I knew it was going to happen, but it still hurts like hell to watch it in slow motion.

NOTE: To anyone who feels that their morale may be damaged by an unvarnished assessment of reality these last eight to twenty-five years may not wish to read any further. Everyone from Polyannas to Coincidence Theorists, please find another thread to soil.

Anyone who would like to converse civilly is most welcome.

NOTE: Neither should this thread be construed as an advocation of giving up or not voting. I will be out in November pulling the lever for Obama and I would hope every other DUer would, as well. And to all those who are working for Obama as I have worked in elections recently passed, thank you for your efforts this time around.

It's like a slow motion car accident unraveling before one's eyes, bodies crumpled and mangled flying out windows at breakneck speed in agonizing detail. Or maybe it's like watching a bad reality show or maybe WWE wrestling again and again and again, one with the same outcome no matter what nonsensical plot twists get us to the preordained ending.

But the outcome is never in doubt, and if we look at what passes for "elections" in Bushie Amerika or Putinist Russia, which are almost identically governed by Inverted Totalitarianism as well as having identically trustworthy "elections", we can see that computerized wholesale Bushie election fraud, which may or may not exist, may not even be necessary whether it exists or not.

I have said it before and I have said it again: What the Bushies have done to our media, our institutions and our National Psyche as expressed in our National Dialogue, is psychologically similar, deeply similar, to what the Nazis did to Germany, and the Stalinists to Russia, as absolute and as irrevocable. At least it is not yet physically dangerous, as per the kinder and gentler methodologies of Bush and Putin's Inverted Totalitarianism as compared to Hitler and Stalin's brand of brutal Classical Totalitarianism.

Does wholesale electronic Bushie electoral fraud exist? Probably. But for the purposes of this discussion, let us assume that which is not 100% proven does not exist and so for the purposes of this discussion, wholesale electronic Bushie electoral fraud does not exist.

Does it even need to? In this nation of drugged-out, TV-zombied-up sheep, of which we are all a part what is essentially a vast artificial marketing scheme which has replaced objective reality, a National Hologram, to borrow Joe Bageant's term for it, do the Bushies even need wholesale election fraud to get their way?

At least a year ago, I knew that McCain would be our next Emperor, probably holding the throne for Jeb, but who knows. American Tyranny is a bit more inclusive than familial monarchies and dictatorships of the past, like the Roman Emperors didn't have to be members of the Caesar family, eventually.

No one can predict the details of the future, only that the Bushie Summer Propaganda Offensive would come in some form, using all the power of The State to advance it's goals.

When the Bushies, probably through Randy Scheunemann, greenlighted Georgia for or perhaps ordered it to begin it's August 2008 "Bushie Bounce" invasion of Georgia, the same way the Israelis coincidentally did the same things for their Bushie Masters in August 2006 in pursuit of the same Bushie electoral goals, they knew their mass psychology.

Instant McCain bounce. Add to it the framing of the National Dialogue through the Bushie M$M as restarting the Cold War, and the certainty of the knee-jerk statistical reaction is frighteningly predictable and accurate.

Six percentage points, plus or minus three, for our next Emperor McCain. This would probably not be the case if the Bushies hadn't long ago bent the media to it's will through corporate consolidation and a dozen other sub-strategies including Bill Parcells "working the ref", and all have been staggeringly successful to the point where the Bushie M$M is now pretty much where all discussions are leveled from the start by using a Bushie Linguistic Frame.

Language is power, any marketer will tell you that, and the Bushies took over the language over two decades without anyone really even raising a voice in protest.

So, it's knotted now. And I believe that, in the current restructuring and Gleichschaltung the Bushies have carried out on our "National Nervous System", every facet of it, it simply is not possible for Obama to GAIN in the polls.

As impossible as it was for whoever Medvedev's opposition patsy, his "Obama", was in our Sister Nation and fellow Inverted Totalitarianism, Putin's Russia, and THEIR "election" (which, if we are assuming no Bushie electoral fraud, then we MUSt also assume no Putinist United Russia electoral fraud and thus Medvedev's "election" victory was indeed 66-33% as advertised) to gain in the polls.

It makes me laugh. Nothing left to do but laugh about it now. The Bushies, in their kinder and gentler way, have us in a grip as absolute as the Nazis has over Germany.

If there are any left who can scoff at this quite reasonable notion in the face of the last eight years, and I have no doubt that even now most will...even NOW, when it is tragically obvious to the point of insulting the intelligence of the few members of the Reality-Based Community left, then just wait until November.

First, the October Surprise is still yet to come, though it may not even be necessary...whatever it is, it will be at least as shocking to the National Nervous System as the Georgian Invasion of Ossetia that was likely instigated by the Bushies for McCain.

Then, the usual boring "Surprise McCain Upset Victory Show" coming a few days later. Boring. I've seen it before and they could at least come up with a new plot.

Can't you see it? Can't you smell it? Doesn't that tingle of deja vu tells you it's coming?

And the sad truth is, it simply doesn't matter what is right and wrong, what is true and what are lies, or how obvious and shameless upfront Bushie villainy is.

At the end of the day, it's going to be a "surprise upset win". Sorry, I don't want that any more than you do. But reality is reality. Don't hate the messenger because reality is what it is.

Just get ready, because in just a few more weeks...eight to be precise, we are all going to be schooled on just how powerless we are to stop the systemic and structural changes the Bushies have wrought to every aspect of our once-free, once proud society. And it doesn't matter who pulls what levers...even if there ISN'T wholesale Bushie manual and electronic election fraud occurring, which probably IS also occurring.

For a few of us realists, this will be no surprise. We knew where this ride was ending (50-1 chance) before it started. That is the way of Totalitarian Nations, and even though ours is the kindest, gentlest, newest, most modern form of it, our Inverted Totalitarianism is still totalitarianism.

All hail Emperor McBush

My point is, with their marketing abilities, as well as the double-standard and totalitarian infrastructure they have literally hardwired into our nation as they have hardwired their biggest lies into our National "Conventional Wisdom", the Bushies don't even need much in the way of electoral theft to tilt the scales in their favor.

This limits their chances of getting caught.

The Bushies, as they famously told Ron Suskind, do indeed bend and create new realities.

Something else the varioua totalitarianisms and autocracies throughout history have tried to exercise upon their hapless subjects, but never and I mean NEVER has science understood the human mind and how to manipulate it so well be several orders of magntiude.

And NEVER with such a delivery system for their propaganda as the modern media-saturated Imperial Amerika. What could Hitler or Stalin have done with a nation mind so wired together and media-saturated? One shudders to think. Scary enough to think what the Bushies are going to do to all of us before their through.

Our new National Motto should be that old line from "A Clockwork Orange", Did you ever notice how nothing seems real until you viddy it on the screen?

That was my point, not that I disbelieved in wholesale Bushie electoral fraud. I agree, there is a massive preponderance of evidence such that, if it isn't 100% proven, it is so close to 100% and it is public knowledge where more than a few of the electoral "bodies are buried" that a little vigorous investigation would knock the whole house of cards over.

Though I woudn't hold my breath for that...such reform movement do not usually happen in decaying toalitarianisms like our Empire...

I live in MD too and gave up on her a long time ago.

Tom_Paine, the writer of this post, articulates exactly how I feel: scared to hope, and terrified not to.
Yes, we must all work hard in this election and do what we can in terms of donating, phonebanking, GOTV efforts, and pollwatching. That sinking futile feeling I am starting to get in my gut and I suspect many of us have now, is probably the result of all of us being Rovian psy-opped for 8 plus years, plus being part of the "reality-based community" who know what is really going on. But we keep going and keep working because we have to.

they are still members of the wealthy class that will retain their lifestyles and power no matter what happens to us underlings.

And wasn't Erlich trying to get paper machines in place but was voted down by the MD legislature?

The Governor and all executive positions are now in the hands of DEM's........The election should be fair and transparent again.

We're living in a dictatorship. A self-perpetuating autocracy in which the working classes...

Oh, there I go bringing class into it...

(apologies to Monty Python)

I live in the Twin Cities.

Last week we saw the violence inherent in the system.

Unfortunately, the human society hasn't been invented in which their wasn't some or a lot of "violence inherent in they system".

From where I am standing, at the probable pinnacle of the material achievements of the human species, it doesn't seem likely that we'll figure that one out in the brief few millenia we have left (if that).

What a great screen name for a female...

Boy those laughs are welcome.

"Moistened Bint"

Gotta love those Python British colloquialisms that make great comedy even greater!

Ever hear this one? It's from one of Michael Palin's "Ripping Yarns".

To translate, it basically means "you cheeky young bastard", so it isn;t sexism or anything like that, so far as I know.

In one of the shows, the School Bully Character calls Michael Palin's character a "snotty little oik".

Don't know why, but like "moistened bint" that phrase itself just tickles my funnybone.

still miss it! MN isn't my home state but I love it more and always thought of it as being so progressive and well, just wonderful. It's a state with a variety of people, positions, culture and beauty...aw the lakes and TREES, how I miss the trees. SO it is with great regret I saw what I did in the law enforcement department last week although I wasn't totally surprised. I saw it coming there. I think last week was just practice and a test to see how much the people will tolerate! I am in Texas because of my husband and there's a lot to like (& hate) here but God forbid if anything happened to my dear husband, I would return to the forests and lakes of MN. Stay strong. My daughter and son, 30 & 32 respectively are still there. They have kept me even more abreast of the law enforcement crackdown of last week...I could go on and on...obviously, but won't. Stay safe and be our eyes for us!

What really set me off were the reader responses in City Pages to the report of their own people getting roughed up.

http://blogs.citypages.com/blotter/2008/09/breaking_ten...

Apparently, people will tolerate -- and actually encourage -- a lot!

The one respondent saying he would help club his fellow citizens for not marching to the tune of the enforcers instructions....that's scary. Thanks for the link....just can't read it all right now....I will though. Stay safe. I hope the rancor of the police subsides.

And of course you have the "Don't they have jobs?" contingent. Like they are the only ones who get to take a vacation day or two.

I'm glad these fuckers weren't around at the time of the Boston Tea Party.

free speech is?

Someone should write and article in olde english with torries writing letters to the editor.

And the 'wingnuts'? Slapped down at every opportunity.

Don't give up on people yet.

repressing me?

I think that DU is the best available at this time.

I always enjoy your posts from the South. I am listening to hartmann talk to terrorist David Horowitz and conservatism is a mental illness which is epidemic and needs to be cut out of the collective American body. I've almost stopped watching any TV and listening to the radio and reading the "news", because it's like a nightmare. I will vote and learn to survive under The Spotty Dirt Bag and Gidget until I can get a job in Old Europe.

you wouldn't post "pep-talks" like this. It'd be like Tom Coughlin telling the NY Giants, "Hey guys, we're not going to beat the Patriots in the Super Bowl. C'mon, they're undefeated, they got Tom Brady and Randy Moss, it's just not going to happen. But hey, let's go out there and try anyway."

Seriously, if you're not part of the solution you're part of the problem. Posts like this do zero to help Obama, and in fact, only dilute his grassroots supporters excitement and enthusiasm. This hurts Obama's chances.

I know your kind. You would rather lower your expectations than raise your hopes in case they get dashed. There are lot of people like that on DU and in the world and hey, I get like that from time to time. But we all need to change our attitude. Do what you can. Do all you can to get Obama elected. Then at least if we lose, which I don't think will happen, you can say you did all you possibly could. How many friends have you converted from McCain to Obama? How many family members? How many strangers? I have a few notches on my belt, how about you friend?

We can bitch in November. But all this kvetching and hand-wringing about those sneaky Republicans has no fucking place in September or October.

Get back on our side friend. We need you.

He is on "our" side


He is just wide awake and sees what is REALITY

granted, that reality was from a year ago. Things change, money talks, bullshit walks, etc. Obama ran a damn fine campaign and is doing so again. It won't all be roses, so get used to some bumps here and there.

Can't you understand that the doom and gloom in threads like this are the antithesis of Obama's message of hope and new politics? Is it a naive message? Not when you've proven you can beat an established political machine like the Clintons. Not when you can out fund-raise your Republican opponents.

Do you think this thread helps Obama get elected?

If you and him are "wide awake" why don't you do us all a favor and go back to sleep until November 5th. I'd love to hear how smart you all were about the Bushies nefarious plots at that point, but today you're not helping anyone.

With the Bushies iron grip on our National Psyche and the National Hologram, I have long maintained and still maintained that they could run a ham sandwich against Jesus Christ and win by their usual 0.05-3%.

It would have been the same with Hillary, as it was the same with Gore and Kerry. The details and calumnies change slightly, but the overall template is remarkably similar.

And it works. Every time. Reality doesn't stand a chance.

Jesus Christ is soft on crime.

Jesus Christ is a flip-flopper who will say anything to win.

Jesus Christ is unprincipled.

Jesus Christ doesn't have experience.

Jesus Christ is a socialist.

Jesus Christ consorts with prostitutes.

Jesus Christ has been linked with the villain Judas Iscariot.

It'd be all over for that weak-on-terror hippie socialist Jesus before you could blink, and Bushie vote thefts could be kept small and restriucted to minority communities, where no one cares, apparently not even the communities themselves, or are intimidated into silence by the Bushie DOJ.

Again, the hows and nuts and bolts of the operation no longer really matter. What matter are the RESULTS.

That's what bothers me more than anything.

EVERY election is thisclose. That is not fucking normal and people keep overlooking this as though the media's claims that people are "split" and "divided" are actually true.

America has changed absolutely in the past 8 years and that change would be reflected in the vote--if the vote were real. But just as we are told that unemployment and inflation are 1/3 as bad as they actually are, we are told that people are still "divided." It's not posible.

I, too, have lost all hope in America's salvation. Obama isn't the answer. Sadly, there isn't an answer--at least one that will not result in serious consequences even loss of life or a long stay at Gitmo.

like they don't know it was stolen. It truly makes me feel sick, alone and helpless.

stolen more by media control and manipulation than by election fraud

not saying it's not occurring

but it's not even necessary

They decide who the candidates are, what stories are going to bring down a candidate and what trivial bullshit they will use to prop up another.
This point guard bullshit and the PTA are good examples of the propping up while using the lipstick on a pig to drag the other candidate down.

It is all bullshit and we are stuck with what the media wants us to eat.

but I do disagree about necessity. Fixed machines, phone banking, disenfranchisement, purging voter rolls have been happening with increased frequency since 2000 worked so well.

Just ask Greg.....http://www.gregpalast.com /



Obama Doesn't Sweat. He should.

by Greg Palast

Listen to the report on the Air America Radio's Thom Hartmann


In swing-state Colorado, the Republican Secretary of State conducted the biggest purge of voters in history, dumping a fifth of all registrations. Guess their color.

In swing-state Florida, the state is refusing to accept about 85,000 new registrations from voter drives – overwhelming Black voters.

In swing state New Mexico, HALF of the Democrats of Mora, a dirt poor and overwhelmingly Hispanic county, found their registrations disappeared this year, courtesy of a Republican voting contractor.

In swing states Ohio and Nevada, new federal law is knocking out tens of thousands of voters who lost their homes to foreclosure.

My investigations partner spoke directly to Barack Obama about it. (When your partner is Robert F. Kennedy Jr., candidates take your phone call.) The cool, cool Senator Obama told Kennedy he was “concerned” about the integrity of the vote in the Southwest in particular. (Show me more...)

KEEP WORKING KEEP WORKING KEEP WORKING. CONTACT CAMPAIGNS FOR SUGGESTIONS, PUT OUT SIGNS, VOLUNTEER, PRINT OFF FACTS AND HAND THEM OUT TO UNDECIDEDS, TAKE NOTES AT POLL PLACES IF YOU NOTICE ANYTHING STRANGE, DO WHAT YOU CAN. IF YOU SIT AND DO NOTHING, EVEN THOUGH WE KNOW THERE WILL BE HUGH OBSTACLES, THEN WE ARE LOSERS IN AN EVEN BIGGER WAY. KEEP WORKING!!!!!!!!!!! EVERY STEP, EVEN THE SMALLEST, IS SOMETHING.

I recognize what is going on... and it ain't pretty

So here is my question WHAT ARE YOU PREPARED TO DO WHEN THAT REALITY HITS YOU OVER THE HEAD?

Good....

There is a military saying that applies in this case

Prepare for the worst (yes they steal it), and plan for the best (we are full of it and Obama sweeps all fifty states... which is just a dream)

As to hope... it does not reside in one person... it resides in you

And if you are prepared you can better react and make that reality you hope for, actually happen

ed for spelling... I hate it when I do those stoopid mistakes

Good message. Don't cry gloom and doom without remedy.

DO SOMETHING

Added: http://electiondefensealliance.org/what_you_can_do_defe...

sounds fine to me.

The OP sees an aspect of reality, at least, but we should never mistake a small-t truth for the capitalized whole.

Yeah, Teh Man is trying to saddle us with fascists, but our voices far outnumber his, and I don't see the same inevitability as the OP does.

I think we're going to trump the corporations with the sheer weight of numbers, and buy ourselves more time, at least, for the descent into out-and-out fascism.

This is no pep talk, with or without quotations, and I am not the Tom Coughlin of DU. Nor would I want to be. I'm an Eagles fan. But I'm not the Andy Reid of DU, either.

I'm just a guy who is posting his observations. Do I wish I had better observations to post? You better believe it. But being a member of the Reality-Based Community means don't sugarcoat it.

I have always thought well of you, Scriptor, and I have and will always be on your side, on the side of DU.

But reality is what reality is. I am sorry that I could no longer contain myself and unleashed this rant. I agree, it's not good for morale, for those who are one the front lines. That is why I have been recently largely absent from DU, to preserve morale by keeping my observatiosn to myself. And I do apologize, but I could contain it no more.

Watching the same media dumbshow as 2000 and 2004 (and 2002 and 2006 and 2998 and 1996 and 1994 and 1992, for that matter...) now that it has advanced to the, what do screen writers call it, the pivot, the turn of the tide, the peak of the story arc, I can keep silent no longer and so, like Ginsburg in a prose sort of a way must HOWL.

I tried to apologize in advance, Scriptor. I tried to warn you not to read it if you though you would be affected.

But you read onward, anyway.

I couldn't turn away!

You're letting the idiots get to you. The idiots in the media and in the electorate.

I just subscribed to the Economist and they have a great quote on the inside cover:

First published in September 1843 to take part in "a severe contest between intelligence, which presses forward, and an unworthy, timid ignorance obstructing our progress."


Not sure if that quote was from 1843 too, but I think it's safe to say it's been a long "contest" with its fair share of gains and losses. We're smack in the middle of it right now, that's for sure.

We don't need to and should not sugarcoat the reality of our current struggle. But you mentioned the importance of language earlier, so I assume you're familiar with Lakoff. We can use positive language on DU and in campaigning that encourages our side, even while touching on many of the real threats that we face from Bush, Diebold, the media, etc etc.

Well, let me finish with my own pep talk: soon enough McCain will debate Obama and Biden will debate Palin. On the issues. On live TV. If that don't make you smile, I don't know what will.

in this degenerate time in this degenerate nation unable to sustain it's own liberty or national dignity and sanity, for that matter.

The idiots get to me? Not really, that would be like saying breathing oxygen gets to me. They are a part of the landscape, the environment. Their vileness pours from every media orifice, be it print, radio, TV or Internet.

It is the toxic soup of unreality in which we all swim, which filters through our mental "gills" 24/7 like a pernicious advertising jingle.

The idiots themselves...they merely are, almost like a force of nature. They have always been with us and they always will be. As are the sociopaths who repeatedly harness them throughout history for their own nefarious ends, power, "glory" and base thievery. They were when they were murdering and burning my people by the millions in the Middle Ages, they were when they were industrially killing us by the millions in Eastern Europe 60 years ago... they are now that my people are now the ones mudering and destroying the lives of tens of thousands, if not more, today in Gaza and the West Bank.

I shouldn't say anymore. Let us agree to disagree and let me say I hope I am wrong and you are right. In that event, I hope to see you here at DU the day after election, where I will be suitably penitent and ready to eat a nice big plate of crow.

Best plate of crow I WILL ever have et, as we all bask in the Obama victory! (I can still dream too, if I wish)

ON EDIT: Tell me if you can see what is badly wrong with this picture that is probably one of the most subtle and powerful propaganda/advertising/PR coups ever. It is so brilliant in the way it bypasses the conscious mind yet goes so powerfully and directly to the subconscious. This one picture, more accurately what it represents psychologically, changed more votes than all the hours of questions and answers combined, by the immutable axioms of psychology/PR/marketing/advertising. Go ahead and tell me if you can see what it is about the picture.

From the 3rd 2004 Debate:

not quite sure that I'm smart enough for this... but Bushie is hunched and leaning towards the people and Kerry is standing up tall and looking forceful but I don't see how that would make Bushie look more Presidential. Bush's light is on and Kerry's isn't (not supposed to talk when the light is off?). I don't know - i guess my subconcious gets it though. lol

Bush looks like a 270 lb. NFL lineman, a pretty scary dude. Broad in the chest as Michael Strahan, wide as Jon Runyan and twice as strong.

How better to play into the Bushie Marketing Meme, designed for subconscious "ingestion" and force-fed at every turn in 2004, that Bush was strong and Kerry a wimp?

Now a picture of the men in their normal proportions:



Bush is shorter and thinner than Kerry. He looks quite small and childlike, in reality, next to Kerry. But the Bushies neutralized it...and easily.

They did not do this during the first two debates, but as any psychologist, advertiser, marker, or PR person will tell you, that whatever is said/seen last is by far the post powerful thing in people's minds, sometimes by several orders of magnitudes.

And for two hours or more and all the clips shown thereafter and even today of 2004 Debate #4, the undeniable image broadcast to millions of subconsciouses in Bush as giant strong hulk and kerry and weak and skinny.

As usual, the Democrats were clueless. "Sure, you can try to fix the picture that way. Why would we mind?"

As always when talking about advertising and marketing strategies, it sounds stupid and almost nonsensical to verbalize it, but it's real and IT WORKS.

And if you don't think so, know this, that until Bush and soon McCain, EVERY US presdiential election ended with the taller man winning. Look it up.

So, there you have it. Bush a giant strong scary hulk who will protect us, Kerry and thin-chested shorter loser. And of the millions upon million who watched the debate and the tens of millions more who watched the clips the next day, how many noticed this?

I have never met anyone else, either in person or on-line, who noticed.

And as any advertiser, psychologist, marketer or PR person could tell you, it is literally ten to twenty times more effective to manipulate people, when they don't realize or even consider that they're being manipulated. This has been proven and re-proven in decades of scientific research.

Thus, I satnd by my statement that the Bushies enlarging his picture (and the Democrats letting them get away with it) for the entirety of that third debate may have been one of the most brilliant moves ever, in terms of deep-peneteration advertising and gestalt-based propaganda. I also stand by my statement that this one action gained Bush more votes than all the blither-blather of all 3 debates combined. More importantly, the votes gained were through people's subconscious', where conscious reason cannot touch. This, as any advertsier can tell, is the most effiient and effective way to sell someone, and almost guaranteed to keep them from being able to change their mind to something else, when it is lodged in the subconsciuous.

This was one of the literally hundreds of examples of the Bushies bending reality to their will, and doing it easily, through the delivery system of mass media saturation of our society.

because I thought he looked like a goof in that position. Most people knew that Kerry was taller but still fall for that kind of manipulation. unreal.

I'm sure they'll try it again with McSame because look at him compared to Obama! The differences in stature are great and Obama easily looks stronger than him.

Crack wise all you want. I already said it sounds foolish when talking about it.

Sadly, the fact that it sounds ridiculous to verbalize it does not lessen it's effectivess.

And yes, people are, in fact, easily manipulated, and tenfold so when they do not "screen" the manipulation with their conscious minds.

But it is quite clear you think that's all bullshit. So fine...we agree to disagree and that's the end of it.

If you are mildly interested in understanding what I am talking about, please read Vance Packard's "The Hidden Persuaders".

It was written some thirty years ago, but still is something of a primer for understanding the wild success of subconsciously-directed "deep penetration" advertising and the history and ethics (or lack their of) that lead to it's widespread acceptance as acceptbale, permissable methodology.

Or don't read it. Keep snickering, then...

that I was serious and not at all snickering or trying to be a smart ass. sorry.

I would also then doubly recommend Vance Packard's "The Hidden Persuaders" for more information on the topic.

http://www.amazon.com/Hidden-Persuaders-Vance-Packard/d...

I will definitely look into that one.

but it's what they perceived that mattered. It worked on a visceral or unconscious level that bypasses the intellect...just like everything else they do. I totally get the point tom_paine is making.

However, when I first looked at the pictures, I would have said they showed Bush in close-up and Kerry from further away, making him appear more aloof. Bush by contrast appeared more "up close and personal." I didn't perceive Bush as bigger because I already knew that Kerry is the bigger man.

horizontally or vertically.

It was actually easy becasuse there was a frame of reference, which was the little lightbox each man had on the podium in front of him.

By comparing the size of Kerry's podium lightbox to Bushler's, an experiment anyone can easily replicate using the splitscreen picture posted above, one finds that Bush was increased vertically only by roughly 105% but horizonatlly by at least 1105 and perhaps up to 125%, it's that wide.

Again, copy the picture to your photoshop program or paint program and check it yourself.

And no one noticed. No one. well maybe someone, isolated and far away, but certainly no one in the media.

Then by further levelling the top of Bushler's head not just even with kerry but slightly HIGHER than Kerry, Bush appeared to be a 6'7" 270 lb. muscleman.

Good PR.

And not a single person but for me noticed. You wanna talk about an Invasion of the Body Snatchers Moment? How'bout that one?

Huh? Do you mean in the room where you watched? Cause we discussed that here.

And the media noticed knew. They just know not to say anything about it.

Operation Mockingbird didn't 'end'... it just changed names.

I didn't see the thread(s) of which you speak, but it doesn't surprise me that DU caught it.

And how true is this And the media noticed knew. They just know not to say anything about it.

What I don't get, what I will NEVER GET is if that is the case, and I am almost certain it is, how come the KERRY CAMPAIGN DIDN'T NOTICE? DIDN'T STOP IT? OR AT THE VERY LEAST BRING IT TO THE PRESS" ATTENTION.

Either when the Bushies were doing it (and stop with a "Hey, you can't increase Bush's width 120% unless you increase Kerry's width!") or bring attention to the dirty trickery afterwards, so at least the manipulation wouldn't stay in it's most effective place, people's subconsciouses, which would be reminded that Bushler is not 6' 7" 270 lbs. and as big across the chest as John Runyan.

Whatever the answer turns out to be: complicity, sheer cluelessness, fear of blackmail, fear of anthrax, Bushie Moles, or whatever the dozen other possibilities, something is very VERY wrong here.

I mean of all the shit the Bushies could dispel easily, this trick exposed, is so obvious and reproducible by anyone with a Photoshop can measure the width extension, could not be "spun away" by the Bush Lie Machine.

Well, maybe not. They have done a remarkable job bending the perceptions of reality like fondue cheese these last eight years, but this would be a hard one, even for them, to shout down with the Bush Lie Machine. Not impossible, I suppose, not after what feats of Bushiganda we've seen these last eight years, but difficult.

But it doesn't surprise me that DUers were one of the realtive tiny handfuls of who caught on to that.

I have discussed this with probably 50 people, give or take, since 2004. You are the very first to have recognized it before I mentioned it to you. Most of the sheep, of course, don't believe it even after I tell them.

No way that could have happened and nobody heard about it.

We would have heard about it in the news.

Liberal Propaganda.

Etc.

And no party leaders will save us. No one can save us but US.

And precious few of us even seem to notice what's going on.

two in the photos.

There's a DU video clip of Brian Williams saying something to the effect of the "lipstick on a pig" story is ridiculous. And they feature a photo of Obama beside a photo of McAnus. Obama's image is smaller, McAnus is larger and dominates the frame.

IT NEVER FUCKING ENDS.

Thanks for awakening me to this trickery, tom_paine.

Reality is reflections of the past.

Reality -- put most simply -- is based on data that can be collected, processed, and cataloged.


Reality is NOT assuming the future.

Reality is most definitely not what you're putting forward in my opinion -- at least not wholly so.

First off, by and large I wholly agree with what you said, but for this caveat that I believe to be a key distinction:

(it also goes without saying that I could be wrong in my assessment, and realizing that would be a dmaned happy day)

But back to the key distinction. It has to do with totalitarianism/tyranny vs. democracy/liberty, basically, though strictly the Old USA was a Representative Democracy, a Constritutional Republic, a Democratic-Republic, it was in one way or another all three, it comes down to that dichotomy.

I never said my assumption of the future was reality, and if you'll go back and reread the Op I believe even there I thought Obama had a 50-1 shot to assume the throne, even considering the issues raised, so I did say unequivocally that I was 100% certain. 98% certain? Yes. 100%? No.

I merely point out that since changing my basic premise of thinking that our nation was free on 12/12/2000, suddenly, perhaps coincidentally, I became remarkably "prescient". Not with 100% accuracy, but with roughly 80% accuracy and that is way too high.

Somewhere in my DU journal is a partial list of some of the things I predicted months, even years in advance, once I began to see through the hologram, so to speak. There are also a couple I missed.

I am not speaking of pyschic nonsense or anything, just the base premise that totalitarianism, in whatever form it comes in, is predictable to people who know what to look for. Totalitarianism is predictable for the same reason Free Nations are perplexing, puzzling and surprising.

The minute I changed my base premise that America was a Free Nation, which IMHO it hasn't been since 12/12/2000, the Date Everything Changed, suddenly it was like being able to see the future.

As I said, it hasn't worked out 100% of the time, but it has worked an amazingly high amount of times. But it's just using observation and analysis to plot the future based on the past human reactions to similar situations.

Do I sound arrogant? My apologies, But I am beyond caring.

If I am wrong, I am wrong. I will joyously take my verbal flaming here at DU. Joyously because of my being wrong about something terrible coming like in Europe 1936..waiting in the calm before the storm.

But I am tired of tapdancing around the obvious, being Politically-Correct about it. Just calling it like I see it and not caring anymore.

Like how I was saying in 2001 (really, it's archived here at DU on numerous threads) that I was CERTAIN that Bushler, would leave office with us $10,000,000,000 in debt.

Here's how much debt we have at this second:

http://brillig.com/debt_clock /

So add that one to my tally of shit I was CERTAIN of and said so repeatedly every month since 2001, until it hs basically come to pass and can no longer be fobbed off as a prediction because IT'S HERE.

Think that's easy? Know anyone else who did that? I've done it more than a dozen times sine 12/12/2000.

If we lived in a Free Nation, I would wholly agree with your sentiment. Of course, if we still lived in a Free Nation, I wouldn't even be on DU, mostlikely.

But we do not live in a free nation, only the pale shadow of one, an Inverted Totalitarianism. And as such, that distinction I mentioned makes me feel ever more comfortable in being certain about thing...ESPECIALLY since predictability is woven into the very fabric of all totalitarianisms, included the newfangled Inverted Totalitarianism that rules American and Russian Subjects.

application of brute force to terrorize the citizenry?

Nothing like very publicly shooting a few troublemakers to get everyone else on the team.

It's just smart marketing. The Classical Totalitarian brand has been worn out in America. More appropriately it was discredited from Day One as being antithetical to our founding ideals.

The Bushies, I strongly suspect, have been dreaming of absolute rule of this nation since Prescott Bush and his boys tried to overthrow FDR and turn the USA facsist, then ally with the Nazis, with Prescott Bush as Ambassador to Nazi Germany?

Don' t believe me? Do please check it out and listen to those wacky conspiracy theorists at the BBC and Washington DC's National Archives, the records of the 1935 House Joint Committee on UnAmerican Activities.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/history/document/document_2...

Pretend you are the Bushies and you desire unchecked, unopposable power in a nation where the founding central myth is that it will NEVER bow to a king.

Like ol' Br'er Rabbit, you've got to find another way to get your way, by and by.

How to do that? Well, it's a long story. Luckily, people lots smarter than I have already sussed it out.

You are the citizen of a nation governed by that most recent advanced in totalitarian control, NEW and IMPROVED forthe 21ST CENTURY! Innovated by Bush and Putin, with a little help from the Chinese.

Welcome to Imperial Amerika, 2001-?, and...(drumroll)................ Inverted Totalitarianism.

http://www.truthdig.com/arts_culture/item/20080515_chal... /

Cool, huh?

without being called a baiter or some some equally juvenile name. WE ARE FUCKED.

Seeing this as though it were a sporting event is a big part of the problem.

just turned...

get impatient with me from time to time probably for the same reasons you are upset with the OP and would have posted the same as you. I don't know how to say this without sounding feeble or old but I am over twice your age and have been interested in politics since 1960 and active from 1968 forward. I guess I've just gotten to the point after all I've been involved in that I'm tired. There I said it. Just tired. I still have good energy levels but my head says maybe I ought to place this energy somewhere else where it might be more productive. Went to the funeral of a friend yesterday...he was 62. You know it just makes me think. I'll probably never totally turn off but I feel worn out from years of trying and not seeing our lives improving that much for all the effort and it's gotten worse during the last eight years....that's all. End of rant. And, thanks again for answering.

Obama has spoken about this very fact of American life many times. That was what his whole "bitter/guns/religion" comment had to do with. Check out the full context of those remarks, he was talking about people just like you, that have given up on politics, a little clumsily perhaps.

If Obama loses I will probably be forever demoralized with regards to politics. I recognize that this is our only chance to truly change things in Washington. McCain won't do a goddamn thing different from Bush. I don't know why more people can't see that.

As I said in another post on this thread, it will always be a struggle. Always. But it's one we got to fight. Our country simply won't survive another 4-8 years of conservative foreign and domestic policies.

This is an extremely bad time to be preaching "all is lost". We need fixes, not doom and gloom. We all know the difficulties, how about the solutions.

http://electiondefensealliance.org/what_you_can_do_defe...

don't think about from time to time. But you tell me what good was that post for anything? If that is what the poster believes, then so be it, I may think it too but I am not going to put it all out here. It is hard enough to stay upbeat when you get broadsided but you do find a way to stay upbeat and you can win against all odds if you have the initiative, desire and the willpower to stay in the fight.

Are the New England Patriots going to quit now that Brady is out for the season? No.

It is just the same with Obama, he knows the odds and he knows the media, the possibility of theft of the election, the courts; how they are all stacked, but we don't quit, sulk and say no chance. We fight the battles for ourselves, our children, our grandchildren and each other.

and vp pick provided ample evidence of what we, as a nation, have become. Not that there wasn't plenty of evidence before, but too many (for their own sanity) refuse to even consider the reality in this "reality based" party.

Obama said things were Urgent. Well, they are beyond urgent. Facing this and still resisting is the measure of one's mettle.

good work, Tom Paine.

and you made a good point too about the VP pick. People are excited about her because she's "one of them" - a hockey mom, a church goer, etc. It's all manufactured b.s. and the people who are now defending her knew nothing of her two weeks ago and STILL know close to nothing about her and definitely nothing of her policies. It's terrifying really.

"When the Bushies, probably through Randy Scheunemann, greenlighted Georgia for or perhaps ordered it to begin it's August 2008 "Bushie Bounce" invasion of Georgia"


Did you mean to say "invasion of Russia"?

Otherwise, great post.

But the editing period has expired.

Seems no matter how hard I go back over a long OP and how much shit I fix, there's always at least ONE THING I miss.

Thanks again.

There is nothing so dreadful as editing your own work. Either way, good post -- though I may not agree with it.

Have a beer on me...

The abortion issue is the primary issue that has the greatest affect on the outcome of the election. It is what put Bush in office the second time when he should have been defeated easily. Every issue, economy, jobs, Iraq, Iran, education, health care etc. will take a backseat to this issue. Throughout the nation, ten of thousands of evangelical and fundamentalists pastors are organizing their flock to cast their vote based on this one issue. Catholic bishops are denouncing Biden a lifelong Catholic for his unwillingness to back legislation banning abortion. Remember this that the outspoken fundamentalist were joined by the majority Catholics for the first time in the 2004 election to vote Republican.

Sorry, the Democrats sealed their own fate when they allowed the party to take a strong pro-choice stance that has been interpreted as being pro-abortion. It not only alienated the Republicans, but also many of their own party, especially Catholics. In fact, isn't true that the rank-and-file of the party allowed a rather radical element to dictate party policy. They should have taken the pro-prevention course of action supporting a positive policy of education and public awareness of the necessity of preventing un-wanted pregnancies that would have actually reduced the abortion rate. They should have exposed the Republicans for the hypocrites that they are with the statistics that reveal the fundamentalists and Catholics high rate of abortion and how they have opposed effective measures of comprehensive sex education that has fueled the abortion mills.

Abortion mills? That tells us everything we need to know about you right there. Troll much, Mr. 21 posts?

That is the message they send. Morons who are only concerned with the invisible man in the sky will never listen to that message. They're more concerned with the fetuses. If the whores that have them die along with the babies, all the better, right?

But I actually believe Obama can/will/must win this thing. I refuse to concede my country to the soft fascism of Bush/McCain. But you go right on ahead, if it makes you feel better.

Oh, and the Georgia/Ossetia thing? That was a HUGE blunder by the Bush administration. they were, in fact, trying to engineer a great moral victory for Georgia, of which McCain is a big and very vocal fan/ally, and they COMPLETELY underestimated Russia's likely reaction, causing the deaths of thousands of people. Another foreign policy cluster-fuck, brought to you by W, Condi and the Dickster.

They could give a shit if they burned the whole nation or the world down.

Sure, it hurt America, and if the Bushies were Americans, they'd probably be unhappy. But Bushies are NOT Americans. In fact, they are as unAmerican as you can actually get without hurting someone (and many Bushies are ready to do just that with just the tiniest of permissions from authority).

McBush needed a ratcheting of fear and tension to make the "election" close enough to rig without having to tip their hands by doing too much of it. He got it, and now the polls are tied, mysteriously beginning, not after Palin, but after the Ossetia Invasion and Russian response.

You see, you are keeping score...of the wrong game. In your scorecard, the Bushies are amazing, staggering failures, are their successes.

And I don't just mean a willful ignoring of reality, though the Bushies do plenty of that, I mean the destruction of New Orleans and the Black Diaspora was a MAJOR POLITICAL SUCCESS for the Bushies and will ensure their solid control of Louisiana for a long time.

I could go down the list of Bushie "failures" which are really Bushie Successes but our own minds are so staggered by the enormity and villainy of it that we refuse to believe our eyes and common sense.

The Georgia/Russian conflict may have been an American foreign policy failure, but it was an unqualified Bushie success, just like the handling of Katrina and Iraq.

And they don't care. For most people, Ossetia/Georgia is a complete non-issue. And I'd like to see your link that shows Obama's lead shrinking before the Republican election. That certainly didn't happen in any of the polls I was watching.

The only big revelation in the McCain post-convention bounce is that people are easily swayed by stuff they see on TV. There's a lot of time left before November, and lots of things can happen between now and then. The race is essentially tied, just as it's been since Obama nailed down the nomination. There are lots of places to pin the blame (racism, fear of change, American anti-intellectualism, rightwing media bias disguised as "fairness," on and on), and I'm aware that it's tougher than ever to elect a Democrat to the presidency, but that doesn't mean I'm ready to throw in the towel. And seriously, you shouldn't be, either.

That is the brilliance of the Bushies, at least in the areas of lies, deception, propaganda, and media control. It is the only area where they could be considered geniuses, aside from overall villainy, fraud and theft.

Also, I said in my OP I am NOT advocating throwing in the towel, and I will be out there voting for Obama in November.

But reality is reality. I see what I see and I will not close my eyes to it because I don't like it. That's what being a member of the Reality Based Comunity is, keeping one's eyes open to the truth, even when it is extremely painful, as this one is for me.

I very much hope I am wrong. If I am, I will show my face at DU day after election for the tastiest plate of crow I ever et! Never EVER in my life will I have been so happy to be wrong.

But I am not wrong. 50-1 odds, I would guess, so anything is still possible. Obama could still win, I just think that given the current degenerate state of nearly all facets of our nation, the oddsa re 50-1 against, no matter who pulls what levers. I also believe Obama has to win the cast voes by 60-40% to win the "counted" votes by 51-49%, so that, too, is a pretty tough hill to climb, and to start at the bottom of.

You can be the first person on November 5th to post on DU and say "I told you so".

care about the s. ossettia issue

georgia has a long and brutal history of abusing folks in those two provinces...ossettia nad abkazia

bush and his crew of 'advisors' had been in georgia for months, ostensibly trainning them to fight radical fundies

the reality was to push georgia and its corrupt prez (who's well represented by lobbyists close to mccain) to invade, knowing full well this would provoke russia

Russia was entirely within its rights....anyone with ANY knowledge of the region knows that

but the media and bush and cheney and mccain had their golden opportunity

and americans of all stripes were alarmed that the cold war was renewed

it was a huge coup for the rethugs....all carefully choreographed

but lord do they care that the COLD WAR is back on...

All them FEARS are back

Amen to that brother tom. Their audacity is their greatest asset. In choosing McSame's sidekick, they went with the most unqualified person they could find, just to prove they could do it. Sarah Palin isn't fit morally or experientially to run a dog pound, much less a country. Yet her nomination has pulled millions of votes into the McSame column. Those of us based in reality either laugh or cry at it. But the brainwashed masses eat it up, and the Bushies put another one in the win column.

but we really didn't expect them to just go away, did we? Ok, I kind of hoped they would take their loot and scurry back to their cracks. Let us fatten up for 10 years or so before they returned. But I guess they still have the military to liquidate. Lots of ready cash there still, even if it is sold to the lowest bidder terrorist state.

On the other hand, more people are aware now than before. While another election theft is the likeliest outcome it's not an absolute certainty. And who knows, maybe this time those that we've given our power to will fight back. And if they don't, maybe we'll take our power back. That has happened before, it could happen again.

And look on the bright side, if they are planning another election theft perhaps that means they'll leave American cities alone. For now. Perhaps.

At any rate, I am going to continue to choose to hope, since hope costs nothing. We'll know soon enough if I am a fool for it. I can handle another humiliation.

Save despair for better times.