A 72 year old man beaten to death in front of his wheel chair bound buddy

[dsc]

How brave that young assailant must have been? A 72 year old, eccentric, effeminate, gay man got beaten, in the back, by such a wonderful standard of bravery. The man died a slow, lingering death. Yet what is the AFA's response. If you protect men like Andrew from these kinds of attacks, legalizing polygomy would be next. No I am not making that up.

http://www.lsj.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070224/NEWS01/70224001

http://www3.capwiz.com/afanet/issues/alert/?alertid=9395716

Link one is Andrew's story, link two is the afa website.

I was just a kid when Harvey Milk was assassinated along with Mayor Musconi. I took some interest in the case because of the twinkie defense. You see, I love junk food, so I was intrigued. Then I read about the case and everything clicked. I read about a jury that had no gays on it. I read about how the jury judged an Eagle Scout more favorably than a fag. Now I got it. I knew what I was being called, and why I was being called it. The murderer of Harvey Milk was a domestic terrorist. And sadly, to a decent extent, it worked. Milk was replaced by a conservative and Musconi by the far less liberal Feinstein.

Now we have Andrew's murderers. Like the terrorists who threw a wheelchair bound Leon Klinghoffer into the sea we have a new terrorist beating an elderly man with a pipe. These are not ordinary crimes. They are intended to scare a group of people and keep us down. We are supposed to all know that it could be us. We are supposed to know that if we dare get elected to office, or merely exist and ride a bus, that we could be just as dead as they are.

And now, we have the Christians weighing in. The AFA says don't you dare protect the Andrew's of this world. Don't you dare pass a law saying that gays are people too. Don't you dare tell us it isn't ok to call the faggot and beat the shit out of them. If you do, we will call you unchristian. We will say you want to legalize polygamy or child molestation. They are defending domestic terrorists. Make no mistake about it. They are press agents for people who beat down 72 year old men.

I can only imagine Jesus' response. Jesus wept.

[xchrom]

1. if AFA continues to exist -- it really is a hate crime.

[dsc]

4. I so agree

I hate Don Wildmon

[PDJane]

2. I most sincerely wish

That those who waste their time with these petty-minded, mean-spirited and controlling campaigns would find the light and use their efforts towards something useful and helpful.......and I can think of hundreds of things for them to do, from universal health care, to ending global warming, to promoting equity in the division of resources. Lord and Lady.

[krispos42]

3. Ah, the "special rights" argument

Look, luring freepers, "hate crime" legislation addresses the 'intent' of the criminal committing the crime, not the crime itself.

Let's look at two examples.

I point a gun at somebody and pull the trigger in a non-self-defense situation. The gun does not go off (it's empty). Do I go to jail for attempted murder?

I point a gun at somebody and pull the trigger in a non-self-defense situation. The goes DOES go off and kill the person. Do I go to jail for murder?




In the first example, it depends on whether or not I knew the gun was unloaded. If I did not know the gun was unloaded, then when I squeezed that trigger, my intent was to commit murder, regardless of the outcome. If I did know the gun was unloaded, then I'm simply being an asshole. Maybe I can go to jail for assault or something for scaring the bejeezus out of somebody, but you get the idea.

In the second example, it also depends on whether or not I knew the gun was loaded. If I did know it was loaded, then I've committed first or second degree murder. If I did not know it was loaded (unlikely in my case, since I'm experienced with guns, but you get the idea) and pulled the trigger, then it's negligent manslaughter or something.

It is the intent that is being punished here. "Hey, let's go find us a n****r, beat the shit out of him, and steal his wallet" should, in my opinion, be punished somewhat harder than "Hey, let's go find somebody, beat the shit out of him, and steal his wallet".

If you want to hate, fine. It'a free country. But don't act on it.

[dsc]

6. It really is a different and worse crime

I think your argument is terrific.

[krispos42]

22. thank you

it was the clearest way i could think of to explain the difference

[dsc]

5. kick

[wicket]

7. RIP Mr. Anthos

:cry: :cry:

The AFA disgusts me. :grr: They certainly do not speak for this christian.

[xchrom]

8. kick

[Arugula Latte]

9. Disgusting.

The AFA preaches hate and violence. How Christian of them. :grr:

[SemperEadem]

10. If speaking out against hate crimes against gays makes me unchristian

then I'm proudly unchristian and not ashamed of it because I'd be far more like Jesus than those imposters who have no clue as to what the person they claim they worship SAID regarding their fellow man.

I think that AFA should never be allowed any distance from the fact that they patently endorse, condone and encourage hate crimes against gays--and they should be denounced by all who call themselves good, upstanding christians.

[gratefultobelib]

11. I feel like I've just been slimed having paid a visit to the AFA website. How

utterly disgusting. I didn't realize Donald Wildmon had such an organization. Surely their impact is minimal in spite of the glowing reviews he gives the organization.

[dsc]

12. Sadly they have a great deal of impact

One of our two political parties is practically run by them. When the GOP is in charge they have immense influence on social policy.

[gratefultobelib]

16. I'm aware of Focus on the Family (I think it is), the James Dobson group and

its influence, but I didn't know about AFA. Do you remember the Crusade for Children (I think) from the 70's (you're probably too young!), but it was founded by Anita Bryant (a lame singer). This was the first time I was aware of a group founded solely for the purpose of "protecting" our children from homosexuality. I remember getting into a tremendous argument with a woman in my adult Sunday Sch class.

[dsc]

18. admittedly AFA is a bit more regional

but at times they do boycot things and get press. Focus on the Family though is another side of the same coin.

[fishwax]

23. I think they're almost as powerful, and barely regional at all

AFA runs AFR (American Family Radio), which pumps their BS into 20 states. Their "Worldview Weekends" have been pretty influential in the religious right community as well. While I think Dobson is more known to the general public, AFA and the Wildmons are hugely influential within the radical right community.

I used to listen to AFR on a daily basis (oppositional research, and all that). They're sick :grr:

[proud patriot]

13. How Awful

:(

[Beelzebud]

14. Not "like" terrorists... Those sick bastards ARE terrorists...

Notice how all the violent, homegrown terrorists are ALWAYS right-wing nuts that hate basic human rights...

[proud2BlibKansan]

15. The AFA is utterly repulsive

I hate to do this but it is just so nutty and I figure posting this here will save DUers from having to click on your link:

Here is a partial list of what homosexual activists are trying to force on every American. While HR 254 will not, in and of itself, accomplish these goals, it will open the door to such regulations. Once the elephant gets its trunk under the tent, the way is open for the elephant to move inside and do whatever he wants.

*
Preaching that homosexuality is a sin from the pulpit will result in the preacher being charged with “hate speech.”
*
Churches will have their tax-exempt status revoked if they oppose homosexuality.
*
Homosexual marriage will be legalized and recognized in all states.
*
Polygamy will be legalized.
*
Landlords will be forced to rent to homosexuals.
*
Scouts, and all non-profit organizations, will be required to hire homosexuals as leaders.
*
Biblical language used to define homosexuality will be considered “hate speech.” City officials have already had a billboard removed in Long Island, NY, because it was classified as “hate speech.” The billboard read: “If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination.” (Leviticus 20:13)
*
Employees will not be allowed to say anything negative about homosexuality in their workplaces.
*
Classes promoting the homosexual lifestyle will be included in school curricula beginning with the lower grades.
*
Employers will be forced to hire homosexuals.
*
Adoption by homosexuals will be legalized in every state.

[dsc]

17. thanks

I didn't put it up because as crazy as it is I didn't want there to be any possibility of being accused of editting to make it look worse than it was.

[originalpckelly]

19. Actually, that quotation of the Bible is wrong, and it was manipulated...

to make the Bible look better. It really says to kill gay people:
"If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them."

http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=leviticus%2020:13

[wicket]

20. kick

:kick:

[roguevalley]

21. this makes my heart ache. i cannot understand this at all. my dad

was so frail and helpless at that age. If anyone hurt them, I would hunt them down. It would be hard to live a normal life after such a thing. God bless them both. :(

[k_jerome]

24. kick. and if you don't like it kiss my ass. nt.

[dsc]

25. kick