Why are people who are not doctors/nurses/medical assistants talking about healthcare?

[originalpckelly]

Do any of the candidates for President on our side, or the Republican side for that matter, have any degrees in medicine? Only Ron Paul to my knowledge is an M.D. and he's not going to be elected.

Why is it then that people who have no medical degree are proposing healthcare systems, Democrats a socialized system and Republicans the status quo fascist system? These people are not qualified to give advice to anyone about these matters, nor am I. On the other hand, I think it's valid to point the lack of common sense being demonstrated by the American people. Would you go to a politician to fix your car? Not unless they had enough knowledge to do it, right?

This is the problem, they aren't doctors, they don't know what they're talking about. Not to say that either side is wrong, that's not what this is about, it's to say that there is something wrong with unqualified people giving advice. These people are telling us that either solutions x, y, or z are right, but they're not qualified enough to make those decisions. Have any of these people even just been paper pushers at an insurance company? No!

The only reason, in my most humble of opinions, that either side talks about this is to score political points. They want to tell us happytalk to get our asses in the voting booths and pull the lever for them. (OK, I know that's out of date now, but go with me on this will you?)

And what about Congress? Aside from a couple people, Congress is not made up of medical professionals. Maybe it's just a little odd that people who have absolutely no experience associated with an issue are making life and death decisions for other people.

Hell, even if they were all a bunch of doctors, I'd still seek a second opinion!

And it's not just about this issue, it's so many others. How the fuck do any of the men on the stage know what it's like to be a woman? What makes them qualified to make decisions about a woman's body?

Are any of them gay? How then, are they qualified to know whether or not gay marriage is good or bad for gay people?

Maybe the problem here is that people who are not qualified are butting their damn noses in where they don't belong, and for no other reason than the same old political BS "Hi, I'm Mr. Politician, I'm going to piss on your boots and tell you it's raining again!"

It the quadrennial rainy season in America again, isn't it?

[stray cat]

1. Why do people who are not politicians vote?

[originalpckelly]

4. Why do people get a choice in a doctors office as to whether or not they want a medical procedure?

As long as it doesn't hurt anyone else in very material ways, all people have inalienable sovereignty over their lives. Yes, we all makes mistakes, but how's a person we've never met going to do any better than us, if we've sort of know ourselves our whole lives and we still don't know what the fuck to do?

Fixed massive murderous typo.

[FormerDittoHead]

2. The issue is HOW it's paid for, nothing about medicine itself. n/t

[originalpckelly]

8. What about embryonic stem cell research?

Few people who voted on those bills were doctors. Bush is certainly no doctor, and he vetoed it.

Sometimes how something is paid for determines whether or not a treatment will be given.

[Sarah Ibarruri]

3. Well, I have no medical degree, but I personally know people who have no health insurance....

... I think I'm qualified to talk about people who are lacking health insurance because the system in this country is based on a two-class system, the haves and the have nots.

[IdaBriggs]

5. To answer your first question simply --

You don't need to be a Medical Provider to be a Medical Receiver, and anyone who RECEIVES medical care in this country knows there are problems with it that need to be fixed. (The Providers also know, of course, but are so busy doing their jobs -- saving lives! -- they are kind of involved in other things.)

Medical professionals are trained in healing -- they are not trained in finance. If they were, most probably wouldn't spend TWELVE (earning) years of their lives wracking up hundreds of thousands of dollars in debt so they could work 60+ hour weeks for 30 years (assuming they don't burn out). In my experience, most do it because they want to make a positive difference in people's lives.

But as for financing this mess, we need a better system, and those who are enmeshed in it currently are good for input, but if they could have fixed it, they already would have.

:shrug:

[LeftCoast]

6. Well, I'm an RN with a MS in Nursing

I think having the degree and the experience helps when discussing healthcare, but don't forget that we are all customers of healthcare and so everyones opinion and experience is completely valid and necessary.

Now, I will say that I think the healthcare debate as a whole is framed incorrectly, but that's off topic and would probably get a big argument going. :)

[Robbien]

7. Since it was the politicians who decided our healthcare was to be a for-profit system

It can only be the politicians who decide to change that awful premise.

Every country in the world had their politicians decide who provides healthcare, the government or for-profit insurance companies. Every country in the world, except the US, decided that for-profit insurance companies just increase costs without adding benefits.

[existentialist]

9. Does this mean

that if Ron Paul had a chance of winning that you support him?

how about that other physician Republican, and erstwhile candidate for President: Bill Frist?


Hmmm?


my own take is that a knowledge of medicine does not equate to a knowledge of health care systems and of financing health care systems.


Although they are not physicians, and although their proposals vary, and are all subject to attack for bias, I actually do think that all three remaining first tier candidates--and for that matter Richardson and Kucinich, and Biden and Dodd, and Gore too all have better ideas on how to fix the health care system than many physicians, including the aforementioned Republican candidates for President.

For that matter, I also think that health care, while vitally important, is something better addressed by Congress than from the White House.

[originalpckelly]

11. Maybe we should have a thing, um, you know that whole separation of powers thing.

It might be nice to apply that to various sectors of government, if we're going to have a socialized system it should be run by people with the knowledge to run it, although there are some problems with planned economies that would inherently limit the efficiency of such a system. The current planned system, only implemented through a fascist model, is rather inefficient and is being railed against by lots of people who come into contact with it.

Why not a medical branch of government, with a congress of medically trained representatives, an executive branch with the actual people providing care, and a judicial-esque branch with more medically trained folks to review claims?

[greendog]

10. Why is "health care" sold through insurance companies? n/t

[rug]

12. Of course. Patients have nothing to say about it.

[sendero]

13. Because health care..

.. and the financing of health care are two different things.

[JBoy]

14. So politicians should only address issues

for which they personally have expertise?

Doctors have limitations too. I mean, which one of these would you want as your President?



(I'm torn between Kirk and Spock, but it sure as hell wouldn't be Bones!)

[ThomWV]

15. Mechanics don't design cars, why would Medicos design a service delivery system?

[catnhatnh]

20. Ding, Ding, Ding....

Neither am I a plumber, nor an electrician, nor a carpenter....But I would bloody well expect to be consulted about the outcome of my house...How about because we are PAYING. Whether directly out of pocket, or indirectly by paying insurance premiums, or extremely indirectly by paying salaries to congress to act on our behalf...the opinions of health care professionals aside, the question is not how to cure a boil-it is a question of how most efficiently deliver health care to over 250 million people.

[rubberducky]

16. Do I need a degree in healthcare to know that our healthcare system is a mess??

No degree in healthcare here, but have recently been an uninsured patient. 2 months ago I had a heart attack, ex-hubby took me to emergency, they put a stent in a 99% blockage. $45,000. I have no way to pay them, and I continually ask the creditors, "Why did they save me"?? I could have quietly died at home. Now I`m left with 3 70% and 1 50% blockages and no money. It`s a matter of time. I live on nitro pills. I`ve learned to doctor shop for nitro pills, because they keep turning me down for refills every week. " sociallized health care" is becoming a necessity. I have an LTTE for when I pass that addresses this issue. No healthcare degree is needed to address this issue, just patients, who are "saved, only to be billed".

[Union Thug]

17. Because in a system with ostensibly democratic institutions

we all have a say in determining policy - theoretically, that is. Additionally, we aren't talking about medical treatment; we are talking about access to it.

As for "are any of them gay?" - why yes! Although they deny it, and insist that they love their wives or some such red herring. :-)

[rubberducky]

18. Another kick and a rec

[rubberducky]

19. See how fast these threads die?? Another kick

[rubberducky]

21. Why do people who are not, "doctors,nurses or medical assistants"

talk health care?? Maybe, they would have to be patients first?

[rubberducky]

22. Where R U originalpkelly??

Don`t care?? Just left this to drop?? Very sad.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

23. Because people who are not health care professionals are consumers of health care.

Do you have to be a lawyer to comment on the legal system? I think most of us can legitimately comment on the mess in the Justice Department without having law degrees. I think we can figure out that eliminating the right of habeas corpus is a bad thing.

Do you have to be a civil engineer to comment on the state of the infrastructure? A freeway bridge in my city collapsed because the asshats who fund and manage the highway system couldn't be bothered to keep it safe. I don't need to know how to build a road to figure out something went wrong here.

Basic point: You don't need to know how to transplant a kidney or diagnose some obscure disease to determine whether a health care delivery system sucks -- it's an entirely different analysis.

And I sure as hell wouldn't trust Ron Paul to fix it, either.

[rubberducky]

24. Thank You! Give me Edwards, anyday!

[Mayberry Machiavelli]

25. Doctors are only one group, but an important one, that should be represented in this debate/planning

As it is, doctors in America as a group (not all individuals of course) will generally be opposed to single payer universal health care because for most it will likely represent a significant decline in income. So to rely on doctors to do the primary decision making will result in some form of the status quo.

But the input of doctors as a group is certainly needed in planning.

[rubberducky]

27. My doc is very interested in universal health care.

He is independent. This won`t help me , but may help many who come after me. Vote for health care reform!!

[Beelzebud]

26. I don't need a weatherman to tell me which way the wind blows!

[rubberducky]

28. Why are you allowing your thread to fall??

I`ve tried to help you. Poured out my soul. Please help me understand why you have abandoned me.I guess, I wrongfully thought that somebody gave a damn. Peace.