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I can't shake the gnawing feeling I have about November 7th.

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ClusterFreak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 08:04 PM
Original message
I can't shake the gnawing feeling I have about November 7th.
I can't help it. It won't go away. I just think we will see a repeat of '04 all over again. I think this election will be stolen, again. Or...the theft will be attempted at the very least. I think we'll see the results not reflective of the polling, especially in the hotly contested races where the Dems have a slight edge. I am not a person with a defeatist attitude, in fact I'm usually a very optimistic person. Am I just paranoid?

Please, tell me why I am wrong? I want to be wrong, very, very badly.
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AlCzervik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 08:06 PM
Response to Original message
1. i think it'll be more like 94 except we'll benefit this time.
glass half full time and in polling democrats are poliing over 50% in some nationial polls, over 50% is a good place to be.
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Skittles Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 08:07 PM
Response to Original message
2. you are not wrong
you have every right to be suspicious of the lying, thieving bastards currently in control
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aquart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 08:07 PM
Response to Original message
3. Thank you for your concern.
Demoralization is so important at a time like this.
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greeneyedboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 08:09 PM
Response to Reply #3
7. LOL!
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Imagevision Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 05:47 AM
Response to Reply #7
102. Broward Co., FL: Votes for Democrats are registering for Republicans
snip

Several South Florida voters say the choices they touched on the electronic screens were not the ones that appeared on the review screen -- the final voting step.
Election officials say they aren't aware of any serious voting issues. But in Broward County, for example, they don't know how widespread the machine problems are because there's no process for poll workers to quickly report minor issues and no central database of machine problems.

Debra A. Reed voted with her boss on Wednesday at African-American Research Library and Cultural Center near Fort Lauderdale. Her vote went smoothly, but boss Gary Rudolf called her over to look at what was happening on his machine. He touched the screen for gubernatorial candidate Jim Davis, a Democrat, but the review screen repeatedly registered the Republican, Charlie Crist.
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helderheid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 09:00 PM
Response to Reply #3
36. what is demoralizing about facing reality? They stole 2000, 2002, 2004...
hmmm

Sensing a pattern here...

that said, VOTE ANYWAY.
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Demobrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 08:08 PM
Response to Original message
4. I wish I could help you, but ...
Edited on Mon Oct-30-06 08:08 PM by Demobrat
I feel the same. Of COURSE they will steal it - DUH. They stole the last two - and the nation yawned and changed the channel. Why on earth would they NOT be working day and night to steal it again? I think it goes without saying.
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bobbolink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 08:11 PM
Response to Reply #4
8. "Yawned and changed the channel"... that sums it up very well!
Given the stakes....war crimes and more... they are desperate, and desperation with power...well, they'll come up with something...

Would have been nice if there had been a loyal opposition all these years.
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tavalon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 10:30 PM
Response to Reply #4
45. But, let's look at the silver lining here
Many, many, many more people are aware of the possibility that they may steal it and even the specifics of how they might do it so if they do, in fact steal it, I think they will be found out this time and there will be a groundswell that will lead to their ouster anyway.
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silverweb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 08:08 PM
Response to Original message
5. I know exactly what you mean.
My stomach's been in knots lately and I've been having trouble concentrating. The anxiety just won't go away, no matter what all the hopeful polls say.

I want to believe that we will have a Democratic tsunami so huge that no amount of trickery on the part of the reTHUGs can eradicate our win, but I just can't shake the fear that they're somehow going to cheat to win this time, too.

:pals:

Let's hope we're both wrong!
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MadMaddie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 08:08 PM
Response to Original message
6. On November 8th if the Dems do not win and it is blatently
been thievery....this country is going to be hellish for the next two years....there are many Republicans that are voting Independent and/or Democrat it won't be just us in an uproar.....That will be the marked difference...
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riderinthestorm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 08:12 PM
Response to Original message
9. Just vote. Go on. Get out there and vote.
I can relate to your feelings of helplessness and futility since here in the IL CD #6 it's as tight as tight can be. This is a race that will be stolen in my opinion (especially since the Republican controlled election commission in my District just bought Diebold machines without a paper trail to use just in time for the election next week).

The only thing we have going for us is to get out there in sufficient numbers for people to just rebel when/if things are revealed to be a diabolical plot to steal the election.

It's too late now to change the machines (although in the IL CD#6 we tried, god knows we tried) so do your duty and ferry the old Dem grannies and grandpas to the polls, participate in GOTV phone banking, volunteer between now and Nov 7th but most of all, VOTE!!
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ClusterFreak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 08:18 PM
Response to Reply #9
13. If I could vote, I would!
I'm Canadian! ;)
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buzzard Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 10:39 PM
Response to Reply #13
51. Me too, I wish I could vote, all I can do is call my American friends
to make sure they vote and so far they all are straight Democratic even those who might have voted independent in the past.
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bdamomma Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 10:48 PM
Response to Reply #13
57. I bet alot of people feel the same way in other countries.
Edited on Mon Oct-30-06 10:49 PM by alyce douglas
it is that some American people vote against their own best interests. JUST GET OUT THERE AND VOTE. Americans abroad are voting absentee hopefully, this is just too damn important.
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LeftishBrit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 07:30 AM
Response to Reply #13
106. Same here - I'd vote if I could, but I'm British
But big vibes going from here, for you to raise a great opposition to your own 'Mad King George'.

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mopinko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 10:26 PM
Response to Reply #9
44. you will have a paper trail
illinois law requires paper trails. you can use yours to wipe your ass, i suppose. but it will be there, afaik.
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Renew Deal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 08:14 PM
Response to Original message
10. First step, stop whining on DU
Edited on Mon Oct-30-06 08:16 PM by Bleachers7
Or anywhere else.

Then watch this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ghjSaCYNJzY&eurl=

Third, get productive. As long as you are here bitching, you're not working. Occupy your mind with something useful.

http://www.dccc.org/races
http://www.democrats.org/a/party/a_50_state_strategy/50...
http://pol.moveon.org/event/events/index.html?action_id...

(BTW, I am working late tonight. That's why I'm here)
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ClusterFreak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 08:22 PM
Response to Reply #10
18. "Whining?"
Please.

I applaud your activism, but please don't chastise me for bringing up the white elephant sitting in the corner.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 08:23 PM
Response to Reply #18
20. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
ClusterFreak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 08:44 PM
Response to Reply #20
32. I'm not here to demoralize anyone.
I'm concerned, big time. So are lots of other people in this thread apparently. And who the hell are you to declare my intentions and then tell me I'm not welcome here? You have a problem with my comments? Hit alert and let the mods decide, otherwise I'll express myself the way I see fit.
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freeplessinseattle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 09:05 PM
Response to Reply #32
38. so go see a therapist, what do you want from us?
man this crap is getting old.
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ClusterFreak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 09:12 PM
Response to Reply #38
40. What do I want?
The freedom to express myself, and not to be told I'm not welcome to do so here.

Too much to ask?

Next time you post something that riles someone else, and they tell you you're not welcome here, you're free to use my defence.

Peace.
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motocicleta Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 10:47 PM
Response to Reply #40
55. from the outside
it looks as if you have been a victim of THC inspired paranoia. Or something similar. Eff 'em. I like CLS anyway.
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ClusterFreak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 11:13 PM
Response to Reply #55
63. "THC inspired paranoia..."
LOL!!!!

I drink to you motocicleta... :toast:
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freeplessinseattle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 02:58 AM
Response to Reply #55
97. oh my, way to go. thanks for confirming all
liking someone and not liking their behavior are two different things dear. all of the doom and gloomers aren't necessarily trolls, but their posts are pointless, and obviously a cry for help.
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ClusterFreak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 04:33 AM
Response to Reply #97
100. Obviously.
I suppose I'd have to be RFK Jr. himself to not be considered a doom and gloomer crying out for help.

Uh huh.
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robinlynne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 10:43 PM
Response to Reply #38
53. what is wrong with you? If you guys don't agree, discuss or move on, but
why on earth are you censoring extremely legitimate concerns?
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Renew Deal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 11:16 PM
Response to Reply #53
65. Because there are no concerns
It's not about legitimate concerns. It's about preventing Democrats from getting motivated to do anything. Nothing more. Nothing less.
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freeplessinseattle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 03:00 AM
Response to Reply #53
98. whoa nelly! do you realize the irony in what you just said?? n/t
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hang a left Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 11:45 AM
Response to Reply #38
110. THis is a discussion board. Many people share the same sentiments
as the OP. If you don't like the topic get of the damn thread. Everyone here is voting, and doing their little part. It is not the OP's fault our election system is rotten to the core. I remember being here election night and all the excitement the two weeks before how it was going to be a Kerry landslide even the networks were sayins so, everyone had champagne chilling, the site was at code 4. You could feel the electricity through your keyboard. And. Then. It. Started. Numbers started changing. Exit polls weren't matching tabulated results. Several "WHat the Fuck is Happening Posts!" We watched live, we watch them steal the election while they were doing it. Everyone put the champagne back in the fridge and got out the tequila, their firearms, and kleenex. Everyone was screaming in their homes but no one hear could hear us. So we used a lot of capitals in our posts. So don't give me that "crap is getting old" line, take it somewhere else. I have sat through two midterms and a presidential election on DU, I have watched it happen. If you don't think there is a possibility of them stealing it again, you ain't been around long enough to form an opinion IMO.

RANT OFF
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hang a left Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 12:07 PM
Response to Reply #38
111. Come on
Reply to me. I am in the mood.
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Renew Deal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 11:14 PM
Response to Reply #32
64. I stand by my comments
You don't live here, but you are trying to demoralize the people doing the work that are also most affected. It's wrong.
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ClusterFreak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 11:29 PM
Response to Reply #64
71. To say that I am "demoralizing" anyone is quite simply mind-boggling...
It doesn't even make sense. Clearly, I am not the only one who thinks this either.

BTW...I like your new screen name....uh, "Deleted Message", is that it?
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demwing Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 08:59 PM
Response to Reply #20
35. Thats out of line
I don't know who you speak for, but you don't speak for me.
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tuvor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 10:49 PM
Response to Reply #20
58. Canadians can't be worried about what the neighbours are up to?
The hell with that, and the hell with your lazy conclusions about CLS's motivations.

BTW, feel free to join us at our home on DU so you can see what we're up to.
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Renew Deal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 11:17 PM
Response to Reply #58
66. It's an epidemic.
CLS has caught the bug and it comes from places that are not friendly to Democratic campaigns.
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ClusterFreak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 11:38 PM
Response to Reply #66
72. Actually, the only bug around here is you...buzzing around my head...
...and WHINING because the overwhelming majority of people on this thread agree with me. If you want to deny the threat, the very real and legitimate threat, that electronic voting, that Diebold and other such Republican-friendly corporations, are to democracy....then go ahead and bury your head in the sand like an ostrich.

Verbalizing concerns about how e-voting imperils democracy is not antithetical to fighting the good Democratic fight. It kind of goes hand in hand. Dontcha think?
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Renew Deal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 11:44 PM
Response to Reply #72
73. Overwhelming numbers of people think
gay marriage should be banned, minorities don't deserve equal rights, and the death penalty should be legal. I'm not denying the threat. There are multiple threats. What you're doing is only one.
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ClusterFreak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 11:51 PM
Response to Reply #73
76. Yes, there are multiple threats.....
...and me simply saying "Hey folks, I'm worried about the stealing of votes through e-voting" is what...just...like...someone saying gay marriage should be banned. Yeah, it's exactly the same as that.

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greeneyedboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 08:15 PM
Response to Original message
11. less thinking, more action. only 8 days left. seriously...
the cure for depression is getting out there and connecting with people, or even just making some calls through callforchange.com.

and if you must brood, look at the numbers, and count the races where the Democratic lead is outside the MOE.

if a race is 51-49, or 52-48, dirty tricks can shave and steal away a win. past 53-47, extremely difficult. past 54-46, impossible.

we were all scarred by 2000, 2002, & 2004. those were all CLOSE races. this year, even Fox News has the Democratic Party way way way ahead.
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Mr_Spock Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 08:16 PM
Response to Original message
12. G'bye
Look like I'll be hiding a LOT threads this week.
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ClusterFreak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 08:19 PM
Response to Reply #12
15. No need for sarcasm, friend.
Or a passive aggressive tone. Why not just hide this thread, and be done with it?
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robinlynne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 10:48 PM
Response to Reply #15
56. I apologize for the attacks coming from my colleagues. I can understand
people saying let's get back to work and be productive, because we have a HUGE fight to fight. It is sad that we don't really have a plan. It is clear theya re going to steal the election. Maybe, just maybe the dems will stand up this time. or the people will stand up.
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ClusterFreak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 11:08 PM
Response to Reply #56
62. The vast majority of people on this thread, and on DU...
...understand my point, and yours. That's why this is as great a place as it is. Thanks for your comments. :hi:
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Renew Deal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 08:18 PM
Response to Original message
14. You're Canadian
Why should we care?
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ClusterFreak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 08:24 PM
Response to Reply #14
21. Umm...
Because I live in Canada and can't vote in an American election.

I don't get your hostility. Sorry.
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Renew Deal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 08:25 PM
Response to Reply #21
22. Because you have no direct interest in this election
Edited on Mon Oct-30-06 08:25 PM by Bleachers7
Yet you are willing to demoralize the people that do.
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ClusterFreak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 08:29 PM
Response to Reply #22
26. In case you haven't checked your Rand-Nally lately...
Edited on Mon Oct-30-06 08:34 PM by Chimpys_Last_Stand
...Canada sits right on your northern border.

So yes, I do have a direct interest.

ON EDIT: And...Canada has a couple thousand soldiers fighting in Afghanistan. In recent months, since we got Harper in up here, we've seen a few dozen of our men and women killed over there too.

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Renew Deal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 11:18 PM
Response to Reply #26
67. You can't vote.
You can't volunteer. You can't contribute. You are not directly affected by what happens here. Just indirectly.
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ClusterFreak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 11:45 PM
Response to Reply #67
74. Seems to me the only thing to do then...
...is to banish all DU'ers who live outside the United States. Or, at least ban them from offering opinions on American politics. We can't volunteer or contribute...therefore we are not directly affected by what happens here. Now there's a leap of logic for ya. If you can leap across a canyon, you just might make it.
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Renew Deal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 11:47 PM
Response to Reply #74
75. No one is saying you can't comment
All I'm saying is that it's inappropriate to demoralize people.
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ClusterFreak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 11:57 PM
Response to Reply #75
79. Good Lord. n/t
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tavalon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 10:35 PM
Response to Reply #22
47. No direct interest!?
The whole world has a direct interest. We are the rogue state now, and we are huge and dangerous. That person does have a direct interest in our election and while you may not like what they have to say, they have the right to say it. Hide this thread if you don't want to hear it.
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Renew Deal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 11:19 PM
Response to Reply #47
68. They have a right to say it
and I have the same right to comment.
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ClusterFreak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 12:01 AM
Response to Reply #68
81. Oh, so I DO have the right to say it now????
Jeez, cuz I thought I wasn't welcome here and that my comments were 'inappropriate' and 'demoralizing'?

So, which is it?
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Renew Deal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 12:07 AM
Response to Reply #81
83. Yes
No, Yes, Yes
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ClusterFreak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 12:41 AM
Response to Reply #83
87. Well cheer up...
...maybe one day you'll be able to pull yourself out of your paralysis of grief at hearing one man's opinion on a DU discussion board.
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Renew Deal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 12:55 AM
Response to Reply #87
88. lol
:toast:
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New Earth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 10:36 PM
Response to Reply #22
48. how the hell is this demoralizing anyone
by expressing his fear? :wtf:
i am trying to stay balanced between thinking positive and facing reality...
it is hard. but i feel like some people around here are in denial.
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Renew Deal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 11:21 PM
Response to Reply #48
69. We're DOOMED!
It's been going on the last few weeks. A few insidious posts here and there to demoralize and distract.
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Zodiak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 01:44 AM
Response to Reply #48
95. Agreed
Edited on Tue Oct-31-06 01:44 AM by Zodiak Ironfist
I have not posted one way or another on this issue, but I can tell you that attempts to censor another in the interest of groupthink rubs me the wrong way. Not all of us are into groupthink or unbridled optimism.

I see politics as a chess match with incredibly high stakes. I do not engage in chess by ignoring or denying the enemy's strategy or their best pieces, especially when the stakes are this high.

I do not feel demoralized by the mention of election malfeasance. I am demoralized by the fact that so many on our side have swept this issue under the rug for years and then tell those that are concerned to shut up. I am demoralized by the fact that activists have been stonewalled by the leadership of their own party on this issue and now the problem is worse. That is the worst strategy of all...but that is what we are doing.

A poll should be conducted to dispel the false meme that the mention of election concerns will prevent DUers from voting. I would wager that other than the few freepers who always get in on our polls, there would be overwhelming refusal to stay home. Everyone knows the election machines are compromised, and everyone knows the only way to TRY to counter it is by voting.

The evidence of a chaotic election is already coming out here in Ohio. There are problems in other locations, as well. I see little evidence that this election will be clean.

But it doesn't mean we can't win. If they steal it, it is up to us to make it obvious WITHOUT support from the media. That takes voting....ALL of us.
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tuvor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 11:03 PM
Response to Reply #22
60. WTF? The whole WORLD has a direct interest in this election.
Usually your posts are a fair bit more thoughtful than this.
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New Earth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 10:37 PM
Response to Reply #14
50. wow
that is really rude.
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buzzard Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 11:05 PM
Response to Reply #50
61. Hi Faye I haven't seen you post much since 2004 I always enjoyed your posts
I think it is rude as well, we all have an inherent interest in what direction your country takes and for many of us we are looking at the e voting situation and wondering if the same thing could happen here. Wishing you all a win for the true patriots of America.
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robinlynne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 11:12 AM
Response to Reply #14
107. Are you for real? Are you a republican?
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reality based Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 08:20 PM
Response to Original message
16. With the polls as they are and public sentiment palpably
anti-* (my local suburban pharmacy of all places has a category of "political" birthday cards, all of which disparage * severely) there will be only one conclusion to draw if Democrats do not prevail. These guys are willing to torture, lie, and shred every constitutional principal for power. Stealing elections is part of their game.
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asjr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 08:21 PM
Response to Original message
17. I have the same feeling. I cannot seem to shake it.
Hasn't there already been "glitches" in FL early voting? We know they will try every dirty trick imaginable. They have no sense of fairness or honor. They are crooks in the worst definition. I really believe the "F" word has been replaced as the dirtiest word in the language by the word politician.
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dajoki Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 08:23 PM
Response to Original message
19. "Please, tell me why I am wrong?" I can't...
I too am an optimist, but after what we have witnessed in the past, it's scary.
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alittlelark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 08:27 PM
Response to Original message
23. Whatever....
:eyes:
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NotGivingUp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 08:28 PM
Response to Original message
24. well, to me it just sounds like you are an intelligent person...
with all that has passed, you are just using your brain for reasonable thinking. WE NEED THAT!!!! besides all the people that have NO idea whats going on...we also have the 'oh we should think optimistically put a fucking smile on your face' people. i'm sorry. i will not put a fucking smile on my face as i am being enslaved further and further as we have for the past AT LEAST 35 years. WAKE UP PEOPE! this is NOT the land of the free.
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ClusterFreak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 08:49 PM
Response to Reply #24
34. Thank you for your support...
...and to all the others on this thread who simply feel very worried about what will happen next week, and are expressing themselves.

Cheers to all of ya! :thumbsup:
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OhioBlue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 08:28 PM
Response to Original message
25. win right now
make sure your precinct has more Dem lawn signs.
make sure your precinct has more Dem canvasses
make sure your precinct has more call to Dems for GOTV
make sure your local paper has more Dem letters to the editor
make sure you are contacting your family, friends and neighbors that lean dem but might not vote midterms.

Make that your contest right now and beat them.

Volunteer with moveon or another organization for virtual phone banking.

Beat them right now.
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chefgirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 08:32 PM
Response to Original message
27. I know how you feel
This is how I felt in 2004. Got all excited because it looked like reasonable people were going to prevail.

I can't even describe exactly what I was feeling the day after the election. I've never been so personally devastated about the result of any election in my life.

It was surreal and it scared me, that I could be so personally invested, that I almost couldnt get out of bed and face the fact that we had to deal with the little idiot for another four years.

This time, I just can't pony up the emotional price that I paid last time. I've been doing all I can to support and contribute to Democrats, and speak to as many people as I can, and of course I will be out there voting first thing in the morning next Tuesday, but....

I believe with all my heart that its going to be stolen again and not a damn thing will come of it, just like the last three elections, and I'll be damned if I'm going to let it shut me down like it did last time.

I'll live my life the best way I know how, and until and unless Bush and his bullshit really impact my personal space, I plan to keep my head down.

Sorry folks, but I just don't have it in me this time.

I pray to God every day that I'll be proven wrong.

-chef-



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Indiana_Dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 08:32 PM
Response to Original message
28. If things don't go as expected, I expect
people rebelling in the streets. I've ID'd too many voters in my highly conservative area to believe it will swing in the Rs favor this time. Half the Rs I call say they want our D-guy for congress. If our R-guy wins this time, I will know for sure there has been some vote tampering.
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AlinPA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 08:42 PM
Response to Reply #28
30. But what could we do about it except raise hell like we did over Florida?
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Indiana_Dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 08:47 PM
Response to Reply #30
33. Well, it wouldn't be pretty but it would be more widespread than
just in FL. There are more people than just Ds in discontent right now.
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AlinPA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 08:41 PM
Response to Original message
29. The voting machines scare me, especially Diebold. There is no way to
know what goes through them. There is no way for us to know whether or not that they are pre-set for republicans. Who trusts the machines?
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La Coliniere Donating Member (581 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 08:42 PM
Response to Original message
31. Yeah, I have that same feeling.
Make some calls for Move On, go knocking on doors for the local Democrat this weekend, give what you can in the last minute crunch for bucks most of our candidates could benefit from. These are the things, that if all of us participate in, these are the necessary things that will enable what we want to happen, happen.
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emdee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 09:01 PM
Response to Original message
37. I feel the same way.
nt
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demwing Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 09:07 PM
Response to Original message
39. There's only one course of ACTION
and thats GOTV now, and POTF (point out the fraud) later, if required.

And if that later comes, I don't think a little gentle prodding will suffice.

No, what would need to happen is for people to take to the streets and forcefully TAKE back their government. Sometimes, you gotta do what you gotta do.

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mb7588a Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 09:14 PM
Response to Original message
41. Deep breath. Easy.
Anxiety is bad.
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stillcool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 09:41 PM
Response to Original message
42. here's your problem...
you are 'thinking'..in a linear manner...connecting dots. You need to 'cease and desist' until others around here can handle critcal thinking. 2+2=5...until further notice.
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glarius Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 10:02 PM
Response to Original message
43. For the people who think you have no right to express an opinion because
you are Canadian, I'd just like to say.....We Canadians are greatly effected by what is happening in your country. That is why we are on this forum and express concern. George Bush's war has screwed up the whole damned world to some extent. One of our innocent citizens was grabbed at an airport in the U.S.A and sent to another country to be tortured because it was decided he was a "terrorist", for example.
Right after 9/11, the word was put out that the 19 terrorists who did the bombing entered the U.S.A. from Canada....completely UNTRUE.
Now the Republicans are running a political ad saying that quote..Canada isn't doing anything, so they can take care of North Korea.....Apparently the Republicans aren't aware that Canada has the second largest contingent of troops in Afghanistan, next to the Americans....We are having coffins coming home to Canada every few days now, too....So don't say we don't have an interest. We are concerned because of these reasons and because we consider you our good friends! :loveya:
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bdamomma Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 10:55 PM
Response to Reply #43
59. I agree this election affects all of us.
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laundry_queen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 12:00 AM
Response to Reply #43
80. Agreed!
And...
I think some of us Canadians are perhaps a tad more pessimistic simply BECAUSE (well, I'm speaking for myself here) there is a limit to what we can do. We can't vote, or donate to any campaigns. We aren't doing all of the busy work a lot of you are all doing. It's somewhat unnerving to just WAIT and know you have little influence in the outcome, even though the outcome will have a huge effect on you. I think some nerves are shot (I know mine are).
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Cleita Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 01:01 PM
Response to Reply #43
115. Well said.
Also, I'm an American who knows that what our morons in office do affects the world especially our closest neighbors.
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glarius Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-01-06 10:49 AM
Response to Reply #115
116. Thanx.......I know there are many like you who are aware of how
Bush's administration has wide-reaching consequences. Here's hoping the Nov. 7th election will elect mostly Dems! :)
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SouthernBelle82 Donating Member (879 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 10:31 PM
Response to Original message
46. I do think
it's something to keep in mind. I do have this very high hope feeling just like in 2004 but they are trying to steal it and will keep on trying. I think it will be more obvious of the theft though this time around because so many polls are predicting the opposite win and the democrats taking it back.
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Fovea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 10:36 PM
Response to Original message
49. What is the worst that can happen?
I watched 'V for Vendetta' again last night.
I am not afraid.
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blues90 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 10:40 PM
Response to Original message
52. It's to be expected
How else can one feel after all the horrors that have happened since 2000 , it has been 6 years of complete endless hell .

It is an emotional blow for anyone with a heart and for anyone who is concerned about other people and this country .

Six years of watching death and suffering and still it goes on and gets worse . All the lies and destruction is absolutely horrendous .
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mnhtnbb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 10:45 PM
Response to Original message
54. I hope to be surprised by Dem victories; I expect to see R's prevail
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Independent_Liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 11:26 PM
Response to Original message
70. I know what you're talking about...
Edited on Mon Oct-30-06 11:27 PM by Independent_Liberal
But I think too many people are aware of the e-voting issue right now. With Lou Dobbs reporting on it and RFK Jr.'s articles in Rolling Stone about 2004 and e-voting, I think people are now going to be more vigilant about the issue than ever before. Regardless of what happens, we need to stick together.
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struggle4progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 11:52 PM
Response to Original message
77. Go volunteer. Give money. Do a lit drop. Save yr feelings for next Wed.
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Guaranteed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-30-06 11:54 PM
Response to Original message
78. Eh. Just have faith. Do what you can, leave the rest
to whatever the hell is steering this damned ship.

There's only so much we can reasonably do. Not that much point in worrying about it. Things'll work out.
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CarbonDate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 12:03 AM
Response to Original message
82. The time to worry about this was in January of 2005.
It's too late now. Worry about it again if it happens, but there's nothing we can do about it at this point.
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nolabels Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 12:16 AM
Response to Reply #82
85. I would say I saw it in November of 2000
but it doesn't really matter when it all started if it is never corrected :shrug:


The only thing left that seems one can wonder about is if this will be the last sham election or will there be another one
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Helga Scow Stern Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 12:13 AM
Response to Original message
84. Thanks for being honest...
It's a very real possibility.
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Raksha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 12:31 AM
Response to Original message
86. I think they'll at least try to steal it. They may or may not succeed.
But if they do steal it, at least THIS TIME the theft will be documented. Fewer Dem candidates will concede without a fight, and afterward there will be a major effort to ban touchscreen voting machines, if not all electronic voting machines. This may not be very comforting, but I believe it will be their LAST stolen election.
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renate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 12:57 AM
Response to Original message
89. I think they'll TRY to steal it, and may get away with several races
I'm an optimist too but, like you, not enough of one to think that power-hungry people who have the capability of stealing an election will altruistically and nobly decide to play fair.

But what still gives me hope is that I think this election is different from those in 2000, 2002, and 2004, and not just because the "Republican" label is something the candidates are actively running away from.

For one thing, the possibility of election fraud is on even the corporate media's radar, to at least a small extent. For another, people in the media have been talking nonstop about how the tide is shifting toward the Democrats; if the Republicans don't lose at least the House, the pundits will look like idiots and will be looking for someone or something to blame for that, and the problems with electronic voting that have already been documented will be the most obvious culprits. So the theft of the election, unless it's really done seamlessly (which hasn't been the case so far), will be up for discussion and investigation by reporters, if not during the actual counting of the votes then afterwards.

Election fraud isn't just for conspiracy theorists any more. And that's why I think this election will be different.

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K8-EEE Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 12:59 AM
Response to Original message
90. Eyore Dems: WELL POOH I GUESS WE'RE GONNA LOSE...
Things are looking good. We'll be vigilant and we will win. I'd MUCH rather be running as a D than an R this year!

The polls and momentum are with us, and awareness of the election fraud has never been higher.

This constant message of "we can't win" is unintentionally harmful to the cause, it doesn't do any good. IMO.
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nolabels Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 01:09 AM
Response to Reply #90
91. The analogy of this being a shot in a gambling Casino is more apt
We need the whole enchilada not just a piece. They are planing on cheating big time but this time they will get caught by many, it's a sure bet.
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chefgirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 06:20 AM
Response to Reply #90
105. I envy your positive attitude
If only I could get as jazzed as you, and really make myself believe that we have an honest chance, my mental outlook would be much brighter.

Things are looking good. We'll be vigilant and we will win.

Thats how I felt in '04, and really thought the momentum was with us. We were polling ahead almost all night long, on election night and then, all of a sudden...SURPRISE! The Republicans win!

As my dear Mother used to say, "I wont hold my hand on my ass" waiting for Democrats to win the House or the Senate this year.

-chef-
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OneBlueSky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 01:13 AM
Response to Original message
92. the difference this year is that . . .
EVERYBODY KNOWS the Democrats are going to win, and win big . . . if the election results don't reflect that (i.e. give the people what they want), there's going to be hell to pay . . .

they got away with it in 2000 . . .

they got away with it in 2002 . . .

they got away with it in 2004 . . .

they will NOT get away with it in 2006! . . .
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 01:13 AM
Response to Original message
93. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
ClusterFreak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 01:33 AM
Response to Reply #93
94. Really? If I get a star you might see my point?!
Until then however, "Get lost". Ah. I see.

Well scootch over on that high-and-mighty pedestal of yours for a sec, will ya? I just want to whisper a couple things in your ear...

Fortunately, the DU rules are available to star and non-star participants alike. Oh! Here's a couple:

Do not tell someone, "shut up," "screw you," "fuck off," "in your face," or some other insult. I would assume telling others to "Get lost" might also be included in this list.

"...do not otherwise imply (someone is ) not welcome on Democratic Underground..."

Now...even star-less DU deadbeats like me can understand those rules.

Why can't you?
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hvn_nbr_2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 02:03 AM
Response to Original message
96. Disillusionment is a high state
That's what the minister of a rather unusual church that I used to go to sometimes said. More completely, she said, "Disillusionment is a high state. What? Would you rather continue living in illusion?"

Some here apparently would rather continue living in the illusion that we lost in 2000 and 2004, that Max Cleland really lost and Chuck Hagel really won, that the Ohio reform proposition that was ahead 2-1 in the polls really lost 2-1, that all the reports we're already seeing of vote-flipping don't mean anything. And would rather chastise anyone who mentions the giant gray pachyderm sitting on top of what used to be the coffee table.

I'm getting tired of people being accused of being trolls because they acknowledge reality. No doubt someone will now accuse me of being a troll. But they won't start an argument, because I'm gonna ignore them (unless they or I have something really new and interesting to say on the subject, which isn't very likely because it's all been said already, probably a couple times on this thread alone).

All that said, I'll vote anyway and keep encouraging people to vote and try not to think too much about the dirty tricks because at this point there's not a lot I can do about them. Oh yes, one other thing. Like it or not, I'll continue to be--most dreaded and dreadful and feared and hated word of the week--"concerned" about the situation. So sue me.
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ClusterFreak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 04:30 AM
Response to Reply #96
99. Right on brother!
...and I shouldn't get sucked into dumb arguments like I did tonight, but sometimes you just gotta do it. Most of the time I just ignore, but I guess this time I felt like going toe to toe.

Oh well, time for sleep now! :boring:
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 04:58 AM
Response to Original message
101. Here's what encourages me: The laws of the Universe.
Pendulums swing, and this year the swing is hugely toward the dems and away from the pukes. I just don't think they can steal this one.
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cassiepriam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 05:55 AM
Response to Original message
103. Why wouldn't they steal it again?
Unless they let the Dems win so they can blame everything
on them.

And Repugs are used to others cleaning up after them.
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MadHound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 05:57 AM
Response to Original message
104. You're not alone in your feeling, and you're not crazy.
After all, as you have said, we have the examples of '00, '02, and '04 to show us clearly that the 'Pugs have no compunction about stealing the vote. However this time it is going to have to be on a multi-state scale, a much larger operation than they've previously pulled off. This might actually cause a fuck-up that will expose the whole sordid mess, one can hope.

The real question is how will the American people react when blatant election theft happens again. Will they take to the streets, or will the just change the channel. Sadly, I think it will be the latter, especially since the MSM will be spinning, spinning spinning away on all reports of election theft and fraud.

But the 'Pugs have got to do this, they've got to try and rip off the vote. Investigations, trials, and jail time awaits them if the Dems get control. They're fighting for their political lives here, and like any cornered rat, they're going to fight with everything they've got.
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HardRocker05 Donating Member (486 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 11:31 AM
Response to Original message
108. ditto. i won't be surprised if repukes hold both houses. and you can bet
bet that if they do 'unexpectedly well,' everybody, including the dems, will just accept it. the MSM will spin it every which way, and no dem will have the guts to suggest that bush's 'win' was not on the up and up. count on it.
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Cleita Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 12:13 PM
Response to Reply #108
113. If they do, I believe there will be more activism as a backlash.
Also, there are some big guns on board this time like Bobby Kennedy, Jr. who will be investigating and reporting on this.
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KoKo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 12:20 PM
Response to Reply #113
114. Agree....we have three stolen elections that's we've had time to catalog
and gather evidence on. The Conyers hearings documented all of what happened in Selection '04 and there is overwhelming evidence available now about what happened in Selection 2000 which can no longer be covered up.

There will be activism and lawsuits forthcoming. Probably even if we win there will be evidence we could have won bigger without dirty tricks and voter disenfrachisement and lost or switched votes.

I'm optimistic ...either way.
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spacemanspiff Donating Member (59 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 11:32 AM
Response to Original message
109. me neither! Of course they will steal it again!
Edited on Tue Oct-31-06 11:36 AM by spacemanspiff
Why would they stop when they have been so successful?

That is why I posted this

Democratic Politicians in the upcoming 'election' must be forced to act on election fraud!
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

The Stolen Election Audio Collection
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

We have to be prepared to fight this time! And we have to force our Democratic politicians to join us.

They are already stealing it and blaming the computer glitches on old poll workers. They are preparing up to Blame Chavez if something is screwed up.(like Chavez wants the Republicans to win? Last time all computer glitches were in their favor)

It might be depressing to think about, but it is reality and we must face it or the election will demoralize democrats even further.

One thing we can do is DO YOUR OWN EXIT POLL AT YOUR PRECINCT!

If we do all we can to raise awareness, if we catch them stealing it or implant doubt in enough people, we should have enought support to pass Kucinich's "hand counted ballots, counted and posted at the precinct level" legislation when congress comes back in session. I know that our legislators will continue to ignore us, but if the American people shout loudly enough....just maybe....
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Cleita Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-31-06 12:11 PM
Response to Original message
112. It's not hard to feel that way.
We had two years to fix the way we do elections, yet nothing has changed. As a matter-of-fact, even more of the electronic machines have been put in place. If they could rig the elections in 2004, they can do so in 2006 as well.

The only thing that we have going for us this time, is that awareness has spread about the problems with elections so there will be more eyes watching and that will make it harder for a fix to be made.
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