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Philosoraptor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 04:29 PM
Original message
Do you personally see any evidence of global warming?
The republicidiots keep saying it's an hallucination, but I swear, it's downright tropical today in Missouri, when it really ought to be about 35 degrees. We've had unnatural weather patterns and very mild winters for several years in a row.

I get the feeling that global warming is real, and is happening right now, in front of my lyin' eyes.
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gatorboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 04:30 PM
Response to Original message
1. It was 71 here in Arkansas today.
Edited on Thu Dec-14-06 04:31 PM by gatorboy
Normally it's in the 30's. 40's tops. The ice skating rink is a puddle.
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Skittles Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 04:42 PM
Response to Reply #1
13. it will be 80 degrees here in North Texas this week
or so I heard on the radio while getting my teeth scraped
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dysfunctional press Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 04:31 PM
Response to Original message
2. seeing as it is pretty much inevitable at this point...
i hope the rate of decline speeds up a little- i'm 45, and i want to live long enough to see florida submerged by rising sea levels.
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flyingfysh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 04:49 PM
Response to Reply #2
20. I hope that doesn't happen
My mom's house is a few yards from a salt-water tidal marsh. If sea level goes up, she gets flooded out.
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dysfunctional press Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 04:53 PM
Response to Reply #20
23. it's going to happen.
it's just a matter of how long the greenland ice sheet takes to melt and/or slide into the sea.

when it DOES- look for another 20 ft. of ocean world-wide, and lots more beachfront property in southern georgia.

and me doing this:
:woohoo:
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1monster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 05:06 PM
Response to Reply #2
32. Gee, thanks. Florida is my home and I love it here, despite that fact
Edited on Thu Dec-14-06 05:07 PM by 1monster
that it is being destroyed by developers and incoming people who have no idea what an incredible and very delicately balanced ecosystem we have here.

The cost of your fresh veggies will go waaaaay up when Florida is submerged. As for orange juice, faghetaboutit.
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dysfunctional press Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 05:33 PM
Response to Reply #32
53. it's not my fault that it's going to be underwater in the relatively near future-
but it is going to happen, and it's something that i'd like to be around to see.
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1monster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 09:24 PM
Response to Reply #53
96. No, but your gleeful attitude is your fault and your responsibility.
Gee Dubya did not win Florida. Florida did not give the election to Gee Dubya. The Supreme Court did.
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dysfunctional press Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-15-06 01:04 PM
Response to Reply #96
113. oh, well...
the state is one big septic sore on our nation, and i for one will be estatic when it's washed away. :hi:
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gulfcoastliberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-15-06 03:58 PM
Response to Reply #32
117. Oranges,maybe - but California is a much larger ag economy than FL
Perhaps sugarcane prices will go up, too.
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Kber Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-15-06 10:19 AM
Response to Reply #2
110. Yeah? and where exactly do you think all those Floridians will go?
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dysfunctional press Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-15-06 01:02 PM
Response to Reply #110
112. i don't know- but they'd better start thinking about it...
cuz it's coming.
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KitSileya Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 04:31 PM
Response to Original message
3. It's been raining for 52 days straight here,
it's been the warmest autumn ever, the warmest November ever, there's never been as many storms and thunderstorms at this time of year that I can remember. It's crazy.
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AnnInLa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 04:33 PM
Response to Original message
4. This was an OK year for hurricanes, but
the year before that....oh boy, ask anyone here in Louisiana if they believe. They do now. Many of us, myself included, are looking forward to owning beach-front property soon.

I was wearing shorts yesterday too, but it's not uncommon here to be wearing shorts for Christmas.
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flyingfysh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 04:47 PM
Response to Reply #4
18. the African dust storms kept the hurricanes at a minumum this year
Dust storms from the Sahara kept away enough warming to keep this hurricane season minimal. If we don't get dust storms next year, we're in trouble.
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Bjornsdotter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 04:34 PM
Response to Original message
5. Quite balmy

..in northern Illinois. Two weeks ago we had 15" of snow, today no more snow and the grass is turning a lovely shade of green.

Cheers
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pscot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 04:34 PM
Response to Original message
6. How about the category 1 hurricane
bearing down on Puget Sound right now?
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windbreeze Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 09:15 PM
Response to Reply #6
92. Yeah, how bout that???
I am so thrilled...don't go out if you don't have too...the wind is pretty strong outside, tree branches/fallen trees everywhere...surprise, we haven't lost our elect just yet...but if it gets much worse it will, and rain...OMG...is all I can say...
windbreeze
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Broken_Hero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 04:35 PM
Response to Original message
7. What completely sold me
was a 93 degree day in SE Alaska last year..it happened while my parents were down here visiting my wife and I, August of 2005...

I'm in SW Missouri, and we are still in a drought...been going on two years...last winter was a complete and utter joke, and so was the winter before that...

We had severe weather down here a week(or 2) back, and that was a shocker to all of us....ice/sleet/snow. Its hard for me to get a good bearing on the weather here, its so...severe at times, and can change pretty damn quickly...
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newportdadde Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 04:38 PM
Response to Original message
8. Also in Missouri, we now have armadillos.
Edited on Thu Dec-14-06 04:39 PM by newportdadde
This is as far north as near KC, unheard of where I grew up about 60 miles south of KC. I had seen them in Oklahoma but that was it.

My father who is 58 is a farmer and talks about how are winters never get cold anymore. For example when I was born almost 30 years ago the winters were so cold they had to wrap the pipes.

Forgot to mention that I walked outside today in KC without a jacket, about 60 here.
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Broken_Hero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 04:47 PM
Response to Reply #8
16. We are infested with armadillo's
down here, SW Missouri...they can tear up your yard/garden pretty damn quick.
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Philosoraptor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 05:20 PM
Response to Reply #16
45. Lately I've seen a few dead ones...
...And I've never seen one in my life in Missouri. Saw a bobcat in Kansas last year, first ever, but I heard they introduced them.

I wonder what's up with the dillos? Shouldn't they be going south instead of northeast?
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Broken_Hero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 05:25 PM
Response to Reply #45
46. I have no idea...
I wish they would all stay in Oklahoma/Texas...but thats wishful thinking... :D I've seen a large cat, in summer of 04, it was a dark brown, but I barely caught a glimpse of the thing...my buddy Tom did though, I was to busy looking at our paper targets(target practicing)...but, I believe they are part of the country here(not 100% on that).

I have no idea about the migrating patterns of the armadillos truth be told...I know that they are just a PITA...There are a ton of critters down here, still trying to get use to their signs, prints, and what not...
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Maru Kitteh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 09:23 PM
Response to Reply #8
94. Armadillos are showing up in Nebraska
Not many yet mind you but they're here. DOT roadkill trucks were the first to notice.
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droidamus2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 04:39 PM
Response to Original message
9. Vermont seems a little warm
I live in the mountains east of Lake Champlain and it was 50+ degrees today and pretty much all of the snow has melted. It was more like a spring day than a winter day.
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 04:42 PM
Response to Reply #9
12. A little warm?
Last winter was incredibly warm. Today in the Kingdom it was in the high fiftes. But there's much more evidence than this anecdotal it's warm today stuff.
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Altean Wanderer Donating Member (202 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 06:20 PM
Response to Reply #9
65. You wouldn't be Trey or Mike from Phish? n/t
and yes, it's very warm for this time of year in southern New Hampshire as well.

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Altean Wanderer Donating Member (202 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 06:29 PM
Response to Reply #65
68. Changes in bird life
Yes, I believe that the effects of global warming are beginning to manifest. In New England, we've seen Carolina Wrens and Red-bellied Woodpeckers, both southern birds, increase over the last decade or so. The normal winter migrant birds that come down from the arctic are seen less frequently because they can stay up north and survive mild winters.

I fear what will happen to our beautiful nature if we do indeed see a doubling of C02 levels by 2050 or so. Our mixed-hardwood and conifer forests may die off in large areas, resulting in a mass extinction of sorts. Our descendents will be living in a depleted world that will be but a shadow of its former self. I do think that it's not too late to check the damage at a "reasonable" level, perhaps, but that will require a massive reduction in emissions over only a decade. I don't think that will happen, as the "American way of life is non-negotiable" and India and China are going to be greenhouse gas giants very soon.
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windbreeze Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 09:24 PM
Response to Reply #65
95. Well, that's sure different from the -16 that greeted me in Jan...2004
when I came there to visit....I loved it...brisk..and just downright cold...had to buy longjohns..and a jacket
windbreeze
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yella_dawg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 04:40 PM
Response to Original message
10. No sign here!
We caught the back blast of Katrina, took Rita head on, serious drought ever since, and it's mid seventies for the last several days and predicted to be mid seventies to low eighties for the foreseeable future.

Nah! No climate change here!


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Arger68 Donating Member (562 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 04:42 PM
Response to Original message
11. December 14th in Minnesota and it's
nearly 50 degrees. It has gotten much colder already, but the average is certainly up. Also when it was near 90/over 90 for the whole month of July that is quite warm for this area. A few years ago I mowed my lawn in late December, which was a first. Usually the ground is frozen solid starting in late November/early December. It is definitely warming up here!
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elocs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 05:10 PM
Response to Reply #11
35. It was in the low 50s here in western Wisconsin and the 40s through the weekend.
No snow yet this year which stuck and winters have been warm for year. When I was a kid we routinely had winters with lots of snow and temps of -20 degrees. The robins as well as the snowbirds don't seem to go south anymore.
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JDPriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 04:43 PM
Response to Original message
14. Idyllwild California
A few years ago, we drove to Idyllwild. On the way, we noticed what appeared to be many dead trees. Not too long after that forest fires hit the area. I read a newspaper article at the time that blamed the fires on the many dead trees. The article said the dead trees were due to bark beetles. I read recently that the bark beetles are infesting large areas of forest in several western states because it takes one week of very cold weather to reduce the bark beetle population. Apparently, forests are being killed due to the slight increase in the temperature.
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/05/03/national/main...
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Blue_In_AK Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 05:49 PM
Response to Reply #14
57. Bark beetles are a big problem up here...
In 2004 and 2005 we lost 11 million acres to wildfires fueled by beetle-infested dead trees.
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Donald Ian Rankin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 06:59 PM
Response to Reply #57
75. Here in the UK they killed of the elm, more or less.
Dutch elm disease, spread by bark beetles, kills them once they grow to a certain age, and now they're not extinct, but pretty damn rare.
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flyingfysh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 04:46 PM
Response to Original message
15. pleasant weather in New Hampshire (!!) today
I'm in Nashua NH at the moment, well away from the seacoast. But a light jacket is plenty for today's weather. This is December!
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judaspriestess Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 04:47 PM
Response to Original message
17. yeah everyday in the pics from Iraq
Edited on Thu Dec-14-06 04:50 PM by judaspriestess
big giant clouds of ultrathick black smoke spewing into the atomposphere.

on edit: I personally feel its affecting the climate.
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JustABozoOnThisBus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 04:49 PM
Response to Original message
19. It's December, and I haven't shoveled snow yet
Can't I be "for" global warming and "for" Gore, too?

:)
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alfredo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 04:49 PM
Response to Original message
21. The first frost comes several weeks later.
Oct 15th used to be the end of warm weather here.
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theophilus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 04:52 PM
Response to Original message
22. Out and about in Arkansas yesterday I saw a
box turtle out motoring on the road and a grasshopper flying about at the park. Spring plants are coming up.

There are a lot less critters of all types around all year and expecially fewer birds.

It will be twenty degrees above normal this week and it feels like spring.

It's real folks. Every few years these things might occur but every year there are "oddities". I think it all adds up.
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Cleita Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 04:54 PM
Response to Original message
24. It's 80 degrees right now in my yard. I live on the coast of
California, but in the middle of December, this is not normal.
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freethought Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 04:54 PM
Response to Original message
25. Unseasonably warm here in Maine.
Usually, February is the coldest month here in Maine but here we are coming into the third week of December and it has been almost like early spring. We did have a cold snap that would have been atypical for December buy it was over in 3 days.
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Maine-ah Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 05:05 PM
Response to Reply #25
31. it was damn near 60 today.
my grass is still green.
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Ariana Celeste Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 04:54 PM
Response to Original message
26. It's 57 in the Indianapolis area right now.
It's been warm enough to walk around in a tshirt for the last few days and will stay that way for the next several. I think that's pretty unusual. 'Normal' temp for this time of year is in the low and mid 30's.
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leftchick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 04:57 PM
Response to Original message
27. my roses are pushing out buds
and tropicals that should die back and not return have become perennials in my zone 7. I also am seeing Robins all over the place like it is spring in the past week of 60 degree weather. It scares me to death.

:scared:
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Arkansas Granny Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 05:17 PM
Response to Reply #27
43. My climbing rose was blooming up until a couple of weeks ago
in west central Arkansas. This may be the first time it has been in bloom past Thanksgiving. We had a cold snap with low temps in the teens, but it's 72F right now.
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yellowcanine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 04:58 PM
Response to Original message
28. Yes, a Burmese python just entered my backyard and scarfed up my dog.
Just kidding but if this crap keeps up it COULD happen.
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DemExpat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 05:00 PM
Response to Original message
29. The Netherlands is having its warmest autumn ever known....
and I still have summer roses blooming for the umpteenth time in my back garden....

DemEx
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Philosoraptor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 05:16 PM
Response to Reply #29
40. You can cancel your skiing the Alps tour
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1monster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 05:03 PM
Response to Original message
30. More trees changed colors this year than I have ever seen in the
thirty-two years I've lived in Northeast Florida.

And the colors were glorious, deep reds, orange reds, and yellows...

Every year, on US 1 North, there are some trees that change colors in December, but this year lots trees were changeing colors in my neighborhood.

It is something new, and, although it was a beautiful sight, it makes me somewhat uneasy... Nature in her full-fledged fury can be awe-inspiringly beautiful, but incrediby dangerous too.

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Lydia Leftcoast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 05:07 PM
Response to Original message
33. In 2003, I moved back to Minnesota after 19 years in Oregon
Since then, we have not had one REAL Minnesota winter in Minneapolis. Temperatures have been above normal and snow has been scarce.

I bought snow boots in the fall of 2003, and so far, I have worn them three times.

My idea of a Minneapolis winter is lots of snow (up to the knees by January), several weeks of below-zero temperatures, and blizzards. The winters of 1982-84 were like that, with the last snow accumulation in 1984 occurring on April 30.

I remember days when the high was below -25. Since I moved back, the coldest it's been is -7.
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leftchick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 07:18 PM
Response to Reply #33
79. that is just plain scary
and is Climate Change anywhere on the first hundred days list of the Democrats? Does anyone know? We are truly screwed if it is not. :(
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bdamomma Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 09:36 PM
Response to Reply #79
99. Global Warming should not be pushed to back burner
there is clear evidence, that our environment is changing dramatically, and we are the only ones to change it, or minimize this. It is really scary. We only have one Earth.
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Redstone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 05:09 PM
Response to Original message
34. 62 degrees in Connecticut on December 14. Next question?
Redstone
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rock Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 05:10 PM
Response to Original message
36. I paused a bit before posting but I will have my say
You're asking for anecdotal evidence, which is pretty much worthless for scientific purposes. Of course, it may carry some political weight, but I would prefer to argue on rational grounds and argue that we should listen to the scientists.
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blues90 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 05:13 PM
Response to Original message
37.  When I lived in Chicago
During most of my life in the 50's to the mid 70's you could count on snow by thankgiving all the way through april and plenty of it .

I still have family there and it get cold then worms up without much snowfall , less every year .

Here in southern calif it get hotter every summer and summer heat lasts longer , I have been here since 1981 and each year has a definet change .

It is december and still it reaches 75 in the day .

I have read about movement north of certain animals and many other effects .

Yes I do think global warming is real and a real threat but I don;t have much faith we can turn this around before it is well too late if it is not already .

You have to kill the oil corporations and before this you have to find cleaner fuel and make this easily available .

This is something that should have happened long ago . The common citizen just does not have the funds to make the change with this rotten economy .
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Lasthorseman Donating Member (197 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 05:13 PM
Response to Original message
38. No
but every single day I watch and make note of the presence or absence of chemtrails.
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windbreeze Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 09:31 PM
Response to Reply #38
98. My friend in Missouri was commenting on that just today...
here it has been raining so much...you can't see if they are above the clouds or not..
wb
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WinkyDink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 05:14 PM
Response to Original message
39. No natural snow in the Poconos ski area.
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Pirate Smile Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 05:16 PM
Response to Original message
41. It is 54 degrees in Iowa on December 14th. Women are wearing capri's.
No snow yet for the year.

Odd?

Hell yes!
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Doctor_J Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 05:16 PM
Response to Original message
42. We used to avg 3.5 ft of snow per winter in Chicago
it hardly snows at all any more. You might think this is good news "except for you skiers out there", but in the spring the rivers are mud holes instead of waterways. We also get the odd blast of exceptionally bad weather (like the snow storm of two weeks ago), but that's another symptom of climate change.
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kimmerspixelated Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 05:18 PM
Response to Original message
44. Yep, it's in the 60's here this week
in NW Virginnie, and I must say it is convenient. Nothing like trying to finish up shopping for your kids with only a few days left, and then there comes snow or ice grounding your plans, cuz they have the day off, or yur 2 scared to drive on the ice. Another thing, we usually freeze our butts off at the Xmas light park where you walk thru and all. They usually have a couple of barrels with fires smoldering just so you can warm up. I think we'll be able to go without gloves this weekend. But, I'd sure rather see it normal! It was actually colder in Nov. than it is now! But, alas, I know it will change. I heard we will be in for a very cold winter! I don't think we're staying warm for long ya'll!
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bluerum Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 05:29 PM
Response to Original message
47. Mid 50's on Dec. 14 in central MA. is "un-seasonal". Not sure I could
unequivocally attribute it to global warming.
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Richard Steele Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 05:30 PM
Response to Original message
48. Our daisies bloomed again 3 weeks ago. Tree in the yard is putting out new shoots NOW.
And the giant carnivorous slugs are still coming out at night,
when they normally are hibernating by now.

NONE of these things are 'normal' for this time of year.
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bluerum Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 06:03 PM
Response to Reply #48
60. Carnivorous slugs! Where you at? nt
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Richard Steele Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 06:08 PM
Response to Reply #60
63. North Carolina. The big "Leopard Slugs" here are meat eaters.
Cat Chow, raw chicken, etc...I put it out on the porch at night,
they're all over it.
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 05:31 PM
Response to Original message
49. December 14 in San Diego
and it is WARM out there
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Holly_Hobby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 05:32 PM
Response to Original message
50. I definitely see it
Edited on Thu Dec-14-06 05:32 PM by Holly_Hobby
Actually, I noticed it years ago. I'm in NW Ohio and our winters were brutal when I was a kid. We always had at least 3 weeks of below zero temps.

About 10 years ago, it started warming up here. We haven't had below zero temps for many years, not much snow, and absolutely balmy temps. I've said for a long time too, that the sun seems hotter in the summer. My veggie garden and flowers seem to need more water now, even the same day it rains.

A couple Xmas's ago, we had a BBQ on the patio in shorts. We haven't had consistent snow cover in a long time.
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kineneb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 05:32 PM
Response to Original message
51. increase in rainfall- NorCal
Our "average" is supposed to be around 25"... last several years it has been closer to 35-40" total. The rains seem to start later and last into June, something I don't remember as a child (Cal native). And Mom used to go ice skating on Reflection Lake in Lassen Park as a teen; I don't think it freezes over anymore.
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Xithras Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 08:43 PM
Response to Reply #51
86. Gotta disagree with you there.
Edited on Thu Dec-14-06 08:44 PM by Xithras
Northern California native here too. The normal weather pattern for Northern California rotates on a 10 year drought cycle (has something to do with Pacific currents, IIRC). Rainfall generally increases through the cycle before hitting its peak and crashing into drought.

The normal rainy season in Northern California is October-March, with the bulk of rainfall coming January-March. While we have had above average rainfall the past two years, it's fairly consistent with the heavy rain patterns that preceded the droughts of the 1970's and the 1987-1992 drought (the years preceding 1986 had steadily increasing rain amounts culminating in the devastating 1986 floods...after that, there wasn't a normal rain year again until 1993). Winter temps HAVE climbed here a bit (it doesn't get as foggy in the Central Valley as it used to, and we rarely get hard freezes anymore), but the rainfall seems to be part of the normal pattern. As I understand it, the increased temps here in the valley have more to do with increased local population explodes, than it does global climate change.
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kineneb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 10:43 PM
Response to Reply #86
102. coast range
maybe the rainfall pattern is more localized, as we live in Lake Co. Any local change in temperature should not be caused by heat islands, because there aren't any here (well, except for that big heat sink- Clear Lake). We have been getting rainfall into June, which really messes with gardening; the normal growing season is much shorter than in the valley due to the elevation (mid-May to mid-October).
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Xithras Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-15-06 03:24 PM
Response to Reply #102
114. What I'm saying...
Is that you're pointing to a one time occurrence rather than a trend. Last year it stopped in June. The year before in May. Meteorological shifts are measured over longer terms than that, and that two year bump is consistent with past heavy rain periods in the California weather cycle. It's happened this way ever since the Spanish moved into California and started recording the weather...periods of above average rainfall followed by periods of intense drought.

In December 1861 the worst flood in California history occurred when it rained for four weeks straight. The resulting flooding created a lake in the Central Valley that was 300 miles long and 20 miles wide, and lead to the creation of the levee system we have today. That flooding was followed by a seven year drought in which rainfall was half of average...and almost nonexistent some years. In the 1860's the effects were minimal since few people lived here. If it happened today, it would devastate California.

My point is simply that a couple of wet years is a normal part of the California weather cycle, and that it will probably reverse into an equally normal drought at some point in the next few years. None of that has anything to do with global warming.
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CanonRay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 05:33 PM
Response to Original message
52. Hummingbirds
When we first moved to the mountains, the first hummingbirds would should up on April 23 or 24th like clockwork. Last year? April 7. This year? April 9. Go figure.
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HughMoran Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 05:33 PM
Response to Original message
54. I wish we could tell by the weather on any given day
it's just too simplistic to assume that since we are having an el nino year that this is an indication of global warming. I am enjoying the mild winter so far though.
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Maru Kitteh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 09:47 PM
Response to Reply #54
100. And I wish we could all bury our heads in the sand and sing LA LA LA LA LA LA LA LA
and not understand that what we see with our own eyes, in not just this year but in the patterns of the brief candle of our lifetimes, are verifications of the hard ugly science before us. Global warming is here and it's a disaster we'd damn well better prepare for and attempt to slow down as best we can. The consequences of willful ignorance are beyond our ability to bear.
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HughMoran Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-15-06 07:11 PM
Response to Reply #100
120. You didn't actually address my point !!!
Nice false choice argument though! Love the fake concern too!

I simply pointed out that you cannot predict global warming just because we are having a pleasant winter!

Even you state "not just in this years patterns". I guess you just felt like this was a good post for you to jump on your soapbox huh?

I am a very strong believer in global warming and always have been. I really enjoyed how Al Gore laid it out in "An Inconvenient Truth".

Do not let my reasoned response stop you from lashing out at me though - this is DU after all...
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Firespirit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 05:35 PM
Response to Original message
55. Yep
I have since then moved significantly north for work purposes, but I used to live in the Deep South.

I sat through Katrina. That's evidence enough. The ONLY reason why the 2006 Hurricane Season was a no-show was a strong El Nino that kept the wind shear high throughout the season. Unless El Nino continues, 2007 is likely to be bad.

But there's one more point. The place where I used to live would typically have some sort of snow accumulation, no matter how slight, no less than once every two years. The reason for the inconsistency was that the area was right on the dividing line between freezing and not freezing. Everything south of us had rain.

There was a significant snowfall in early 1993 and an ice storm in 1995. Since then, there has been nothing. Nada. The cutoff line between snow and rain has moved north, and is now approximately at the latitude of Memphis, TN.

The shift actually goes farther back than my lifetime, though. My parents and older relatives remember when snow used to fall virtually every winter, and the "big" snowfalls of their youth were considerably more significant than the "big" snowfalls of mine. But -- in keeping with the science that says global warming is occurring at an accelerating pace -- it's gotten much more serious in the past decade.
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Blue_In_AK Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 05:35 PM
Response to Original message
56. The effects are very noticeable in Alaska
We're the canary in the coal mine.
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muriel_volestrangler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 05:51 PM
Response to Original message
58. Average annual days of snow cover here: 1975 8; 2005, 4
Precise figures from http://www.metoffice.gov.uk/climate/uk/about/UK_climate... , but it's a fairly obvious difference (this is southern England; the rest of the UK has a similar drop). Those aren't figures for a particular year - they're smoothed out over several, so there's a clear trend.

As for this year - we had our warmest July ever, our warmest autumn ever, and the the whole year is set to be the warmest ever, despite a January and February that were more like the long term average.
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bluerum Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 07:18 PM
Response to Reply #58
77. 8. Days. Of. Snowcover. Big sigh. Come on April. nt
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leftchick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 06:02 PM
Response to Original message
59. an upside?
I was thinking today that the fur coats won't be needed pretty soon. At least a few animals won't suffer horrible deaths for their coats? Sad that that is the only positive I can see. :(
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BelgianMadCow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 06:03 PM
Response to Original message
61. We have broken the autumn temp record for the second year straight, PLUS
we did so with an average that was more than 1.5 *C higher than last record. Normally these records only move 0.1 c at a time. Weatherman was flabbergasted when he announced it.

The Solanum plant which is not winter hard has been on my terrace, abundant with flowers till wel in december.

I have little doubt.
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Hand Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 06:08 PM
Response to Original message
62. Record breaking high temperatures all across Eastern Canada...
No snow in Montreal so far, 50 degrees in Halifax, Nova Scotia today, lots of farmers worried about pests not getting reduced by the normal cold snaps... yes, it is real, you do see it happening.
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BlueManDude Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 06:11 PM
Response to Original message
64. Charles River barely froze last winter.
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WindRavenX Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 06:23 PM
Response to Original message
66. One of the warmest falls on record here in boston
Global warming deniers are asshats.

It's been so warm here that birds have been seen building nests. In December.
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pdxmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 06:27 PM
Response to Original message
67. I see evidence of global climate change...which is really what it is.
Just come to Oregon. How often have you heard breaking weather news about Oregon in the past 10 years, up until now. Our weather is strange, even for us. Usually, the rain and storms don't depress me until February, but I'm about at the end of my rope now.
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retread Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 06:30 PM
Response to Original message
69. Anecdotal evidence only. See "An Inconvenient Truth" for the real thing. n/t
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Donald Ian Rankin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 06:32 PM
Response to Original message
70. No, I don't.

The changes in the climate due to global warming are relatively small compared to normal annual and daily fluctuations. On average over time the evidence is there, but it's not something you could conclude from day-to-day observation (at least not without specialist knowledge and equipment - there may be ways of doing so that I don't know about).

You can point to the fact that the last couple of years have had more hurricanes than ever before as evidence for global warming, or the average temperature over the past n summers, but you can't point at any one hurricane or hot summer and say "that's global warming, that is", so far as I know.
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tammywammy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 06:41 PM
Response to Reply #70
71. In addition to what you said
We're in El Nino, so wet & warm is expected during the winter.

And you're exactly right: "The changes in the climate due to global warming are relatively small compared to normal annual and daily fluctuations. On average over time the evidence is there, but it's not something you could conclude from day-to-day observation (at least not without specialist knowledge and equipment - there may be ways of doing so that I don't know about)."
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muriel_volestrangler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 07:14 PM
Response to Reply #71
76. Though the amount of snow has decreased where Donald is
quite noticeably, over the years. That's one measure it's easy to see yourself. See post #58. Southern England has half the number of days of snow it had 30 years ago.
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tammywammy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 07:30 PM
Response to Reply #76
80. Right
I saw your post upthread.

It's just hard to differentiate day to day or even one year to the next of climate changes, but in the long run, like the past 30 years it's much easier.
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Donald Ian Rankin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 08:46 PM
Response to Reply #76
87. Yes, but that's not something you can see, exactly.

I can't say "there would be snow today were it not for global warming".

It is certainly true that there seems to be a lot less snow on average than there was 10 or 15 years ago, but if it weren't for your assertion I wouldn't be confident that that wasn't just nostalgia on my part.
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irislake Donating Member (967 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 06:42 PM
Response to Original message
72. Terrifying! Terrifying!
I honestly fear my little grandchildren will have no future. Over one year the thousands and thousands of dragonflies around my pond and property have dwindled to a few. The bumblebees that came to my planters on my deck by the hundreds last summer bizzing and buzzing all day long in every flower are gone. I counted two every day. One got into the house and I removed a storm window to let it out.

In rainy weather thousands and thousands of frogs used to swam onto the country roads to get squished and cause compassionate swerving by frog-loving drivers. No more.

A local naturalist reports gnats have gone -- and some birds that fed on them. Swallows have vanished from my pond. Not a single pair nested here this year. There once were hundreds.

I have three hundred acres of red and white pine with a bit of oak and maple. I hear that an infestation of some bug that is destroying the pines in B.C. likely will not be killed and stopped in Alberta because it's not cold enough there for long enough now to kill them. All my pines will probably be killed in my lifetime. Maybe within five years.

Wild honeybees have been gone for years. I miss the wonderful hum of honeybees in the wild cherry tree out front. Many wildflowers are vanishing because of the disappearance of the honeybees. All these changes are sad and scary enough but they affect other flora and fauna.

On the bright side though the turkey vultures are more numerous. Hmmmm.

I could KILL Stephen Harper and his idiot environmental Genius Rhonda.Or Rhoda. Daughter of a big oil man.

And thanks, George Bush for sending up your crew of corrupt scientist deniers and their little band of public relations twits to help them out. I understand they are the very same scientists and public relations folk that used to support the beleagered tobacco comanies way back when.

Carpe deim time is fleeting! Talk about SOYLANT GREEN.
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deaniac21 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 06:43 PM
Response to Original message
73. Absolutely! Some days it's hotter that it was supposed to be
and on other days it's colder. UNMISTAKABLE!!
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mtnester Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 06:45 PM
Response to Original message
74. 63 degrees here in Central Ohio..one week before the shortest day of the year
Edited on Thu Dec-14-06 06:45 PM by mtnester
All the Harley's back out on the street.

And even after dark, it is now 1845 hours, and it is still 59 degrees outside.

We watched this morning's meteor shower in t-shirts, shorts and slippers.

It was warm yesterday, and the day before, and will stay in the mid 50's for the reminder of the week.


It should be in the 30's daytime, and in the teens at night. There are bugs and bats out flying around.

Last winter, January and February was warm as HELL here....many days in the mid 60's for days on end.

Nah...no global warming here.
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sakabatou Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 07:18 PM
Response to Original message
78. Record rainfalls
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lastknowngood Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 07:31 PM
Response to Original message
81. 63 deg maryland for the next 4 days at least
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RPM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 08:18 PM
Response to Original message
82. 10 days before x-mas in pittsburgh and its 60 degrees
not too shabby!
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Deja Q Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 08:27 PM
Response to Original message
83. It's been a weird season,
but it wasn't dissimilar in the 1930s (the years of the Dust Bowl)

I think there is evidence to support global warming, or at least a shift in weather patterns brought about by the heat generated by excess traffic and pollution.

It seemed a normal winter last year; this year is rather different.

But any way to control excess travel would definitely help. (Living closer to work when possible?)
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tammywammy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 09:02 PM
Response to Reply #83
91. We're also in a period
of El Nino right now as well, which lends to warmer and wetter winters.
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Ioo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 08:36 PM
Response to Original message
84. My Balls are way sticker than most of the time....
LOL
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dddem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 08:38 PM
Response to Original message
85. I work at a hardware store,
Edited on Thu Dec-14-06 08:38 PM by dddem
and the bosses are all up in arms because we haven't sold any snow shovels, window scrapers, snow blower or ice melt and it's mid-december in New England. I think we should stock copies of "An Inconvenient Truth". Then we'd have some sales I bet.
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Lisa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 08:50 PM
Response to Original message
88. my folks have lived in the Great Lakes area since the 1950s ...
They report a significant decrease in winter snow cover, and the spring arriving earlier. The Lilac Festival and Maple Syrup Days, which my mom has helped organize locally for the past few decades, were once timed to coincide with major civic holidays and school breaks, but it's common now for the lilacs to be over and the maple trees to be putting out leaves when the actual festivals happen. When I was growing up in the 1970s and 80s, we'd expect our first snow to arrive in the first week of November. Now it can be well into December before there's white on the ground -- and we've had tornados at this time of year, a couple of times in the past decade! The milder winters were already becoming evident, around the time I moved away,

I've only lived out here on the coast since the early 1990s, but the people who've been here longer have described significant changes in the timing of seasons. It seems that summers have been unusually dry recently (more water alerts) and winter storms have harder and more plentiful rainfall (which runs off and damages water quality with sediment, rather than staying around as snowpack for the summer).

A friend of mine who moved up to near the Arctic Circle a couple of years ago, says that people in his new home are even more emphatic that there are things happening. They had to shut down the winter ice roads early because they were so unstable, and the cost of groceries skyrocketed because stuff had to be flown in, instead. People were describing seeing new kinds of birds (robins are rare in the Arctic, but more of them are showing up).
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Tyo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 08:50 PM
Response to Original message
89. Check out the glaciers in the Canadian Rockies
Melting down and a pretty brisk pace.
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LWolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 09:00 PM
Response to Original message
90. I heard a frog singing this morning.
From the drain in front of my barn. It was 6am, raining, and the frog was singing.

It should have been snowing on hard frozen ground, with temps dipping into single digits. Instead, I was slopping through mud.

Mud in the winter is unusual, to say the least. Frogs singing in December? Uh huh.
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Maru Kitteh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 09:19 PM
Response to Original message
93. Projected high of SEVENTY DEGREES IN NEBRASKA tomorrow
That's about 40 degrees above normal. The river (Platte) is gone. Summer storms that used to come like clockwork at 4p.m. are no more. We're totally screwed here.
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The Velveteen Ocelot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 09:25 PM
Response to Original message
97. Aside from the fact that it's 50 degrees in Minneapolis on 12/14?
Nah. Not a thing.
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MOB Donating Member (77 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-14-06 09:49 PM
Response to Original message
101. Record Highs on Mnt Washington
Important because it's the point of source of some major New England water ways
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Philosoraptor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-15-06 05:35 AM
Response to Original message
103. Near 70 expected on Dec. 16, in KC
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SoCalDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-15-06 06:13 AM
Response to Original message
104. I don't know if what i've noticed is entirely due to it,
Edited on Fri Dec-15-06 06:13 AM by SoCalDem
but I notice the LACK of:

butterflies
fireflies
honey bees
amphibians of all kinds
small reptiles
and yes..even bugs.. (haven't seen a junebug in decades)

as recently as when my boys were small (20 yrs ago), those little critters were all over the place, and we almost always had some little thing being caught , examined, and released.

The general degradation of nature is killing our home :(

Probably most of what I'm missing is due to chemicals & pollution, but those have a way of changing the flora of earth, and that affects climate..so..
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BoneDaddy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-15-06 08:16 AM
Response to Original message
105. 60 DEGREES ONE WEEK FROM CHRISTMAS
IN NYC AREA.
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bklyncowgirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-15-06 08:45 AM
Response to Original message
106. In the 60s in New Jersey. Gotta admit, I like it. Al Gore could lose my vote over this.
Of course there is that flooding thing. Well Bangladesh wasn't much of a country to begin with and all those black people in New Orleans got to live in those really cool sports stadiums.

:sarcasm:
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symbolman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-15-06 09:40 AM
Response to Original message
107. Nope, not here in Hawaii
same as it ever was :)

However, the great state of Alaska where I lived for ten years back in the 70's and 80's is THE BELLWEATHER state for acknowledging Climactic Disaster..

A lot of it in covered in "An Inconvenient Truth" the brilliant work by Al GOre I finally watched on DVD the other day. "Drunken Pines" "Loss of Glaciers", etc, etc.

I'm in the process of writing a book about the changes I've seen since 1976 or so, when I was flying around in choppers in the Alaskan Bush for two summers, looking for Uranium for the Dept of Energy then. I saw the pollution and graft in the Oil Companies Locations, dying herds of caribou. As a matter of fact, global warming may have saved my life.

When our Chopper crashed on the other side of the Brooks Range we landed on a section of the tundra where the permafrost had melted underneath the grasses, making a kind of 'waterbed' effect. If that had been solid when we autorotated in on fire, my teeth would have probably shot through my skull like popcorn and I wouldn't be posting here today :)

I remember a SUN in the sky as a kid some 50 years ago that resembled a bright DIME, you could see it as an Object, and now it has all the bullshit coronas and crap around it. You could almost tell it was a STAR then, a body in the sky, a dot, instead of a blurry, out of focus radiating thing.

That and the weather was like CLOCKWORK when I was a kid...

Good thread!
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in_cog_ni_to Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-15-06 10:11 AM
Response to Original message
108. YES. It's NOVEMBER 15 and 48 degrees at 9:00 A.M. and it's been like this
all week. Last week we had a blizzard threat (missed us! YEAH!) and bitter cold, but that lasted 5 days and now we're back to 40-50. I'm in Illinois. As a kid, I remember blizzards and bitter cold throughout the winters. We were GUARANTEED at least 3 snow days off from school due to the blizzards. My son hasn't had a snow day in YEARS. The neighborhood I grew up in had a pond. That pond had to be at least 12 inches thick with ice before we were allowed to ice skate on it. We were always skating by Decemeber. I really doubt they've been skating on that pond at all the last 5 years. Global Warming is real. It's here. It's NOW.
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Kber Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-15-06 10:18 AM
Response to Original message
109. Well, our unusually warm and wet weather in NJ
is playing havoc with my mold alergies. It's usually over by mid October to early November after a few good frosts.

Today it's supposed to get to 60 degrees.
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porphyrian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-15-06 10:21 AM
Response to Original message
111. Yep, it's never been this hot this long this late in the season. - n/t
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Odin2005 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-15-06 03:26 PM
Response to Original message
115. It was 45F here in Fargo a couple days ago. That's right, 45F in FARGO, in DECEMBER!!!
There is almost no snow on the ground. The weather is so un-Fargoish it's nuts.
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newportdadde Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-15-06 03:55 PM
Response to Reply #115
116. Ow Yaaa?
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Odin2005 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-17-06 02:20 PM
Response to Reply #116
123. Uffda, ya!!
:evilgrin:
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Rex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-15-06 04:07 PM
Response to Original message
118. We had 120 degree heat here in south Texas for months.
It was a dry heat, very unusual, like desert heat. Summers are hot here, but next year I expect it to be in the mid 120s all around the southwest. Very little rainfall. I expect longer hotter summers and shorter colder winters.
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shadowknows69 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-15-06 04:08 PM
Response to Original message
119. It's 52 F
in a place in upstate NY they USED to call "Snowtown USA"
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Philosoraptor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-16-06 05:13 AM
Response to Original message
121. 1st day of winter? you'd never know it here, 65 expected today
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JCMach1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-16-06 05:17 AM
Response to Original message
122. Cool in the UAE with record Rainfall this Winter
That would support changing weather patterns. Sometimes we go for years without rain here.
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