Yes, Another - Impeach Them Now - Post & It Won't Be My Last

[kpete]

I submit to America that unless Bush and Cheney--these two fatally malignant cancers on the body politic--are impeached, America has no reason to have the provision for it in our Constitution. And soon--very soon--we will have no further need for a Constitution at all. Impeach them now!


Impeach Them Now!
by Paul Edwards | Aug 24 2007 - 9:14am |

Think! Are we Americans willing to live in a country in which an autocratic chief executive can alter and ignore at will the laws made by our elected Congress?

Are we willing to live in a country in which we can be electronically spied on, our personal lives monitored and documented for no cause, any time, everywhere?

Can we live in a country where anyone can be disappeared and held incommunicado, without right of habeas corpus or accusation, much less trial; where we can be kidnapped and flown anywhere on earth to be imprisoned and tortured, perhaps to death?!

Think! Will we--CAN WE?--continue to face ourselves and our families, our children, our future, in a country so corrupted and degraded that it can be fully aware that its President has tricked it into the horror of an imperialist blitzkrieg and brutal, bloody occupation on the basis of outright lies, and DO NOTHING ABOUT IT?!

I know the arguments of fearful, hostile ignorance and those of cowardly complacency and pusillanimous pragmatism and they are false to the core. The worst of all is the spineless whimper Representatives Pelosi, Conyers, and Senator Reid have made: that impeachment is "off the table", "a waste of time", that there are "better things to do".

more at:
http://www.smirkingchimp.com/thread/9517

[ClassWarrior]

1. Everything's IMPEACHY, kpete!

Never Give Up, my friend...

NGU.

[VP505]

The one

excuse that chaps my hide the worst is the "we have more important things to focus on, like ending the war". There is NOTHING, IMO more important than defending the Constitution, and its painfully obvious that nothing will get accomplished until Bu$h/Cheney/and Gonzales are out of the White House. The Republics in the Senate will continue to obstruct and filibuster as long as they have Bu$hCo to protect and run interference for.

[Jack Bone]

2. Recommended..ENOUGH

ENOUGH!...ALREADY!


http://www.theyoungturks.com/section/Enough
http://www.awesclarkdemocrat.com/2007/07/enough.htm

[hobbit709]

3. More, more!

[Solly Mack]

4. The last - too far away from over to even consider getting giddy about -

several years have seen several books come out in attempts to justify and rationalize the actions or inactions of the author, or their thinking on the actions and inactions of others in government...but even more will come out as people attempt to explain away why Bush Inc wasn't held accountable.

Sickening...already sickening.

K/R

[wildbilln864]

5. K&R kpete!

I'm with you bro!
:yourock:

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

6. I Submit That Idealism Isn't Realism.

"I submit to America that unless Bush and Cheney--these two fatally malignant cancers on the body politic--are impeached, America has no reason to have the provision for it in our Constitution. And soon--very soon--we will have no further need for a Constitution at all. Impeach them now!"

I mean, that sounds great and all. Makes ya wanna just give a huge "Hear Hear!!!!" and "Yay!!!!!" and stuff, but it really is quite idealistic and nonsensical.

Impeachment will fail and may even do as much as put the 08 election at risk, which would then have the opposite effect as intended of actually hurting our country more by enabling further control of our policy by republicans.

To submit that impeachment shouldn't even be in the constitution if not used here is a true sign of one who is too narrow minded to look objectively at the reality before us. Impeachment has no chance of success. None. Nada. Zip. Let's be real here. All it will do is take away time from that which we CAN do, and also put further healing that can come by way of our winning more seats and the presidency in the next election, at risk.

The fact that impeachment is not occurring is due to the fact that republicans walk in lockstep and would never have the integrity to support this process as they should. That is not a sign that the constitution has failed. It is not a sign that impeachment isn't even worth having in the constitution. Such conclusions are just quite simply hogwash. What it is a sign of, is that next election and each election we need to make sure we win as many seats as possible, in order to make sure the corrupt policies can no longer be put in place, and that there isn't enough of a lockstepping force available to throw a wrench in the works of justice.

But the constitution is fine and so is the impeachment clause. What isn't fine is the mentality of the republicans in enabling this president to do the harmful things he's doing. What isn't fine is the way in which they walk in lockstep and subvert our constitution and the integrity of it by doing so. Such things are not fine. But such things are not handled by a simple clause in the constitution, they are handled by democratic elections. So it would be wise to put our focus squarely where it should be, which is making sure as many republicans are defeated next election, and each election thereafter, as possible.

[truedelphi]

11. The 2008 Election is at risk by the simple fact that

We are about to attack Iran.

If we had Impeachment on the Table - we could maybe stop this New War madness - because then it MIGHT be possible for people to realize what the little men behind the curtain have been up to.

And unless you have been living in Candyland - the eletion process has not worked for the last two election cycles.

This very week, there is a newly written Election clause about to take place here in California which will make it possible for a Republican to split the California Electoral Votes with the Democratic candidate.

This means that tweaking Ohio or FLorida or Florida will not be necessary - as long as there is a legalization of splitting the electoral votes in the Gold Country state, the Repugs can win.

[Senator]

12. I Submit That Impeachophobia Isn't Realism.

There is no evidence that impeachment, however it turns out, is not the best way to make "sure as many republicans are defeated next election, and each election thereafter, as possible."

And there is a good bit of evidence to the contrary.

Which is more "realistic?"

---

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

13. If Ya Truly Think That A Huge Failure Of An Impeachment Right Now Would Actually Help Us Gain Seats,

then I've got a bridge that I'm just DYIN to sell ya...

[Senator]

15. I Do. And you make my point for me.

Because -- in reality -- you really haven't got a bridge to sell. You see dismissive, but ultimately empty, rhetoric is the classic symptom of Impeachophobic groupthink.

But luckily some other impeachophobes have moved past this "laughing at us" stage and begun the "fighting us" stage. So it's becominng more and more likely that we'll reach the "then you win" stage before it's too late.

I'm sure some of you will continue as the regime's firewall right to the end, claiming that failure to impeach is somehow a better result in some strategeric, "one of these days it will all make sense" kind of argument. But that claim will be just as real as the bridge you claim to be marketing.

Failure to impeach is complicity -- approval -- exoneration of the regime. We allow it at our peril.

----

[FogerRox]

16. nice comeback, IMPEAch, knr

[Mandate My Ass]

21. Well said, Senator

Democrats in both houses would do well to listen to you. :thumbsup:

The excuses about having more important business to attend to is utter hogwash. There is no excuse not to pursue impeachment knowing what we know now about how Bushco* operates.

[Raster]

30. Bravo! Failure to impeach will haunt this country for years to come.

It is time to regain our national sanity. Far past time.

Wake up America!:kick:

[Orsino]

19. The Constitution called. Says it isn't fine. n/t

[TahitiNut]

22. "Realism" is the perfect antithesis to "courage."

:shrug:

[kenfrequed]

28. But what advantage to not do so?

What is your evidence/argument for impeachment hurting congressional elections in 2008? Is Bush so wildly popular that the public will rally to his side in sympathy? I mean, particularly after the case is laid out step by step is the public going to side with him? Are Bush’s policies (such as the Iraq war) so completely succesful and awe inspiring that people will leap to his defence?

You suggest that Impeachment has no chance of working. Is this the only reason to consider when you decide whether or not to pursue impeachment? Whether or not it will work? In a criminal investigation or trial, if you have a suspect do you give up on it despite having evidence because you think they will get off anyhow?

As to whether or not it is politically a good idea I have to ask whether the Democratic congress continuing to be ineffectual and unable to accomplish anything for the next year or so looks better or worse politically? Are you willing to continue letting a rabid undemocratic minority party running the table?

As far as the fear of repugnik lockstep I would hae to say your arguments fall apart. How many of these politicians are going to rub themselves against this unpopular administration so thoroughly? In an upcoming election where many seats are up on the block, do you honestly thing that republicans in swing states are going to be as enthusiastic about associating themselves with a president that most Americans hate? Or with a war that most Americans do not support and desperately want out of?

We can blame republicans only so long, but when we choose not to bring impeachment (which only needs a simple majority of the judiciary committee in the house to get started) to the table we provide all those republicans with cover for their next congressional runs. And what do we get out of the deal? I haven’t seen any good DLC triangulated deals lately, unless you count the wonderful wiretapping bill.

[Raster]

29. The act of impeachment would seal the fate of rethuglicans in Congress

Once the discovery process begins, and the American people begin to hear the evidence presented, the OVERWHELMING public outcry will demand impeachment, Democrat or Republican alike. When it comes to a vote, you must stand up and be counted. Anyone NOT voting for impeachment has just committed political suicide. We seem to forget that more than just Democrats want these criminals impeached. Just as the Clinton lynching show extreme bias and a true right-wing agenda, not voting to impeach would also expose that bias. With Clinton members of Congress ultimately had to justify why they voted to impeach, with bush*/cheney* they will have to explain why they didn't. All this talk of posturing and positioning for 2008 ignores the obvious. If the rethuglicans don't act in concert with the Dems to rid the country of bush*/cheney*, they face more than just 40 years in the wilderness.

[In Truth We Trust]

37. I Submit That There Is Rule Of Law Or There Is No Rule Of Law. Impeach NOW!

[defendandprotect]

7. Impeach!!! We could have been six months into this by now ---

[pansypoo53219]

8. if not now,

WHEN?!?
no fucking shit.

[cui bono]

9. kick for the Constitution! eom

[madokie]

10. kick for our grand children

if we want to leave them something lets leave them an intact constitution

[Kurovski]

14. Kick

for this and all pro-impeachment threads.

Can't get enough till we don't need them anymore.

[frustrated_lefty]

17. You're a good man, kpete.

[Orsino]

18. No more pretending that all is well.

Acknowledge the rot and impeach.

[Pierzin]

20. Amen to that kpete!

We must impeach before there is no constitution left!

How is it possible that our military is at war based on lies and nothing is happeneing??? no mass demonstrations!??

[TahitiNut]

23. We're a nation of cowards and outlaws

... unless and until we impeach, remove, indict, convict, and imprison those who've committed the highest of crimes and basest of misdemeanors in the violation of their oaths of office.

Outlaws have always regarded themselves as "pragmatists" and cowards have always called themselves "realists."

Under such conditions, we can never be regarded as the "Land of the free and home of the brave."

[bobbolink]

39. "cowards have always called themselves "realists." "

:rofl:

:patriot:

When you're right, you're damned right.

[onewholaughsatfools]

42. I call myself a realist

you can refer to my last post on this topic. I resent you statement on grouping ......I think you should retract your statement Bob........Blessings

[bobbolink]

43. Then why don't you reply to the one who said it....

:shrug:

[TahitiNut]

49. Q.E.D.

:rofl:

[Maestro]

24. Impeach the bastards!

:kick:

[Prophet 451]

25. If not us, who? If not now, when?

Impeach the bastards, either do Cheney first or both together. Yes, it might fail but it might not. There are plenty of Repubs up for re-election and who are aware that Bush is electoral poison right now who may well decide to keep their re-election chances alive by voting for impeachment.

To those who believe a failed impeachment would harm Democratic chances, I submit that you are wrong. Yes, Clinton enjoyed a bounce in the polls after the failure of the impeachment against him but I propose that was because the public was bright enough to see that the impeachment was unwarranted. If you look at Nixon's impeachment, many of those who voted in Nixon's favour lost their seats in the next election. I believe that since a good portion of the country believes that Bush's impeachment would be warranted and would respond positively.

Even if they did not, there's no shame in fighting and losing but there's no honour in not fighting at all.

[Mandate My Ass]

26. Edmund Burke said...

"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."

Congresscritters took an oath. If they can't live up to it they should resign and give up all the taxpayer perks they'll enjoy for the rest of their lives.

Admonishing us to wait until the next election is a crime of omission on their part.

[WillyT]

27. Big K & R !!!

:bounce::kick::bounce:

[bobthedrummer]

31. CHENEY FIRST! K&R

[hfojvt]

32. Does he have any band instruments to sell?

"America is in terrible trouble and we all feel it."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qam1fbQmA_s

Is there a rational argument for impeachment? Or is it all about the hyperbole? One that doesn't see all the Democrats and citizens who are not all hyped up about impeachment as "the arguments of fearful, hostile ignorance and those of cowardly complacency and pusillanimous pragmatism and they are false to the core."

"If we do not impeach, then soon we will have no further need for a Constitution at all!!"

Doesn't that sound a little bit like scare-mongering?

[Raster]

33. scare-mongering? No, unfortunately reality. And we are perilously close.

[bobbolink]

41. Actually, there ARE some things to fear.

Like, plans to bomb Iran, for instance.

Like, the death of our Constitution.

Unfortunately, the frog isn't boiling, and people are in denial rather than fearing the future and fighting for our country.

[ProudDad]

34. I was just at an event about Medicare

that was thrown by our local Dem Congressperson Gabrielle Giffords.

She's good. She's tinged by DLC but it's an R+1 district and she's a former CEO of a large family owned business so that's to be expected. She IS a liberal. She loaths the bushies and the theocracy for which they front. She is socially and economically liberal. She's FOR single-payer. She probably wouldn't lose any sleep after impeaching bush and cheney

but...

it was clear that it ain't gonna happen.

The United States is FAR less a democracy than it was in the early 70's. The right-wing fascist "revolution" has seen to that. They've turned the popular sentiment into a "ME" society of the Randian screwballs from the "WE" society of the Populists through the New Deal to the Great Society that still was the norm in the early 70s. That sentiment and selfish self-defense above all pervades the halls of Congress.

I'm afraid we ain't gonna get impeachment unless bush kidnaps, rapes and buries a 9 year old child in the Rose Garden of the White House -- and even then, I'm not too sure...

----------

I don't want to leave you too gloomy though.

If, after another couple of election cycles, The worm has really turned back towards the "WE" society again and there's a majority of Dems in Congress, especially 60 reasonable Dems and (old line "moderate") republicans in the Senate, we may be able to see Single-Payer and (I hope, I hope) true Public Financing in our time. Our Congresscritter ain't alone in desiring both of those to be passed and enacted into law.

[Jack Rabbit]

35. Hear, hear

Tell the Vichy Democrats in Congress to get with the program.

[onewholaughsatfools]

36. No, As an American

I am not willing to live in a country in which an autocratic chief executive can alter and ignore at will the laws made by our elected congress.
I am now willing to live in a country in which we can be electronically spied on, our personal lives monitored and documented for no cause, any time and everywhere.
I can not live in a country where anyone can disapear or held incommunicado.
THAT'S WHY I MOVED OUT OF THE USA WHEN THEY STOLE THE WHITE HOUSE IN 2000. This has been going on for years now and people just sit and complain, when is enough, enough. Well I made my decision in 2000 it's not for me to decide for you.
SO I say you are correct. THINK!

[puebloknot]

38. K&R Great article!

[porphyrian]

40. Hell yeah. - n/t

[Sam Ervin jret]

44. IMPEACH NOW or PROSECUTE LATER

[Amerigo Vespucci]

45. My three least favorite words from the last year:

"...off the table..."

I read a post on DU the other day in which one DUer admonished another to "not come here and bash Democrats."

I'm not doing that, just in case that same school marm is policing this thread.

I'm just saying that the three least favorite words I've heard Ms. Pelosi utter since picking up the gavel are "off the table." I'm not the guy who made those three little words a part of her legacy. Speaker Pelosi is that person.

:evilgrin:

[Sam Ervin jret]

47. off the table = lets make a deal

[Senator]

51. "off the table" = "I'm more important"

And you're right, it is now inevitably her entire legacy.

She sealed that with her recent, stunning confession that she "would probably advocate" impeaching, if she were not Madame Squeaker.

There is no "other achievement" that can loom larger in her legacy than being the bushcheney firewall.

(And welcome to DU.)

---

[indepat]

46. Failure to impeach signifies only one thing: the system to too broken to be fixed

[porphyrian]

48. Kick it again. - n/t

[pansypoo53219]

50. i blame the teevee gnews

who think it would be PARTISAN and wrong. THEY are the ones the congress is afraid of. how do we make the gnews fear the people?

the gnews still like georgie for some fucking reason.

[bobthedrummer]

52. Down with the Decider and his "loyalists"-there is a correction coming from the people

IMPEACH CHENEY FIRST