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frogcycle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 09:55 AM
Original message
Dad Accused of Forcing Girl to Kill Pet Cat
Edited on Fri Mar-14-08 10:51 AM by frogcycle
Source: Comcast

A man was jailed Thursday on charges that he forced his 7-year-old daughter to kill the family cat by holding a knife in her hand and making her stab the pet.

Danield J. Collins, 39, told his children during a visit to his home Sunday that he wanted them to "learn how to kill" and gave his 11-year-old son a knife to do it, according to an affidavit filed in the case.

The boy tried to save the cat by hiding it under a sofa bed and putting ketchup on a knife when Collins went to the bathroom. But when the father realized that the cat was not dead, he forced his daughter to hold the knife and then held her hand tightly as he drove the knife into the animal, Muncie police Detective Jami Brown said.

Police said Collins stabbed and strangled the cat himself, and told his son to throw the dead pet in the trash. Officers retrieved the carcass to be used as evidence.


Read more: http://www6.comcast.net/news/articles/national/2008/03/... /



Edit for clarification, since, as usual, people tend to read between the lines and jump to conclusions (what else is new?):

I am NOT saying this guy was/is in the military. My entire point is that the referenced thread about the shooting of the 10-year-old is ranting on and on with little or no factual information, and making broad-brush condemnations of the military as a bunch of monsters. I grant that some scumbags are getting in to the military, whereas in saner times without bush's atrocity of a war that would be better controlled, BUT, the military is not CREATING monsters. Here is a prime example of someone completely fucked up in the head in Muncie Indiana. So why not condemn all of Muncie as a bunch of monsters?

end of edit


Just read the thread about the troops shooting the 10-year-old.

Understand something, people. The volunteer army is a sham. What once was what many of us still want it to be - an organization of highly patriotic individuals with a desire to defend the country, using force when necessary in the face of threats (with "a few bad apples" that it polices and eliminates asap) - has of necessity, due to bush's illegal war of aggression and brutal occupation, reduced recruiting standards time and again. People with criminal records are accepted, low-intelligence individuals are accepted, and, in all likelihood, people with the character of the guy in this article are accepted, because the flow of "good guys" into the service has diminished and the demand for more headcount has escalated.

I don't try to rationalize the killing of the 10-year-old; I wasn't there and accept that there is some remote possibility it was an honest error (people DO shoot the little old lady targets in the training exercises; it IS extremely difficult to make the right snap judgment every time). By the same token, I know there are assholes like this brute now in the service, and they are probably licking their chops for the chance to "plug somebody." When you recruit scumbags, you can train them to kill, and give them the equipment with which to do it, but you cannot train the scumbag-ness out of them.

People like this guy are unreconstructable and any sane society would eliminate them. Same goes for most of the hate crime perps. We are so fucked up we will eventually self destruct as a species.
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AndyA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 10:02 AM
Response to Original message
1. What the fuck is wrong with people today?
Sick crazy ass bastards. They cannot be human. Stories like this are deeply disturbing to me, it shows that so many have such little value for life.

My elderly Cat Max had to be put to sleep in 2002, and I still miss him. I just can't comprehend how a human being could do such a thing to a sweet Cat. And what a horrible memory to etch into his children's minds.

The man is a monster.
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IndyOp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 10:21 AM
Response to Reply #1
11. On edit - removed. I misunderstood the OP. Apologies. (n/t)
Edited on Fri Mar-14-08 10:48 AM by IndyOp
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JBoy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 10:35 AM
Response to Reply #11
20. Sorry, nothing in the linked article says that.
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IndyOp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 10:50 AM
Response to Reply #20
25. Thanks. I removed my comment. I apologize. I thought I understood the OP, but didn't read article.
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JBoy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 10:54 AM
Response to Reply #25
27. No problem, the OP was confusing as hell.
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frogcycle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 10:56 AM
Response to Reply #27
29. yeah, sorry
I went back and edited

I read the two stories back-to-back early in the morning, drew an analogy in my head, and started typing, probably in midthought. I do that a lot. Very few people ever have the slightest idea what the hell I am talking about.
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IndyOp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 11:16 AM
Response to Reply #29
30. Keep on talking, keep on writing - you've got heart frogcycle, and we need that! (n/t)
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katty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 11:23 AM
Response to Reply #1
32. this is so deeply sick - WTF is going on?!
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Mountainman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 10:05 AM
Response to Original message
2. The military is made up of a lot of individuals. The vast majority of them are no different from
you. They are not some supper race with kill kill kill on the brain. Also, when you spend time in a war, it effects you in ways that you never intended. Life becomes cheap after so much killing, survival is utmost on your mind. I'm not making excuses for killing innocent people but just trying to point out that condemning everyone in the military with the same condemnation as the ones killing the 10 year old girl isn't fair.
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frogcycle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 10:12 AM
Response to Reply #2
5. not what I intended at all
Edited on Fri Mar-14-08 10:12 AM by frogcycle
I was trying to say that sadly, the military has been polluted by such scum, and in such numbers that their self-policing ability is overwhelmed. I know that the vast majority of them are as I described the "good guys." My point was that we should no more condemn all military for the 10-year-old incident than we should condemn everyone in Muncie for this one. Sorry I was not clearer.
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Mountainman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 10:17 AM
Response to Reply #5
9. OK, my misreading of your post also. Sorry
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Xenotime Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 07:48 PM
Response to Reply #2
49. I think you are right. There will be a whole new breed of killers...
that come back to America when we get a Dem President in the WH
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DS1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 10:05 AM
Response to Original message
3. dead cat = war in Iraq rant on the military
Gotta love the DU
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frogcycle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 10:14 AM
Response to Reply #3
6. see my response above
also visit my website www.Zeitlangers.com
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DS1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 10:16 AM
Response to Reply #6
8. have you been in the military in the last 5 years?
I'm just wondering where you get off making the claim that the military is so polluted with scum it cannot police itself.
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iaviate1 Donating Member (289 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 10:23 AM
Response to Reply #8
12. I can think of a few examples.
Illegal invasions and occupations, illegal detentions, torture, outsourcing to Blackwater... sounds like a big mess to me.
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DS1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 10:24 AM
Response to Reply #12
13. not relevant to the subject
try again
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frogcycle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 10:43 AM
Response to Reply #8
22. I give up
You're right. I don't know my ass from first base.

I defer to these guys: http://ivaw.org/wintersoldier
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14thColony Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 12:04 PM
Response to Reply #8
35. I have been and still am
Edited on Fri Mar-14-08 12:12 PM by 14thColony
in the military, 18 years now. And I can tell you he's right. Standards are dropping to a scary level. The Army is waiving serious violent misdemeanor convictions and even felony convictions now to keep the recruiting numbers on-target. The number of recruits requiring "moral waivers" for criminal convictions (talking robbery, agg battery, etc, not just toking a joint) went from 4.6 percent in 2004 to over 12 percent in 2007. Alchohol and drug abuse waivers are also rising steadily, yet the number of recruits per-year remains steady (since annual goals don't change much). If the number of recruits remains steady yet the number of criminal waivers increases, then the only logical conclusion is the overall number of criminals in the military (mainly the Army) is rising.

While that's still not a big percentage, the military's systems of discipline, which resides mainly at the unit-level, is simply not designed to deal with number like this. The assumption is that administering discipline is the exception; most Commanders and First Sergeants don't have time to deal with it full-time because they have units to run, and in I'd guess 90% of cases they are the ones administering justice in the military. I am currently dealing with three cases requiring Article 15 proceedings at one time as the commander of a unit of only 120 people. Four years ago I commanded a unit of 220 people and dealt with one Article 15 case during my whole tenure. Yes, it is happening.
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frogcycle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 05:34 PM
Response to Reply #35
45. Thanks for the input
I regret that my post was taken by some as an attack on the military as a whole. It was intended to be far from that. You made the point I could not.

I never was in the military, because I was 4F. I grew up in a military family, and wanted to be a fighter pilot. I came "this close" to getting into NROTC, and had I made it, I might have been flying A4's or A6's over VN. I was raised to be proud of "The Corps" and look down my nose at "swab jockeys", "dogfaces", and "flyflys." That said, though, there was a grudging acceptance that maybe those guys hearts were in the right place, even if they WERE inferior human beings! :)

It saddens me no end to see the organizations that have been built and refined to protect America used cynically as tools of imperialism. gwb is not the first so to do, to be sure. He has just been more baldfaced about it while treating like dirt the very people he commands to do his bidding. His twofold assault on the military - assigning a mission that is unjustified and unachievable, and at the same time extending tours and squeezing pennies w/respect to family service, medical service, etc. is going to have a long lasting affect. It is going to be harder and harder to present military service as anything BUT a last-resort escape from an even worse situation.

Thank you for your service.

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global1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 10:09 AM
Response to Original message
4. I Wonder If 41 Did This To 43 When He Was A Kid........nt
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barb162 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 10:15 AM
Response to Original message
7. Sick bastard n/t
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mike_c Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 10:19 AM
Response to Original message
10. sel delete....
Edited on Fri Mar-14-08 10:30 AM by mike_c
Deleted-- my original response was to the OP, not the article it references.
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DS1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 10:26 AM
Response to Reply #10
15. Where did it say he's in the military?
I must have missed that part in the article
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mike_c Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 10:30 AM
Response to Reply #15
17. oops, I edited it....
eom
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raccoon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 10:25 AM
Response to Original message
14. This man must be batshit crazy. This is a terrible kind of abuse. nt
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last_texas_dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 10:27 AM
Response to Original message
16. Very sad
I just can't begin to understand what makes some people the way they are, and I know we aren't supposed to... but wow, this is scary stuff.

But apparently this dude's a totally different person when he's not drunk. That's reassuring. :sarcasm:
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JBoy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 10:33 AM
Response to Original message
18. Hold on! Where does it say this guy was in the military??
No doubt he's a sick fuck, and it's a horrible thing he did to his children.

BUT - there's nothing in the linked article saying anything about him being or having been in the military.

WTF has the shooting in Iraq got to do with this case??
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frogcycle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 10:40 AM
Response to Reply #18
21. geez that was not the point
the point was not that HE is/was in the military. The point was he's from Muncie!

All the ranting and raving in that thread about the ten-year-old saying the military are a bunch of monsters is as logical as saying everyone from Muncie is a monster.

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kestrel91316 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 10:35 AM
Response to Original message
19. I can't read about this stuff. Tales of animal abuse this severe
(especially involving cats) almost make me physically ill.

My cats are my CHILDREN. I realize pets are not considered family members to many, but there is simply NO ROOM in civilized society for anyone who behaves like this, and tries to make their own child an abuser too.

Let me have at this guy. I know JUST the perfect punishment.
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Sock Puppet Donating Member (624 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 10:44 AM
Response to Reply #19
23. it's also horrific child abuse.
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ryanmuegge Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 10:47 AM
Response to Original message
24. People are such douchebags to cats sometimes.
Edited on Fri Mar-14-08 10:49 AM by ryanmuegge
The economy has created the military situation that exists today.
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frogcycle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 10:54 AM
Response to Reply #24
28. actually, no
george bush's obscenity of a war has created the pressurecooker environment.

economic pressures don't create monsters; lack of volunteers (and where is the surprise in that?) so recruiters waive restrictions in order to make their numbers are what allows an increase in undesireables
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ryanmuegge Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 12:14 PM
Response to Reply #28
37. Yes, but the lack of decent paying jobs and high cost of college make joining the military much more
Edited on Fri Mar-14-08 12:24 PM by ryanmuegge
attractive, creating more cannon fodder. If there were no economic incentives to joining the military, fewer people would. Certainly, if there were no wars to fight, there would be no demand for volunteers, and thus no incentive for recruiters to engage in questionable practices to hit their numbers. This is nothing new, though, as the US is the world's preemptive, imperial military hegemon (and has been for several decades). As sure as the sun rises, regardless of who is president, the US will create new wars to fight. This did not just start with Bush. There will always be a demand for military service because of our foreign policy, particularly with the current cold resource wars with China, and also because the United States' military superiority is all that she has (again, due to the economic conditions). This is only going to get worse as oil becomes harder to find.

There are significant economic incentives to join the military. Many things that have been inaccessible for many in the Reagan/Bush/Clinton/Bush economies can be had by joining the military and being sent to Iraq. How hard is it to get health insurance, for example, right now? How hard is it to find a decent paying, stable, consistent job right now for most people? Pretty fucking hard.

I don't think it's a logical leap to think that, in a horrific economy, that the military becomes much more attractive and attracts more volunteers. And, in a country that is the militaristic, hegemonic bully of the world who is fighting for the last reserves of the world's most important resource (oil), there is going to be a strong demand for volunteers, and therefore more incentive for military recruiters to let people who aren't in the military because of some high-headed, moralistic, patriotic reason.

By the way, I wasn't making an excuse for people hurting cats. The guys an idiot. People who hurt cats are idiots. How stupid does somebody have to be to read my post like that? I was responding to the original poster's commentary about the notion of the all volunteer army. I do think it's absolutely idiotic to blame all of this on Bush, though. Certainly, he exacerbated the situation, but the need for more and more volunteers, regardless of how fit they are for service, is a logical outcome of several US policies that have spanned many administrations.


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Lorien Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 11:30 AM
Response to Reply #24
33. No, there's no excuse for being a sadistic psychopath
His actions have nothing to do with the economy. I didn't see anything in the story that referred to military service either (though I may have missed it). We live in a sick culture that glorifies killing and violence. A person who is already a sociopath with sadistic tendencies might think that teaching their kids how to murder something they love is somehow a good thing-because they don't understand love and compassion to begin with. I had a relative like this who, when he found out that his young son loved the family rooster, forced the child to kill it and eat it. The boy grew into a man who hated killing anything (thankfully) and was estranged from his father.

I just hope that those kids can be placed in a safer environment ASAP and that the father gets some serious psychological help. People who enjoy killing defenseless animals are usually only a breath away from doing the same to children.
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Hissyspit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 10:53 AM
Response to Original message
26. He wouldn't have done that if I had been in the room with him.
Sick fucker.

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1620rock Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 11:22 AM
Response to Reply #26
31. I would like one hour alone in a room with that sub-human monster.
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Gemini Cat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 11:48 AM
Response to Original message
34. Sick fucker.
Somedays there aren't enough words.

I love cats.
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Hannah Bell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 02:32 PM
Response to Reply #34
42. How about the KIDS? That's some serious
mental trauma.
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OhioChick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 12:06 PM
Response to Original message
36. Excuse my French...
But this is really fucked up.
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14thColony Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 12:16 PM
Response to Original message
38. Idea!
Where's that tiger that escaped from its cage at some zoo and chewed on some people? Give Mr. Muncie a knife and let him 'git 'er done' with that kitty. I bet he sobers up real quick.
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OhioChick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 12:17 PM
Response to Reply #38
39. Good Idea. n/t
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DS1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 12:26 PM
Response to Reply #38
40. It's already dead
shot and killed by the police, I believe
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mitchum Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 12:27 PM
Response to Original message
41. May his death be equally terrifying and pointless
sick motherfucker
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BreweryYardRat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 03:03 PM
Response to Original message
43. You don't even want to know what I'd consider an acceptable punishment for this filth.
Edited on Fri Mar-14-08 03:04 PM by seawolf
Really, seriously, you don't. Because then you'd be condemning me for even suggesting it.
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Bigleaf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 03:11 PM
Response to Original message
44. If I witnessed this sick fuck doing this, I'd take my baseball bat to him
and believe me, he'd be feeling the big hurt cause I'd be swinging for the fences. I don't give a flying fuck why he did it. When it comes to kids and/or innocent animals, all bets are off with me. This shit brings out a nasty, mean streak in me.
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ThatsMyBarack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 05:46 PM
Response to Original message
46. It's sad enough when a sweet kitty dies....
....but killing for no reason.... :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:
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and-justice-for-all Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 06:45 PM
Response to Original message
47. That poor kitty and those poor kids....
That guy is a sick fuckin' bastard. Where the Hell is PETA!!!
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Brigid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 07:42 PM
Response to Original message
48. Oh, my God . . .
I think I'm going to be sick. :cry:
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Brigid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 09:14 PM
Response to Original message
50. Just thought of the perfect punishment:
May this sick, sorry excuse for a human being get a cellmate who is a big bruiser -- and loves cats.
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