The US does not have the finest military in the world

[Johonny]

President Bush on Tuesday lashed out at critics who say that al-Qaida's operation in Iraq is distinct from terrorists who attacked the United States on Sept. 11, 2001. "The merger between al-Qaida and its Iraqi affiliate is an alliance of killers and that is why the finest military in the world is on their trail," Bush said.

You're only as strong as your weakest link and having * as your commander and chief is one huge weakness. For instance here * makes a fine argument for not starting a war in Iraq... oops.

[Kagemusha]

1. So whose is better?

Democracy is the absolute worst form of government imaginable until compared to the alternatives, or something like that?

[Johonny]

2. apparently any country not lead by Bush

He's managing to lose two wars in two separate countries while at the same time failing to affectively hurt terrorist organizations that have only gotten stronger due to his failed wars. At the same time he's driven down military moral AND reduced his countries military capability. That's a lot of suck. Your only as good as your leadership and well... Bush ain't no leader.

[Kagemusha]

3. ..Seriously, if anyone knows of an army in better shape lately, let's hear it.

And the military being fine or not fine is not.. exactly the same thing as whether or not it is succeeding at implementing the flawed strategy of the political leadership. But I can't point my finger at a military that's doing better. I just can't. I'm not seeing it. They all seem to have suffered across the board as gear becomes more expensive and budgets shrink.

[Babsbrain]

5. Our troops are terrific

Our military leaders are milquetoast..and that starts with the CinC

[razors edge]

8. China.

[Solo_in_MD]

13. Untrue...but there are those who believe it...whats your reason?

[razors edge]

14. Shear numbers..

We are out numbered and out produced.

Short of a billion and a half nuke scorched Chinese, we do not stand a chance against the hoards who follow the leadership that has kept them alive and prospering, albeit it under the stomping from a hog-nail boot.

The world would not stand by as the US nuked them without raising a fist, especially after our own little Hitler wannabe. No other country would buy false flag nuke strikes against us at this point.

That leaves conventional warfare, which reminds me of the old saying that those who do not remember the past, are doomed to repeat it.

Who would pick up the Chinese portion of financing our ballooning defense debt if we were in some sort of open warfare with them?

[Solo_in_MD]

15. The Chinese lack the logistics for power projection beyond threatening the nation of Taiwan

A massive human wave attack is one of the clear justifications for cluster anti personnel munitions. The MLRS is called the Corps Commander's shotgun for just that reason.

That said, the Chinese know that. A nation that bears watching in terms of power projection is India, who will soon have a more powerful and modern navy than any nation in Europe.

[razors edge]

16. But the simple facts that

the Chinese do not have the naval capability (according to the same people who said Saddam had reconstituted his nuclear programs, etc) and that they have a massive production base to draw from, including all the scrap steel they can get their hands on, should give pause to assumptions of weakness.

They have not wasted time and money maintaining a fleet for no real reason, we have. Who is made stronger, and who is made weaker by these actions?

Our Navy was destroyed in 1941, yet we prevailed with a newly built Armada.

In 1950/51, the Chinese showed what they could do with existing forces, no air cover or heavy infantry support, against NATO troops.

Imagine what they could now with the wealth and productivity gains of the last 66 years.

[Solo_in_MD]

19. It would take too much time

the main battles would be decided in days or weeks. That is the reality of modern combat. Except for Taiwan, China is content not to have power projection. That may change if they take Taiwan by force.

[razors edge]

21. Go default on the T-Bills

and all that could change.

Battles decided in days or weeks with nukes maybe, but we are still amassing the surge in Iraq.

Five years on and that mission does not look accomplished, one against a nation already on it's knees before we arrived.

[Richard Steele]

9. Have you seen our ABYSMALLY low recruitment standards lately?

We're accepting 42 year olds with no prior military experience.
We've lowered the physical fitness standards time and again.
We're accepting HS dropouts now.
Almost one in five new recruits last year got a waiver for some
prior criminal conviction or drug use.

And what percentage of our troops are currently being FORCED
to remain in uniform, AKA "stop-lossed"? Far more than a handful.

Sorry, but this is -NOT- a blueprint for the best Army in the world.

[razors edge]

7. The Swiss, of course.

Those little knives are relatively inexpensive and have kept them safe from invasion for centuries.

[LSparkle]

4. But we used to ... that's the saddest part of all this

We once had a proud, effective military force ... then Little Lord Pissypants got his hands on them and forgot they aren't just toy soldiers.

[Richard Steele]

11. Yes indeed. There used to be some pretty high standards just to join.

Compared to many other nations throughout history, we held
the bar pretty high for new enlistees.

Once.

[Babsbrain]

6. The little general

When you have a military headed by a coward who went AWOL from the National Guard, you have a prescription for failure from the start.

[catmandu57]

10. I think we've got a

used up, worn out, and demoralized army right now. They keep charging into the breech because they're good at that, but they can only go so long.

[AndyTiedye]

12. If Bush**Cheney Had Been Running Hitler's Armies, they Would Have Gotten Bogged Down Invading Poland

[Tesha]

17. We have the most expensive military in the world.

We have the most expensive military in the world; I
don't think anyone could debate that point.

It's far more debatable whether or not we have the
"finest" military in the world, especially when you
consider factors like leadership, clarity of mission,
and the like. And there's no question that Shrub's
mis-adventure has substantially degraded our military
capability in many, many ways.

Tesha

[bemildred]

18. Most expensive by far.

"Finest" is another question entirely. I can't think of any military organization anywhere that I'd want to paste that label on today, for various reasons. What is striking is what half-a-trillion a year in military expenditures will NOT GET YOU these days, in terms of ability to work your will in the world.

[Atman]

20. It's Clinton's fault.

Well come on...someone had to say it.

.