Maybe $4 a gallon isn't too much to pay for gas

[SparkyMac]

I detest SUVs. Have you ever been in a shopping center parking lot and have an SUV on each side -- and there is no way to see how to back out ? That's why I hate SUVs.

About once or twice a week we like to ride out early to the local Mall. Except for the food court -- the shops don't open until 10:00AM. I like to get there about 9:00 and get a walk in and then we have a breakfast of sausage biscuits and coffee.

Most days when we leave the front parking area - around 10:00 AM - there will be about 80 to 100 cars there. Well over half are usually SUVs. We left yesterday and I was so shocked I had to stop and do some counting. There were a total of 92 cars in front of the Mall. And THREE of them were SUVs.

I hate to say it -- but it may well be worth paying $4 a gallon to get those damn things off the road.

[mrreowwr_kittty]

1. I hear ya.

And doncha just love it when they park those big behemoths in "compact car" spaces? :grr:

[taterguy]

2. If you rode a bike you wouldn't have to worry about seeing around SUVs

But I guess some environmentally bad things are ok, if they're things that you do

[Richardo]

7. Here's a wiki article on the One Note Samba

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/One_Note_Samba

[taterguy]

14. Interesting but irrelevant

[Fran Kubelik]

21. Sometimes I am certain you're sitting there laughing

Pretending to not understand what people post. Like this incredibly dry humor or something.
I mean, how else can you explain not understanding that he's telling you that your song only has one note (ie you are repetitive) or not knowing that in the southern hemisphere the seasons are different than in the northern hemisphere. If this is the case, then hats off to you, taterguy. :applause:

[taterguy]

70. How did I come up with the hemisphere thing if I only play one note?

Boy does it make me feel superiour when I catch a contradiction in someone else's post.

:yourock: :yourock: :yourock:

[Fran Kubelik]

72. you came up with a hemisphere thing?

What hemisphere thing do you think you came up with?

[taterguy]

74. Whatever hemisphere thing you mentioned in your earlier post

[Richardo]

37. mmmm not really.

You know you'd be doing a much greater service to the environment and your fellow citizens if you stopped being a disgreeable, strident, hectoring ass and maybe constructively suggested how those who do not enjoy a viable bike option might contribute to the reduction of greenhouse gases for the betterment of us all.

My theory is that don't really give a crap about the environment nearly as much as you like being a righteous twerp.

[JANdad]

67. You don't know the half of it

from Taterguy:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=3323522#3330125

[Richardo]

68. Oh man.

Case closed. :pals:

[taterguy]

102. Do not follow someone into another thread to try to continue a disagreement you had elsewhere.

I guess reading comprehension isn't one of your strengths

[JANdad]

110. I don't believe I was "following you"

Simply backing up another posters argument...Sorry you feel threatened...

[taterguy]

111. What does your post have to do with gas prices?

You were clearly continuing a disagreement you had elsewhere.

I'm not threatened, just perplexed that some folks can't follow simple, clear rules.

[cliffordu]

99. Well.....

If you're serious about greenhouse gasses, you are going to have to at least entertain the idea that changing MANY of your habits, if not your entire life is in order.

After 9/11 I moved near a town where I will NEVER have to have a car again.

The environment has almost nothing to do with my decision. I figure it's fucked beyond repair already.

I will no longer easily trade blood for oil, which is exactly what we are all doing.

I have spent zero dollars on gasoline this year.

Had to get rid of the house in Austin, the toys, the career, and the attitude that unbridled consumption was my birthright but the upside is I don't miss the life of 'upward mobility' nearly as much as I thought I would.

I don't owe any man or institution money.

I know everyone I do business with, the people at the post office are my friends.

It takes will and sacrifice. I believe anyone who WANTS to do it can, or at least live smaller.

I'll live in the woods in a tent before I EVER go back to the 'burbs.

Oh, yeah, and I'm 56. My wife is 59 and she does the same number of miles a week as I do.

[RadiationTherapy]

11. i disagree. I walk and still have this issue.

SUVs affect visibility of all those in traffic excepting other SUVs. I think it was a marketing ploy to sell more SUVs!!

[SparkyMac]

20. I think you are on to something ...

I have actually considered buying one myself. But only for self defense.

[Fran Kubelik]

18. come on, dude

Why do you feel the need to be such an asshole about this? Is this like the one thing you have where you can feel superior? It's just kind of...rotten. It's better when people use LESS gas. I'll grant you that it's even better when they use none, but not everyone is there yet.

[taterguy]

30. If we're gonna get all psychoanalytical it stems from childhood

My favorite fairy tale was the Emperor Has No Clothes. That part about how something was glaringly obvious but no one was willing to say anything.

People drive too much.

Some people need cars but they don't need them all the time. There are plenty of trips that could be easily done with other means but people use cars for no other good reason than that "Every body else does it"

That mentality bothers me so I speak out about it.

Sorry.

ps: There are lots of other things I feel superior about but how often does GD give me an excuse to brag about my exquisite musical taste or the time that I did that 18 mile Grand Canyon hike in one day?

[EstimatedProphet]

61. Maybe people do drive too much here

But that doesn't mean that complete abandonment of automobiles is necessary, or even possible. I think you should see an opthamalogist, because you only see in black and white.

[bobbolink]

83. You obviously feel superior to poor folk, and proud of it.

"Sorry."

No you're not.

[taterguy]

85. This has nothing to do with income level

I know lots of rich folks that drive when they don't have to.

I know middle class folks that drive when they don't have to.

I know poor people that drive when they don't have to.

It annoys me no matter how much money they have.

[bobbolink]

86. It has EVERYTHING To do with poverty.

You are quite ill-informed, and don't seem to care how many people you hurt.

That's a democratic value now?

:puke:

[taterguy]

90. Are you confusing me with the OP?

He's the one celebrating higher prices.

Not me.

[bobbolink]

91. Apparently so. Although, you are also "annoyed" with poor people, claiming

they/we waste gas, too.

How many poor people have you observed doing this? Do you actually KNOW them, and know what they are dealing with?

Because I live around a LOT of poor people, and I can guarantee you, NOBODY is "wasting gas".

[taterguy]

92. Here's what I think is wasteful

Using a car for trips of less than three miles with common sense exceptions.

Like when you're carrying lots of cargo, or the weather is abysmal, or if you have some disability.

I see hundreds of people doing this every day. I don't have access to their tax returns so I don't know how poor they are though. Like I said, their income level doesn't matter to me.

[bobbolink]

94. And what I'm getting is that you really don't care. You get to judge, and that's that.

May you walk in our shoes someday.

[Carnea]

95. Well one mile... Three miles is a bit of a hike. But I agree,

I see people all the time drive to their mailbox. No shit. or drive their kids 200 yards to the bus stop and the kids look like they could use a walk.

[bobbolink]

105. Let me know when you are poor, working two jobs, and carry your two small children a mile.

I'll be happy to listen then.

[fudge stripe cookays]

25. I've got someone you simply HAVE to meet.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x3343425#3343647

You can compare the size of your penises. :D

[asthmaticeog]

38. I ride a bike. I have trouble with seeing around SUVs.

Yet I have no trouble at all seeing how to avoid being a smug prick about how I get to work. What's blocking your vision?

[EstimatedProphet]

42. It's a shame smug narcissism can't be turned into energy...

[Starbucks Anarchist]

57. And if I stood on a ladder, I'd be Yao Ming.

[LanternWaste]

76. To a degree, everyone subscribes to that

"But I guess some environmentally bad things are ok, if they're things that you do"

To a degree, everyone subscribes to that. I imagine many people simply differentiate the degrees of damage being done vs. the neccesity (real or imagioned) of thier own excess.

For example, I usually have a lamp on at night in my living room. I really don't have to because I'm usually being lazy and watching television. I can easily imagine someone denigrating my excesses and wastefulness and I wouldn't have any room to defend myself.

Yet I am still active in local environmental causes which I believe are excessive and wasteful.

Someone will always conserve the environment better than I, and someone will always waste the environment more than I. I certainly don;t see that as a reason to quit my activism or pointing my fingers.

We are all hypocrites-- some of us recognize that and still try to do the right thing.

[Hydra]

3. It certainly IS

I can't afford to go drive to work on Friday unless I get my rebate check tomorrow.

The SUV people are still driving. The people who were just staying afloat aren't.

[wryter2000]

13. We have a winner

People with those expensive behemoths will manage. Others closer to the borderline will go under. (Sorry about the mixed metaphors.)

[Hydra]

19. I knew what you meant :D

They could afford the expensive behemoths to begin with. I, on the other hand, can't afford to commute with my 30mpg car.

[Rosemary2205]

35. There are SUV people just staying afloat.

An early 90's SUV got about the same gas mileage as early 90's sedans and had the double benefit of many more uses. Someone driving an old SUV is probably not the evil rich.

[hfojvt]

80. Bus and train ridership are way up

Some people are probably saving money with the higher gas prices.

[DainBramaged]

4. It is causing EVERY auto manufacturer to rethink their economic model

[tridim]

5. I saw a Hummer on the road today with massive aftermarket monster truck wheels.

They were probably 6 feet tall. I bet that monstrosity gets about 1 mile per dollar, yet the idiot keeps driving it because (I'm guessing) it makes his tiny penis feel larger.

[Whoa_Nelly]

6. Thank you for demonizing me

especially since I haven't the money or job at the moment to change to a better mpg car.

But, that's okay.

you can hate me.

[Name removed]

15. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[bobbolink]

27. Yes, it's ever so "liberal" to denigrate those who aren't in the fast lane, eh?

I give up trying to educate "liberals" about those of us who aren't in their economic bracket.

[Rosemary2205]

28. you'd be surprised at how little the MPG advantage is.

Oh sure, if you go from an Excursion to a Prius. But people who own the biggest SUV's bought them for a practical reason and it's not likely they'll be happy in a dinkmobile. SUV's didn't evolve to this kind of popularity in a vacuum. The haters need to be thinking about why they became so popular and then figure out how to give that to the American public in the most fuel efficient way possible. As it stands right now, an SUV that seats 6 and a large car that seats 6 are not far enough off on mileage to have a financial payoff in the lifespan of the car based only on gas prices.

[Whoa_Nelly]

32. I didn't buy my car--won it in a contest in 2000

it was a godsend for me as I needed a new car at the time.

It's been a good car, gets about 15-19 in town and 24-33 on the highway depending on the terrain.

It's a momvan.

It's all I have.
If I can get another teaching position, then maybe I can get a loan.
Until then, am all but tapped out :cry:


BTW--High gas prices are caused by the speculative oil market, not the large vehicle owners.
Just thought I'd share that.

[Rosemary2205]

33. Hey, your momvan gets slightly better than a new Toyota Avalon!!

And the Avalon can do 5 adults at best, an uncomfortable squeeze at that. 2 Avalon owners I know are getting about 14 city and 22 highway.

And yes, I am right out there with you screaming about the facts on the oil market. You are completely right.

[Individualist]

8. Yeah; who cares how many poor die of hunger. Getting those damn things off the road

is far more important.

[Lex]

9. Not an either/or proposition.

nt

[Hydra]

10. Poor? We're supposed to care about them?

"There are no poor in America! I make it a point of ignoring them" :sarcasm:

Seriously, why is it all about "What I want" in America rather than "who will this hurt?"

[kestrel91316]

22. Getting those damned things off the road will, amazingly enough,

help lower the cost of gas for the poor (and everyone else, too, but the benefit will be greatest for those closest to the brink).

The ones who keep driving gas hogs when they don't have to are the ones who don't give a damn about the poor. And don't you forget it.

[JANdad]

64. Ummm...My gas hog ran supplies twice

Into Baton Rouge to a staging area for the evacuees thank you very much! Don't you sit there behind your keyboard and pretend to know what is in people heart and minds...

[SammyWinstonJack]

73. .

:thumbsup:

[cliffordu]

100. Well, gosh!! That justifies two whole trips in the little thing, then, don't it??

[JANdad]

101. But if I did not have it at all

Those supplies never would have made it there now would they...since no one else at wanted to go...

[wryter2000]

12. I wouldn't mind

Unfortunately, we're already at $4.50 here with no end in sight.

Still, I'd pay it happily to get every Repugnican out of office and the SUVs off the road.

But, I cry for the people who have to drive large vehicles for their jobs. They can't take this.

[rock]

16. I might agree if big oil wasn't making such outrageous profits

:(

[Warpy]

17. SUVs, monster trucks and momvans

My dad called them "those goddamned rolling billboards" because he could never see around them in a lot or on the road.

I'll be glad to see them go, too.

Unfortunately, too many people got suckered by the low election season gas prices in the fall of 2006, and now they're in an upside down loan position, no way to sell them or trade them in to get out from under the high loan payments, high insurance payments, and high fuel charges.

My charitable feelings don't extend to the mofos who insist on parking them in spaces clearly marked "compact," with the end result that I have to enter my car through the hatchback.

[SparkyMac]

23. Why are all the people who drive them so stupid ?

Have you ever noticed that a driver of a SUV can't make a right hand turn unless she is talking on a cell phone ?

[TommyO]

45. This kind of stereotyping and misogyny doesn't belong here on DU.

[uppityperson]

79. Are you really this prejudiced and misogynistic?

or is it a personal issue?

[krabigirl]

117. momvans" - can you be any more degrading?!?!?!

[nebula]

24. It is when oil companies are making 40 billion a year in profit

[bobbolink]

26. Yeah, that's right... FUCK ALL THE POOR FOLK.

After all, it's worth it.

:mad:

[spanone]

29. that parking lot thing happens to me ALL the time.....if you're alone, it's russian roullette

...and when they give you the grill.....grrrrr

[DutchLiberal]

31. Americans complain about expensive gas, but it is still very cheap...

...compared to prices in Europe. We have alway envied the Americans for their incredibly low gas prices. And still now, with gas prices soaring and Americans complaining, you're *still* much cheaper off than us. Go figure...

[Rosemary2205]

34. apples to oranges

what is the price of the gas and what are the added taxes in each case?

You can't compare the end price of gasoline between Europe and the US until the taxes are stripped out.

[DutchLiberal]

36. What do I care about that? I'm talking *prices*, whether taxes are added or not...

[uppityperson]

44. Difference is whether you get health care paid for by gas taxes.

Choices: pay $4/gal for gas, and pay for own health/dental care, pay $6/gal for gas and get health/dental care paid for. Some places you are not just buying the gas, but the extra taxes get you something else. Pull those extra taxes out to compare plain gas costs, or else add in dental/health care to gas costs.

[Marrah_G]

63. And college, and really great public transit, and you are tiny countries with dense populations

[DutchLiberal]

89. Yeah, France, Germany, Poland etc. are tiny countries...

:eyes:

[LostinVA]

97. Compared to the US they are

If you have such problems with Americans, why are you on an American political discussion board?

[Marrah_G]

103. I am not sure what reality you are living in but.....

YES, in comparison the US is far larger and Has states bigger then any EU country.

Roll your eyes some more, because frankly, you are the one looking like a moron.

[LostinVA]

98. You ruin your whole "argument" right there

[Johnny V.]

40. I'm really sick of these comparisons with Europe

you can drive from one end to the other end of the typical European country on half a tank of gas. If you don't want to drive just take a train, we don't have that option. Plus we have far more oil within our borders than they do.

[DutchLiberal]

87. You can drive from one end of France/Spain/Germany to the other on half a tank?

Man, you're ignorant.

[Initech]

50. I'm sick of this crap.

Look, in Europe, most of the cities are clumped together and have better mass transportation than we have here. It is much easier to get around in Europe without a car than it is here. Here, not everyone lives in Boston, DC, or New York and we don't get mass transit. Shit. :eyes:

[DutchLiberal]

88. Are you always this hostile? I recommend anger management.

Jesus, the fuss people make about one innocent remark...

[Initech]

93. No, but the US - Europe gas comparisons really irritate me.

[Marrah_G]

53. You can't compare europe to the US

We are bigger, more spread out, don't have the same transit systems, etc etc. I would love to see us set up more like europe but I have to live in this reality.

[LostinVA]

96. If we had the social services Europe has, I wouldn't complain about gas prices

But we don't. We don't even have real public transportation, which Europe also has.

Meanwhile, our prices keep going up as the oil companies score record profits.

[DailyGrind51]

39. I hate those things during the winter months

when I am driving my old RWD six-cylinder Mustang 20 mph in second gear just to keep the car from fish-tailing and some jerk in his Durango is tail-gaiting so close, I can see the ketchup in his beard in my rear-view mirror.

[Jack_DeLeon]

41. I do think the high prices are a good thing...

It forces some people to ration voluntarily. It will make our finite oil supply last that much longer, it will also force people to change thier lifestyle to one that is more sustainable and look for alternate methods of doing things. All of this will hopefully make things not so bad when we finally do start having actual shorages due to a reduced supply of oil.

[TommyO]

46. If there were valid alternatives for most people, you might be right

Unfortunately it's impacting those least able to shoulder the added cost the hardest, and the worst thing is that it's artificially high due to asinine speculation.

[TommyO]

43. Of course, you're not considering the impact of $4.00+ gas

on those living on a fixed income, like my retired mother. Thank you for your selfish concerns.

[Jack_DeLeon]

48. She is your mother, not ours...

you take care of her. We all have our own families and our individual burdens, we all do what we can with what we have. I help out my grandmother and my aunt that lives with her, honestly at thier ages they dont really do that much driving so while the cost of living is going up we are still doing okay.

Does your retired mother really do that much driving? If so then maybe she like the rest of us simply has to adapt to these changing condidtions and figure out whats really important to her.

[TommyO]

52. Your lack of compassion and understanding is astounding!

[Jack_DeLeon]

54. Damn right my understanding is astounding...

We cant just keep going on paying trivial amounts of money and wasting a finite resource our entire civilization runs on. Once its gone unless we have alternatives our civilization collapses. This current time is a transition period, and its rough, but it has to happen. We cant keep doing business as usual. Even our Presidential Candidate, Barack Obama, said so himself.

"We can't drive our SUVs and eat as much as we want and keep our homes on 72 degrees at all times ... and then just expect that other countries are going to say OK," Obama said."

Once we have actual shortages thats it, we are fucked, right now there are not shortages because we are rationing voluntarily due to price, and for better or worse increasing price is the best way to get people to cut back and find alternatives.

Yes its not fair, and its hurting some people very badly, but the world isnt fair, someone people dont even have cars or modern luxuries that we have so I'm not going to sit here and shed tears for people who have had their whole lives to prepare, people who have lived through the oil embargos and still went back to life as normal.

A smart person learns from their mistakes, a wise person learns from the mistakes of others. The writing has been on the wall for a while if people are only now seeing it thats not my fault.

[SammyWinstonJack]

77. Isn't the US Air Force the largest gas guzzling source in this country?

Maybe we should stop attacking oil rich countries just to steal their oil, while wasting even more oil.

[JANdad]

65. God am I glad I left Texas...

Self righteous pompus assholes...

[Marrah_G]

66. I have to say, you are a real piece of work

[Initech]

47. That's exactly what those fuckers want you to think.

We pay $2.00 a gallon for fucking nothing. It's all market speculation and commodities trading. Yeah, it may be a pain in the ass to deal with those gas-guzzling fuck you mobiles, but there's got to be a way to get them back down to tolerable levels.

[Marrah_G]

49. Now see the Humvee drivers can AFFORD the 4 $ gas

The working poor are the ones who are struggling to get gas to get to work, higher food costs and come Winter, heating bills that are astronomical. By Winter we may well be paying 600 dollars for 100 gallons of oil.

Those who can least afford it are the ones who are really going to pay.

There is nothing good about the rising cost of gas in my life. Not one good thing. I can't go out and buy a new efficient car. I can't go buy better energy saving heating units. I can't consider solar panels.

The working poor are stuck.

I now hang laundry out and have planted a garden. I drive as little as possible and shop as carefully as I can.

There is no money left for kids clothes, school supplies or day trips of any kind.

Yes I know how pathetic it sounds, but frankly my blood boils everytime I see someone cheer on the price of gas going up.

[KillCapitalism]

51. You're right about that.

A lot of the large SUV drivers can afford the gas & won't have to even think about giving them up. $10 gas is nothing to someone who's pulling down a few million a year.

[Dukkha]

56. it is still a cheaper solution to their 'problem'

Gas: $4.00 a gallon
Viagra: $10.00 a pill

[The2ndWheel]

81. Yeah, that's the risk we take when we universalize life

Or have it universalized for us. Either way.

When the working poor can't just say, "the hell with this crap", walk away, and start something else.

When assuming it won't feel like a cold climate living in cold climates come winter.

Cheap energy has given people a lot. However, it hasn't come without cost. Most of us wouldn't exist without cheap energy. When physical reality catches up, it can suck.

[PVnRT]

82. Yeah, but how else will people feel smug and superior?

Really, who cares if the proles suffer? THEY WILL DO WHAT WE TELL THEM TO!!! :sarcasm:

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

55. Awwww, Boo Hoo For You.

4 dollars is way too much, causes a ton of suffering to a ton of people (though I don't expect your selfish ass to get that), and SUV's ain't goin anywhere.

[tammywammy]

58. My very good friend has a Toyota 4 Runner

It's paid off. She cannot afford to have a car payment. She's paying $60 every 3 days right now to commute to work.

She cannot afford to move closer to work right now.

She screwed.

[Dreamer Tatum]

59. $4 gas is going to get a lot of people off the road, not just SUVs

Funny how many people you're willing to let suffer to fulfill your preferences.

[SammyWinstonJack]

78. SUV bashing is an all time favorite thing too do here on DU.

Has been for quite a while now. Way before gas was $4/gal. That won't change anytime soon.

[Dont_Bogart_the_Pretzel]

60. WHAT????! "but it may well be worth paying $4 a gallon"

I hope people like you like $4.00++,

I can't afford it and the only jobs (if any) are 35 miles away, and so job seeking is a real depressing and a BIG pain on my checking / savings account.
So I get average 21+MPG @ 55-65MPH and I'm not going/can't afford a "car". :rant off:

[bobbolink]

106. Did you notice you didn't get a compassionate reply to your "rant"?

Interesting how "progressives" think EVERYONE has plenty of $$$, isn't it?

:grr:

[JerseygirlCT]

62. Well, people will drive what they want. But I do think specific spaces

for compact cars needs to make a come-back. Parking in between two big cars is scary - getting out is a crap-shoot.

Make compact spaces, and then enforce it with towing.

[bobbolink]

107. Boy, do I agree with that! Being effectively blinded by monsters *IS* scary!

Thanks for the fine idea!

Although, I'm willing to bet, if the designated compact spaces are in a choice location, there will be Hummers taking up TWO of them.

:grr:

[JerseygirlCT]

112. I was going to say - that should be enforced like handicapped

spaces... but those are rarely enforced, too. And that's even worse!

[Carnea]

69. If the money was going to mass transit I would agree.

In fact even at these prices I would support another $1.50 a gallon gas tax to use toward mass transit and alternate fuel programs.

That said I don't blame SUV and Minivan owners. Ironically it's the over cautious child seat rules that cause the need for such vehicles. (Warning old guy back in my day moment coming up)

When I was a kid we could drive from CT to Florida on vacation in the back window sill of the car. Kids could crawl around the back seat to avoid fidgeting and you could fit a good four to six kids in the back of a '72 Mustang. Now its all no front seats facing backwards Nasa style child seats two to a row crap. You need a minivan if you have more than two kids or if they have friends.

[colinmom71]

71. I respectfully must disagree...

As others have said above, the ones who are truly being harmed aren't just SUV drivers. The ones I worry about the most are persons who no choice but to drive less efficient vehicles - the disabled with wheelchair accessible vans or mini-vans. Those things guzzle gas too but they're necessary for some people and their families.

But then I've also known some parents of disabled kids who found a larger SUV provided enough room for their child's wheelchair and/or gear with some room left over for their other kids' stuff or for luggage for family vacations. Different folks have different reasons for owning the vehicle they have. It's not always a matter of seeking a trend, of "keeping up with the Joneses", or TPC (Tiny Penis Compensation) syndrome...

[DefenseLawyer]

75. Geez

Do you REALLY think the price of gas is based on too many SUVs on the road? You really buy into the "this is a supply and demand problem" excuse? If demand is outstripping supply then why are refineries operating at 85% capacity? We would be better off in the long run if we all drove more fuel efficient cars, but just cavalierly telling the working poor to suck it up and pay for it is not something I can get on board with you on.

[bobbolink]

108. "just cavalierly telling the working poor to suck it up and pay for it "

:applause:

Very well said.

Not that it will be heard.

Some people have their minds made up, and don't wish to be confused with the facts.

[uponit7771]

84. Fuel cost 4 cents a gallon gas in Saudi Arabia & Venezualians pay 12 cents!!!

[Carnea]

104. Higher gas prices caused by road taxes are a win win for America.

We need to institute LOCAL gas taxes between $1.50 and $2.00 a gallon and put that money into expanding mass transit.

[bobbolink]

113. With that ignorant statement, I hope you "win" by being poor and losing all because of

your ignorant proposal!

It's the only way people like you can ever learn.

[Carnea]

118. So I take it your against funding mass transit for the poor? NT

[orleans]

109. $4 is too high to pay when these fucking speculators are the assholes

raising the prices (which the "enron loophole" closure provision in the farm bill will stop)

also, i think a lot of those suv drivers are not conserving gas -- they keep driving as fast as they want -- they don't care about conserving, because they bought those suvs to begin with. (i'm not saying everyone--i realize some people still have a social conscience who own suvs, but i think the overall market that suvs appealed to don't care.) someone i know said he bought another pick up truck and didn't care about the price of gas because he figures the more gas he buys the more he supports america, etc. (obviously he's republican)

[Two Americas]

114. unbelievable

This is contrary to every principle and ideal of the Democratic party.

Working people HAVE to drive to get to where the jobs are, and the more poor that people are the more this is the case.

You don't like SUVs, so you want to punish those who are struggling the most to advance your personal agenda.

We should all be strongly advocating public transportation, not bikes. All of this is a cruel joke on poor people and working people, and is EXACTLY why the right wingers can call us "elitists" with effect.

Bikes are not an option, and $4 a gallon gas is not an option for the very people we should be defending and supporting if we are going to call ourselves Democrats and claim that we represent any sort of serious alternative to the right wingers.

I will tell you what I hate - malls. If you want to turn the country back from reliance on automobiles and if "personal choices" are so important to you, why are you frequenting and supporting a mall? Another thing I hate is this new "personal choice" liberalism that so neatly complements the Reagan right wing "bootstrap" bullshit and that sabotages any and all attempts at building support for political solutions to social problems through public policies and programs. "Personal choices" - such as driving a certain car or riding a bike - are not political solutions to social problems, they are libertarianism with an "organic" label slapped on it to make the few, the upscale and the self-righteous, feel good about themselves and look down their noses at working people. It represents a knife to the heart of the Democratic party.

[LWolf]

115. While I don't disagree with you in the abstract,

the timing sucks.

With the economy tanking, who can afford to replace their SUVs? Gas prices on top of the housing bubble, unemployment, food prices, and general economic insecurity is terrible for too many people.

[krabigirl]

116. Don't be so quick to judge.

My CR-V gets better mileage than many sedans. Heck, it gets as good of mileage as my 2001 Beetle..imagine that? Costs me $45 every two weeks to fill the tank, since I don't drive much. I'd love to get a hybrid wagon to carry my two kids, but I can't afford a new car, sorry.

I wonder why people don't have hatred for sports cars and German luxury sedans? Those burn gas like crazy.

[mdmc]

119. we need public transport

now