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Judge on Rove’s citizen arrest: ‘It’s about time.’

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tannybogus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-01-08 02:13 PM
Original message
Judge on Rove’s citizen arrest: ‘It’s about time.’
Last Friday, police in Des Moines, Iowa arrested four people who attempted to make a citizens’ arrest of former top White House aide Karl Rove, who was in town to speak at a GOP fundraiser. A retired minister and three members of the Des Moines Catholic Workers community were cited for trespassing. However, according to a press release, the judge presiding over the case praised their efforts:

Shaw was the first called before Polk County Fifth Judicial District Associate Judge William Price.

After entering her plea, the judge asked Shaw, “Mamn, what were you doing at the Wakonda Country Club?”

“I was attempting to make a citizen’s arrest of Karl Rove, your honor,” Shaw answered.

“Well,” the judge looked up and said, “it’s about time.”

http://thinkprogress.org/2008/08/01/judge-on-roves-arre... / :applause:
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lonestarnot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-01-08 02:15 PM
Response to Original message
1. Heh! LOL
:rofl: K & R
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gasperc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-01-08 02:16 PM
Response to Original message
2. I hope this gets more press than DU
maybe Ed Shultz or Olberman can pick up the the story, interview these people
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Kierkegaard Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-01-08 02:17 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. That would be amazing.
I'm not holding my breath, though.
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The Backlash Cometh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-01-08 02:18 PM
Response to Original message
4. Oh, fracken good!
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libodem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-01-08 02:54 PM
Response to Original message
5. There is hope for America
I am so sick of thugs running the country into the ground.
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wurzel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-01-08 03:01 PM
Response to Original message
6. All is not lost. Cheers to Judge Price.
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pleah Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-01-08 03:06 PM
Response to Original message
7. Bravo! Hot damn, it's nice to see this.
:applause: :applause: :applause: :woohoo:
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agentS Donating Member (922 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-02-08 10:27 AM
Response to Reply #7
49. Get some rope...
I hope the next citizen's arrest, the citizens bring the rope and some duck tape, then tie him up and toss his fat ass into the trunk of a car From Dusk till Dawn style to Washington and drag him up the steps of Capitol Hill.
If they stop for gas and he starts banging the side of the trunk and someone asks "What's that sound? Is it coming from your car?" the citizen arrestors should say "Ahh, low quality gas".
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flvegan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-01-08 03:17 PM
Response to Original message
8. Now, lets say they're found "not guilty" at trial.
Makes for interesting case law, doesn't it (at least in Iowa)?
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Piewhacket Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-01-08 04:02 PM
Response to Reply #8
10. Or in California....
I agree this story is amusing, and the "about time" remark is a definite 'keeper'
for my file.

I've also heard that Rove is suppose to speak in Sacramento on Sept 19 on 14th
and J Street. I've seen posts indicating some advocate a welcoming party.

Yet I remind, the judge's amusing retort aside,
It is a serious matter to 'falsely arrest' someone, and has serious consequences.
It is not something to be done by those are obedient to the rule of law.

However, similar to Iowa, citizen's arrrests are also permitted in California.
California law (CA Penal Code 837) permits a private person to arrest another:
1. For a public offense committed or attempted in his presence.
2. When the person arrested has committed a felony, although not
in his presence.
3. When a felony has been in fact committed, and he has reasonable
cause for believing the person arrested to have committed it.

In effecting the arrest the person making an arrest may orally summon
as many persons as he deems necessary to aid him therein. (CA Penal Code 839)

see also http://oldweb.uwp.edu/academic/criminal.justice/citarr....

It is my belief that the offense must be a violation of CA STATE LAW for
the arrest to be proper under the above law (but I could be wrong).

So this is all fun and all. But we should remember what my ancestor Squire Boone's
favorite son Daniel woulda said.... "Be sure you're right, THEN go ahead."

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nickgutierrez Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-01-08 07:21 PM
Response to Reply #10
27. I'm not sure that's right.
Cal. Penal Code § 17(a) refers to a felony as being a crime punishable by time in a state prison, which probably would support your assertion. But, Monteiro v. Howard in 1971, a federal district court held that "where there is reasonable cause to believe that felony has been committed and that arrested person committed it, arrest by private person is legal," so this would be a very interesting case.
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Piewhacket Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-02-08 02:04 AM
Response to Reply #27
42. Me either, but...
I'm not confirming Roves Sacramento visit, only reporting what I saw in a post.
Someone might want to verify.

As for Montiero v. Howard, I did not find it but I did find it mentioned in one of Erwin
Chemerinsky's US Supreme Court briefs, so it exists ( 334 F. Supp. 411 (D.R.I. 1971)).
But it is merely cited for unremarkable proposition that an off-duty officer who
happens upon the commission of a felony in progress is entitled to make a citizen’s arrest
just like an ordinary citizen may. Its only a brief, remember, even if it is by a noted
constitutional lawyer.








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intheozone Donating Member (839 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-01-08 10:57 PM
Response to Reply #10
36. I'm in Sacto, should I be putting this on my calendar????
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pink-o Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-02-08 12:48 PM
Response to Reply #36
53. ..And the "Capitol Corridor" train service from the Bay Area is AWESOME!
..could get me there in a couple of hours! :evilgrin:
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LiberalFighter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-02-08 09:11 AM
Response to Reply #10
46. The question might be whether one can make a citizen's arrest on private property.
Anyone know?
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Piewhacket Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-02-08 02:19 PM
Response to Reply #46
58. Not for sure, but...
...you raise the defense of the folks in Iowa who were
arrested for trespassing. "Not guilty of trespass, your
Honor, I was attempting to make a lawful citizen's arrest
(and apparently did not bring enough muscle)."

Appears to me the CA statute makes no 'exception' for private property,
I know of no such exception (but I'm not expert on that),
but I personally doubt the existence of such an exception.
IOW, private my ^ss, you're under arrest, scumbag.

A citizen's arrest is a legal process which, IF CORRECTLY DONE, is
NOT vigilantism. Those calling this vigilantism need to be corrected.
Of course, unlawful acts like a lynching IS vigilantism, as is its advocacy.
So have a care what you say. We don't want any whacked-out justice
people with whacked-out degrees from Monica Goodling's whacked-out law
school whacking out subpoenas for DU logs on a pretext, thereby generating
more hearings about whether these whacked-out Bushwhacker wannabes should
have been given jobs, much less law licenses, in the first place.

However, citizens arrests are subject to strict limitations
and severe liabilities which the police are not limited by. If force is
required, there may be a claim of excessive force, with liability
possible even if the a arrest is otherwise proper. There is also
no general right to search or seize anything.... also someone could be
hurt if force is required to effect the arrest.

So folks need to think it through, know what they are doing. For this reason
it is preferred, if the situation permits, to call the police.

BUT... I really think that, clearly, this situation in Iowa was not intended
to be successful, but was political. One of the arrestors was elderly, retired
minister, for goodness sakes and I don't think a wrestling match was intended.
Yet to get off they might have to prove a crime was committed and there was good
reason to believe Rove was a responsible evildoer....

Good clean fun, eh? Anyone got some proof to send in order to help
them out? Sounds like the judge is prepared to listen and put it into the
record. What a freekin nightmare for TurdBlossom if the press (or
intrepid DU reporters in Iowa) cover it. LOL.

Personally I think the charges will be dropped.
Just guessing. Rove may be scum, but no one ever suggested he was actually stupid.
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LiberalFighter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-02-08 09:54 AM
Response to Reply #10
47. Another question would be whether the Club interefered in a legal arrest.
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xxqqqzme Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-02-08 11:55 AM
Response to Reply #10
51. Then what we really need is a bounty hunter in
Edited on Sat Aug-02-08 11:56 AM by xxqqqzme
Sacramento. Someone who knows how to get rough and get to the perp and get him to a police station. Bet saurove would welcome that congressional supeona as an excuse to get out of Sac.
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LiberalFighter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-02-08 03:22 PM
Response to Reply #51
59. Don't bounty hunters generally hunt down bail jumpers?
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xxqqqzme Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-02-08 12:03 PM
Response to Reply #10
52. He is currently avoiding/ignoring
a congressional subpoena. That should count for something.
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MadrasT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-01-08 03:42 PM
Response to Original message
9. Whoot!
I love this! :bounce:

YAY for Judge William Price! :patriot: We need more like you, Your Honor!

:woohoo:
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Gold Metal Flake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-01-08 04:06 PM
Response to Original message
11. Now, that's not exactly right, is it?
If he had said "wadaya, a COMMIE?" we'd be pissed.

Just the same, I wonder if this is an elected judge. If so, maybe he needs a little campaign contribution?
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ColbertWatcher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-01-08 06:21 PM
Response to Reply #11
20. Good point. Perhaps a pizza delivery for lunch for the whole staff. n/t
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Gold Metal Flake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-01-08 07:14 PM
Response to Reply #20
24. We must not gloat like pukes. And throw in a case of a real nice small label pilsner.


:toast:


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ColbertWatcher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-01-08 07:15 PM
Response to Reply #24
25. Bucket of chicken wings, too. n/t
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MNBrewer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-01-08 09:43 PM
Response to Reply #24
34. Ale
Edited on Fri Aug-01-08 09:43 PM by MNBrewer
Definitely an ale!

:beer:
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aquart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-02-08 02:15 AM
Response to Reply #20
43. Would you trust food from strangers if you'd said that?
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Crabby Appleton Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-01-08 05:11 PM
Response to Original message
12. K&R
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lovuian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-01-08 05:13 PM
Response to Original message
13. AWESOME
Hear that CONGRESS!!!
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Vidar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-01-08 05:19 PM
Response to Original message
14. Nice to there are some decent judges out there. Cops, as usual, are on the wrong side.
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AnnieBW Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-01-08 05:54 PM
Response to Original message
15. ROFL!
Durn activist judge!
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proud patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-01-08 05:58 PM
Response to Original message
16. Wheee ! ! !
:woohoo:
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HCE SuiGeneris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-01-08 06:03 PM
Response to Original message
17. W00T !!
:applause:
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FourScore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-01-08 06:14 PM
Response to Original message
18. love it!
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samsingh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-01-08 06:21 PM
Response to Original message
19. is this an urban myth?
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Kire Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-02-08 12:58 PM
Response to Reply #19
54. I'll believe it when I see a legitimate source.
a press release from an organization that the defendants work for is all we've got so far
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katty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-01-08 06:58 PM
Response to Original message
21. that's what i said!! go judge!
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understandinglife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-01-08 07:06 PM
Response to Original message
22. Should be happening any where he, Libby, Feith, Bolton, Cheney, Rice, ..... go ....
No place to hide ....
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jeff30997 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-01-08 07:17 PM
Response to Reply #22
26. Oh,those Mo Fos think they got away with it isn't it...
But apparently the people do not agree and those gangsters are not out of the woods.Not only in the

U.S BTW but in Europe as well.
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Hardrada Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-02-08 12:18 AM
Response to Reply #22
37. And Perle & Wolfowitz too.
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norepubsin08 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-02-08 10:48 PM
Response to Reply #37
63. add
Colin Powell, Condi Rice, Paul Bremer and David Petrayus
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lynettebro440 Donating Member (950 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-01-08 07:09 PM
Response to Original message
23. Seriously
I just can't stop loving my fucking city of Des Moines. I am so impressed and proud. We rock Des Moines, we fucking rock. :yourock:
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jeff30997 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-01-08 07:21 PM
Response to Reply #23
28. You're right!
Fuck Des Moines and rock! ... Err...Sorry,I mean:

You rock Des Moines, you fucking rock!!! :)

:yourock:
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lynettebro440 Donating Member (950 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-01-08 07:27 PM
Response to Reply #28
29. This small little geek town
is making history. It's amazing and I'm so proud they turned from bright red to blue.
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jeff30997 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-01-08 07:50 PM
Response to Reply #29
30. That's really cool ynettebro440!

:hi:
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ColbertWatcher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-01-08 09:21 PM
Response to Reply #23
32. Here you go...
...http://www.wikiality.com/Des_Moines%2C_Iowa

Brag to your heart's content!

I started it for you, just fill in the blanks.

It is empty awaiting your truthiness.


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Gregorian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-01-08 08:39 PM
Response to Original message
31. The real silent majority is right here.
We've been held hostage. America has been forcibly detained. And just like what the drug war did to the voices of a generation, the war on terrorism did to an entire fraction of Americans.

I've learned something today. The word "WE" is used far too loosely. There are those who still care and think critically. And those who still have morals. There is still an America. We aren't all criminals and liars. We aren't all what we see on FOX. We are in the majority. But we've been silenced.

The avalanche in the snowfield of lies has been slow and it is slowly sliding away to expose the truth.

The whole country isn't conservative.
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orleans Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-01-08 09:35 PM
Response to Original message
33. so then what happened? did he throw the case out? n/t
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MissDeeds Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-01-08 10:47 PM
Response to Original message
35. K & R
About time indeed.

:kick:
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Overseas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-02-08 12:36 AM
Response to Original message
38. You sure said it Your Honor !
Thanks in advance to the next brave citizen.
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Karl_Bonner_1982 Donating Member (701 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-02-08 12:54 AM
Response to Original message
39. It will be interesting to see the prosecution and defense's cases
How will the prosecution and defense make their arguments, and what will the jurors think?

Let's make sure to invite the judge over for beers after this case is finished. :headbang:
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FogerRox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-02-08 01:04 AM
Response to Original message
40. Rec for the judge
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grantcart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-02-08 01:54 AM
Response to Original message
41. pictures


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eowyn_of_rohan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-02-08 06:00 AM
Response to Original message
44. “Mamn, what were you doing"
Damn + Ma'am = Mamn. Should be Damn, Ma'am, what were you doing?
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NorthCarolina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-02-08 08:55 AM
Response to Original message
45. So, if it's legal in IA to make a citizen's arrest
then under what grounds were they arrested?

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file83 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-02-08 01:01 PM
Response to Reply #45
55. Trespassing.
Which is stupid because they were trespassing in the line of duty. You know, like when a cop runs a light in the line of duty...

I guess since they never got to actually arrest Rove, the police are not obligated to take Rove in to custody?
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blue sky at night Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-02-08 10:25 AM
Response to Original message
48. and the meek shall inherit the earth.....
doesn't it just figure, and so many here at DU Criticize anyone connected to a Mainstream Religious Denomination. Guess who has the real balls fellow DU'ers? About time indeed.
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whistle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-02-08 10:30 AM
Response to Original message
50. Put a court ordered public bounty out on Rove's arrest
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HEyHEY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-02-08 01:55 PM
Response to Original message
56. Hate Rove, but can't condone the judge's quip
Justice, even for Rove, has to be objective.
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bobd0 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-02-08 02:12 PM
Response to Reply #56
57. I'm all for The Code of Hammurabi in Rove's case
and Bush's case, and Cheney's case, etc.

Torture is fine too, as long as it's done within the parameters this administration has defined.
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Imagevision Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-02-08 04:19 PM
Response to Original message
60. No respect for Dem's if they allow Rove to walk away from court appearance
Dem's seem weak as garbage, Pelosi should be replaced ASAP!
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MonkeyFunk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-02-08 07:36 PM
Response to Reply #60
61. What court appearance has Rove walked away from?
And what's Nancy Pelosi got to do with this?
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tannybogus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-02-08 07:58 PM
Response to Original message
62. If you have any doubts about this story, check out this site
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Turbineguy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-04-08 01:22 PM
Response to Original message
64. My friend is thinking of selling tickets.
The winner gets to pick Rove's cell mate.
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