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originalpckelly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 09:53 AM
Original message
It is all about oil. I used to write off all the people on our side...
Edited on Sat Oct-28-06 09:54 AM by originalpckelly
who used to say that. "No more blood for oil" made me write them off as nuts. I wasn't angry at them for saying it and I was offended by it, but I didn't really take them seriously. I might even have thought they were hurting our cause.

Now the political adviser to the President gives us the real reasons we can't leave Iraq: oil, oil, and oil.

Suddenly "no more oil for blood" sounds completely sane. What are these "far left" anti-war activists drinking, because what ever it is they know what this is really all about. (I want some of this juice if you can send some my way.)

I have considered myself a left anti-war person. (Hence the whole "hurting our cause" part.) But I bow down to the people with foresight and enough depth to understand what was really going on all these years.

The assholes in this administration did indeed launch a war based upon lies and it was mainly because of their greed. They wanted to help the oil companies of this country, which they have invested in and/or are beholden to because of campaign contributions.

There may have been other possible reasons and they are even worse: we sought to dominate Iraq, we sought to use their land to squeeze Iran, or other countries in the Middle East.

Some are comparatively petty: the plot by Saddam to kill Bush 41. Or even to "finish the job of the first war."

May history have mercy upon us all.
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spanone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 09:56 AM
Response to Original message
1. 9/11 was the excuse, oil was the reason. Bet on it.
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stillcool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 10:00 AM
Response to Original message
2. Pepe Escobar writes an excellent article...
concerning the oil war: http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Middle_East/HJ27Ak03.html

'Stability First': Newspeak for rape of Iraq
By Pepe Escobar
The coalition of the drilling
World public opinion must switch to red alert. The real, not virtual, future of Iraq will be decided in December. The whole point is a new oil law - which is in fact a debt-for-oil program concocted and imposed by the International Monetary Fund (IMF). This is the point of the US invasion - a return on investment on the hundreds of billions of dollars of US taxpayers' money spent. It's not war as politics by other means; it's war as free-market opening by other means - full US access to the epicenter of the energy wars and the perfect geostrategic location for "taming", in the near future, both Russia and China.

Very few observers have detailed what's at stake. In US corporate media the silence is stratospheric.

US Energy Secretary Samuel Bodman duly landed in Baghdad this past summer, insisting that Iraqis must "pass a hydrocarbon law under which foreign companies can invest". Iraqi Oil Minister Hussein al-Shahristani was convinced, and said the law would be passed by the end of 2006, as promised to the IMF.

No wonder: the Green Zone US Embassy colossus has always made sure that the US controls - via well-paid Iraqi servants - the Petroleum Ministry, as well as all key management posts in key Iraqi ministries. The draft hydrocarbon law was reviewed by the IMF, reviewed by Bodman and reviewed by Big Oil executives. It was not and it will not be reviewed by Iraqi civil society: that was left to the fractious Iraqi parliament - which can be largely bought for a fistful of dinars.

The Bush administration needs somebody to sign the law. The nation of Iraq as it emerged out of British imperial design is an artificial construct that can only be "tamed" by a hardcore strongman a la Saddam. It has to be "our" strongman, of course: when Saddam started to act independently he was smashed. Insistent rumors of a US-engineered coup to replace the hapless current premier Nuri al-Maliki have surfaced of late. Poor Maliki, if he clings to a minimum of integrity, can't possibly sign the oil law. Enter the Washington/Green Zone-backed strongman a la Saddam: a likely candidate is former interim premier Iyad Allawi, who ordered the destruction of Fallujah in late 2004.

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twilight_sailing Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 11:06 AM
Response to Reply #2
9. Pepe Escobar
is brilliant. And the Asia Times is one of the best news sources available.
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vssmith Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 10:09 AM
Response to Original message
3. I believe some decision makers had protecting Israel as a priority also.
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tabasco Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 10:14 AM
Response to Original message
4. Oil = $$$$$$.
$$$$$ = Power.



There is a criminal corporate mafia in control of the Nation and the oil tycoons are a big part of it.

There is no patriotism with these multinational corporations.

They will gladly loot the US Treasury and launch illegal wars to fatten up their bank accounts!!


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earth mom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 10:30 AM
Response to Original message
5. I used to write off anyone who didn't understand that it was about Oil.
Why does it have to get so bad, and things get so extreme for people to open their eyes and their minds?! :banghead:
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The2ndWheel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 10:44 AM
Response to Original message
6. Without oil, civilization collapses
That's why it's about oil. Our entire existence is based on oil. Everything we do, oil is what makes it possible. More and more countries are now "developing". Where does the energy required to develop come from? Since our entire way of life is based on exponential growth, we need more and more energy all the time.

Whatever the source of energy would be, we would find a way to fight over it. I guarantee we would even fight for more access to wind if that was a primary energy source. The ability to expand has been the core purpose behind every war. The 21st century will be no different. Nobody will be able to stop it either.
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The Anti-Neo Con Donating Member (402 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 10:47 AM
Response to Reply #6
7. It will be interesting to see what happens when oil is depleted.
I know I won't see it because I'm betting I will have been long dead when it finally happens. I've always thought things would revert to how they were back in the middle ages where there was feudalism.
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MikeDuffy Donating Member (309 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 11:09 AM
Response to Reply #7
11. It will be interesting to see what happens when oil production declines...
And you likely will be around to see that. So what do you think things will be like?
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Strelnikov_ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 12:53 PM
Response to Reply #7
20. We Are On The Plateau Now, And The Problems Begin Once We Start
to slide down the backside.

However, it is EROEI that will cause the energy crises to hit harder and faster than most can imagine.

Remember, we have consumed nearly all of the 'good' (high EROEI) oil and coal (the elementary school snots should at least complete high-school science before shilling for the 'coal solution'). Most of what is left is of poor quality from an energy standpoint.


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originalpckelly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 11:38 AM
Response to Reply #6
12. Oil is just another form of solar energy...
Edited on Sat Oct-28-06 11:48 AM by originalpckelly
that is if you believe in evolution and that dinosaurs existed 65 million years ago.

Here is how it works:
Plants/trees absorb suns rays, use it to grow; photosynthesis
Herbivorous dinosaurs eat the plants/trees - If they are big enough probably are not killed by
Carnivorous dinosaurs who ate herbivorous ones.

The plants, both kinds of dinos (not DINOs ;-)) and any other animals living then, die and then somehow manage through changing geology to be buried below lots of rock. Pressure, heat, microbes and time break down the animal/plant matter into the various chemicals which make up oil.

Humans come upon oil and find it is a better energy source than whale blubber or gas because you don't have to chase it around and it doesn't blow up in your face (at least if there aren't any natural gas deposits in the oil field.)

There you have it, oil is solar energy, it is just a battery storing solar energy.

What we have to do is manage to get that much solar energy or use the same process in the sun to produce our own "solar (really fusion) energy."

Ethanol is solar energy, the corn absorbs the sun's energy (like a solar cell) and then stores that in starches (like a battery.) Bacteria then eat the starches and transform them into ethanol. (There are a few more steps, but this is the basic idea.)

We might use solar panels, but instead of actively relying on their power, we could store it in batteries. This would increase its overall reliability.

It would give us the best of solar cell energy and ethanol.
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catmandu57 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 10:59 AM
Response to Original message
8. We were drinking common sense
It's not hard to see behind the curtain, when every reason they gave was batted aside oil was all that's left.
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originalpckelly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 11:45 AM
Response to Reply #8
13. Oil and greed.
It is 2006, it is possible for this nation to be off oil with the current technological development of our society. The only reason we aren't is that oil companies, their major investors and their executives want to continue to exploit oil for profit. They are greedy. If it costs a little less to go to Iraq and let American soldiers die rather than make the small investment needed to changed our economy to use other sources of energy, they will do it. It is about the bottom line for them.

And hawkish political leaders, who themselves are oil men and investors will be only to happy to be able to oblige.

That is why we are in this crummy war. These soldiers did not have to die, they died for petty money, not principle.
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KansDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 11:08 AM
Response to Original message
10. 15 of the 19 attackers on 9/11 held Saudi passports
Yet, we invaded Iraq? :shrug:

The bin-Laden Family and the Bush Family have had close business ties for decades. One could suppose that's why we didn't do "shock and awe" on the Saudis.

There were repeated warnings about the attack that Bush and his gang of thugs and cutthroats chose to ignore and refer to later as "errors in intelligence." We now know Bush's excuses were complete lies.

And Bush let Osama's relatives escape from the US without being questioned by authorities. What's up with that? Is that a standard crime investigation technique?

Hell yes, it's all about oil... Always was...always will be...
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TheFarseer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 11:52 AM
Response to Original message
14. They even admit as much now
The number 1 reason given why we can't leave is that we cannot let the oil fall into the hands of the terrorists. But don't just believe me, ask GW Bush or Cheney or Rumsfeld, they'll TELL you that.
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leesa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 11:57 AM
Response to Original message
15. Don't forget water...it's always in the mix too. And I read recently,
the lust factor in Afghanistan, besides the need to install a recognized government (Karzai) to ensure the gas pipeline right-of-way, is uranium deposits, apparently that is why the USSR was there as well.

These plans were a go whether 9-11 occurred or not. 9-11 was the all-too-convenient trigger.
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DURHAM D Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 12:04 PM
Response to Original message
16. Welcome. About oil...
I always thought it was about oil. Hell - I think Vietnam was really about oil. But the difference in this war - we went in to control and slow down oil production. Makes for bigger profits later for Bush/Cheney masters.

The thing to remember - American oil men do not have America's interest as number one - they are more about power and their family fortunes and they think of themselves as "internationals". In other words, they can pick up the family assets and move/live comfortably anywhere. The rest of us are stuck here.
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rman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 12:08 PM
Response to Original message
17. Ruthless power-politics is dominant
No morality, just the self-interest of the ruling class. Save for a very few exceptions.

Everything else follows from that.

fake democracy
media as propaganda
neo-colonialism as foreign policy
discarding civil rights
false flag operations
denouncing opponents as communist and/or dictator and/or terrorist

and probably more
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BeFree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 12:12 PM
Response to Original message
18. Welcome...
...to our nightmare.
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Strelnikov_ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 12:18 PM
Response to Original message
19. Specifically, It Is About Peak Oil
The purpose of the 'War On Terror' and all of it's subsidiaries are related to Peak Oil as follows:

- By maintaining a constant state of tension, high petroleum prices can be explained away as a temporary spike due to politics. This way, the publics attention can kept from the accelerating supply problems worldwide, thus preventing them from starting to make other arrangements for a post-carbon world (they can't have the addicts kicking too soon).

- Whoever controls the remaining (cheap) petroleum reserves stands to make a fortune in the years immediately following the peak of production. Even the most optimistic scenarios indicate it would take twenty years to mitigate the loss of petroleum production following peak. During this period of transition, the 'addicts' will have no choice but to pay, and pay, and pay.


Cheney as much acknowledged that peak will occur in the latter part of this decade at a speech in 1999 when he was still an 'official' oilman. Yet the reich-wing media and echo chamber spouts the party line that additional supplies will come on line. All one has to do is read about the wildly exaggerated EIA estimates to know that the facts are being covered up.

The peaking of worldwide conventional (high EROEI) petroleum is real, and will probably occur within the next few years. During the initial 10 yrs.+ following peak oil, petroleum will still be readily available. But with demand chronically outstripping supply, prices will go through the roof, and the profits for those selling the oil will be massive.


And if this bunch did not believe Peak Oil is looming, why are they throwing money at highly risky resources such as Russia (nationalization), Deep-Water and Artic (mother nature, limits of technology, limited net energy).


Consider the following statement:

From the standpoint of the oil industry obviously - and I'll talk a little later on about gas - for over a hundred years we as an industry have had to deal with the pesky problem that once you find oil and pump it out of the ground you've got to turn around and find more or go out of business. Producing oil is obviously a self-depleting activity. Every year you've got to find and develop reserves equal to your output just to stand still, just to stay even. This is as true for companies as well in the broader economic sense it is for the world. A new merged company like Exxon-Mobil will have to secure over a billion and a half barrels of new oil equivalent reserves every year just to replace existing production. It's like making one hundred per cent interest; discovering another major field of some five hundred million barrels equivalent every four months or finding two Hibernias a year. For the world as a whole, oil companies are expected to keep finding and developing enough oil to offset our seventy one million plus barrel a day of oil depletion, but also to meet new demand. By some estimates there will be an average of two per cent annual growth in global oil demand over the years ahead along with conservatively a three per cent natural decline in production from existing reserves. That means by 2010 we will need on the order of an additional fifty million barrels a day. So where is the oil going to come from? Governments and the national oil companies are obviously in control of about ninety per cent of the assets. Oil remains fundamentally a government business. While many regions of the world often greet oil opportunities, the Middle East with two thirds of the world's oil and the lowest cost, is still where the prize ultimately lies, even though companies are anxious for greater access there, progress continues to be slow.

- Cheney At London Institute of Petroleum, 1999

Puts a whole new spin on the Cheney 'Energy' task force, doesn't it.


Following is an article that sums up the peak oil/WOT link. I do not necessarily agree with all of the points, but I feel it provides a decent big picture view.

Energy Depletion And The US Descent Into Fascism
http://www.mountainsentinel.com/#energyfascism

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dkofos Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-28-06 12:57 PM
Response to Original message
21. You would only have to read a few PNAC papers to understand
it's all about the oil.

Because oil is money and money is POWER!!
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