Government Gone Wild: TSA Detains Mother, Threatens Arrest Over Sippy Cup Full of Tap Water

[ChoralScholar]

From The Consumerist http://www.consumerist.com

http://consumerist.com/consumer/government-gone-wild/ts...

The TSA is out of control! Monica Emmerson was traveling with her 19 month old toddler when she was detained at Reagan International Airport and threatened with arrest because her toddler had a sippy cup with tap water in it, according to NowPublic:

"I demanded to speak to a TSA supervisor who asked me if the water in the sippy cup was 'nursery water or other bottled water.' I explained that the sippy cup water was filtered tap water. The sippy cup was seized as my son was pointing and crying for his cup. I asked if I could drink the water to get the cup back, and was advised that I would have to leave security and come back through with an empty cup in order to retain the cup. As I was escorted out of security by TSA and a police officer, I unscrewed the cup to drink the water, which accidentally spilled because I was so upset with the situation.

"At this point, I was detained against my will by the police officer and threatened to be arrested for endangering other passengers with the spilled 3 to 4 ounces of water. I was ordered to clean the water, so I got on my hands and knees while my son sat in his stroller with no shoes on since they were also screened and I had no time to put them back on his feet. I asked to call back my fiancé, who I could still see from afar, waiting for us to clear security, to watch my son while I was being detained, and the officer threatened to arrest me if I moved. So I yelled past security to get the attention of my fiancé.

<snip>

http://consumerist.com/consumer/government-gone-wild/ts...

[babylonsister]

1. WAY out of control, and whatever happened to that liquid bomb scare

from last summer? Let me guess...not a damned thing!

[Tandalayo_Scheisskopf]

2. It's pretty well apparent...

That the DHS and the agencies under it are completely out of control.

[Horse with no Name]

3. I see a Bad Moon A' Rising

I see trouble on the way.
I see earthquakes and lightnin'.
I see bad times today.


Don't go around tonight,
Well, it's bound to take your life,
There's a bad moon on the rise.

I hear hurricanes ablowing.
I know the end is coming soon.
I fear rivers over flowing.
I hear the voice of rage and ruin.


All right!

Hope you got your things together.
Hope you are quite prepared to die.
Looks like we're in for nasty weather.
One eye is taken for an eye.

[ChoralScholar]

11. Preach it, brother Fogerty... EOM

[quiet.american]

4. The victims of 9/11 have been made into the perpetrators.

This is craziness. Utter craziness, with a touch of sadism thrown in.

[ChoralScholar]

8. Very astute observation.

I hate feeling so helpless about this Gestapo-like activity. I've had excellent luck in airports, but I'm sure my time's coming.

[tblue]

5. So now we're terrorizing mommies and toddlers, and that's supposed to make us safer?

Whatta buncha crap! A nation that needs to be that controlled is absolutely NOT free!

[BeHereNow]

10. You nailed it- that is the plan.

"A nation that needs to be that controlled is absolutely NOT free!"

DHS and the Patriot Act were NEVER about freedom or "keeping us safe."

The whole nightmare has ALWAYS been about contolling the masses
and keeping TPTB safe from the citizens.

BHN

[LiberalFighter]

6. What we need is a database of TSA idiots with their photos

[BeHereNow]

13. That is the scary part- the majority of them ARE idiots.

High school drop outs, displaced factory workers and
frustrated security guards.
The most dangerous people in the world to give
this type of power to, ignorant and hungry for domination over others
because their own damned lives are so miserable, are the very people
the TSA look for in an employee.

Hasn't anyone else noticed this yet?
Slack jawed, uneducated morons line the airport terminals-
all wearing badges, ready to exercise some "power"
over their fellow citizens at whim.

Remind you of anyone else, my fellow good Germans?

BHN

[pocoloco]

15. displaced factory workers???

damn, I didn't know.

[knitter4democracy]

28. The ones are our airport are great.

Of course, it's a small airport and not super busy. I only fly through there now. Philadelphia was awful! Atlanta wasn't so bad, but Philly, hands down, was the worst about security. Nasty attitudes from the guards, and they went through everything. At our airport, they're polite, smiling, and still very careful but not crazy about it.

[BeHereNow]

35. Well, that is the insanity of the whole operation, is it not?

When I flew through a small airport in Ohio last year,
NO problem, REALLY nice TSA employees; however,
THEY did not search my lap top etc...
The guy said, "Don't worry about it, we're short handed today-
enjoy your flight."

The inconsistency between airports PROVES what a joke TSA is.

Some airports are manned by TSA gestapo types, while others
say, have a nice day.
Mind you, I prefer the "have a nice day" types to the others,
but can not help but wonder how we are actually supposed
to buy the notion that TSA is nothing more than a huge
expense that achieves nothing more than conditioning the
peasants to accept authoritarian domination.

BHN

[FloridaJudy]

71. The TSA screeners at my airport were thorough but courteous

But again, it's a very small airport with long intervals between flights, so they're probably not as stressed.

Many years ago - after the first highjackings but before 9-11 - they used to search all carry-ons by hand, and everyone jumped when one of the screeners let out a scream. Several security guards' hands went to their holsters, before we saw what had caused the commotion. In the middle of some school-kid's back-pack was an extremely realistic-looking toy alligator (every kid needs a fake alligator as a souvenir of his visit to Florida). A good laugh was had by passengers and staff, including the woman who'd screamed, while a red-faced dad lectured his offspring.

I can't help but reflect that these days the outcome could have been a lot uglier, with guards drawing down on little Timmy.

[BeHereNow]

76. Taser Timmy, yeah, how far off is that?

Sorry, but like I have posted elsewhere on this thread,
my impression of the majority of TSA employees is
they are not the sharpest tools in the shed, and
again they prove it by the many examples of nonsensical
behaviors under the guise of "following the rules" to the
point of ridiculous as illustrated by the various stories on this thread.
Do we REALLY want to give a bunch of uneducated,
unthinking morons this much power?
Do WE?
Maybe the Germans should have asked themselves this question?
BHN

[LostinVA]

101. OMG -- Philly IS horrible!

They are nasty, and humiliated my 86-year-old grandfather who has had a stroke. They suck. Seattle is pretty bad, too.

The best security anywhere I've been is Frankfurt: very efficient (those Germans!), very polite, very civil.

[knitter4democracy]

149. I was shocked, frankly.

And I flew through Detroit a lot before they put up the new concourse that's so nice (Hubby proposed to me there, actually). I'm used to not-nice airports, and Philly's really surprised me at how dirty/dingy it was and how mean everyone was.

[RC]

7. Now why can't there be a law suit about this?

The police can be brought up on charges for shit like this. Why not other incompetent nut cases in uniform? Who are they working for? Who are they really keeping safe? Not the other passengers by causing a distraction like this.

[ChoralScholar]

I've wondered that myself....

DU law types(huskerlaw, eyesroll, others): any reason we can't bring charges against TSA officials?

[Canuckistanian]

21. This should be a test case

The level of harassment here is astounding.

As a federal agency, can the TSA be treated like the FBI or BATF?

[ChairmanAgnostic]

100. as the newest federa agency

they are much closer to the SS, the SchutzStaffel of last century.

[Hangingon]

94. I travel fairly often and

the signs about liquids are posted every where I go. In rush times at HOU and DFW TSA people make announcements. I have yet to see a security checkpoint that has a liquid disposal area. It is the world today - get used to it. It isn't so hard.

[Gormy Cuss]

120. We aren't required to "get used to it." If people used their spines we wouldn't have Keystone Cops

implementing poorly thought-out and often unnecessary security procedures. I say that as someone who never gets stopped at security checkpoints because I observe all of the rules. I just believe that most of them are window dressing. Everyone removing shoes? Please. That's not security, that's social conditioning.

[truedelphi]

127. I agree with your thoughts on this

We had one shoe bomber and now we have to remove our shoes.

And the matter of a mom bringing liquids aboard - kids need fluids. They cry; they fuss; they get miserable without them.

Especially given that sometiems once you have gotten on the plane - there can be a long wait (especially during wintry weather conditions)

The flight attendants may or may not be giving the passengers drinks - but the kids expect mom or dad to give them the nourishment.

There has gotta be a better way than this insanity.

[RamboLiberal]

158. Most airports have plenty of shops where you can buy a bottle

of water past the security checkpoint. Or bring your own empty container, sippy cup, nalgene bottle, etc and you can fill from a water fountain.

[Hangingon]

151. Well, I guess you prove my point...

follow the rules and you don't have a problem. You don't have to like the rules. But following them does make the process go faster for those of us behind the person bravely shown their resistnce to social conditioning and dispproval of the jackbooted miminum wage no benefit TSA agent.

[Gormy Cuss]

156. Not if your point is that we should be polite little sheep.

I am not at all happy about it but I comply because I know the rules and understand what it takes to get through the line. I am not happy about the required strip tease which causes a bottleneck both before and after passing through the security points. A qualified analyst noted that this area, with so many unscreened people is a natural target for a terrorist. I agree.

I don't get mad at the TSA person doing his or her job in a professional manner. I also don't get mad at the infrequent fliers who haven't had a good reason to keep up with the frequently changing rules. I do glare at the self-important frequent flyers who get huffy because someone ahead of them in line caused the line to slow down. Frequent travelers ought to have enough sense to build in delay time at the security checkpoints just the same as we build in time for traffic delays on the way to the airport.

[yardwork]

131. I disagree. Children and lots of adults with health issues need fluids.

The national security risk posed by a woman carrying a toddler with a plastic sippy cup is nil, nada, below zero, minus 257 degrees kelvin. This is ridiculous and it needs to stop.

[GumboYaYa]

9. I fly fairly often and occasionally you run into a sceener

who treats everyone like they are terrorists. The only option is to do exactly what they say without question. They can make you miserable if you do not. The system has definitely given some of these pin heads too much power.

[JDPriestly]

12. You mean they aren't? Or at least all terrorists in waiting? I'm joking!

[GumboYaYa]

14. I have noticed that I frequently end up with the "special" treatment.

I have often wondered if the fact that I produced a film titled "Can Mr. Smith Get to Washington Anymore?" has anything to do with the way they treat me at the airport.

Did you know that exercising your first amendment rights is a form of terrorism these days?

[BeHereNow]

16. WOW! Just watched the trailor!

So many talented people on DU.
And yes, I would think your movie might be related
to the "special treatmemt" you aare the recipient of.
BHN

[GumboYaYa]

19. Hey thanks,

I am very proud of the film. It has been a crazy ride this past year with it.

[ellisonz]

31. Great film!

I very well may buy a copy next payday.

Good to see that even though he narrowly lost the primary he's running unopposed for the state senate after winning the primary.

[GumboYaYa]

103. Thank you.

Tell your friends and family about the film and if you know of any political organizations who would like to show it, encourage them to do that.

We are working on another film about New Orleans musicians who are trying to preserve the musical heritage of the city after Katrina.

Any DVDs we sell go to fund the next movie. We are donating all the proceeds from that film to a charitable organization (Music for Tomorrow) that is giving money directly to musicians to help them get back to New Orleans.

[ellisonz]

163. I'll pimp it to all the poly-sci majors I know, the prof's too.

Rock on! If they stop the music they stop the soul!

[alarimer]

73. I saw that. Very cool film

Thanks for that. I really liked that guy. Too bad the deck is stacked against folks like him getting into office. I recall, though, that he eventually won but not the office he was originally seeking.

[dragonlady]

115. Thank you for your movie

We saw it recently and were quite impressed. Everyone should see it and be inspired.

[Left Is Write]

168. Do what they say without question, or they will make you miserable.

Sounds eerily like another group in history with far too much power.

[high density]

17. Flying is such a painful and depressing experience

I want to travel but I hate the nasty gyrations we're put through to get on a plane. We really need a decent high speed rail service in this country. I'd like to take Amtrak but it's painful when their routes take longer than driving a car.

[BeHereNow]

20. They WANT it to be a horrible experience.

They are conditioning you to stay put and be a good serf.
BHN

[conspirator]

108. I agree with you. Its an elite cabal. I used to love flying,

but the police state security makes it so depressing now.

[DemBones DemBones]

164. Flying was great once but now I refuse to fly. As someone said,

it's not traveling, it's being shipped.

Unless of course you pay the outrageous prices to fly first-class.

[Hekate]

74. Amtrak would've taken me two days to get to where I needed to go...

After mom died last fall, and given my horrible feelings about her former airport (see downthread), I investigated train schedules. I needed to join my sibs in Salt Lake City in December to clean out her condo and so forth. Turns out Amtrak requires two days, plus an overnighter in Sacramento, to get from Santa Barbara to SLC. It's just not feasible. This country is not invested in mass transit.

Hekate

[high density]

166. I hear ya...

I am considering taking a vacation in Chicago and looked at the rail option between Boston and Chicago. On the train, the trip takes 22+ hours in traveling, and if I wanted a roomette for the overnight train between Albany and Chicago, the round trip ticket shoots up to something like $800. Considering the cost of a hotel room, this could be a workable price for a couple, but it makes no sense for a person who travels alone. Driving would take roughly the same amount of time, and that includes an 8 hour stop at a hotel. The fare for a seat on the train is within $150 or so of a plane ticket. The air travel ends up being roughly twice as expensive as the train seat ($160 train fare vs. $300 plane ticket), but the plane is four times faster!

[lapislzi]

109. Airports have become laboratories for social engineering experiments

We are instructed to line up, take our shoes off, hand over our belongings for inspection...wait for our turn at the showers...oh, wait a sec...

[MountainLaurel]

133. Unfortunately, I think you're dead on.

Last time I went through this, as I watched the TSA agents harass a mentally challenged man they had separated from his mother (she had a tie-dyed shirt on, you know: obviously a terrorist), I considered that this was all a big training exercise to get us used to standing in line and treated like cattle.

[Canuckistanian]

18. They made her wipe it up???

Look, even if this WAS some ultra-dangerous explosive or biological agent, is it wise to let the alleged perpetrator handle it? What if they threw the rag at the officers or innocent civilians?

No, these assholes were on a power trip.

Repeatedly threatening detainment while the substance in question was being handled by the person in question.

I hope there's a way to sue the ass off these guys.

[ChoralScholar]

24. I thought about that to...

It was about the humiliation. I imagine the TSA agent was more than a little misogynistic.

[BeHereNow]

32. Not mysogynistic, I believe the agent was a female.

I think rather just another mini-hilter-wanna-be.
TSA has knack for signing the type up.

BHN

[ChoralScholar]

34. I didn't read closely -

I assumed the agent was a man, given the actions. My mistake.

[glitch]

46. Females can be misogynistic too. Just like any human can be a misanthrope.

There are some women who are virulently misogynist. Phyllis Schafly springs to mind.

[Morgana LaFey]

63. Being female doesn't save you from being misogyist. At all.

One would hope it would be less likely, but there are plenty of women out there who have thoroughly adopted the most woman-hating parts of patriarchy as their own. They don't REALIZE it, but that doesn't change the facts.

[theHandpuppet]

86. There are women who are misogynists, too

Believe me, I've met a few -- mostly Republicans.

[BeHereNow]

25. I have had far too many encounters with these types in airports.

And yes, it is most certainly a power trip for them.
Many are quite sadistic as well.
In one instance, I was SO angry that I tracked down the
head of the TSA at a particular airport- I drug him back
to the security point I was harrassed at and pointed
out the guy and his supervisor- I told him that a
taxpayer, I was not paying their salaries to be terrorized
by THEM. And yes, I used that word.
To the head guy's credit, I will tell you he was
most apologetic for what had happened.

I have pretty much decided to check everything and
take nothing more than my purse, ID and ticket through security from now on.
BHN

[Canuckistanian]

47. Good for you

Not as many people would do something that brave, standing up to authority like that.

But you KNEW you were being jerked around by these little low-budget martinets.

I applaud you.

[BeHereNow]

60. I don't know how brave I was, just PISSED off at my tax dollars being used AGAINST me

by MINDLESS morons.

The whole situation was so ridiculous and it quickly became clear to me that
I was dealing with a jackboot. I thought to myself,
"Now wait a minute, I pay this dumb ass! My tax dollars
are going to fund this insanity!"

That was the basis for my actions after the incident.
Pure rage at the thought of MY tax dollars being used
against me by an idiot with a badge.

BHN

[Ilsa]

66. They didn't call in a biohazard team with this dangerous sippy cup water? nt

[eppur_se_muova]

22. It doesn't matter that it doesn't make any sense ...

all that matters is that you OBEY ORDERS WITHOUT QUESTION. That's all this maladministration is asking.

[Madspirit]

23. I know I feel safer now.

You never know about young babies and their moms.

This is sick.

Lee

[progressoid]

26. Phew! Another terrorist plot foiled!!

Hooray for the USA!!!

[cobalt1999]

27. I'm sorry, but she was stupid.

I fly every week for my job. If you aren't an asshole, and you make a mistake, like I have many times, they'll ask you to dump what you've got and move on without any problems.

She decided to esculate this, and, of course, she lost. She provoked the situation and got what she asked for. She was dumb.

[BeHereNow]

30. I disagree- they didn't offer her that option.

And I have encountered MANY TSA assholes just like the
ones depicted in the story.

BHN

[cobalt1999]

33. She demanded to speak to a supervisor

Sounds to me like she copped an attitude which is stupid. You're not going to win. Like I said, I fly over 100 times per year into/out of many cities. Keep your cool and no problem. Escalate the situation and you lose. I see these idiots about once a month.

[BeHereNow]

36. I too asked to see the supervisor.

I too, was removed from line and put back into the terminal.
All because my "Baggie was too big."
I offered to switch the meager contents into a smaller one.
The agent refused- told me I could go back into the terminal
and do it.
I said, that is patently ridiculous- I asked to speak with his superior.
I told him that if the only issue was the size of the baggie, that
I could transfer the contents to a smaller one right in front of them.
They threw me out into the terminal, even though I told them
I would miss the flight if I had to stand in line again.
Fortunately, a couple let me right back in after I made the
switch in the terminal.

WHAT REALLY PISSED ME OFF WAS...
When I went back through the same line, the ASSHOLE didn't even
LOOK at the bag, I could have gone through again with the SAME BAGGIE!
PROVING that it was NOT about security, simply about some
distorted, "WE are the gestapo" on the part of the TSA in that particular line.

Turns out, my flight was delayed, so I went to find the head
of TSA in that terminal. As I posted above, I drug him and his
assistant BACK to that line and told them what happened-
how the guy had not even LOOKED at the bag my second time through
and that as a US taxpayer, I was NOT paying their salaries to be
harrassed and terrorized by the TSA.

I got an apology and went to my gate.

WE HAVE to start fighting back.
I'm ALL for security in our airports, but I will NOT
take being "terrorized" and needlessly humiliated by
people I PAY the salaries of.

Neither should you.

BHN

[cobalt1999]

40. You don't like the rules, write your congressman.

Fighting with a lowly TSA agent is stupid and pointless and delays people that know the rules and how to get through security without causing a scene.

[BeHereNow]

42. My point is, there should never have been a "scene."

Switching the contents of one baggie to another would have taken all of
2 seconds.
Problem, in the TSA idiot's mind, was the SIZE of the baggie.
I had one in my purse that was the correct size.
And since WHEN is the size of a fucking baggie relevant to SECURITY???
HELLO?
Any thinking people out there?
BHN

[theHandpuppet]

87. I'm infinitely more frightened by Americans with your attitude...

... than of some booga-booga terrorist attack. They don't need to tear us down from the outside when we're doing such a good job of tearing this nation apart from within.

[Hangingon]

96. Yes!

I would have hated to be behind you in the security line. These regs are for our protection and they are widely available. Just follow them.

[Hangingon]

95. As a a retired Federal employee

let me inform you that you do not pay their salaries. You pay taxes. The Federal government, using funds appropriated by the Congress, pays Federal employees - who are also tax payers - to enforce the laws and regulations.

[lapislzi]

111. The federal government, who serves

..at the pleasure of the people, last time I checked.

I'm just sayin'.

[Hangingon]

113. The ELECTED government officials

serve at the will of the people as their preference is expressed at the polls. The career civil service is hired under a merit system and are expected to carry out the laws and implementing regulations of the government. They are removed for cause. At least this was what I learned in 6th grade civics. The self-righteous statement, "I pay your salary", is crap since Federal civil service people, like the TSA employees in this thread, pay taxes too. Just saying....

[Occulus]

135. These are likely not career civil service positions

As a CURRENT Federal employee, the government is relying more and more on largely untrained temps who get no benefits, vacation time, or sick leave. The liklihood is, the airport screeners are not eligible to be hired in "permenantly".

Such employees are not removed "for cause"; they are terminable because you don't like their hair. And I mean that in all seriousness.

[lapislzi]

138. Anybody have figures on how much of the TSA is privatized?

I would be willing to bet that it's quite a bit. In that case, the whole "civil service" argument becomes moot.

And if the private contractor is making a profit...that's all that's important, right? It's all about the bottom line.

[Hangingon]

148. Actually, it doesn't make the point about "I pay you salary" moot

The contract still comes out of agency funding.

[kestrel91316]

37. The nerve of her demanding to speak to a supervisor. She should

have just been a GOOD LITTLE GERMAN.

[cobalt1999]

39. Bullshit.

If she even bothered to look at the rules, she'd know she was violating them. If she didn't know the rules, she should have apologized instead of demanding a supervisor, thus escalating the situation.

I see these folks all the time. Yes, she was being an asshole.

[ChoralScholar]

41. Well, I guess you'd know. EOM

[BeHereNow]

43. Maybe you should get a job with TSA?

Your thinking process is just as ridiculous as theirs
over the SIZE of a BAGGIE.

You are the perfect example of why this country is falling into
despotic rule.

When you do not question the ridiculous, you condone it
and are no longer a logical person, simply a drone, which is
EXACTLY what the BFEE is depending on in this country from
citizens like you.

Thanks for being such a good patriot and all.

BHN

[cobalt1999]

44. Sorry, no drone here.

However, I know what battles are worth fighting and which ones are pointless. You don't like the rules, take it to someone who can do something about it.

I too got hit with the baggie thing when it was introduced. Difference is, I understood the TSA agents are just enforcing the rules from above. I say this slowly...They...don't...make...the...rules. Go to the source of your frustration, not the person trying to do their job.

That is thinking...try it once in awhile.

[BeHereNow]

48. And the person who offers to COMPLY, is simply what?

When the person "just trying to do their job" will not
permit a passenger, or in the case of the op, offered
the opportunity, to comply with the rules, then what have we?

FASCISM, that's what.

When citizens act against the best interest of fellow citizens
out of BLIND obedience, or worse, an inner inclination to
dominate others while claiming to simply be following orders,
well hell, how far from our very own gestapo can we be.
Isn't that JUST what the nazis did to their fellow citizens?

That is what I am THINKING.
Big picture with full knowledge of history.
You are simply a little too compliant and ready to side with
those just "following orders" for my taste, as a PATRIOT.

BHN

[jberryhill]

105. Oh give it a rest...

While history will no doubt record the great stride in freedom when you win your right to bring a 10 ounce bottle of hair gel on a flight to Tampa, I want to know what people who can't handle getting through airport security do when they have to get on the PLANE and remain belted in a space that is 18 inches by 31 inches for six hours.

But, go win one for me. I want to smoke on airplanes again.

[RamboLiberal]

160. Bad enough to sit in that cramped tube

I'm glad they don't let you smoke. I remember those days when you could smoke anywhere and I remember the useless no smoking sections on a plane - like one row in front of the smokers. IMHO no smoking in public places is best rule ever!

[uppityperson]

92. They may not make the rules but they get to decide how to enforce them

They can escalate a situation or figure out how to make things work civilly. Sounds like this one had an attitude, I have run into them also. Try figuring out that sometimes TSA agents, like people everywhere, might have an attitude.

[Occulus]

134. People with attitudes like yours are why I won't fly anymore

People like you- do as you're told, no way to win, abandon hope, all ye who enter here- are exactly how this situation got to this point in the first place. If people didn't think like you do, if people were more willing to stand up and refuse to tolerate this sort of absolutely insane behavior, it wouldn't be possible for it to exist as a situation in the first place.

Here's what should have happened: four or five people observing the situation should have surrounded the agents and demanded the woman be allowed through the gate unmolested. If that didn't work, six or ten more should have joined them.

But no, too many people think like you do, and the boot just grinds down harder and harder on our collective throats. Be glad we don't know which airline you fly for, because I think the sane, rational, and angry people here- people other than yourself- would take action against it.

Shame on you for supporting fascism. Welcome to my ignore list.

[Richard Steele]

56. I find your attitude FRIGHTENING. nm

[BeHereNow]

68. AGREE 100%. A "good German" if ever I've seen one.

And that unquestioning compliance with the "rules" is why this country is in the shape it's in.
BHN

[Richard Steele]

83. But...but...but..."It makes the planes run on time".

Oh, wait- we don't even have that sad BS to fall back on.
Yet some people just keep smiling and saying how good the shit sandwich tastes.

Scary and SAD, all at once.

[LostinVA]

102. Agreed

[fooj]

64. We're talking about a toddler with a tippee cup.

It had water in it. Give me a break. Escalate what? The whole thing is ridiculous.

[BeHereNow]

67. And THAT IS THE POINT.

The BLIND-MIND set of "just following orders"
has resulted in civilians killing fellow civilians through out history.
What have we become, if not the "Good Germans"
when we comply with this sort of facism?

BHN

[Hekate]

75. Like some damn WW II movie: "Und you VILL obey!" When did WE get to be the fascists?!?

The baby needed his cup. Travelling with infants and toddlers is all about making THEM comfortable, happy, content, and secure, because if you don't, I guarantee that EVERY ONE ELSE in the airplane will share the misery of this little person.

Hekate

[Zookeeper]

88. Well, if she had given up the sippy cup, her toddler would have....

been screaming on the plane, which would have pissed off the other passengers.

She was in a no-win situation.

[Hekate]

90. Travelling with toddlers is all about making them comfortable, bcs if you don't, I guarantee...

Travelling with infants and toddlers is all about making THEM comfortable, happy, content, and secure, because if you don't, I guarantee that EVERY ONE ELSE in the airplane will share the misery of this little person.

You are absolutely right that the baby needed his cup.

When my daughter was infant-to-toddler age I flew several times with her. Everyone around us praised her for being a "good baby"-- but I had made it my mission to keep her that way. Breast, bottle, binkie, blankie, bear, quality snacks, toys and story books -- not just diapers and wipes.

TSA is a freakin' joke. Are they checking all the cargo yet?

Hekate

[Zookeeper]

93. Yes, when I read the OP, I just went straight back to my...

mother of a toddler days. She had a choice between humoring the crazy-jerk TSA agent or placating the irrational toddler. That choice is a no-brainer.

Meanwhile, there could be an un-inspected cargo ship loaded with dirty bombs arriving at one of our ports.

( )

[RamboLiberal]

161. All terminals I've been in have shops past the checkpoints

You can buy water! Yeah some TSA agents are probably schmucks but I bet they have to follow the rules to the letter or risk the wrath of their supervisors. Good grief if you work for a living for an employer we all have stupid rules at work and you probably sign on the line saying you will obey the rules. I'm a rebel and hate rules and think I should be allowed to use my common sense. I can get away with it on my job to some extent, but as a TSA agent I probably wouldn't last an hour.

[uppityperson]

91. I asked to see a supervisor about my hearing aid batteries

They were in the 4-pack container I got them in, sealed, with "hearing aid battery" writen on the container. I tok out my hearing aids and showed them the ones in place. If they get run through the scanner their life-span drops from 1 week to 20 minutes. I asked if they could be hand checked, was told they had to go through the scanner. They are in clear bubble things on a piece of cardboard. I asked if they could look at them and not scan them. They said no and gave me "the look". I asked to see a supervisor who offered to scan them. Explained again why and what. The supervisor looked the package over, and my hearing aids, decided that they were safe to take on the plane. So now I put them in my pocket and walk through the machine, never had a problem.

It was 1 of the 2 times I have been scared of getting arrested in recent yrs. Pissed me off.

Provoking the situation by accidentally spilling water? Give me a break.

[northzax]

137. well she provoked the situation

but opening the cup when she had been told she couldn't drink it there, so yes.

I think you handled your situtation well, as did TSA. think of it from the perspective of the low level screener. you are a flunky, poorly trained and poorly paid, dealing with pissed off people all day, every day. if you make a mistake, err on the side of allowing too much through, you could end up fired, on dateline or (worst case) contributing to the deaths of a hundred people. the guy doesn't know you aren't an undercover reporter, doing an expose on sneaking stuff through security, right? you are in a job where EVERYONE hates you. TSA screeners are targets of ridicule, anger and media attention, all for $12/hour. it's a crappy, crappy, job. so what do you rely on? the rules you have been given. if you follow the rules, you can't get into trouble, right? if you let contraband through, but you did your job to the letter, you can't be in trouble, they can't blame you, only the system. (think of the guilt of the people who let the 9/11 hijackers carry fully legal boxcutters on the plane, that must be crushing, but they followed the rules) so if there is a question, you can allow your supervisor to take the chance on being wrong or right, you relieve yourself of the responsibility. you aren't going to get any credit for bending the rules, right? would you have posted this if the screener had said "sure, seems reasonable' and let you through? probably not. there is no percentage in bending the rules, you don't get anything from it but the potential for trouble. so why do it?

now a supervisor can make a different decision, they have the flexibility in their jobs to do so, and the potential of an upside for making the right choice. I just don't see any reason to get pissed off at the poor schumcks we have chosen, as a society, to deal with this crap job. they're just trying to make a living, and not fuck up. the rage should be expressed at the people who make the rules, and give no flexibility to the workers. they have all the responsiblity, and none of the flexibility to make choices, why get mad at them?

as an example, I have worked as a bouncer at a bar, this is DC, so we get every type of ID you have ever seen. our policy is to card everyone, no matter how old they may look. If I am not certain about your ID, for any reason, you aren't getting in. I get no reward for letting dubious IDs in, and take all the potential punishment (under DC law, as the doorman, if I let you in, even with an ID, and you aren't old enough to be there, I get fined $500.) there is no upside for me to take a chance on you, so why would I? doesn't make sense.

[RC]

146. I have never heard of such a thing.

My hearing aid batteries are in a pocket in my camera bag with my digital camera.
It all goes through the x-ray machine. I have never had a problem, not even after bringing most of the batteries back after a month there. They still worked fine for me. That is twice or more through x-ray machines, depending on the airports.
The batteries are metal anyway.

[yardwork]

132. I don't get that impression from the article at all.

[Vinca]

29. TSA - keeping the world safe from thirsty toddlers.

What a wise use of resources.

[RamboLiberal]

38. I sympathize with the mother - BUT

You have to have a clue when you're traveling these days. It's been almost a year now since this stupid liquid ban went in to effect, so you should know you can't bring any liquid through TSA security unless it's under 3 oz and in your little baggie. If your kid needs a sippie cup, bring it through empty and buy some water past the checkpoint.

I don't doubt some "little tin god" TSA agent having a bad day escalated this, but I also wonder if the mother copped an attitude as well, like "I'm blonde and white so I can't be a terrorist, why are you picking on me and my kid?". What should've happened is she should've been allowed to drink it or to dump it at the checkpoint. And if she spilled it accidentally or on purpose - call an airport cleaning person.

After watching numerous episodes of Airline I don't always think the passengers are totally innocent. Some of them can be total Aholes as well.

I don't travel a lot but the business flights I have taken since the ban I haven't encountered any problems with TSA and several have been very friendly, but I also make sure my carry on stuff meets their requirements and I dress so I don't set off the metal detector. On my last flight I saw several clueless travelers - like 5 water bottles and another with a ton of metal jewelry on - and I was thinking "we let these people vote!"

[trudyco]

49. I'm up on political stuff but not flying stuff...

Now that I've become soccer mom I don't fly much - maybe once a year. I don't see how being clueless about stupid illogical rules at airports equates to being clueless about voting issues. I didn't know about the liquids thing for months after it was inacted. Since MSM news is no longer worth watching I don't watch it. I still can't remember about the rule. It seemed like a ploy to get people to buy drinks at outrageous prices at the airport. I also wondered if a Bush supporter produced little bottles for a living.

Not everybody is a jet setter.

[RamboLiberal]

157. Just from reading political blogs like DU I'd figure you'd be

somewhat familiar with the rules. We were all over it last year when the bans were enacted. So was the news. And this mom was supposed to have worked for the Secret Service - I'd figure she should know security rules. Don't know if she was a former agent, but maybe she took an equally "little tin god" attitude.

[jberryhill]

80. It is pretty amazing on both sides

Watching stupid TSA agents deal with stupid travelers is pretty depressing.

No, showing up at the airport with thigh-high boots when you are going to have to send your shoes through the scanner is not a sign of an intelligent life form.

When you have a line choice, you have to size up the folks in front of you, and you can spot the folks with huge belt buckles, large hoop earrings, and a laptop case from which they show no signs of removing the laptop, pretty quickly.

No doubt, some TSA agents were not selected from the skinny right side of the curve either.

[AlCzervik]

45. i walked through the airport security in las vegas with a lighter in my pocket that i forgot

to throw away---got right through, no problem at all, i didn't even realize it was in there until i got off the place and picked up my bags.

[BeHereNow]

51. EXACTLY!!!

The inconsistencies in TSA have ALREADY been more than documented,
and thus, when these airport jackboots make an issue over a toddlers sippy cup,
or the size of a baggie, what the fuck is the point of all of it.
SUPPRESSION of citizens, BY citizens, that's what! And, just look back
to all the hitlers of history to see where we are heading.

BHN

[hvn_nbr_2]

50. Sometimes you just wanna ask someone "Do you have any human chromosomes?" nt

[Make7]

52. They are obviously acting as agents for the Bottled Water companies.

I used to fly quite a bit. Shortly after 9/11, I forgot I had my finger-nail clippers packed in the bag I was taking as carry-on. Of course it got flagged to be searched going through the x-ray machine, when the offending item was discovered the security person told me I wasn't allowed to take that on the plane, I was supposed to put it in with my checked luggage.

So I quickly explained that I had just been out of town where I had driven and forgot that I had them packed from that trip just a few days before. I said that if I couldn't take them on, they could just throw them away - I really didn't care, I'd just buy new ones. She looked at me for a few seconds thinking about it and told me it didn't really matter, I could take them on the plane anyway. Okay....

A similar thing happened about six months after that. I had a skinny 6 inch screwdriver in my laptop case. When security searched my case, they questioned me about it because they said I shouldn't be taking something like on the plane.

After I explained that one of our suppliers ships them with every single product we buy from them and I just keep one in my laptop case because it comes in handy sometimes, I told them they could throw it away because I would be able to get a new one free in a couple of days. And again, once I told them to throw it away, security told me it didn't really matter, I could take it on the plane anyway.

I must have an honest face or something. Or maybe most of them know that a lot of the rules are pretty dumb - including the restrictions on liquids. Part of me thinks it's just to get me to fork over $3.00 for a bottle of water after I get past the security checkpoint.

- Make7

[BeHereNow]

55. If you search the archives, that is what I said too.

It's all about the money.
The fact that the fucking agent wanting to know where the water was from tells
the whole story.
No doubt, if the woman had produced a bottle of airport purchased water and
explained that she needed to give the kid medication before flying, there would have
been no problem.
See, the problem was the water was not profitable to the multi national corporations
that have stolen this country.

The whole fucking situation is ridiculous. Really.
BHN

[jberryhill]

79. There are bathrooms and drinking fountains on the other side of security

What was the big deal here. I also fly frequently and it's a no brainer that you aren't getting through security with a sippy cup that has water in it.

Inconvenience aside, she was probably no more than several feet from a tap or drinkng fountain on the other side of the gate.

But, no, she had to hold up everyone in line by copping an attitude about it.

YES, the rules are stupid. YES, many TSA people can be dicks.

But if you haven't been in line behind someone who is wearing tons of jewelry, has a pocket full of change, and is carrying a water bottle, when you already have about 5 minutes until your gate time, you just haven't appreciated the utter stupidity of some people in airports.

[fortyfeetunder]

85. Try traveling with a toddler in an airport

I'll put it like this. I've traveled with babies and toddlers and meeting their needs is paramount to those silly-ass TSA rules.

TSA needs a course on babies and children. They are not little robots...

[jberryhill]

104. I have travelled with toddlers at the airport

and you have to allow extra time. If your child is thirsty, then there is time for them to drink before the few minutes that it takes to get through security.

Again, the rules are utterly stupid. Making a scene at the checkpoint is not the way to change the rules. Countless thousands of infants and toddlers manage to make it through every single day.

I have seen TSA agents with a bad attitude, and I have seen travelers with a bad attitude.

Personally, I've thought about freezing bottled water and trying to get that through:

"Waddya mean 'no liquids'. This ain't liquid, it's solid."

[fortyfeetunder]

114. Under normal circumstances yes it's possible

But throw Murphy's Law in the mix (emergency trip, long lines, holiday periods, etc)...extra time might not cut it for toddlers. Few minutes? How about 30 minute or more wait?

If TSA is so good with racial profiling, then why can't they profile the threat potential for parents with kids?

I read an interesting comment from that blog last night. One poster suggested that TSA is a service organization, and they should never have humiliated or embarrassed any of the people going through. If anything they should have taken the high road.

[jberryhill]

122. It's still pretty simple

Few minutes? How about 30 minute or more wait?

You can drink, carry, consume, hold, etc. WHATEVER LIQUIDS YOU WANT WHILE YOU ARE IN THE LINE. I fly at least twice a month, and I spend plenty of time in those lines, and I have travelled with small children.

In fact, the last time I flew with my 13 year old son, he remembered that he had a can of spray deodorant in his carry on. You take it out, you leave it on the table (if there is no trash can there), and you go through.

It's not brain surgery here.

If the kid needed the sippy cup while standing in line, then its a no brainer when you get to the checkpoint to unscrew the cap swallow the contents, take the empty cup through, and then refill it from the tap or drinking fountain on the other side.

But if the point is to keep the child comfortable, then you tell me how arguing with the TSA is going to accomplish THAT.

[truebrit71]

125. Riddle me this...I just got back from a trip to Europe and noticed some interesting things...

...leaving the US it was the usual, no shoes, no liquid, no matches, no lighters type nonsense. The ban on lighters and matches in response to the alleged 'shoe bomber', the liquid ban due to the alleged plot last year (that was possibly YEARS away from being feasible) in England, and yet as I travelled back from London I got to keep my shoes on, drink and bring through security my water bottle, and yet in the USA where NEITHER one of the aforementioned "threats" started or reached, they STILL have the 'closed barn-door' mentality....

Not surprising really, it took US customs an extra three years to figure out that foot and mouth had been contained and quashed in the UK before they took down their stupid signs about that...

The TSA does a good job of providing the appearance of security, and not much else. I have been picked out a couple of times for some extra screening and everything's been just fine. These folks are doing a thankless job for not much money and if I were in their shoes I'd get attitude too when the eight thousandth person that day lipped off to me...

[jberryhill]

126. Oh I agree with you it is utterly stupid

I've been to Europe three times in the last year. I'm also a smoker, and so being able to light a cigarette after landing matters to me.

At Madrid, they SELL lighters on the "secure" side of the airport.

The TSA is 99% purely for show value, and most of the rules are as utterly stupid as those who enforce them. I've been consistent in saying that in this thread.

That said, however, making a stink about getting liquid through in the US is not going to get you, or your child, through security any faster. You can drink in the line and have an empty container in your carry on when you pass through the checkpoint, and you can refill it from a tap or fountain on the other side.

As an ex Secret Service employee, this passenger believed she was "special" and needlessly inflamed the situation.

You know, of course, the MOST outstandingly stupid thing of them all - security screening the pilots. That is so utterly brain-damaged that I can't imagine why the pilots put up with it.

[blondie58]

98. this is ludicrous

and I too, have noticed that you're okay to bring on a water or some other liquid- after you've gone through the security checkpoint.

Terrorists are really pretty smart- I'm sure they've figured that one out.

And I've often thought- you can't totally prevent liquid.

What is to stop a terrorist from drinking his liquid before the flight and retrieving it in the bathroom?

[Zodiak]

99. his kidneys?

amazing little filters those things are.

[tblue37]

53. Wow. If you follow the links to the original article,

not just the quoted article that reprints her comments, you will learn that this woman is a former SECRET SERVICE AGENT who left the service to raise a family. A former Secret Service agent!

Here is a link to the original articel:
http://www.nowpublic.com/nightmare_at_reagan_national_a...

[ChoralScholar]

54. I couldn't get the original article to open earlier

or I would have posted it. Thanks for posting.

[tblue37]

57. Here is a comment posted to the original article:

fatcat1111:

On a related note, flying back from my parents' this winter, TSA goons removed from my five-year-old daughter's backpack a snowglobe, presented to her as a Christmas gift from her grandparents, and threw it away, right in front of her, telling her (not me!) that it could be used to make a bomb. Of course she was histerical. She still talks about this, asking me why somebody would do that to her and why didn't I do something about it.

Someone should compile these horror stories. Maybe that should be Michael Moore's next movie.

[ChoralScholar]

58. Check your PM. EOM

[jberryhill]

124. I agree with the kid

Why didn't the parent put the snowglobe in checked baggage instead of thinking the TSA was going to make an exception.

What part of NO LIQUIDS do people not understand?

Yes, it's a stupid rule.

No, you are not getting through security with liquids except in very narrow exceptions.

Can I post my horror stories of waiting behind stoopid people in the security line?

[Occulus]

139. No, but my horror stories of people allowing such rukes to exist because they're rules

is told in your posts throughout this thread.

Welcome to my ignore list. I don't read posts by people who apologize for open fascism.