Response to Reply #135
139. Sadly, 1st Brigade is only PART of a huge team
Edited on Thu Sep-25-08 10:05 AM by eowyn_of_rohan
From that Army Times article:
"the 1st BCT will be under the day-to-day control of U.S. Army North, the Army service component of Northern Command"

"Other branches included - The active Armys new dwell-time mission is part of a NorthCom and DOD response package."

"Active-duty soldiers will be part of a force that includes elements from other military branches and dedicated National Guard Weapons of Mass Destruction-Civil Support Teams."

"A final mission rehearsal exercise is scheduled for mid-September at Fort Stewart and will be run by Joint Task Force Civil Support, a unit based out of Fort Monroe, Va., that will coordinate and evaluate the interservice event."

"In addition to 1st BCT, other Army units will take part in the two-week training exercise, including elements of the 1st Medical Brigade out of Fort Hood, Texas, and the 82nd Combat Aviation Brigade from Fort Bragg, N.C."

"There also will be Air Force engineer and medical units, the Marine Corps Chemical, Biological Initial Reaction Force, a Navy weather team and members of the Defense Logistics Agency and the Defense Threat Reduction Agency."

~~~~~~~~~~~
Consequence Management Response Force to join Army Northern Command
Sep 15, 2008

Elements of the force, known as the CBRNE Consequence Management Response Force, or CCMRF, assembled at Fort Stewart, Ga., Sept. 8-19 for a command post exercise called Vibrant Response. (how exciting!)

Three brigades form the core of the force: the 1st Brigade Combat Team, 3rd Infantry Division, Fort Stewart; the 1st Medical Brigade, Fort Hood, Texas; and the 82nd Combat Aviation Brigade, Fort Bragg, N.C.

The response force will be assigned on Oct. 1 to U.S. Northern Command, Peterson Air Force Base, Colo., and placed under the operational control of U.S. Army North, Fort Sam Houston, Texas.


This week, Col. Lou Vogler, U.S. Army North's chief of future operations, and Marine Corps Lt. Col. James Shores, director of plans and policy for Joint Task Force Civil Support, participated in a round table interview with online journalists to discuss the force, including its unique mission and training.

"U.S. Army North is the Army component of U.S. Northern Command," said Vogler, "and we're charged with coordinating the federal military response in the land domain for domestic operations or disasters, to include CBRNE."
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
From the Air Force Times: (Of course the Air Force will be able to quickly transport the troops anywhere in the country)
http://www.airforcetimes.com/news/2008/06/airforce_ccmr... /

Beginning in October (2008), a federal military response will be available for the worst disasters....Three CCMRFs, each with about 4,500 troops from all branches, are in the making.

Some units already tagged for CCMRF 1 the team expected to be ready by October (2008) trained as part of National Level Exercise 2-08, which involved a variety of local, state and federal disaster response agencies

The training was successful in terms of proving the units capabilities, Cunniff said, and was an early step toward the kind of CCMRF training NorthCom leadership envisions. That training will start with individuals perfecting their basic warrior skills, such as wearing and maintaining protective gear, Cunniff said.

We envision that could be regionally based, Cunniff said, perhaps one on each coast and one in the middle.
Once thats determined, Cunniff said, NorthCom will have only one more decision to make: Theyd like a better name for the CCMRFs.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
FEEL SECURE

Above is just a sampling of what I've found. There are plenty of names and acronyms to Google, for anyone who has the stomach. If you'd like, try any of these along with "civil disturbance" (you know those "homeland emergencies", like carrying peace signs and singing). Here are some for starters:

Northern Command <AKA NorthCom > (Controls, I believe, all "homeland" deployed military branches)
U.S. Army North
"DOD response package"
"Consequence Management Response Force" <AKA CCMRF >
Joint Task Force <AKA JTF>
VIGILANT SHIELD (with or without "2008" after it
VIBRANT RESPONSE
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
;( :nuke:
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eowyn_of_rohan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-25-08 09:44 AM
Response to Reply #129
142. From CCMRF - about 14,000 troops
Edited on Thu Sep-25-08 10:16 AM by eowyn_of_rohan
CCMRF "Sea-Smurf" = Consequence Management Response Force
1st Brigade 3rd Infantry is only part of CCMRF.
I haven't figured out what other troops, if any, are involved in this outside of CCRMF

From the Air Force Times:
http://www.airforcetimes.com/news/2008/06/airforce_ccmr ... /

Beginning in October (2008), a federal military response will be available for the worst disasters....Three CCMRFs, each with about 4,500 troops from all branches, are in the making.

(see my post above this one for more details)
edited for spelling
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readmoreoften Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-25-08 05:46 PM
Response to Reply #142
143. 13500 Troops? Martial law. Dictatorship of the Smurfs.
Smurf these fascists. They can smurfin' go smurf it up their smurfs for all I smurf.
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leftofthedial Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-25-08 03:45 AM
Response to Original message
133. putting the martial in martial law
civil unrest and crowd control

the first ever nonlethal package that the Army has fielded

a new modular package of nonlethal capabilities




The way it worked on the Eye-rackeez, I can't WAIT to try it on some damn liburls.
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eowyn_of_rohan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-25-08 09:38 AM
Response to Reply #133
141. non-lethal, unless they forget to set the phasers on stun
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glinda Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-27-08 05:38 PM
Response to Original message
144. Bail Out a DEVIATION to take focus off of this?
Maybe some people out to email some Dems in Washington and remind them (or point this out) of this as they are all balled up in the Bail Out thing.
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