can everyone chill out a little regarding Impeachment???

[LSK]

There is no doubt that there will be hearings and investigations into all sorts of things. I mean Conyers had a hearing in the basement for crying out loud. Why the hell WOULDNT he have more with the full power that he now has??? Another example is Byron Dorgans investigation into Iraqi contractor waste that yielded a report a few weeks ago. There is no doubt and no reason to think there will not be investigations.

The MSM and half of DU is freaking out on whether there will be Impeachment or not. It is waayyyyyy to early for ANYONE to commit to Impeachment one way or another. The investigations will happen and based on what comes from that there may or may not be an Impeachment. Nobody is going to start Impeachment hearings come January, thats just foolish thinking.

Also, give the Dems time to figure out what they are going to do. They still have a lame duck session to get through where the GOP will certainly try to stuff Bolton down our throats again, and confirm the new Sec Of Defense and I would bet the farm that they will try and make the Bush tax cuts permanent. The 100 hour plan is a good one, there are people who definately NEED the minimum wage hike and other things. There is plenty of the Dems plate.

There will come a time to decide on Impeachment in the next year or so, but now is NOT THE TIME to commit to it one way or another.

So please, everyone just chill out over it a bit.

[neuvocat]

1. No.

Bush lied to Congress to go to war.

[baldingrockwarlord2]

42. I'm with you, cat

See, here's the thing. The minute the pukes found about Clinton/Lewinsky, there was no "let's go easy on him" or "Let's wait for the facts" before they all foamed at the mouth, threw it all over the press 24/7 including Rush,Hannity etc. And this was over an affair, and lying under oath about the affair. Now, I know lying under oath is unnacceptable, as well as the affair being wrong also. But that was totally victimless and a personal matter, and NOBODY's sons or daughter had to die over it. Here we are now with high crimes and treason on the table, as well as Bush shitting on and rewriting the constitution and the bill of rights, torture, wiretapping, and I never thought I'd see people fold over so damned easily. How can one thing be impeachable, the other not. Don't you think our soldiers need to know that we have their back at home and will do everything we can to assure that any time they are placed in harms way by a president to "protect out freedoms" that it is for a just cause and that if a president ever does lie or mislead them into the path of possible death that president will be held accountable for selfishly taking that soldier away from their real job, home, family and friends.

I just can't believe I'm hearing people say "cool it". You or I ever do anything wrong we can't ask the police or the judge to "cool it". They didn't cool it with Clinton. Bush has been able to say "cool it' or skate by, his ENTIRE life with no accountablity whatsoever. I find it interesting that only a few days ago, another country's leader was sentenced to death for killing and torturing people, but here at home we're saying "cool it". Warped perspective when the blowjob and the lying under oath about it trumps the lying us into war and 3000 soldiers dead, tens of thousands more maimed for life, family's broken up. Do we tell them to cool it, also?

Let the investigations begin ASAP, then if applicable let's do the right thing and impeach him. Not the "nice" thing. Gore was 'nice" after 2000, Kerry was 'nice" after '04. Don't you people see what happens to us when we're "nice" and we 'cool it"?

[Mythsaje]

44. Do you realize how bad it is to start screaming IMPEACHMENT

before there's even a serious investigation?

[neuvocat]

47. Ever heard the saying about the broken clock?

You don't have to investigate or be a lawyer to know that laws were very badly broken.

[Name removed]

2. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Spearman87]

8. Fantasyland., LOL. There'll be investigations ,but not

outright impeachment, just like Speaker Pelosi has stated. If you guys had any understanding of the electorate, you wouldn't be in such a rush to cut your noses off to spite your face. Pelosi is a little wiser, luckily for you.

[Howardx]

10. thanks for playing today

n/t

[Spearman87]

29. Anytime. call when reality doses are needed.*

dfdf

[pnwmom]

21. It's not freeping. It's being smart.

Why impeach Bush if we don't have the 67 votes we need to actually CONVICT him in the Senate? I don't want him to be able to say that he was impeached, but found NOT GUILTY in a Senate trial. He and all his supporters would be able to claim he was vindicated.

Do the investigations. Drain the swamp. Then see what's there. Maybe there will be the votes to convict then, but there aren't now.

[Mythsaje]

24. That's what I've been saying all along...

Man, we need some shark repellent around here. They get the scent of blood in the water and go NUTS.

[pnwmom]

36. I guess it's the years of wandering around in the wilderness.

Makes us all a little crazy.

[Howardx]

27. it smells like freeping to me

20 "no impeachment" threads all pop up around the same time, im a little skeptical.

[LSK]

30. WHERE DOES IT SAY NO IMPEACHMENT IN MY OP?

My point is that they dont have to announce it one way or another and because Dems are not talking about it right now is not a reason to freak out about it.

[Howardx]

34. WHERE DID I CALL YOU A FREEPER?

i was agreeing with your initial post that people need to chill out on both sides, ESPECIALLY the "no impeachment" threads that have all popped up in the last hour

[LSK]

ok

[pnwmom]

32. They're popping up in response to all the adrenaline-driven,

short-sighted, damn-the-consequences, "impeach NOW" threads.

[LostinVA]

28. LSK is not a Freeper

We don't also agree, but they would be on Ignore list if they were a Freep.

[SwingVoter2006]

40. Impeachment = no more Dem Revolution!

It hurt the Republicans when they went after Clinton, because most of America saw it for what it was: a political hatchet job carried out on behalf of, and for the sole benefit of, the beltway bunch.

A Bush impeachment would go down similarly, with similar results: Bush remains in office, the wind largely emptied from the sails of Dems, and then instead of 2008 being a Dem victory it becomes another deadlocked Presidential race, with many Americans convinced that all the brave talk about change in 2006 was a lot of electioneered hot air.

NOT impeaching would send a big message that the Dems are more interested in where America is GOING, not where America has BEEN.

Save the criminal prosecutions (if they must be done) until Bush is out of office after 2008 and the Dems have the White House.

Impeachment is a fool's gamble.

[BootinUp]

3. We might need an IMPEACHMENT DUNGEON, like the one for

September 11. I would say if this craziness persists for a month or so, I won't be around much.

[tavalon]

5. ignore button

is your friend.

[Poll_Blind]

4. Hey, grieving families of ~3,000 dead: "Chill the hell OUT!" n/t

PB

[LSK]

18. I guess I was canvassing all weekend for my exercise

:eyes:

[BelgianMadCow]

my thoughts. Chill. A bit. Plus, I was looking

for the impressive todo list of Conyers I saw on DU a couple days ago, as a means to convey the same message. Didn't find it :-(

[lapfog_1]

6. Yup, now I'm officially pissed off about the "cool it on impeachment" threads.

Please go away or don't read the pro-impeachment threads.

Nothing will happen till January. There will be hearings and investigations.
Then we'll see what's what. And debate impeachment.

In the meantime, if the activists here who have been raging about Buschco since 2000 (like ME) want to indulge in impeachment talk... what's the harm? It's all part of letting it all out.

[Mythsaje]

7. You're trying to calm the rabid dog with a snausage.

I mean, someone called you a "concern troll."

I guess we have our own brand of freeper here. "Fuck Strategy! We want instant gratification!"

Whatever.

[LSK]

9. your right

It was stupid of me to try and reason with GD when it gets into one of hits moods.

[BelgianMadCow]

11. instant gratification is right imho

and it is also understandable after the last 6 years.

I am in favor of tactics and strategy. But as it is really obvious impeachable offenses have been comitted, I do think it is necessary to let our feelings be known to the dems in charge now.

That's something else than calling for it to start NOW.

[Mythsaje]

16. Like I said in another thread

It's like sharks smelling blood in the water and not realizing their target is still sitting safe in the boat.

What's so hard to understand about wanting INVESTIGATIONS before we start talking about IMPEACHMENT. It's putting the cart before the horse. Investigations, evidence, and THEN impeachment.

Slow, slow, don't go so fast.

[Howardx]

12. whats your "strategy"?

focus group the idea around for a year or so then do nothing cause its the 08 election season?

[LSK]

14. and yours is to get 16 votes from where????

You need 67 votes in the Senate......

[BelgianMadCow]

15. Me, I'm gonna trust John Conyers. There's a thought.

[Mythsaje]

17. They're called investigations...

You know, the thing you do when you want to gather evidence to use in actual proceedings? The mob with the pitchforks and torches thing is all very entertaining, but also a bit over dramatic.

[Howardx]

19. do you think people here are that stupid?

that they dont know we will need to have investigations first?

[Mythsaje]

20. Screaming IMPEACHMENT

sure makes some of them LOOK that stupid.

We have to find evidence to conduct impeachment hearings. Real, solid, "we've got 'em," smoking gun kind of evidence.

Entering into the process yelling "we're gonna impeach the bastard!" is...well...asinine.

You go out, collect evidence, present evidence, shake up the corrupt Republicans in Congress, show the evidence to the public, drag a few more Republican Congresscritters through the mud, and then, if you have the evidence to go forward, START impeachment proceedings.

You do NOT put the cart before the horse and make us all look like a bunch of half-cocked loonies.

[Howardx]

26. people DONT want to hear our reps saying its off the table

BEFORE we have done ANY investigations, theres your problem.

[Mythsaje]

31. It's not ON the table

without evidence. Or a chance to actually succeed. It never was.

When there's evidence, and a chance to succeed rather than giving him a white-wash, then it can go on the table.

[Howardx]

37. then they should say that

not just flat proclamations thats its "off the table" way to move the goalposts there "When there's evidence, and a chance to succeed rather than giving him a white-wash" uh huh

[Mythsaje]

39. I'd say it's because a football team

keeps its playbook under wraps rather than broadcasting it on public TV where anyone can see it.

Or, to mix sports metaphors, it's a rope-a-dope. Here--look at my right hand. Oooh. Where'd that left hook come from?

Let's give them a chance to actually get into office and THEN see if we have a reason to yell. Until then, we DO need to chill out a little.

[baldingrockwarlord2]

43. Exactly!

Hearing that impeachment is off the table is unnacceptable. I understand we need to investigate first. I also understand we would need 67 votes to impeach and that we don't have them today. However at the beginning of the Clinton/Lewinsky thing THEY didn't have 67 votes right away either. They were already smelling blood in the water and crying for and threatening impeachment at the same time.

I'm just saying many of us do not want our new leadership to let this go unpunished or uninvestigated and when they say it's "off the table" that does not sound promising. What? Are we just to shrug our shoulders and let it go? I don't think so.

[pnwmom]

23. Some people do appear to be that stupid, yes.

[AIJ Alom]

13. You're right. I will chill out because there is nothing we can do until January

when we begin holding both chambers. Until then let us celebrate our victory.

[Fovea]

22. I think that a blue wave

shock and awe campaign is in order.
We can walk and chew gum. We can pass the 100 hours initiative *and* let Conyers/Waxman loose.

[LSK]

25. im pretty sure they will do just that

So I dont know what all the freaking out is for?

:shrug:

[Fovea]

46. It is a huge amount of pent up emotion

and the concern that this opportunity will be squandered.

[BelgianMadCow]

35. You sound like the gal / guy to ask this of :

do you have the 100 hours initiative an Conyers todo list that I saw on DU at hand by any chance?

Now is a good time to repost on DU what the leading house dems are planning.

I recall finding both of them both impressive and wise.

And very hard to disagree with.

[Fovea]

45. I am sorry

I have really back slid in the bookmarking lately. I will keep an eye for them.

[CarbonDate]

33. Absolutely.

People who think that this is about Bush and Cheney are ridiculously naive. They're the figure-heads. The real power brokers are the guys underneath them. They're the Bush/Cheney support network. Take them out, first. Start with a few minor players, then go after their bosses, then go after their bosses, and continue that process until there's nothing left underneath Bush and Cheney but us.

As far as Bush and Cheney themselves go, I think we're better off neutering them by knocking out their support network of power brokers and then finally going after them when we've won the White House. The strategy of cutting off the snake's head didn't work in Iraq and it won't work here. Taking out Bush will only result in a different figure-head taking his place. We have the power; let's use it wisely.

(Edited for spelling.)

[Mythsaje]

41. Oooh. Sanity.

I agree.

[AntiFascist]

38. BECAUSE!!!!!

We don't want "off the table" to be interpreted as meaning "it will never happen, get over it".