I want to make a few things clear to everyone here

[mudesi]

Universal health care is a liberal idea, not a "moderate" one.

Full marriage rights for gays and lesbians is a liberal idea, not a "moderate" one.

Reasonable gun control is a liberal idea, not a "moderate" one.

Equitable wealth distribution and taxation is a liberal idea, not a "moderate" one.

Solving global warming and environmentalism in general is a liberal idea, not a "moderate" one.

Abolishing capital punishment is a liberal idea, not a "moderate" one.


You know what else were liberal ideas?


Giving women the right to vote.
Giving African Americans the right to vote.
Ending slavery.
Ending segregation.

They weren't "moderate".

Take back the language.

[Vincardog]

1. Want to add the 40 hour work week? Outlawing Child labor? Minimum wage laws?

Free universal public education?

[cgrindley]

30. Outlawing child labor was FDR... but the US still hasn't signed the UN

Convention on the rights of Children, right?

[Vincardog]

32. Are you saying FDR was not a liberal?

[FiveGoodMen]

2. Absolutely

Bad news: since all of those are liberal ideas, I don't expect either of the two moderate front-runners to support any of them.

[mike_c]

3. unemployment protection, the weekend, an end to child labor...

...the separation of church and state, free speech, free press, freedom to assemble to redress grievances-- the list goes on and on. Liberalism stands for improving the lives of as many people as possible. Conservatism stands for reducing as many people as possible to chattel, to resources used for the enrichment and empowerment of the wealthiest and most powerful few.

[baldguy]

4. Clean air, clean water, clean food.

[regnaD kciN]

5. Universal health care CAN be a liberal idea, depending on how it's implemented...

However, "individual mandate" plans without a guarantee that the premiums people will be legally-required to pay will be affordable (i.e., not something like $500-$1000 per month for a family of four) are anything but liberal. Want proof? Guess who was the first leader to implement such a plan? Mitt Romney.

[defendandprotect]

10. It was a LIBERAL idea . . . part of the New Deal/Social Security package. . .

but by the time Truman came in --- after the former VP . . . eh . . . HENRY WALLACE ...
knocked out because strong forces were against his liberalism.

Wallace ran against Truman in '48 --- as an independent ---
and, as I recall it, more or less Hollywood was hired to run against Wallace.
There's a A&E documentary on him which was pretty good as I recall it.

Truman was more conservative --- dangerously so, IMO -- and the Democratic Congress by then were already being overtaken --- and they never passed the national health care part of the plan.

Henry Wallace was a very interesting man in the history of our nation ---
and would have been a great president.

[parasim]

6. Well, perhaps, but if they can be presented as moderate...

maybe they can actually be embraced by the majority. and brought to fruition.

I hate to say it, but this country is quite divided and getting the majority of voters to vote for this stuff might work if they don't see them as "liberal".

It's interesting, I prefer to call myself liberal, but after a while if I say "Well, I'm a centrist and I am for gay marriage.", more people tend to start to listen to me.

It's sad that the word "liberal" has become so alienating in this society, thanks to Limbaugh, Coulter, Clear Channel and the like, but realistically, it has.

Hell, I'd call myself a full-on, pure-bred right-winger if I thought it would convince more people to embrace a just cause.

[eridani]

7. If people don't like "liberals", that's true in part because so many were too gutlless--

--to defend their principles.

[B Calm]

8. The right for a citizen to own guns is a liberal idea,

when you sit down and think about it!

[Truth2Tell]

11. I'll stand, but thanks. nt

[B Calm]

12. If you are like me, you'll get tired standing!

[ProfessorGAC]

33. I Have MS. Can I Sit?

The Professor

[EstimatedProphet]

18. RKBA is a right of the people vs. the government, so it is liberal, yes

[orleans]

9. no shit (take back the language)! liberal has always been a good/positive

word in my opinion.

[Perry Logan]

13. Show me someone who badmouths liberals, and I'll show you a degenerate.

[Phoebe Loosinhouse]

14. That would make a wonderful ad for any candidate who would be happy to call themselves a Liberal

I agree that this is a beautiful word that needs to be taken back.

Stray thought - Libertarian is embraced as terminology, yet Liberal is not although they derive from the same root. Odd.

[madokie]

15. thats why I consider myself a Liberal

and damn proud of it too

[mdmc]

16. every decent thing is to the left of the triangulators

one big happy party, under INC.

[Squatch]

17. What's "reasonable gun control"

All your other ideals (save wealth distribution) are absolutes: "full rights" "Universal care" "abolishing capital punishment". Why is the RKBA the only one that should be subject to interpretations of reasonableness?

[I work for workers]

27. A bad idea. nt

[benEzra]

19. The conservative roots of U.S. gun control...

Reasonable gun control is a liberal idea, not a "moderate" one.

Neither. It's at the root a conservative one, based on the keep-the-peons-in-line mentality rather than the egalitarian roots of progressive thought. Nor does propagating ignorance and fear (most notably the "assault weapon" bait-and-switch) have anything whatsoever to do with progressive thought, which is why it's always been the DLC'ers pushing it and not the party's liberal wing.

The Conservative Roots of U.S. Gun Control

Keeping guns out of the wrong (color) hands since the 1840's...

[Psyop Samurai]

20. Hmm... No, they weren't "moderate"...

...they were progressive. And the lying buzz word "moderate" should be off limits by now if we want to take back the language.

However, I don't think that "liberal" can be liberated from the liars' frame either, so I'm only half in agreement. That shit is hardwired - "liberal" approximately equals "profligate" - and among the more progressive, less compromising on "our side", it has sadly come to be associated with hypocrisy.

We must break from the phony frame which was not of our making - "liberal", "moderate", "conservative" - all bullshit. To that end, I would lobby for "progressive", the opposite of which is "regressive".

[Laelth]

21. Every great advance of Western Civilization ...

... has been the produce of a "liberal" idea.

But Conservatives control the media, and as long as they do, we will never be able to take back the language. We need a full, liberal network, in opposition to Faux, to force the debate back to the middle.

k&r anyway for righteous indignation.

:patriot:

-Laelth

[dysfunctional press]

22. gun control is NOT a liberal idea.

allowing the citizenry to keep and bear arms is about as liberal as it gets.

[FiveGoodMen]

23. Hold on there...

If you mean letting people do whatever they want is liberal, I think we need at least one qualifier: They can do what they want as long as they don't harm others.

Leave that part out, and murder becomes an extremely liberal idea.

Not that gun owners can't be or aren't normally responsible, but a lot of people get shot mostly because there are guns in easy reach.

[dysfunctional press]

24. that doesn't change the fact that gun control is NOT a liberal idea.

confiscating guns is what fascists and dictators do.
an armed populace is the biggest threat to a would-be totalitarian regime.

a liberal state doesn't have to be a nanny-state.

btw- what in the world do you mean by this: "If you mean letting people do whatever they want is liberal..."
ummmm- when/where did i ever say or even IMPLY anything CLOSE to that??

[FiveGoodMen]

25. I assumed that "allowing the citizenry to keep and bear arms is about as liberal as it gets"

meant it was liberal because people's actions were not restricted.

Three points:

1) Liberals usually defend the potential victims of the world (such as the people that might get shot)

2) A populace armed with pistols and rifles won't get far against an army with tanks, machine guns, flame throwers, bombs...

3) Most of the western Democracies have gun control and they certainly aren't any more fascist than the US!

[cgrindley]

29. Yeah... gun control is NOT a liberal idea but a reactionary one

I see nothing wrong with monitoring people's gun ownership and making people register their weapons, but the sort of ban mentality as in DC only leads to criminals running wild and honest people being defenseless.

[dysfunctional press]

31. that's why you should never assume anything.

allowing the citizenry to keep and bear arms is about as liberal as it gets, because the last thing that a totalitarian regime would want is an armed populace.

you've got your point number one a little confused- liberals usually defend the rights of the victims of the world. such as the right to possess firearms. as for people who "might" get shot- if they have their own gun, they could better defend themselves against those that would want to do them harm. that's why crime rates go down in places here conceal/carry is allowed.

as to your point number two- the iraqi insurgents are probably the most recent example- they don't have tanks, planes, or other modern weaponry, but they seem to give their much more powerful occupiers a lot of problems.

and for point number three- perhaps you'd be more comfortable living in a different western democracy, then. one where people don't have the right to bear arms guaranteed and protected by it's constitution.

[Echo In Light]

26. Spot on. "Moderates" are encouraged as it's rightward leaning/appeasing

[cgrindley]

28. Ending slavery wasn't entirely a Liberal thing...

not meaning to overly simplify it any more that it already has been, but the emancipation of the slaves was pretty much 50% the liberal notion of everyone being free and 50% let's fuck the south... people often forget the pragmatic course of thought that Lincoln (a Republican) followed to get to where he ended up.

And as for the rest of the list... coming up with the idea doesn't give us ownership of the idea. It's up to us not to rest on our laurels but find ways to come up with new ways to approach all of these issues before the other side steals them away from us.