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Dershowitz calls for 'accountable' waterboarding, says torture 'works sometimes'

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donsu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-17-07 11:18 AM
Original message
Dershowitz calls for 'accountable' waterboarding, says torture 'works sometimes'

http://uruknet.info/?p=m38286&hd=&size=1&l=e



Law professor Alan Dershowitz has become notorious since 2001 for his advocacy of legalizing torture and his insistence that it is fully constitutional as long as it is not used to compel self-incrimination. He has also been arguing since 2004 for a pre-emptive attack on Iran

"I think the people in the United States want to see the Democrats be just as strong but smarter than the Republicans in fighting terrorism, fighting in Iran, fighting Iraq, fighting all the enemies of America," Dershowitz said Thursday on MSNBC.

"If Democrats do that in order to win, they might be going against what they believe in," responded MSNBC's Mika Brzezinski. "Perhaps what we really need to be doing is rebuilding our moral standing."

"I agree," said Dershowitz. "I think we should take a stand on waterboarding. We should say, never should it be permitted as a routine matter."

He then cited the hypothetical "ticking bomb" situation, arguing that any leader would order torture under those circumstances, so "we're just kidding ourselves by putting the issue underneath the table and coming up with extreme statements that we know we would never follow in practice."

"If you torture, then what separates you from -- the Nazis, or somebody else?" asked Brzezinski.

"Every government faced with a ticking bomb would, in fact, torture, and we would do it in order to get information to save lives," Dershowitz answered. "The essence of a democracy, if you're going to do something, you have to admit you're doing it and you have to have control over it and you have to have restrictions on when it can be done. ... If it's going to be done in a democracy, then you have to make everybody accountable for it."
-snip-
----------------------


we all know Dersh should be in a straight jacket, in a Fed. pen., for the rest of his rotten life.
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liberalnurse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-17-07 11:19 AM
Response to Original message
1. Dersh has been drinking
the JoeMentum koolaide.
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ChicagoRonin Donating Member (250 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-17-07 11:19 AM
Response to Original message
2. My test for advocates of torture
They should be locked in a room with a potential terror suspect, given a bag of tools and required to produce actionable intelligence within a limited period of time (especially if they are a pro-torture presidential candidate).

If they can't stomach doing it themselves, they shouldn't advocate it.
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shadowknows69 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-17-07 11:20 AM
Response to Original message
3. I hear they're building a statue of him
In the "lawyers" section of Hell. B-)
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PDJane Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-17-07 11:25 AM
Response to Original message
4. What I really want to know, quite seriously,
Is how anyone who promotes something called an "islamofascist awareness week" could have enough pull to get someone's tenure yanked for being honest about the Israel situation.

What this man is advocating is simply nuts. Complety and totally out of touch with reality, yet he has clout...and I wanna know where he gets it!
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rucky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-17-07 11:26 AM
Response to Original message
5. *sigh* My People n/t
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marmar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-17-07 11:28 AM
Response to Reply #5
6. LOL.....
You're not alone. We've got Clarence Thomas and Cowboy Troy to lament. :hide:
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Gormy Cuss Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-17-07 11:29 AM
Response to Original message
7. You first, Dersh.
He once was interesting. Now he's just nuts.
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Union Thug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-17-07 11:29 AM
Response to Original message
8. " The essence of a democracy, if you're going to do something, you have to admit you're doing it "
Edited on Sat Nov-17-07 11:29 AM by Union Thug
WTF? THAT is the essence of democracy? I thought it had something to do with rule by and for the people, and NOT for a small group of wealthy, elitists?

Who takes these people seriously?
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donsu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-17-07 11:32 AM
Response to Reply #8
10. they take themselves seriously and Fox makes sure their watchers


take them seriously with serious kool aide
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sallyseven Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-17-07 11:32 AM
Response to Original message
9. He is crazy and a headline stealer
what a fraud.
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Mnemosyne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-17-07 11:32 AM
Response to Original message
11. Maybe he should have advocated torturing OJ to 'prove'
he was 'innocent'.

Asshole.
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C_U_L8R Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-17-07 11:38 AM
Response to Original message
12. He is SO very wrong
How can a man who has defended people who have been wrongfully accused
even entertain the thought that torture is a-okay ????

Dershowitz has lost everything he's ever stood for. He is nothing.
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tomg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-17-07 11:43 AM
Response to Original message
13. He is right about one thing:
"If it's going to be done in a democracy, then you have to make everybody accountable for it."

I would amend it to, "If it is done in a democracy,and people don't take a stand against it,then you have to make everybody accountable for it."
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Warren Stupidity Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-17-07 11:47 AM
Response to Original message
14. Asshole War Criminal Dershowitz.
All downhill for this turd since OJ. Instant Karma, etc.
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Jade Fox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-17-07 11:51 AM
Response to Original message
15. The whole "ticking bomb" scenario is crap......
Basing policy on some TV show fantasy situation that is extremely unlikely to ever happen in real life is stupid. We're not living in "24" world out here, although many, including Supreme Court Justice Scalia, seem to think we are.

Dershowitz is right about one thing: "if you're going to do something (in a Democracy), you have to admit you're doing it.....". We need to know what our government is doing. But Dershowitz's assertion that "anyone would torture" in a situation very unlikely to ever actually happen is a stupid line of thought to begin with, and a stupid way to justify torture.

I like what Joe Biden said in response to the "ticking bomb" fantasy: Offer the guy who knows where the bomb is a full and immediate pardon. Then he might actually tell you the truth!!
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Fovea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-17-07 11:54 AM
Response to Original message
16. The fact that this crap gets legitimized by the media
makes me wonder what the Murikin point of nausea will be.

Are we going to have to fry the people in Tehran on the evening news for the revulsion to kick in? Will it take live video from downtown by trapped journalists who melt in mid broadcast? Will the anchor proclaim a new period of cheap oil?

But what of the aftermath photos to rival Hiroshima?
A world economic boycott?

What will being Murikan have that even a mouth breather could be proud about if we don't stop before that point? How much lebensraum will our SUV lifestyle need? Answer: Every acre in the world with oil under it.
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lunatica Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-17-07 12:05 PM
Response to Original message
17. The ticking bomb!!
They've tortured people in Guantanamo for years. Wouldn't those ubiquitous ticking bombs have gone off by now? At least one of them? And exactly how many bombs have they stopped? How many IEDs have they thwarted?

:shrug:
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HughMoran Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-17-07 12:29 PM
Response to Original message
18. I've learned to despise this piece of SHIT over the years
Dershowitz is a Nazi, plain and simple.
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pretzel4gore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-17-07 12:42 PM
Response to Original message
19. he, david horowitz, dennis miller, ben stein
willie kristol, norman podhortz, richard pipes, richard perle, ron silver, frum, novak....their names live in infamy- busheviks who lied 'til it was too late
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kurth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-17-07 12:43 PM
Response to Original message
20. Hitler agreed, holocaust "never should be permitted as a routine matter"
Edited on Sat Nov-17-07 12:45 PM by kurth
Required careful planning and execution.
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Warren Stupidity Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-17-07 03:21 PM
Response to Reply #20
21. and it all had to be completely by the law.
They just needed some new laws.
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lligrd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-17-07 04:49 PM
Response to Original message
22. The Problem With Torture Is That Only The Mentally Ill Can
administer it.
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