HEY, HEY, LBJ. HOW MANY KIDS DID YOU...oh wait, this will make us look silly....

[Junkdrawer]

Never mind.

[Just-plain-Kathy]

1. Very good point.

[MuseRider]

2. Nooo not silly!

Anything but silly. That would be so wrong and potentially distracting doncha know.

[redqueen]

3. And it might get attention.

Can't have that.

[MuseRider]

5. Gods no we can't.

:hi:

They might look at us and frown or tsk tsk us. We don't like when they disapprove, it makes us feel bad. I am now waiting for our (?) side to denounce the MoveOn ad and apologize for something they did not do.

What would the general public think? Egads, throw them all in the brig I say! (oh yes, they did)

[TomInTib]

4. Difference is...

those were kids.

These are adults acting like kids.

And, in the interest of full disclosure, I have been guilty of same.

[bettyellen]

41. kids afraid of being DRAFTED so they protested- and that's more acceptable than

adults protesting because they have moral a imperative ?
Really.

[Solly Mack]

6. well, everyone knows obedient and orderly protest is what wins the day

stay in your free speech zone and chant your heart away...that's freedom!

[sniffa]

7. k&r

:patriot:

what the fuck is wrong with some peopLe?

[H2O Man]

9. Well

there is a "From the Right" editorial in one of the local newspapers (The Daily Star; Oneonta NY) titled: "MoveOn subverting democracy." It's by Bill O'Reilly, who I think was one of our Foundling Fathers. We need to be careful that we do not offend open-minded people like him by associating with those who take ads out in newspapers, a clear threat to democracy.

[babylonsister]

14. That little fact right there might make people rethink their opinion

of MoveOn. If O'Reilly doesn't like it, it can't be all bad! ;-)

[H2O Man]

16. But Bill knows

everything. just ask him. And he's never been wrong. Even if he has been proven wrong, he just raises his voice. These are the actions that promote democracy and insight. MoveOn needs to learn from an expert like Dr. O'Reilly.

[TahitiNut]

22. Indeed. Mr. Bill, ensconced in the corporate media, is far more reputable than those ...

... Move-on-dot-commies who haven't earned the anointed altitude afforded Mr. Bill. Gawd forbid such rabble be allowed to sully the hallowed halls of the enlightened. They just don't know their place. But Mr. Bill does - along with some of his echoes heard hereabouts.

[H2O Man]

32. The air waves

belong to Bill. I believe that is a NYS federal law.

[Mabus]

30. Bill looks out for us

He tells us that all the time. He wouldn't criticize any group unless there was justification. Oops. Just ran out of kool-aid. Better go refill my glass.

:hi:

[H2O Man]

33. I am convinced

that we must call him Dr. O'Reilly. He is surely an expert on everything. And if he sayeth that MoveOn.Org is subverting democracy, and is a threat to the democratic party, that alone is enough for me. I do not require the echo of 1,000 convinced souls that the NY Times ad was the single worst sin in the history of human kind -- the second fall from grace. What can we do to redeem ourselves?

[Mabus]

35. Cook up some freedom fries

lock ourselves in our parents' basement and buy some Factor Gear? I think that's what Dr. Old Soily O'Really O'Reilly would suggest.

[H2O Man]

36. And read

Dr. O'Reilly's book. There is a world-wide movement to have the collection declared the Third Testament, so that all may receive the Good News this Christmas. We must use care that we are not fooled into the MoveOn.org War Against Christmas.

[Mabus]

37. And we must read them by the fire

of burning books that perpetrate the liberal lies. Hell yeah. You've convinced me H2O Man.

Dr. O'Reilly, he's the one
Who makes loofah sex lots of fun!

[H2O Man]

38. The thought

of burning books seems connected to the likes of Dr. O'Reilly and Sean Hannity, Ph.D.

[Mabus]

39. Obnoxious insects always seem to be attracted to bright lights

;)

[onenote]

8. you know, I chanted that as I marched against the Vietnam War

Of course, I soon came to realize that what I was doing was less effective in changing policy than my mother writing a letter to our senators and congressmen and talking about the war with her women's group and getting them to do the same. Was she moved to oppose the war because of my marching and chanting? No. She was moved to do so because she was a woman of peace.

[slampoet]

10. They always say thaat the left is more creative. If so, then why haven't the chants changed in 40yrs

It's a legit crit.

[gatorboy]

13. You're the poet.

Give us something snazzy.

[slampoet]

47. Ok. Let me get back to you in 24.

See what i can do.

[leftchick]

11. dumb hippies!

[Junkdrawer]

12. And against a Democrat too....

Betcha they would have had all their posts locked...

[leftchick]

15. lol! indeed...

this guy was pretty cool too....

[KaptBunnyPants]

27. Well, that's because they're attention whores.

Don't these people realize the 1968 elections are around the corner?

[nadinbrzezinski]

17. Andthat is what we are not doing

and it will not happen until there is a draft

There is not going to be one for several reasons

Including the fact that the dominionists have taken control of at least one branch, and short termmers would ruin the fun and armageddon

[robinlynne]

19. and someone is making billions with a b with privatization...

[Junkdrawer]

20. Try $30 trillion with a t in oil profits waiting in Iraq...

And that's a conservative figure...

[KaptBunnyPants]

28. There will either be a draft or a withdrawl.

Which of those scenarios seems less impossible to you?

[sandnsea]

18. That didn't end the war

Thoughtful speeches and facts presented by people like John Kerry did much more than offensive chants.

[Junkdrawer]

21. It all had a cumulative effect...

...

After the Tet offensive of January 1968, his presidency was dominated by the Vietnam War more than ever. As casualties mounted and success seemed further away than ever, Johnson's popularity plummeted. College students and others protested, burned draft cards, and chanted, "Hey, hey, LBJ, how many kids did you kill today?" Johnson could scarcely travel anywhere without facing protests, and was not allowed by the Secret Service to attend the 1968 Democratic National Convention, where hundreds of thousands of hippies, yippies, Black Panthers and other opponents of Johnson's policy both in Vietnam and in the ghettoes converged to protest. Thus by 1968, the public was polarized, with the "hawks" rejecting Johnson's refusal to win the war, and the "doves" rejecting his continuation of containment. Support for Johnson's middle position continued to shrink until he finally rejected containment and sought a peace settlement.

...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lyndon_B._Johnson

[Jacobin]

23. Oh yes it did

riots in the streets and on campuses is what ended it.

The thoughtful speeches were meaningless, as they are today. Just so many pretty words.

[sandnsea]

29. Nope, not until moms and mainstream folks

and the vets, joined the protests did they make a difference. The theatrics really don't matter. They've learned to marginalize that voice. People need to realize they've been out-maneuvered and come up with some new tactics.

[dflprincess]

40. Theatrics called attention to it

Theatrics made the mainstream folks who might not be inclined toward theatrics themselves say - "Hey, there are other people thinking like I am." It's the theatrics that made moms start talking to other moms - maybe by saying "Did you see the women on the news last night..."

[Imagevision]

24. The fact that Iraqi's are standing on our God given oil is unconscionable

[KG]

25. one gets the feeling that theres a sizable faction of DU that, their shrill denials to the contrary,

feels more threatened by the left than the right.

[Junkdrawer]

26. If you can't change minds, at least consul inaction....

And for God's sake, don't do anything that will capture public attention.

[KG]

31. yes, even with massive recent evidence to the contrary, many still live with the mythic notion

that meaningful change can be had thru the ballot box. as if power has ever acquiesced to polite requests.

[Telly Savalas]

42. Meaningful change can't be had at the ballot box?

You mean to tell me Code Pink wouldn't be more effective if they actually had members elected to Congress that were actually participating in that hearing, rather having a few folks dress up like clowns and get kicked out immediately?

And if you're going to claim that the people are incapable of wielding power at the ballot box, then explain to me how guerilla theater has any impact. If the ballot box is fixed, then why should current members of Congress, whose job security is in no way being threatened, feel the slightest bit obligated to change their behavior?

[chill_wind]

50. Owww! Quit making so much sense! n/t

[libnnc]

34. yup. eom.

[Telly Savalas]

46. I think you're mistaking that with annoyance with the Left's impotence

How could anybody feel threatened by the Left? Last time I checked, the nation was run by a far-right executive and the supposed opposition party hasn't done much to keep him in check in the foreign policy arena, and is offering but table-scraps on the domestic side.

The Left is outside looking in. There's nothing threatening about that.

[Raejeanowl]

43. They Only Lacked Imagination

Whereas I plan to wear a tutu, climb a flagpole, shred the Constitution, and sing the National Anthem while simultaneously peeing on the police below.

This will get serious attention for the anti-war movement.

[Junkdrawer]

44. It's been done: "Levitating the Pentagon: Evolutions in the American Theatre of the Vietnam"

http://books.google.com/books?id=RCTa_Kk3Sz8C&dq=levitating+the+pentagon&printsec=frontcover&source=web&ots=IyXHoz_bWJ&sig=6NcEX1qtjwQN8J-C7hn80D47VmA

[Raejeanowl]

48. Bummer

And I thought I was being original. Thanks.

[Babsbrain]

45. Georgie Porgie likes to lie

Sends our kids to war to die.

[chill_wind]

49. There is not much of an equation

between a handful of ladies who, whether it seems fair or not, lend themselves all too well in coming off in the media as a small clueless fringe pack of inarticulate narcissists playing dress-up in stuff from the trunk in Mommy's attic from her 50's prom queen days--

and the gritty mass movements in the streets that could not be dismissed or ignored nearly so readily by the media of the times.

"Hey, hey, LBJ, how many kids did you kill today?" Johnson could scarcely travel anywhere without facing protests, and was not allowed by the Secret Service to attend the 1968 Democratic National Convention, where hundreds of thousands of hippies, yippies, Black Panthers and other opponents of Johnson's policy both in Vietnam and in the ghettoes converged to protest.

At least America KNEW what the people in the streets were screaming and chanting in those times.