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HELP! This man will soon die.

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Th1onein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-26-08 07:53 PM
Original message
HELP! This man will soon die.
As some of you may or may not know, I write to people on Death Row. Recently, I've been writing to Reginald Perkins, who is on Texas Death Row, and scheduled to die on January 22, 2009. Reginald is retarded, and was convicted on purely circumstantial (and not even good circumstantial)evidence. In fact, he is being convicted on the testimony of the person who probably committed the crime, himself. This is a travesty of justice.

Please, please sign the petition at the link below, asking the governor of Texas to spare Reginald Perkin's life:

http://www.petitiononline.com/rwp2904/petition.html
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Kerrytravelers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-26-08 08:03 PM
Response to Original message
1. Done. I am fully against the DP.
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bicentennial_baby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-26-08 08:05 PM
Response to Original message
2. Done
Thank you.
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itsrobert Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-26-08 08:08 PM
Response to Original message
3. Sorry, but
I find it hard to believe that a person that was a truck driver and a plumber is partially retarded.

http://www.tdcj.state.tx.us/stat/perkinsreginald.htm

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Th1onein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-26-08 08:23 PM
Response to Reply #3
7. You can't believe everything you read, dear.
Reginald was working with his relatives, and helping them out and they were paying him a little bit here and there. He was NOT a plumber, but he helped a plumber and they TOLD him he was a plumber, so he told the TDCJ he was a plumber. Same thing with the truck driving.

This poor man is just pitiful. I've written to a lot of death row prisoners, and I've yet to see one that protests his innocence to me. They just don't do it. They don't talk about their cases. They try to get them overturned via a technicality, because they know that the evidence is against them.

This has not been the case with Reginald. From the beginning, he has railed against the injustice, and proclaimed his innocence. The evidence against him is about as substantial as a mist. He was convicted on the testimony of the man who actually committed the crime. However, he is a poor, ignorant, stupid black man; not even smart enough to contribute to his own defense.

It is shameful what the State of Texas is going to do to this man.
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Kire Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-26-08 10:22 PM
Response to Reply #7
19. May I ask for more information?
Edited on Tue Aug-26-08 10:40 PM by Kire
I'm not seeing a big picture here.

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anitar1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 03:26 PM
Response to Reply #19
123. You can google "The Innocence Project" and probably
get info about him there. It is a very good site.
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midnight Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-26-08 09:19 PM
Response to Reply #3
15. It has been thought that the best drivers are not those that are
academically strong. The theory goes that those who are less mentally gifted are better because they are solely focused on the task. Case in point, the character known as Forrest Gump. He was good at cleaning his gun, and doing it faster than those in his regiment. But Forrest Gumps I.Q. was considered to low for him to go to school. That is until his mother took things into her own hands.
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Hugabear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 01:08 AM
Response to Reply #3
31. What is your level of expertise in abnormal psychology?
Is your opinion based on layman knowledge, or do you have extensive knowledge in this field?

You do realize that just because someone is partially retarded, doesn't mean they sit in a corner all day drooling on themselves, and that not all mentally disabled workers are Walmart door greeters? I'm sure you'd find that there are quite a few partially retarded people out there who are able to function in "normal" jobs.
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Duer 157099 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 03:03 AM
Response to Reply #31
39. Heck, some even manage to become President! n/t
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arthritisR_US Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 01:28 AM
Response to Reply #3
33. then you'll be floored to know that an idiot savant can compose a symphony...
your ignorance is showing.
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wildbilln864 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-26-08 08:11 PM
Response to Original message
4. done!
and good luck. :hi:
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itsrobert Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-26-08 08:16 PM
Response to Original message
5. I don't know much about the man
But what about the reports he has prior rape and attempted rape convictions. And he was a suspect in a couple killing in Cleveland in the 1980's?

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Th1onein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-26-08 08:28 PM
Response to Reply #5
9. What about them?
Do you believe everything that the powers that be tell you? Reggie is not very smart. Believe me, he's not smart enough to escape conviction, or to hide his tracks, if he did the crimes. The evidence was simply not there for them to build a case against him and it is highly unlikely he committed any crime, except the rape. And, I don't know enough about that to even go into it.

But rape is not murder. He was convicted for the murder of his stepmother. He and another guy, who is a crack addict, were supposed to have killed her with a telephone cord and taken her checks and gone around town and cashed them. But, the only person on camera cashing the checks was the crack addict, and no fingerprints, no hair, no anything, of Reggie's was even found in the car. He was convicted on the testimony of the crack addict.

And the crack addict was never charged with anything.
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Leftist Agitator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 09:40 AM
Response to Reply #9
50. How do you know these things?
Newspaper articles?

Trial transcripts?

Is your favorite rapist/murderer telling you these things?

Please elaborate.
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Th1onein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 11:48 PM
Response to Reply #50
71. I know them from news reports and his family.
And, by the way, don't couch your questions in terms like "your favorite rapist/murderer" if you expect to be taken seriously, as someone other than an asshole.
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JeanGrey Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-26-08 08:30 PM
Response to Reply #5
10. He had a prior LIFE sentence for rape and got paroled,
and it looks like somebody got killed. Same old story.
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Th1onein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-26-08 11:17 PM
Response to Reply #10
24. And he stayed out of prison for EIGHT years after that.
n/t
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JeanGrey Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 12:36 PM
Response to Reply #24
65. so what?
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tammywammy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-26-08 08:38 PM
Response to Reply #5
11. Here's a link with some of the back story in it
http://cbs11tv.com/local/death.penalty.appeal.2.734101....

"At the punishment phase of his trial, jurors heard testimony that he pleaded guilty to rape and attempted rape of two 12-year-old girls in 1982 and that he had been implicated in the strangulation of two women. One of them was the mother of the girl he raped. The other was the sister of his ex-wife."
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newfie11 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 10:02 AM
Response to Reply #11
57. I say enough let them execute him
Who wants their daughter to be the next one he may encounter.
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muffin1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-26-08 08:17 PM
Response to Original message
6. Done!
Again with Texas????? We must abolish the death penalty!
Thank you for posting, Th1onein.
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midnight Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-26-08 08:27 PM
Response to Original message
8. signed and kicked so that many others can sign this.
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pleah Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-26-08 09:15 PM
Response to Original message
12. Done.
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redwitch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-26-08 09:17 PM
Response to Original message
13. done.
bless you for your kindness, this is a very sad case.
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Lisa0825 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-26-08 09:19 PM
Response to Original message
14. K&R
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Naturyl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-26-08 09:21 PM
Response to Original message
16. No can do.
Edited on Tue Aug-26-08 09:22 PM by Naturyl
"At the punishment phase of his trial, jurors heard testimony that he pleaded guilty to rape and attempted rape of two 12-year-old girls in 1982 and that he had been implicated in the strangulation of two women. One of them was the mother of the girl he raped. The other was the sister of his ex-wife."

And "don't believe everything you read" cuts both ways.
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Th1onein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-26-08 11:07 PM
Response to Reply #16
20. Why do you bother to post here then?
Are you trying to hijack the thread?

You should know that, even in Bush America, people still are innocent until proven guilty. You can be "implicated" in anything, including murder, without being guilty.

I am very sure, given Reginald's mental capacity, they would have railroaded him if they could have, on the other crimes. I am sure that they weren't able to because the evidence simply wasn't there. BUT, they are not constrained when it comes to bringing in this information, true or false, when it comes to the penalty phase of a trial. You ought to know that, too, instead of believing, without evidence.
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Leftist Agitator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 09:45 AM
Response to Reply #20
51. "...people still are innocent until proven guilty."
He WAS "proven guilty".

Why are you defending this scumbag again?

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Th1onein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 11:50 PM
Response to Reply #51
72. I think that there is enough evidence to show that he was innocent
of this crime, or at the very least, not enough evidence to convict him of it. Even so, I don't believe in the death penalty.

Hey...you wanna get off of the thread? This is not for someone who is pro death penalty. I thought that was pretty obvious from the beginning.
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sicksicksick_N_tired Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-26-08 09:38 PM
Response to Original message
17. This individual was too sick to be released via Reagan's mental health abandonment.
Sick minds should be hospitalized as are sick bodies.

Of course,...neither receive the care NEEDED,...SOOOOO,...we end up with sick minds and bodies in our society.

I'd sign your petition but ask whether this man wants to live or die. I consider myself healthy in mind and body. I'd WANT to die for committing such aweful atrocities. But, I am neither this man nor GWB or any of the neocons intentionally planning MASS MURDER for a cause they KNEW WAS REPUGNANT TO AMERICANS, healthy in mind and body,...and spirit.
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Th1onein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-26-08 11:16 PM
Response to Reply #17
23. Of course, he wants to live.
I am against the death penalty. Whether guilty or innocent, I am against the death penalty.

This man, though? I have a horrible feeling that he is innocent of the crime that he is condemned to death for. If what I have been able to ferret out from the news reports, and from his sister (who is sorely lacking in education and ability to convey the facts of this case), is true, then Texas is going to execute an innocent man on Jan. 22, 2008. At the very least, there is not enough evidence against this man to put him to death. This is a clear case of the poor, black, and ignorant not being able to use our justice system in an equitable manner.

From the very first letter, this man has proclaimed his innocence to me. NOT because he wanted me to do anything for him (and in fact, he asked me NOT to write any letters or publicize his case, because his attorney told him that that would speed up his journey towards execution), but because he was ANGRY at the injustice.

Something is dreadfully wrong with this case.

And his attorney won't even file with the Supreme Court, because he says it won't do any good.

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cigsandcoffee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 11:59 AM
Response to Reply #23
62. His attorney did file with the Supreme Court.
http://cbs11tv.com/local/death.penalty.appeal.2.734101....


Supreme Court Turns Down 2 Fort Worth Killers
WASHINGTON (AP) ― A convicted rapist paroled from Ohio and then condemned for the robbery and strangulation of his 64-year-old stepmother in Texas lost an appeal Tuesday before the U.S. Supreme Court, moving him closer to execution.

...


Where are you getting your info?
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kaygore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-26-08 09:50 PM
Response to Original message
18. Done
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karlschneider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-26-08 11:09 PM
Response to Original message
21. retarded? Isn't that a verboten descriptive here?
Just wondering...
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DS1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 09:05 AM
Response to Reply #21
47. he can be retarded, but not a retard
I think

however, the latest iteration is 'developmentally delayed', which is ridiculous because nobody 'delayed' is going to catch up
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GreenPartyVoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-26-08 11:12 PM
Response to Original message
22. Done. I am against the DP. I hope this man can find some justice
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1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-26-08 11:24 PM
Response to Reply #22
25. me too. because he rapes, gets paroled. rapes again, gets paroled....
i too hope this man can find some justice.

and i hope you never run into him somewhere...

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GreenPartyVoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-26-08 11:31 PM
Response to Reply #25
26. If he truly deserves to be in there, then he should stay in there. I am not against
imprisoning people. Far from it. But I do think, given the way our justice system can be so messed up that there are many times when cases need to be reviewed to make certain the correct decision was made.
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1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-26-08 11:40 PM
Response to Reply #26
27. "given the way our justice system can be so messed up"
i agree. and this case is exactly how the "justice system can be so messed up" in the exact opposite way of what you mean.

if you actually look into the facts of "this" case... multiple rapes... multiple paroles... multiple murders...

i got no feeling for this guy.

spare me....



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GreenPartyVoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-26-08 11:43 PM
Response to Reply #27
29. I'm not just talking about _this_ case. I am talking in general. Cases
where evidence get suppressed or thrown out on a technicality and then all that is left to show the jury leads them to the wrong conclusion. That sort of thing.

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1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 12:54 AM
Response to Reply #29
30. again, for you...
i hope you never run into him somewhere...
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GreenPartyVoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 12:27 PM
Response to Reply #30
64. Again, for you, I hope you learn the meaning of "justice." It means getting
what you truly deserve, not getting out whether you deserve it or not, which is how you seem to have taken my original statement in this thread.

Sorry if you misunderstood. I can see how my post might have been taken they way you took it. Thought my further posts clarified things, but I guess not. :shrug:
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closeupready Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 09:50 AM
Response to Reply #27
52. Do you "got a feeling" for life, as a concept? Or is life cheap, in your world?
n/t
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Th1onein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 11:55 PM
Response to Reply #27
75. No, spare US, CasualWatcher. This is a thread about a petition.
It is NOT a forum for debating the pros and cons of the death penalty. I ask you, once again, cease and desist or get off of the thread. We are not interested in your views about the death penalty.
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Th1onein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 11:53 PM
Response to Reply #25
73. It's so stupid to jump to conclusions like you are doing.
And, truly, you insult our intelligence when you expect to receive any credence here, with your argument. Essentially, what you are saying is that if this man is not put to death, then he automatically goes out into the streets again. You know that's bullshit.
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Stern21 Donating Member (331 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-26-08 11:42 PM
Response to Original message
28. Thank you for your work in helping the helpless.
Like others in this thread, I am against the death penalty.

We are humans and prone to err. On both sides of the law. Once a person falls into the prison system, they are essentially helpless. Many will disagree with that statement, but for the most part it is true. I have signed the petition and it has nearly 4K signatures at the moment.

I hope it helps.
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Greyhound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 01:19 AM
Response to Original message
32. Done. The death penalty is simply wrong and must be abolished. n/t
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Norwood Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 01:35 AM
Response to Original message
34. I'm sorry, but no
A Tarrant County jury took just 30 minutes in 2002 to decide Reginald Perkins should be put to death. Shortly after the jury's verdict was read in court, Perkins proclaimed his innocence in a written letter read by his lawyer.

In November, a federal appeals court rejected claims he was mentally retarded and ineligible for the death penatly, that his legal help earlier had been ineffective, that the Texas sentencing statute was unconstitutional and that he was innocent of the murder. It's that appeal the Supreme Court refused to review Tuesday.

Evidence at his trial showed he pawned his stepmother's wedding ring and wrote fraudulent checks from the account of the family trucking business in Fort Worth. When Gertie Perkins showed up missing, police summoned to her home found a carpet removed, a phone cord disconnected and sheets missing from a bed.


http://www.tdcaa.com/node/2658

The fact that he pawned the wedding ring and wrote fraudulent checks shows that he has to have a basic understanding of right and wrong. A person that doesn't know would probably not have the mental capacity to do this. I gotta side with the court on this one.

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Th1onein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 08:04 AM
Response to Reply #34
42. Then post on another thread, not this one.
This thread was not started so that you could voice your opinions on this man's guilt or innocence. It was started so that people would go to the site and sign the petition.

We are against the death penalty. You, apparently, are not. Go start a thread about that and get the hell off of this one.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 09:56 AM
Response to Reply #42
54. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
High Plains Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 11:36 AM
Response to Reply #54
60. Actually, I think you'd probably be more at home at the link you gave.
Support for the death penalty, especially in questionable cases, is not a big progressive thing.

It is quite popular at the site you mentioned, though. Have fun with your buddies over there.
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Norwood Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 05:38 PM
Response to Reply #42
69. I'll post wherever the fuck I want thanks
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Th1onein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-28-08 05:46 PM
Response to Reply #69
95. Oh, I'm sure you will, Socordsx! Most rude people do those kinds of things.
Most trolls do, too.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-28-08 06:15 PM
Response to Reply #95
98. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Th1onein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 01:19 AM
Response to Reply #98
101. Haha! No, look in the mirror, karlschneider...
A troll is someone who tries to hijack a thread asking for people to sign a petition, by starting a fight about the issue. A troll is someone who comes on a thread and spouts right wing propaganda, stages ad hominem attacks, and throws out red herrings. Sound like something you do often?

If the shoe fits, wear it, karlschneider.
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LanternWaste Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 10:14 AM
Response to Reply #98
119. I think it's usually...
I think it's usually a person who consciously posts inappropriate and contrarian responses in threads simply to voice an opinion which is (at best) merely tangential or more often than not, winds up hijacking the thread.

I would hazard that if a person posts a thread calling for good thoughts about a cancer victim, and some random yahoo begins posting that current cancer treatments are evil works of a capitalistic society (a scenario which indeed occurred here some years back), yeah... it's pretty valid call to label them as a disruptor.
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Norwood Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 01:44 AM
Response to Reply #95
107. You opened yourself up to debate and discussion when you decided to post this
You've been here long enough to know that there are a lot of pro-death penalty believers on DU. If you were expecting not to be challenged or disagreed with then you're incredibly naive. By the way those who don't agree with you, aren't always trolls. I love it how so many people on here think that if someone doesn't agree with them 100% and fall in line, "Oh well they have to be a troll or a Republican". Crawl off that cross, you're not better than anyone.

By the way, he's guilty as hell and will be rightfully punished for his crime. By all means all that don't agree with the death penalty, sign the petition and let your voice be heard. I respect your view, I just don't agree with it. But don't try and pretend that you're better than those of us that believe his punishment fits the crime.

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Th1onein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 02:10 AM
Response to Reply #107
114. Yeah, you know all about it, don't you? Must be nice to be God.
I asked people to sign a petition. I didn't ask for your right wing opinions, although it's pretty obvious you can't help but spout them.

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Norwood Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 02:49 AM
Response to Reply #114
115. Really? Thats all you got?
So now I'm god? (Really I'm honored you think so highly of me but that's a bit much)
and a right winger. (Because I happen to believe the same thing that probably 30% of all DU folks do)
This is funny, I'm sleepy but I'm curious where you're gonna go next. Maybe you'll accuse me of being the Easter bunny. In any case it'll probably be more "OMG you're a right winger" or "OMG you're a troll". Its almost like debating a hard right winger, name calling and no real debate.

You accused me of hijacking the thread, when I simply stated my opinion with some perfectly reasonable facts to support it. You totally blew it out of proportion because you just can't stand that people can possibly disagree with you. Its hilarious, you actually hijacked your own thread by starting this argument with me. I would have been perfectly happy just having my one post.

I know I'm in the minority on this site when it comes to the death penalty and gun control, I'm with you all on every other issue. I respect the anti death penalty crowd and their views, I just don't agree and we're not gonna convince each other otherwise. In an effort to get this part of the thread back on track, here's the original link:

http://www.petitiononline.com/rwp2904/petition.html

If you think the death penalty is wrong, by all means go sign this.
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Th1onein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 02:47 PM
Response to Reply #115
120. It says something about you to jump to the conclusion that I think that you are God.
Geez.

Look, Socordsx, there are things that progressives are going to disagree on. That is very true. For instance, I'm against gun control, myself, and I'm also against abortion. But when someone posts something asking for action to be taken, it doesn't help to have someone else post arguments against doing that very thing. In fact, it's quite rude.

You even went so far as to post this: "The fact that he pawned the wedding ring and wrote fraudulent checks shows that he has to have a basic understanding of right and wrong. A person that doesn't know would probably not have the mental capacity to do this. I gotta side with the court on this one."

The statement that you made above, as "fact," is not a "fact" in this case. This is how shit gets all muddied up. Sometimes it's best to just be quiet until you have all of the facts ferreted out. OR, as I asked you to do in the first place, start your OWN thread about the topic and leave this one alone, with your "facts" and your opinions.

All of that said, thank you for reposting the petition URL.
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Norwood Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 03:15 PM
Response to Reply #120
121. Come on you know I was being snarky with the god thing
In any case our discussion appears to be coming to a close, cooler heads seem to be prevailing. I'll just say this in closing. I had no intention of hijacking your thread at all. Its a discussion forum and the death penalty issue is a hot button one on DU. I checked the petition you posted and did a little research and I just wasn't convinced. There were others on this thread who, like me, also disagreed so I figured I would toss in my 2 cents and a news snippet as to why I thought that way. The article I posted from stated:

"Evidence at his trial showed he pawned his stepmother's wedding ring and wrote fraudulent checks from the account of the family trucking business in Fort Worth."

Evidence from the trial, not a newspaper opinion, so I see some truth in that. That's the best you can do unless you were there at the trial. Not every person on death row is guilty, but at the same time they aren't all innocent either. I found what I considered some proof that he knew what he was doing was wrong and was mentally capable. If I researched the guy and was convinced, "Yeah there might be some reasonable doubt with this guy" I probably would have signed.

My point being, if you are pro death penalty don't just sign a petition because someone asks you to. Do some research, come to your own conclusion and decide whether to sign or not. But if you're already anti-death penalty in all cases, then hit that website and sign that petition.

http://www.tdcaa.com/node/2658

Good luck with the petition, perhaps we'll be on the same side in a gun control thread at some point.
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ConsAreLiars Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 01:44 AM
Response to Original message
35. Done. A country that uses the death penalty, and those who approve it, are
Edited on Wed Aug-27-08 01:45 AM by ConsAreLiars
totally happy with murdering 60+ children in Afghanistan. Sick monsters. The death penalty is always as wrong as mass murder of children, and supported by those who are apologists for both.

Sick. Fucking. Monsters. All of them.

(edit trivial typo)
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Marr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 01:49 AM
Response to Original message
36. You know, being against the death penalty is one thing.
Edited on Wed Aug-27-08 01:51 AM by Marr
I'm against the death penalty. But believing every convict's claims of innocence is quite another. I've been around my share of life long, in-and-out of prison types and let me tell you-- the number one crime in America is First-Degree "Didn't Do Nothin'". They've always got an excuse. It's *never* their fault-- even when they're caught in the act, it's the fault of friends, or family, or a mental condition, or... whatever.
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Th1onein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 08:03 AM
Response to Reply #36
41. You don't have to know if he's innocent or guilty.
to be against the death penalty.

There is enough of a lack of real evidence in this case that this guy should at least get a new trial. And, no, he didn't pawn his stepmother's wedding ring or cash her checks. Or, at least, they have no evidence that he did so. Instead, it was his crack addict "friend" who testified against him that was seen pawning the ring, and cashing the checks. This guy provided "evidence" against Reginald. There was no other physical evidence to corroborate these charges.

And the crack addict is free, roaming the streets. He was never charged with anything.

Something is wrong with this picture.

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Dammit Ann Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 02:40 AM
Response to Original message
37. done. god help him.
i hate the death penalty. what a crock of shit.
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Norrin Radd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 02:44 AM
Response to Original message
38. done
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Kitty Herder Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 03:51 AM
Response to Original message
40. Signed it. I don't have to know whether a person is guilty or innocent to know that
Edited on Wed Aug-27-08 03:52 AM by Herdin_Cats
the death penalty is wrong. And Texas abuses the hell out of it.
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Freddie Stubbs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 08:40 AM
Response to Original message
43. If he actually is mentally retarded, this case should be a legal slam dunk
The Supreme Court barred the execution of mentally retarded individuals in 2002. Why hasn't his attorney raised this point? Or have then been unable to convince the court that he is retarded?

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Th1onein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-28-08 12:06 AM
Response to Reply #43
78. Nope. His IQ is 72 and they changed the level at which one is
considered retarded in 1983 (I think that's the correct date, not sure.) Actually, his IQ was barely 70 on one test, but he took it again and scored two more points, so he qualified to be put to death.
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Freddie Stubbs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-28-08 01:02 PM
Response to Reply #78
94. It he is not developmentally disabled (the preferred term for mental retardation),
Edited on Thu Aug-28-08 01:02 PM by Freddie Stubbs
then this should not be a reason not to execute him.

His guilt or innocence should be the determining factor.
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cobalt1999 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 08:51 AM
Response to Original message
44. He raped 12 year old girls.
Sorry, he can die tomorrow for all I care.
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BlooInBloo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 08:55 AM
Response to Reply #44
45. The State can kill you just as easily.
Edited on Wed Aug-27-08 08:55 AM by BlooInBloo
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cobalt1999 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 09:18 AM
Response to Reply #45
48. If I rape 12 year olds, they should.
Edited on Wed Aug-27-08 09:19 AM by cobalt1999
The guy is scum.
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Greyhound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-28-08 12:12 AM
Response to Reply #44
79. Will those girls be un-raped when he dies?
Isn't this just our society's way of abdicating the responsibility for allowing this to happen?



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cobalt1999 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-28-08 12:44 AM
Response to Reply #79
83. Will those girls be un-raped if he spends his life in prison?
I guess we should let him roam the streets because anything we do will not "un-raped" the girls.

What a stupid argument.

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Greyhound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-28-08 12:56 AM
Response to Reply #83
84. Of course not, you're being entirely disingenuous, thanks for contributing to the problem.
The point is that killing him makes no positive difference to his victims yet it perpetuates a fundamentally unjust practice. There are reasons that, until the Raygun dementia became prevalent in this country, we did not hold the mentally challenged to the same standard as others.

This is behavior worthy of shrub, how often have we shamed him for his antics regarding this issue, and you're on his side?



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cobalt1999 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-28-08 01:01 AM
Response to Reply #84
85. Hey, it was your argument.
If it was a totally stupid point, well that's your issue.

Nothing will bring the victim back, so why even use that as a argument?

As for your "unjust practice", that depends on the definition. What's the appropriate justice in this case? For me and most people, the DP is appropriate justice. Your definition is obviously different.
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Greyhound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-28-08 01:09 AM
Response to Reply #85
86. So, you will continue to avoid the issue and persist in your silly ad hominem attacks?
You attempt to propose that there is nothing between killing a person and letting them roam the streets, ostensibly preying on innocent people, and you declare my point stupid.

Here's your sign...



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cobalt1999 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-28-08 01:15 AM
Response to Reply #86
87. You are upset because you made a dumb argument?
That's on you.

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Greyhound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-28-08 01:20 AM
Response to Reply #87
88. I'm not upset at all, you are the person that seems to think that killing a person
Edited on Thu Aug-28-08 01:21 AM by greyhound1966
will solve something. I am completely accepting of the limitations of others, as well as my own. Someday you may catch on.

BTW, you still have not addressed or answered any of the points.

Good night.

ETA: I'm sorry, I just noticed you live in FL, never mind.



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cobalt1999 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-28-08 01:23 AM
Response to Reply #88
89. You haven't made any points to address
Only stupid arguments that don't hold up. What points are you wanting addressed that also don't apply to life in prison? DP won't bring anyone back, nor will life in prison. Both are punishments for an act committed.

You've made no logical points, so you are a waste of time.

Good night.
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Th1onein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-28-08 09:31 AM
Response to Reply #88
92. The hate just SEEPS out of them, sometimes, doesn't it?
It's always boiling there, right underneath of the surface of some of these right wingers, but you can always tell who and what they are, eventually, can't you? The toasts to the death of others, the ad hominem attacks, the lack of logic, the inability to admit when they're wrong, the self-righteousness....

They just can't help themselves; they always show their true colors, eventually, don't they?
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Greyhound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-28-08 11:56 AM
Response to Reply #92
93. And congregate in certain areas.
I particularly like the part where he claims that his pathology is the same as "most People", completely ignoring the fact that the overwhelming majority all over the planet are diametrically opposed to his "belief".

To his credit he, at least, didn't say that because I don't want the state to kill people I'm in favor of rape and murder.


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Zavulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-28-08 06:11 PM
Response to Reply #92
97. Nice formula.
If someone doesn't agree with you, then he or she is a "hater" and a right-winger. What a complete pantload. I especially liked your "the inability to admit when they're wrong," as if the only correct side is the one you take.

You know, I admire you for your dedication for what you're doing, but I'm on Cobalt's side when he says that if a guy rapes a 12 year-old, he deserves to die.

So accuse me of "hate" if you want, because yes, I hate rapists. Murderers, too. For that matter, I hate people who sell drugs to kids and people who steal from others.

If you want to take the next step in the playbook and accuse me of being a right-winger, you'd be wrong with tense - you'd be using present instead of past. I did in fact vote for Reagan in 1984, but have voted straight-ticket Democrat since 1992. Still, I have no problem with the death penalty in certain cases. As such, I must be a right-winger, correct?

By the way, since the guy you're trying to save is black, you forgot to call Cobalt a racist. Otherwise, your use of the "hating all hating hateful haters" playbook was impressive. If someone doesn't agree with you, just use the word "hate!"

Thank you for your cliche-filled post. In a way, it was actually fascinating and quite educational. The next time anyone disagrees with me on DU, I'll just accuse them of hate and of being a right-winger. Flawless, right?

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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-28-08 06:18 PM
Response to Reply #97
99. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Zavulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-28-08 06:23 PM
Response to Reply #99
100. Oh, that's right!
I'm a troll, too! As are you, if you aren't full of sympathy for rapists of 12 year-olds.

Thanks for pointing that out :rofl:
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Th1onein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 01:34 AM
Response to Reply #97
104. I hate rapists, too. But not so much that I become a murderer, myself.
When you spout right wing bullshit, it's a pretty good bet you're a right winger.

Surely you know that we have such a tilted and corrupt justice system that we can't depend on it to tell us anything about what really happened in any criminal case, especially when the accused is black and/or poor. We've got prosecutors who are fighting the testing of DNA evidence in death penalty cases, so that their tally for winning cases is kept intact. Several years ago, a Republican governor saw so much of a problem with the justice system in his state that he commuted all of the sentences of those on death row to life in prison. Something is dreadfully wrong with our system of justice in this country, and yet you continue to support the death penalty, which only serves to exacerbate that injustice.

And here, you support not only the death penalty, but the death penalty for RAPE? That's a right wing thing, friend. I'm just calling it as I see it.

But, look....why don't you just be polite and start your OWN THREAD about your opinions on these issues? This thread is one asking for people to sign a petition to save a man's life, not for the purpose of airing your pro death penalty opinions.
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Zavulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-28-08 05:59 PM
Response to Reply #79
96. This is the most bizarre argument I've ever heard.
Edited on Thu Aug-28-08 06:02 PM by Zavulon
Will the girls be "un-raped" by forcing taxpayers to feed and house him for decades? For that matter, why punish any rapist at all if the punishment won't "un-rape" the victims?

Holy shit. Every time I think I've seen it all, I see a post like yours.

Let me guess - he should be freed, right? After all, no punishment will "un-rape" a victim. :rofl:

On edit, I noticed that Cobalt already hit you for what he correctly refers to as your "stupid argument." Had I noticed, I'd have just kept snickering at your point instead of responding to it. By the way, you DID look upset for having made a dumb argument.
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Th1onein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 02:00 AM
Response to Reply #96
110. It is a more logical argument than any you've got.
It costs more money to put a man to death than it does to feed and house him for the rest of his life, in a prison. Did you know that? Apparently not.

I'm not saying that he should be freed. But, of course, as usual, you add two and two and get seven.

I'm saying that we have the means and the ability, and it costs a lot less, to keep him imprisoned for the rest of his life, than it does to kill him. Just in monetary terms, we are coming out ahead, to say nothing of what the death penalty does to us, in social terms.

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Zavulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 05:28 PM
Response to Reply #110
126. "As usual..."
To the best of my knowledge we've never spoken before, but you've already got my habits down. Impressive. Also, you seem certain you knew what I did and did not know about the economics of prisons even before I get to respond. No wonder you're right and everyone else is wrong.

Your economics lesson is irrelevant, and not even correct, but let's assume for a moment it is since cost seems to be such a major issue for you. Just in monetary terms, we should refuse to imprison rapists at all. Eventually, someone will get pissed off enough to shoot one, and if he or she pleads temporary insanity and gets off we won't have to spend any prison system money on the rapist at all! That bit of insanity, by the way, strikes me as logical as anything you've got, but I'm going to refrain from mocking your economic lectures and tendency to place such a high emphasis on cost, and also from using laughably stupid lines like "But, of course, as usual, you add two and two and get seven."

By the way, just who are you to tell us what the death penalty does to us in social terms? The death penalty seems to do pretty well in polls, so is it fair to assume that you simply think anyone who's for it is a subhuman cretin? Please, PLEASE assume the role of all-knowing authority and tell us exactly what the death penalty does to us in social terms - oh, and be your usual snide and insulting self.

I had a lot more admiration for you and what you are doing before your laughable post. By the way, I used to be against the death penalty, and it was punchless arguments like yours that made me change my mind. After all, if that's the best YOU'VE got...

Despite your convincing and thorough "It costs more money to put a man to death than it does to feed and house him for the rest of his life, in a prison. Did you know that? Apparently not.", the effectiveness of which still has me reeling :rofl: , there is no one-size-fits-all answer on death penalty costs. Different states have different procedures, and different people have different lifespans.

When looking up some of the economics of the death penalty, since I had good reason to suspect your attempt at a one-line piece of "proof" with no backup, I discovered that whichever side you want to support, there's a paper out there for you. Anti-death penalty organizations have done their own analysis, as have pro-death penalty types. Both skew the answer towards the position they prefer, as you have. You could produce a set of numbers to back up your side, I could respond with numbers to the opposite, and it could go on for a while if either of us cared to do it. Since I don't, I'll simply post a link to the most convincing argument I've seen regarding your economics lesson: http://en.allexperts.com/q/Economics-2301/2008/1/death-...

Since I don't give a rat's ass about economics when deciding this question, I don't trust either side's work. Since you're very clearly on one particular side , you've sucked up some set of numbers (which you failed to provide, presumably because you're convinced that you're so intellectually and morally superior to others that they should take your every statement at face value) like a Hoover DeLuxe. Very convincing. I especially liked the detail of your proof. :rofl:

I understand those who are morally against the death penalty, and they're not without an argument. I also understand those who aren't so much against it in principle, but think it's too much power to give to government. I really believe both sides do have compelling arguments, which is why I said I admired your conviction in an earlier post. The one argument you choose to focus on (or even mention more than once)? Economics, and funnily enough you did so in a post where you also write "It is a more logical argument than any you've got." :rofl:

So, putting this in terms you understand, this is why I wouldn't even bother to waste serious time debating you: "But, of course, as usual, you add two and two and get the only aspect of the problem that I don't give a shit about."

Thanks for the laugh, though. The title of your post and the direction you then took it was better than standup.
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Greyhound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 07:40 AM
Response to Reply #96
116. So unoriginal you are repeating the same bizarre nonsense as the other
blood-thirsty barbarian. Since the admitted non-word, un-rape, seems to upset you so much, please insert the word helped or benefited. Fortunately for the species, your brand of 'justice' is outlawed in the civilized world, leaving us in the company of such nations as these



Take a look at the company you would like us to keep. Every red nation on the map is some form of totalitarian regime ruled by terror and violence, The People's Republic of China leads the world in executions (470+ However Amnesty International reports that the actual figure is approximately 6,000), surely a wonderful and quite peaceful nation that I'm sure you would enjoy living in, while we are also surpassed by such advanced and enlightened nations as Iran (317+) Saudi Arabia (143+), and Pakistan (135+)*. Thanks to our own weary acceptance of violence, we have managed to supplant Iraq though they were trailing us by only 9 in 2007. I'm sure that, with the encouragement of enough people like you, we could bring them up to par, after all Iran is only a little over twice as large as Iraq (population), yet manages to kill 10 times as many people, they're not even trying.

But never mind, I'm sure your way is best and the rest of us are just too stupid to see how well this strategy has worked out over the last 10 - 12 centuries.

Maybe some sort of 'surge' would turn the tide...





*Figures from 2007
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Zavulon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 05:08 PM
Response to Reply #116
125. Obviously, you missed my edit.
However, your strategy of using other countries falls flat. The "company" you mention all have different ways of applying the death penalty. Comparing our application of the death penalty to those of "such advanced and enlightened nations as Iran (317+) Saudi Arabia (143+), and Pakistan (135+)" is as ridiculous as the argument I mocked, unless the numerous trials and appeals taxpayers pay for over here means nothing to you. Let me guess - if a murderer is put to death, that's all that matters, and, well, golly, it's just wrong.

But never mind, I'm sure your way is best and the rest of us are just too stupid to see how well coddling the worst of the worst has worked out over the last 10-12 centuries. I look at those we've put to death and read about their crimes, and my only regret is that it took too long to execute them, so insult me and those who agree with me (you know, us "blood-thirsty barbarians") all you like. In the meantime, take a look at this, which is an account of a recent death penalty case:

http://www.murdervictims.com/voices/jeneliz.html

Here's an excerpt, which if pressed to make a bet I'd guess you're already familiar with (this case made quite a few headlines). I don't expect this will change your mind at all (and unlike you, I'm not trying to change your mind), but this is a great example of why I have no problem with the death penalty. The scum described in this article doesn't deserve anyone's mercy...

"...For the next hour or so, these beautiful, innocent young girls were subjected to the most brutal gang rapes that most of the investigating officers had ever encountered. The confessions of the gang members that were used at trial indicated that there was never less than 2 men on each of the girls at any one time and that the girls were repeatedly raped orally, anally and vaginally for the entire hour. One of the gang members later said during the brag session that by the time he got to one of the girls, "she was loose and sloppy." One of the boys boasted of having 'virgin blood' on him.

The 14-year-old juvenile later testified that he had gone back and forth between his brother and Peter Cantu since they were the only ones there that he really knew and kept urging them to leave. He said he was told repeatedly by Peter Cantu to "get some". He raped Jennifer and was later sentenced to 40 years for aggravated sexual assault, which was the maximum sentence for a juvenile.

When the rapes finally ended, the horror was not over. The gang members took Jenny and Elizabeth from the clearing into a wooded area, leaving the juvenile behind, saying he was "too little to watch". Jenny was strangled with the belt of Sean O'Brien, with two murderers pulling, one on each side, until the belt broke. Part of the belt was left at the murder scene, the rest was found in O'Brien's home. After the belt broke, the killers used her own shoelaces to finish their job. Medellin later complained that "the bitch wouldn't die" and that it would have been "easier with a gun". Elizabeth was also strangled with her shoelaces, after crying and begging the gang members not to kill them; bargaining, offering to give them her phone number so they could get together again.

The medical examiner testified that Elizabeth's two front teeth were knocked out of her brutalized mouth before she died and that two of Jennifer's ribs were broken after she had died. Testimony showed that the girls' bodies were kicked and their necks were stomped on after the strangulations in order to "make sure that they were really dead."


Can you tell me you don't even understand why someone would want scum like that executed?

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ThatsMyBarack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 09:03 AM
Response to Original message
46. Done!
This man deserves better.
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ZenKitty Donating Member (169 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 01:27 AM
Response to Reply #46
102. So did those little girls....
and for the record I am anti DP. His ass should be locked up for life. Period.
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Leftist Agitator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 09:36 AM
Response to Original message
49. I'l pick up an extra bottle of champagne to celebrate his demise.
I already have two, one to celebrate on January 20, 2009, when one (mass) murderer is out of our hair, another for when that fuckface dies, and I 'll now have to get a third to celebrate the execution of this rapist scumbag murderer.

:hi:

How you can have sympathy for this asshole is beyond me.
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closeupready Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 09:53 AM
Response to Reply #49
53. Maybe we should put God on trial for giving him life to begin with? Hmmm? That sound good to you?
n/t
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Leftist Agitator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 09:57 AM
Response to Reply #53
55. Nobody but he himself is responsible for raping and murdering people.
I don't know what you were trying to insinuate, but...

FAIL.

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closeupready Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 10:08 AM
Response to Reply #55
58. Thank you (i.e., see post #56).
That means you, you know.
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karlschneider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 09:59 PM
Response to Reply #55
70. There are millions of humans who have absolutely no redeeming value.
They actually need to be eliminated. I would happily pull the switch on that ratfucker.
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High Plains Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 11:37 AM
Response to Reply #49
61. Finding pleasure in the deaths of others is a sure sign of sick fuck.
Drink up, buddy.
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Leftist Agitator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 02:46 PM
Response to Reply #61
67. If you won't take immense pleasure in the deaths of * and Cheney...
Then there is something seriously wrong with YOU!
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lapislzi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 12:22 PM
Response to Reply #49
63. Wow. I can't remember the last time I was so disgusted by a post.
It's not sympathy. It's called empathy. Around here, we like to think we practice the Golden Rule. The taking of any life, be it by an individual, or by the state, is criminal.
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Leftist Agitator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 02:24 PM
Response to Reply #63
66. This asshole sure didn't practice the "Golden Rule"...
When he decided to rape and murder, did he?

You sanctimonious apologists for a murdering pedophile can fuck right off.
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Th1onein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-28-08 12:04 AM
Response to Reply #66
77. It doesn't have a goddamned thing to do with what HE did.
It's about what WE do. And who WE are. Why don't you GET that?

This is a thread about a PETITION. If you don't care to sign the petition, go start another thread about how much you love the death penalty. This is not a thread about YOUR opinions, get it?

Geez, what an idiot.
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ZenKitty Donating Member (169 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 01:31 AM
Response to Reply #77
103. You're correct, it is about what we do and who we are...
...let me put the DP aside as I don't agree with it and I want you to clear your mind and listen to my POV.

Think.about.those.little.girls. That's all I ask. Think about those girls.
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Th1onein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 01:36 AM
Response to Reply #103
105. I do think about them. But the death penalty does not unrape them.
And this is assuming that our system of justice does not discriminate against the black and the poor.

The death penalty is murder. Period. It doesn't matter the crime. It is murder.
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ZenKitty Donating Member (169 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 01:45 AM
Response to Reply #105
108. "does not unrape them"...
It rarely happens, but I am truly speechless. Wow.
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Th1onein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 02:07 AM
Response to Reply #108
112. You're speechless? That could be a good thing, you know.
no text
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ZenKitty Donating Member (169 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 02:10 AM
Response to Reply #112
113. Yes it is.
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Th1onein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-28-08 12:00 AM
Response to Reply #49
76. Same way I have sympathy for you.
Anyone who can celebrate the death of another human being, for ANY reason, is a scumbag. You're no better than those you condemn.
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ZenKitty Donating Member (169 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 01:56 AM
Response to Reply #76
109. What the hell are you talking about....
Edited on Fri Aug-29-08 02:10 AM by ZenKitty
I am celebrating nothing in this case. Anyone that can be so dismissive about rape and torture has no grasp of reality.

I am mourning not only the evil and the ignorance but more importantly I will say again, my empathy lies with the young souls that have suffered such an atrocity that has and will scared them for life. Their very lives are forever altered. They have suffered their own version of the DP.
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Th1onein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 03:26 PM
Response to Reply #109
124. Zenkitty, I wasn't replying to you. Read the chart of the posts.
There you go!

And, by the way? There's only one "version" of the death penalty. It's the one where you stop breathing, see?
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Bill McBlueState Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 09:58 AM
Response to Original message
56. Done
I wasn't going to, but the reactions of death penalty supporters on this thread got me thinking again about why I hate the death penalty.
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SidDithers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 10:18 AM
Response to Original message
59. You might have better luck getting people to sign...
if you don't try to convince them that he is innocent, or wrongly convicted. There are enough people here who are against the death penalty in every case, who would support the petition on that principle alone. The "travesty of justice" argument will only focus the debate on his criminal behaviour, and not whether or not anyone deserves to die.

That said, I don't care what he did or didn't do. Killing him is still wrong.

I signed.

Sid
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Th1onein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-28-08 12:16 AM
Response to Reply #59
81. Thanks, Sid. But, really, do you think they wouldn't post?
These kinds of posts, about the death penalty, bring the right wingers out, even on DU.

And, you know, I am so pissed off, after talking to this guy's sister, about his case. He and his family are very ignorant and uneducated. It is very difficult to get the facts from them, to ferret out what actually happened. What bothers me the most is that the guy who cashed that woman's checks and pawned her ring was never even charged with anything. And they were supposed to have driven together all over town in her car, but there were no fingerprints or any other forensic evidence linking Reginald to that car. It was if he had never been in it. But the guy who cashed her checks and pawned her ring was all over the car.

One guy pawns her ring and cashes her checks, but is never charged. He testifies against another guy and that's all the evidence that they need to give him a death sentence?

Something is wrong with this picture.
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SidDithers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-28-08 09:01 AM
Response to Reply #81
90. You're probably right...
Edited on Thu Aug-28-08 09:10 AM by SidDithers
keep fighting the fight. :hi:

Here's a kick anyway.

Sid
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ZenKitty Donating Member (169 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 01:41 AM
Response to Reply #81
106. Did you ever take the time to speak to the parents of the little girls?....
Edited on Fri Aug-29-08 01:42 AM by ZenKitty
Again, I am 100% against the DP. But for some reason after reading this thread it is apparent that your cause is not one of crusading against the DP.

Your (possibly inadvertent) display of callousness towards the TRUE victims of this tragic tale speaks volumes.

No one should ever be subjected to death at the hands of a government in the name of "justice". Period.

NO ONE SHOULD EVER HAVE TO EXPERIENCE THE FEAR AND HORROR OF RAPE AND TORTURE AT THE HANDS OF A MONSTER. PERIOD.
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Th1onein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 02:06 AM
Response to Reply #106
111. These victims' identities are protected.
I can't speak to them, even if I wanted to.

I agree with you that one one should ever have to experience the fear and horror of rape and torture. That is a given.

But no one should have to experience the fear and the horror of the death penalty, either. Not the criminal, not his family, and not our society. We have an imperfect system of justice and we have put too many innocents to death because of it.

I am not saying to free the criminals; this is an illogical assumption on the part of many death penalty proponents. I am saying that we should keep them in prison for the rest of their lives. It costs our society less than putting them to death.
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ceile Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 04:00 PM
Response to Original message
68. done n/t
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SeattleGirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-27-08 11:54 PM
Response to Original message
74. Done!
And thank you for posting this, Th1onein.

I am totally against the death penalty.

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Truth2Tell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-28-08 12:13 AM
Response to Original message
80. Error: you can only recommend threads which were started in the past 24 hours
Shame. I'll still kick.

Thank you Th1onein! - for the work that you do and for your post!
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Th1onein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-28-08 12:34 AM
Response to Reply #80
82. Thank you so much, Truth2Tell
n/t
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lonestarnot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-28-08 09:09 AM
Response to Original message
91. done
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Donald Ian Rankin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 08:24 AM
Response to Original message
117. I hope that he spends the rest of his life in jail.
I am very sceptical indeed of the claims that he is innocent, but I support execution, ever, because if you execute anyone - even serial-killing child-rapists like this guy probably is - you'll inevitably execute some people who don't deserve it too.
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asteroid2003QQ47 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 08:32 AM
Response to Original message
118. As problematic as the death penalty is...
and of that I have NO illusions, those guilty of rape and murder, including Reginald Perkins, forfeit their right to continue living in the human community. That said, I do not believe capitol punishment is the perfect solution, far from it, it is just the best solution our very dysfunctional society presently has available.
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Th1onein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 03:19 PM
Response to Reply #118
122. It is not the "best" solution.
And the problem is not really the death penalty. In a perfect world, your argument might hold a little water, but the problem, in fact, is our inequitable justice system. We have people sitting on death row whose attorneys slept through most of the trial, and still, our higher courts rule that they had adequate cousel. Come ON!

The poor and the black do not have equal justice under our law, not in capital cases, or any other kind of cases. Given that fact, the death penalty is not the "best" solution.

And this is to say nothing of what these kinds of punishments say about us as a society, in general. Most industrialized countries no longer have the death penalty because they KNOW that it does not even offer a deterrent for committing crimes. AND, it costs us more, in monetary terms, to put a prisoner to death, than it does to just keep them locked up for the rest of their lives.
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asteroid2003QQ47 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-30-08 01:14 PM
Response to Reply #122
129. Inequitable "justice" system? Absolutely! "Justice" is a misnomer in...
our society. But wait, it can easily be argued that at our level of dysfunctionality we are something other than a "society" thus we needn't worry about "what these kinds of punishments say about us," unfortunately.
Equally unfortunate is the fact that we in no way resemble "Most industrialized countries no longer have the death penalty" in that they, for the most part, are deserving of the label society in that their sense of community is alive and well and that they, unlike the
United States, are not obsessed with world domination at all costs.
Would you deny that ours is a dog eat dog system and if one of the bigger dogs, the so called "justice" system and the profiteers who administer it had a shred of integrity, the argument that "it costs us more, in monetary terms, to put a prisoner to death, than it does to just keep them locked up for the rest of their lives" would be invalid?
Unless the societal issues are resolved, our death spiral will continue, there will be ever increasing rapes, murders, prisoners and executions. It is not a pretty picture.
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sourmilk Donating Member (512 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 05:45 PM
Response to Original message
127. Sorry - I am pro-death penalty, especially for recidivists like Reginald Perkins.
He is, by almost all reports, a serial rapist who was seving a life sentence until paroled in 2000. This POS actually strangled his 64 year old STEPMOM to get convicted this time!!!

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Th1onein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-30-08 07:27 AM
Response to Reply #127
128. Noone asked for your opinion, dear. Sign the petition or go away.
Or haven't you been reading the posts before yours?
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