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So how would one smack down a jerk who says EXXON paid more taxes

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ObaMania Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-06-08 05:22 PM
Original message
So how would one smack down a jerk who says EXXON paid more taxes
than they pocketed in profit?

Are there charts or anything anywhere that show aything but the 30 billion in taxes compared to the 10 billion in profit?
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madmax Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-06-08 05:23 PM
Response to Original message
1. You must be talking to my
brother in law. Don't waste your time.
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trashcanistanista Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-06-08 06:19 PM
Response to Reply #1
10. Where is this coming from? I heard a similar thing at
work. The increase in gas is all taxes, the oil companies are not making any money on it and they aren't making enough to put into researching green technologies. Everyone in the room went quiet. No one responded. The person in question is a Christian home schooler. I didn't have the nerve to ask her where she heard that, I could lose my job.
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erpowers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-06-08 06:36 PM
Response to Reply #10
15. Misrepresentation by NBC's Today Show
A few days ago, I think it was the Today Show that did a segment on oil and gas companies and the amounts of money they make and the the amount of money that goes to different areas. The segment may have been on ABC's Good Morning America, but I think it was on the Today Show. However, the person who was speaking on behalf of the oil and gas companies made some type of chart in which it listed percentages of money allocated to different things. I think the person claimed that as a percentage of all things Exxon Mobil paid more in worldwide taxes than on any other thing. I think some people may not have understood that the person was talking in just percentage and not in actual dollar amounts. The whole point of the segment was to discuss how Exxon Mobil is only putting about 2% of its money into alternative energy.
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wtmusic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-06-08 05:24 PM
Response to Original message
2. The back of one's hand works pretty well nt
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XemaSab Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-06-08 05:29 PM
Response to Reply #2
6. Failing that, an open palm is pretty effective
n/t
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tekisui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-06-08 05:25 PM
Response to Original message
3. What, $10 Billion in profit isn't enough?
They are the most profitable corporation in the history of the world. The more they pay in taxes the better. No human deserves what the big suits of Exxon make. No human is worth that much.
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geek_sabre Donating Member (619 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-06-08 08:22 PM
Response to Reply #3
18. They're also the largest corporation in the history of the world
percentage wise, they're not the most profitable industry right now.
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NMDemDist2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-06-08 05:26 PM
Response to Original message
4. I'd call that a fair trade for the roads, streets, pipelines etc we provide
Edited on Wed Aug-06-08 05:28 PM by AZDemDist6
so they can do business

if you're arguing with a right winger who wants you to feel sorry for Exxon, you'll never win. he's an ass and you can't change his mind

'Julie' put it well here

Taxes are not punishment. Taxes are your membership fee for living and doing business in civilized society. Exxons taxes pay for all the time using courtrooms trying to skip out of their Valdez penalty. Exxons taxes pay for the roads that their employees need in order to get to work every day. Exxons taxes pay for the schools that educated their employees to become skilled workers. Exxons taxes pay for the banking and legal regulations that have been developed to protect their own contracts. Go read Warren Buffets view on taxes, and how glad he is to have been born here in the US with taxesversus in an impoverished third world country where lack of schools and infrastructure make doing business extremely difficult, if not impossible.

Hasnt George Bush already shown the US that lowering taxes on those in the upper-income range does NOTHING to support the American economy? That lesson has been learned by every person in the USwitness the crushing turnouts at the Democratic primaries. Thank god for Democracy.

Conservatives wont be happy until only the working poor are PUNISHED (their word) with taxes.



http://frontburner.dmagazine.com/2008/02/06/exxons-pays...
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DJ13 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-06-08 05:28 PM
Response to Original message
5. Remind them that Exxon paid more in executive compensation than in drilling for more oil
in 2007.
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ObaMania Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-06-08 05:40 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. Awesome responses all.
Thanks!
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spanone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-06-08 05:40 PM
Response to Original message
8. NO ONE would be in business if they paid more taxes than they profited.
sounds like a dumbfuck
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many a good man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-06-08 06:45 PM
Response to Reply #8
16. Sure. Businesses are taxed 110% of revenue.
In the small Republican mind.
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renie408 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-06-08 05:49 PM
Response to Original message
9. Since the 11.6 BILLION was a QUARTERLY profit, that would mean
they actually cleared roughly 45 BILLION.


Thirty is less than 45.

Even a Republican should be able to do that math.

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Swamp Rat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-06-08 06:22 PM
Response to Original message
11. Tell him to prove it as well as demonstrate how he and his community specifically benefit from Exxon
Edited on Wed Aug-06-08 06:23 PM by Swamp Rat
profits. Whatever he says, just keep responding, "you proved nothing. Now prove it or _____________."

Right-wing 'news' sources do not count.




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ColbertWatcher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-06-08 06:22 PM
Response to Original message
12. Bullshit.
Exxon fought like hell to avoid accountability for the Valdez spill, who really believes they pay their fair share for anything?


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Dreamer Tatum Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-06-08 11:57 PM
Response to Reply #12
25. I'm sure they'd be happy to show you the cancelled check.
They pay taxes at the appropriate corporate rate, just like all profitable companies.

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ColbertWatcher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-07-08 12:08 AM
Response to Reply #25
28. They may "pay" it, but do they count how much they get back in subsidies...
...and other tax breaks?


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Dreamer Tatum Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-07-08 12:10 AM
Response to Reply #28
29. See post #27 nt
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Crabby Appleton Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-06-08 06:29 PM
Response to Original message
13. From Exxon's 2008 2nd quarter 10-Q SEC filing, page 20-21
which can be found at www.sec.gov (can't link directly to the actual document, and because it's a table it does't copy and paste very well without loss of table structure), "income taxes" is the corporate tax paid, after which there was an 11.6 Billion profit for the 2nd quarter.

"
TAXES

Second Quarter 2008
(in millions of dollars)

Income taxes_______________10,526
Sales-based taxes____________9,538
All other taxes and duties_____12,297
Total______________________32,361
Effective income tax rate______49%


Income, sales-based and all other taxes and duties for the second quarter of 2008 of $32,361 million were higher than 2007. In the second quarter of 2008 income tax expense increased to $10,526 million and the effective income tax rate was 49 percent, compared to $7,668 million and 44 percent, respectively, in the prior year period. The change in the effective income tax rate reflects an increased share of total income from the non-U.S. Upstream segment. Sales-based taxes and all other taxes and duties increased in 2008 reflecting higher prices and foreign exchange.

Income, sales-based and all other taxes and duties for the first six months of 2008 of $61,702 million were higher than 2007. In the first six months of 2008, income tax expense increased to $19,828 million and the effective income tax rate was 49 percent, compared to $14,452 million and 44 percent, respectively, in the prior year period. The change in the effective income tax rate reflects an increased share of total income from the non-U.S. Upstream segment. Sales-based taxes and all other taxes and duties increased in 2008 reflecting higher prices and foreign exchange.
"
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librechik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-06-08 06:32 PM
Response to Original message
14. MAKE THEM PROVE THAT ASSERTION
don't go running around to disprove their crazy talk. Make them prove their point.

(pssst--they can't!)
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Rage for Order Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-06-08 08:27 PM
Response to Reply #14
20. Uh, see post # 13, directly above your post n/t
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IndependentThinker1 Donating Member (2 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-06-08 07:26 PM
Response to Original message
17. Sorry, but i think he might have a point :/
Sorry, but i think he might have a point :/



per CNN
"In addition to making hefty profits, Exxon also had a hefty tax bill. Worldwide, the company paid $10.5 billion in income taxes in the second quarter, $9.5 billion in sales taxes, and over $12 billion in what it called 'other taxes.'"

MP: In other words, Exxon Mobil paid $32.361 billion in taxes in the second quarter, which works out to $4,114 in taxes per second. Another way to look at it - Exxon paid almost $3 in taxes ($32.361 billion) for every $1 in profits ($11.68 billion), see chart above.

http://www.istockanalyst.com/article/viewarticle+articl...
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AllieB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-06-08 08:26 PM
Response to Reply #17
19. So you think they pay too much in taxes?
:popcorn:
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DireStrike Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-06-08 09:38 PM
Response to Reply #17
23. Must be something wrong with that
If they're hemorrhaging 20 billion a quarter in taxes alone, not even considering other costs, they'd be out of business in short order.

Or wait, is the profit AFTER the taxes? So they're complaining about making $11 billion profit? It doesn't matter what kinda taxes you pay, $11 billion in pure profit... wow.
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Dreamer Tatum Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-06-08 11:55 PM
Response to Reply #23
24. Good God, is EBITDA really that foreign a term?
Earnings Before Interest, Taxes, Depreciation, and Amortization.

Subtract each of those and you get net income, aka profit.

It is entirely possible, in fact likely, that MOST profitable companies pay more in taxes than they earn in net income.
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Vickers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-07-08 12:15 AM
Response to Reply #17
31. "$9.5 billion in sales taxes" and "over $12 billion in what it called 'other taxes.'"
Sales tax? Other taxes?

:wtf:

OTHER taxes? The biggest category is OTHER?

Dude, can you name an OTHER tax? One that makes up more than 1/3 of your total tax tab?

:eyes:

Welcome to DU yadda yadda yadda...


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bullwinkle428 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-06-08 08:29 PM
Response to Original message
21. Yep - heard the same things from a fundie neocon wingnut on a board
I frequent, and this was at least one year ago, and perhaps as far back as when prices started to skyrocket post-Katrina!
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anonymous171 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-06-08 08:32 PM
Response to Original message
22. They are lucky that they're not being nationalized right now.
That's all I have to say about the oil companies.
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mrreowwr_kittty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Aug-06-08 11:58 PM
Response to Original message
26. What about the subsidies they get? Don't those offset their taxes? nt
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Dreamer Tatum Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-07-08 12:02 AM
Response to Original message
27. HERE IS THE APPROPRIATE RESPONSE
You should say, "No shit they paid a lot of taxes; their EBITDA was enormous. What should they get, a cookie? It's too bad their subsidies aren't taxable, dipshit."
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ColbertWatcher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-07-08 12:12 AM
Response to Reply #27
30. Nice use of tax jargon and "dipshit" Well done! n/t
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