Bush says the way to counter outsourcing is education

[Rose Siding]

Today's LAT:

Bush Tackles Outsourcing Issue
On the final day of his India visit, the president defends U.S. firms that send jobs overseas.
....
"People do lose jobs as a result of globalization, and it's painful for those who lose jobs," the president said during a round-table discussion at the India School of Business in this city about 800 miles south of New Delhi. "But the fundamental question is, 'How does a government or society react to that?'

"And it's basically one of two ways. One is to say losing jobs is painful, therefore let's throw up protectionist walls. And the other is to say losing jobs is painful, so let's make sure people are educated so they can find — fill the jobs of the 21st century."
....
Bush sought Friday to recast the issue in the public's mind.

"We won't fear competition, we welcome competition, but we won't fear the future either, because we intend to shape it through good policies," Bush said. "And that's how you deal in a global economy. You don't retrench and pull back. You welcome competition and you understand globalization provides great opportunities."

So, how's that working out for us?

Bush Plans On Cutting Vocational Ed Money
President Bush says vocational classes are ineffective.
http://www.keloland.com/News/NewsDetail5443.cfm?Id=0,46...

"Mr. Bush's 2007 budget would cut $2.1 billion next year from education"
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/03/04/politics/04budget.htm...

Education cuts destroy hopes for a college education
http://www.aapress.com/Archive/2006/webmarch4/o-century...

snip>
Tribal leaders wondered why they bothered prioritizing their needs when the federal Office of Management and Budget appears not to take those recommendations into consideration.

Among the programs slated for elimination and reductions are:
-- The federal Johnson O'Malley Program, which has long provided funding to school districts on military and Native lands, faces elimination.
-- School construction faces a proposed cut of just under $50 million.
-- Elementary, secondary and post-secondary education faces proposed reductions amounting to $16.3 million, while the BIA Office of Indian Education Programs was increased $9.1 million for administrative restructuring.
http://www.indiancountry.com/content.cfm?id=1096412605

[proud2BlibKansan]

1. Thanks - great post

recommended.

[liveoaktx]

54. VIDEO clip of Ass In Chief saying that

Don't Worry about Outsourcing, We're Helping India

[RazzleDazzle]

70. Would be a great post were it not for the faulty premise --

we do NOT need "more education" or more highly educated workers in our current job market. That's not what's causing the outflow of jobs to other countries like India.

Lou Dobbs covered this masterfully the other night: he showed the high number of new jobs being created are restaurant workers (flippin' hamburgers) and nurse's assistants (changing bed pans don't need no education either, or at least not much).

No, the "education" that people in India can offer is that they can live on a lot less money per year than U.S. workers are paid.

[ekelly]

73. Exactly.......

Americans who get more education will ask for higher wages.

The whole point of outsourcing is to pay people LESS money, not to find better educated people who demand higher wages.

Bush* is a complete idiot.

[liveoaktx]

76. I actually had made a clip of Dobbs talking about that too

Jobs of the 21st century

It *is* an education, though, isn't it? We're all wising up about Bush.

[Rose Siding]

78. The premise is that bush is a liar and/or incompetent

He's in the process of attempting to deconstruct the very "solution" he proposes.

While it's true that the middle and lower classes here are being priced out of training and education, we aren't losing jobs because we're stupid.

[Drum]

2. in "1984,"

I seem to recall that education of a sort was important to the State as well....

[tanyev]

3. Highly educated IT professionals are losing their jobs to outsourcing.

Many of them are "dumbing down" their resumes in the hopes of finding anything that will pay the bills.

[liveoaktx]

55. Exactly that we were talking about in my home this morning

If you are already educated as a highly skilled person, and your job is outsourced to somebody else equally skilled but in another country who is willing to be paid cheaper, you're supposed to get educated? You ARE educated. But maybe this means get educated for how to work stocking shelves in a Walmart.

[tanyev]

58. My hubby's company went from 90,000 to 30,000 in just a couple years.

All of them computer programmers, engineers, etc. He's still there, thank God, but it could just as easily have been him. And George Bush has the nerve to tell these people they need more education? Maybe he's talking about Starbucks University.

[acmejack]

4. Educating the idiots in DC perhaps.

Too little too late. And they knew full well what they were doing in the first place. This was a wonderful thing for those in the upper strata of society.

[Why Syzygy]

5. If that is so

why did I train the person from Canada who took our jobs? I'm not educated enough?

[area51]

27. You bring up another important point.

Not only are jobs fleeing our country due to greedy traitorous republinazis, but the fact that we are a barbaric country w/o universal healthcare is also greasing the skids for jobs to leave, b/c it's cheaper to do business in a country that has universal healthcare, like Canada.

[Judi Lynn]

6. Wonderful post. Well considered. Thank you.

Hope a lot of DU'ers read it.

[Daphne08]

7. When he stood in India and stated that outsourcing

was difficult for Americans, he insulted my father who fought in WWII for this country. My father was a good man who served his country, paid his taxes and worked every day of his life for his family so that we kids could have a better life than he had.

He insulted my grandfather who also worked hard all of his life, paid his taxes and supported this country so that his sons could have a better life than he had.

He insulted my great-grandfather, my great-great grandfather... all my grandfathers all the way back to the late 1790's!

His is insulting my own sons who have both graduated from college. For what? For friggin' what?

[acmejack]

19. He insulted the 28 people in my group at Dell.

Th empty parking lots at the buildings where the once industry leading technical support force worked mutely accuse him of betrayal too. It sure doesn't feel like it was good for us. I run into people they don't look and act like it was good for them & their families. Many of them act like broken men & women, bankrupt, unemployed, depressed, & filled with self doubt, I would say it has been a little insulting to them as well.

[Skittles]

25. Daphne, this deserves its own thread

yes, he is insulting so,, so many people dear to me - and he is insulting me too.

[Infomaniac]

8. Nominated. More talk the talk, don't walk the walk from Chimpy.

My sister works in Human Resources for Home Depot. She has engineering graduates, IT professionals and other highly educated people applying for cashier jobs. 20-somethings with educational debt are working jobs that barely pay rent and the student loan repayment.

[acmejack]

22. Do any of those highly educated people get interviews?

A lot of places won't even consider them on the basis of "over qualification". It sounds ridiculous, but it is a sad reality and it is encountered regularly, at least down here.

[Infomaniac]

36. Actually, the head cashier

at one of her HDs has an engineering degree. In the rust belt, people do get interviews and jobs.

[katmondoo]

24. I think he intends to bring in lots of looms so that we can learn weaving

then he will bring in farm implements that require hands on (you can employ more people if you do not use machinery) then bring back sewing in sweat shops, (this will keep the women busy) also women seem to be good at tilling tomato plants, that will keep the outdoors types busy. Lots of new innovative jobs that can be outsourced from India to the USA

[Infomaniac]

38. I think you're right.

[0007]

50. ....and most importantly the Americans will learn how to

balance large load on their heads. No need need for wheelbarrows.

[Road Scholar]

9. I wish "Bar" woulda had an abortion back in 1946.

[mitchum]

72. I wish that she had not been too drunk to keep that scrawny WASP...

from crawling on her. The world would be a much better place.

[tularetom]

10. Let me get this straight

What he's saying is get an education so you can qualify for a job at a pay rate less than what they're paying Apu. Because that's the only way that job is ever coming back here. The Indians are smarter, hungrier and more aggressive than Amurkan kids and they're willing to work for a lot less just to get their foot in the door. The "jobs of the 21st century" will all be at retail stores or fast food restaurants. So we've lost the manufacturing jobs, we're losing the tech sector jobs pretty soon all we'll have left is Mall Wart. Whoopie.

[Greyhound]

39. I hope you didn't intend to, but I find your statement insulting, beyond

the fact that it is just repeating the lies that have been disseminated through the corporate media. The Indians are not smarter, or better educated for that matter, they're just cheap.
That is the summed total of their qualifications, and that is mostly due to the fact that they live in a socialist state.
They are hungrier...

[earth mom]

11. So people will need a degree to work at Walmart or McDonalds...

...considering how many good paying jobs requiring a degree have gone to India...what else is left?

The * spin on this is disgusting.

[LiberalEsto]

23. The good news here

is that, because Indians revere cows, they won't take over jobs that involve selling hamburgers. So those are still safe.

Send your kids to school to get their BAs - Beef Associate degrees.

"Always look on the bright side of life"

[Warpy]

12. The most highly educated people are also losing jobs now

because any skilled work that can be outsourced and sent offshore is being so. Medical transcription, billing and records keeping are largely done in India now. X rays are read offshore, especially at night, by radiologist MDs. Engineering jobs of all description are being shunted off to Ireland, India, China, Malaysia, and anywhere else with an educated population. Education in this country is becoming utterly valueless except as a way for educators to make money while keeping people out of the unemployment statistics.

If I were young and healthy and educated, I'd seriously consider leaving. This country has no place for educated people, only for uneducated people who will do as they are told in service jobs.

[Armstead]

13. Education doesn't matter if the educated jobs are outsourced

Bush is spouting the same crap that centrist Democrats who support "free tyrade" spout off.

It's real simple. The only jobs that have to be geographically based are direct personal service jobs and manual labor such as construction.

Everything else can be shipped out of the country, even the highly skilled technical and administrative ones. We've seen that in technology, where the "new generation" of jobs in the 1990's became the outsourced jobs of the 00's.

The only solution is enough protectionism and awareness of the need to retain a domestic economy to counterbalance the amoral forces of unrestrained global "free market" forces.

[leftstreet]

14. "Is our children learning?"

[Coastie for Truth]

15. Kicked and nominated - with pleasure

New Thought:

Our unemployment compensation laws and our adult education laws work at cross purposes.

The problem is that in most states you have to be available "immediately" to accept a new job "immediately" - even if it means dropping out of school.

Back when the auto industry first began to suffer - Michigan co-ordinated unemployment comp and education. Example - if a laid off employee was, e.g., an "ink and cloth" draftsperson or an assembler, and was enrolled in a training program, Associates Program, or Bachelor's Program (there was even one Ford iron and steel materials science PhD who was enrolled in an EE PhD program) - he or she was allowed to at least finish the semester.

[mrdmk]

47. Here in California, YOU cannot collect unemployment and go to

school at the same time. It is not allowed, period.

Stupid ass President I say, does not know the laws of this nation! What good is he?


note: I am restraining from yelling with all my strength. I am one of those IT types that lost a OK paying job, then took a $10 an hour job which got reduced to $6.75 (restructuring) and then took a crap Security Job so I can attend college! I have approximately 4.5 years to go to get my new degree.

[Coastie for Truth]

49. In MI you can

if you were laid off in MI from an MI job that you held for some specified period of time.

[mrdmk]

52. I think MI is different because of the auto industry, they have been

bleeding jobs since 1973 and needed people to stay in the state. This was a matter of survival. In California, anytime that there is mass layoffs (It has happen due to lost jobs in Aircraft, Military, Automotive and Information Technology)the controlling media trots out stories concerning welfare abuse. The retaining programs in California are left to the citizen to figure out on his own.

[Why Syzygy]

62. Not in Texas either

You can't even get foodstamps if you're going to school unless you work a minimum number of hours.

Yeah. Great support for EDUCATION!

I hope we know this guy is a bozo. Look at his Yale educated mug. Of course he made president, so all is well.

[linazelle]

16. Fuck him. Just fuck him. n/t

[thinkingwoman]

17. how much education does he think we need

to flip burgers and ask people if they would like fries with that?

[verse18]

34. If * had not been born into the family that he was,

this would be the only job he could get.

[thinkingwoman]

67. and you know, honestly...

he'd probably get fired from it.

[cap]

18. I dont think education alone is the answer...

there are too many unemployed/underemployed over-educated people. To a corporation, a degree from India's IIT is equivalent to an MIT degree. There is no value add from an American college relative to the price. We need a new industrial policy.

There's an article recently in Foreign Affairs stating that we need no highly paid geeks. Any highly paid but impersonal jobs can be outsourced. People skills are becoming more important than knowledge. High touch jobs are the only safe jobs. A few high touch jobs like internists require both education and location. A lot of high touch jobs require only location like electrician. Marketing jobs are highly dependent on the state of the economy. Some marketing jobs dont require high touch and can be outsourced.

Not everyone is a creative type that can come up with new products and not all creatives have access to financing that will make their dreams commercially viable.

[young_at_heart]

20. "Bush says vocational education is ineffective"...absolutely unbelievable

Every study shows that's it's imperative for nations to have a good vocational training program. It boggles the mind that he would say such a thing. I have personally been involved with vocational education and I know it works....on the contrary, it would be very advantageous if we had lots more of it!!!

[Jayhawk Lib]

35. I do not remember him saying that.

He probably did but can you provide a link that has the highlights of that speech or commentary regarding that speech.

[LiberalUprising]

65. Here it is

President Bush, in his budget proposal this year, recommended the termination of vocational education and other education programs deemed ineffective and "unable to demonstrate results."

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/wireStory?id=728076&CMP=...

Googlesearch for vocational+education+is+ineffective:

http://www.google.com/search?q=vocational+education+is+...

[young_at_heart]

66. It was listed in the first post.......keloland.com

He says so many weird things that we can't remember all of them!

[LiberalEsto]

21. Education such as "Hamburger School"

"You want fries with that?"

[dogday]

28. I saw that movie and laughed my ass off.... nt

[salin]

29. not even that...

outsourcing drive throughs to India....

[Dont_Bogart_the_Pretzel]

44. only if they are

freedom fries!

post 21. Education such as "Hamburger School"

[Cobalt Violet]

26. Here's the curriculum:

Will that be paper or plastic?

[Justpat]

30. Lou Dobbs did a piece on this last night.

He showed how the most available jobs left in the US don't even require a high school education.
They are jobs like kitchen workers such as dish washers, bus boys/girls.
And the usual jobs that fall to immigrant workers like maids, lawn service workers, etc.

So in Bush's world, educated workers must move overseas to catch up to their jobs or take what
is left for the peasantry.

[bridgit]

31. funding from his 'no child left behind' program was said to have...

made it's way into his brother, Neil's, hands via the Dubai Port Authority!!!

Bush is a liar of the 1st magnitude, and i have little empathy left for the IQ of anyone that believes otherwise at this point

[NYC]

32. It's MONEY, not education.

Those people aren't smarter; they're cheaper.

That's all there is to it.

[Fovea]

33. Of course

** wants a peonage lower class structure, so the patrons can stay in power easier and feel even wealthier.

So education is not in the plans for Murika.

[formercia]

37. Have you ever been told you were overeducated?

Sometimes,no matter how well educated you might be, the jobs aren't there, so you take what you can get. You go to an interview and told that you're overqualified for the position.

[TahitiNut]

41. Ubetcha. "Overqualified" and "overeducated" both.

Most employers just want cannon fodder.

[Greyhound]

42. The number one reason for not hiring me for the three years, after

1000's of resumes, and dozens of interviews after losing my career. "You're overqualified for this job and we think you'll be bored or quit when something better comes along", is what they said. What they meant was "you're over 35 and have been around long enough to recognize the bullshit we feed our employees".

[sproutster]

75. Yes on four jobs -- Took me 6 months to find my current job

and every three months we wait to see if we are going to be outsourced.

[gizmo1979]

40. Dobbs looked up what the most needed

professions were going to be in the coming years.Nurses Aid which doesn't even require a high school diploma and food service workers.I guess that will save money on education.

[fortyfeetunder]

43. I don't believe him.

Maybe * really meant: the way to counter education is outsourcing...

[Sadie5]

45. As far back as I can remember

when the economy reached a low point due to job loss, whomever was in office at the time would mount the podium and declare the US citizen incapable of holding the lost jobs due to a lack of education. This might have held water in the 50-60s,even the 70s, but not today. It's a smokescreen and nothing more. If anything there are as many or more US citizens who could do these jobs if Bush tried to do his own job. I cannot describe to you how much I loath this lying idiot, rich frat boy who has never worked a day in his life.

[0007]

46. Americans are not going to forget junior's trip to India. (I hope)

I'm so pissed I can't see straight. What's it gonna take before this nation has had enough of this asshole. Now junior is telling us to get fucked!

[salin]

48. He has just more firmly planted the idea

that my job that disappeared, did so with the blessing (and escalation) of the GOP; or... his party's exceptional deafness and lack of concern at the escalating loss of jobs.

One more reason for the GOP on the Hill to be fuming at Bush - per his selling their incumbancy/reelection rights - yet to date they still seem more afraid of bullying by Rove than by retaliation and loss of job in November.

[ladjf]

51. He insulted the eleven young DBA's that were working at my

company at the time I retired in April of 2005. Back then there were 13 DBA's on staff. By December of 2005, there was only one. The didn't outsource the computers. They stayed in the building. But, the new DBA's were in India.

By the way, that also means that there was no reason in the world that while we were still on staff, we were required to commute to work everyday, some of us as much as 2.5 to 3 hrs. per day, at our expense. If the Indian DBA's could do everything remotely, so could we have done it.

We are headed toward third world status.

[Deja Q]

53. Education. In what fields, again?

Glib words set under circumstances in which all the details point to "nothing new is coming" do little to help.

What is coming?

When manufacturing got offshored, IT was there to pick up the slack.

IT is now being offshored. What's to pick up that slack?

[mhr]

56. 8 Of 10 Top Jobs In Next Decade Need Only High School Ed.

Bush is blowing smoke up our asses as usual.

[UrbScotty]

57. If anyone knows about a good education, it's George W. Bush

[Roland99]

59. And they want to privatize public schools...starting with San Diego. >>>>>

http://rawstory.com/news/2005/K_Street_pushes_charter_s...

[Blue_Tires]

60. how out-of-touch can he BE?

i'm educated, and my field is not the type to get outsourced, and i still cannot find a job

[AzDar]

61. He is LOATHESOME. We cannot withstand even 3 more years

of this creature...there will be nothing left.

[Virginian]

63. All information technology jobs going to Indians and Asians.

American students quit majoring in IT fields.
American schools quit teaching IT subjects.
US has no expertise in IT so it gives up all IT business to foreign countries.
With no expertise in the country, US government outsources IT security.
Citizens find out about outsourced security and complain. To keep from outsourcing IT security, US gives up IT.

Protectionists want to protect, not only American jobs, but America itself.
We used to be self sufficient. We need to make sure we can remain that way. We need expertise in everything. We need to have some of all products made in the USA.

[roguevalley]

64. I have an MA. Fat lot of good it will do me if I decide to work again.

[Rex]

68. How can you find jobs if all the slots are being sent over seas?

Bush, worst president ever.

[undeterred]

69. Best way is to make Bush unemployed

or better yet give him a job digging graves for all the Iraqi Civilians he is responsible for killing.

[Nikki Stone 1]

71. YES!

[Disturbed]

74. Shrub is a dumbass and a liar.

The Neo Fascist Regime of Bush/Cheney are serving the Multi-Natls. Their agenda is to make all workers servile and barely making a living world wide. One of their goals is to destroy the American Middle Class and have a Serf System in America. The Democratic Party is mainly complicit in this agenda.

[opihimoimoi]

77. This dude isn't giving America any valid answers/solutions: He is Not

a Positive President/Person. The Opposite...he is NEGATIVE....