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Starfury Donating Member (615 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-20-06 12:16 AM
Original message
Renew Your Passport Now!
Bruce Schneier is a reliable source when it comes to computer security issues.


If you have a passport, now is the time to renew it -- even if it's not set to expire anytime soon. If you don't have a passport and think you might need one, now is the time to get it. In many countries, including the United States, passports will soon be equipped with RFID chips. And you don't want one of these chips in your passport.

RFID stands for "radio-frequency identification." Passports with RFID chips store an electronic copy of the passport information: your name, a digitized picture, etc. And in the future, the chip might store fingerprints or digital visas from various countries.

By itself, this is no problem. But RFID chips don't have to be plugged in to a reader to operate. Like the chips used for automatic toll collection on roads or automatic fare collection on subways, these chips operate via proximity. The risk to you is the possibility of surreptitious access: Your passport information might be read without your knowledge or consent by a government trying to track your movements, a criminal trying to steal your identity or someone just curious about your citizenship.

(...)

This is perhaps the greatest risk. The security mechanisms on your passport chip have to last the lifetime of your passport. It is as ridiculous to think that passport security will remain secure for that long as it would be to think that you won't see another security update for Microsoft Windows in that time. Improvements in antenna technology will certainly increase the distance at which they can be read and might even allow unauthorized readers to penetrate the shielding.

(...)

The Colorado passport office is already issuing RFID passports, and the State Department expects all U.S. passport offices to be doing so by the end of the year. Many other countries are in the process of changing over. So get a passport before it's too late. With your new passport you can wait another 10 years for an RFID passport, when the technology will be more mature, when we will have a better understanding of the security risks and when there will be other technologies we can use to cut the risks. You don't want to be a guinea pig on this one.


http://www.schneier.com/crypto-gram-0610.html#3

Even ignoring the Orwellian aspects of RFID chips informing on your movements, you know the technology is going to have security holes large enough to drive a truck through.
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stopbush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-20-06 12:18 AM
Response to Original message
1. Time to invest a a biz selling passport-sized tinfoil or lead wrappers.
Whaddayathink?
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speedoo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-20-06 12:26 AM
Response to Reply #1
3. Someone already manufactures them.
EZ Pass (in NY and surrounding states) hands them out, free, when you pick up your tag. They are intended to protect your tag from being read, if you don't want it to be read. Basically just a baggie, with some kind of foil coating.
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HamdenRice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-20-06 03:27 PM
Response to Reply #3
27. Car Talk "Puzzler" about charges on an unprotected easy pass!
This will make sense only if you listen to the best show on NPR, Car Talk. Every week they have a little story involving cars that is kind of a mystery, called the Puzzler.

In one of them a guy had ordered a replacement easy pass, and when it arrived and he checked his account (I'm not sure how it works, never had one) it turned out there were like a half dozen charges going over bridges and tunnels.

Turned out that the pass had been in a mail truck driving around the city, charging the guy each time it went through a toll.

I guess that's why you need a protector.
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formercia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-20-06 03:27 PM
Response to Reply #1
26. High permiability iron
like in low frquency transformers. Your local audio specialist might help you find a sheet of thin material.
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villager Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-20-06 12:24 AM
Response to Original message
2. what about just running a magnet over the thing?
n/t
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China_cat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-20-06 01:13 AM
Response to Reply #2
9. A strong magnet
or even a hefty vacuum cleaner can scramble the microchip placed in pets. I don't see why it couldn't do it to one in a passport.
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xultar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-20-06 04:54 AM
Response to Reply #9
14. Who would want to scramble a chip in a pet unless they stole the pet.
My pets are chipped and I recommend it to everyone.
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China_cat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-20-06 05:25 AM
Response to Reply #14
16. It's been found several times to have happened
with kids playing with magnets and people who think vacuuming their dogs is a good idea. The thing is, if we know the chips in animals CAN be screwed up, then we know that the chips in passports can, too.

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xultar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-20-06 11:56 AM
Response to Reply #16
19. True. They sell really strong magnets on ThinkGeek.com
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formercia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-20-06 03:30 PM
Response to Reply #16
28. Get your friendly cashier to zap it.
on the plate used to deactivate tags in goods.
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KittyWampus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-20-06 03:42 PM
Response to Reply #28
31. would this work? anyone know? please?
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China_cat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-20-06 04:39 PM
Response to Reply #31
33. Why not? If you lay your credit card on that pad
it'll wipe your magnetic stripe in less than a second.
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elehhhhna Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-20-06 05:23 PM
Response to Reply #16
35. Hey, now! Budward LOVES to be vac'd w/ the brush attachment....
cuts down on the hair in the house when he's shedding, too.
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silverweb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-20-06 12:34 AM
Response to Original message
4. Would microwaving kill it?
:shrug:
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readmoreoften Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-20-06 12:39 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. It will damage the passport.
If you microwave an RFID I'm pretty sure it burns the paper around it. That might invalidate the passport.
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silverweb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-20-06 12:47 AM
Response to Reply #5
7. So much for that bright idea.
n/t
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soothsayer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-20-06 07:08 AM
Response to Reply #4
17. only takes a few seconds to fry the chip, so I'd say no,but I don't
think they'll let you back in the country cuz your passport will 'read' as fake
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gerrilea Donating Member (610 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-20-06 12:43 AM
Response to Original message
6. Quick Question about this...
If they are actually going to do this, buying a passport now would be a waste of money...wouldn't it?

Simple fact, if the gov't goes this way wouldn't they then require that anyone with a passport get one of these with the RFID's in them? So we would be paying twice for it...or doesn't anyone see it as I do?

Thanks
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Starfury Donating Member (615 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-20-06 01:10 AM
Response to Reply #6
8. I think it'd still have a 10 year lifespan
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Shakespeare Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-20-06 01:23 AM
Response to Reply #8
11. No, from what I've read, existing passport holders will have....
...a date certain by which to "upgrade" their passports. At this point, it doesn't matter. We're all screwed as far as the RFID chips go.
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Starfury Donating Member (615 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-20-06 01:34 AM
Response to Reply #11
12. Not sure about that...
A quick check of the state department website didn't say anything in the FAQ section.

http://travel.state.gov/passport/fri/faq/faq_1741.html#valid

Doesn't mean you're wrong, though, about the required "upgrades." But you're definitely right that sooner or later all passports will have these chips, regardless.
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NMMNG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-20-06 01:18 AM
Response to Original message
10. I just got a passport a year ago
It has no RFID chip.
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BlueEyedSon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-20-06 03:26 PM
Response to Reply #10
25. ... that you know of
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gumby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-20-06 02:04 AM
Response to Original message
13. Whatever happened to those little metalic strips in our money
that we pulled out for "fun"?

Are RFID less vulnerable? Will it not be long before a virus is issued?
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soothsayer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-20-06 07:09 AM
Response to Reply #13
18. They're still in there, and it's still fun to pull them out!
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shanti Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-20-06 11:58 AM
Response to Reply #13
20. come again?
where are they? i've never seen them.
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Starfury Donating Member (615 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-20-06 02:55 PM
Response to Reply #20
23. Hold a $20 to a light,
and look for a thin vertical strip about a 1/2 inch from the left. I think that's what they're referring to.
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shanti Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-20-06 05:40 PM
Response to Reply #23
38. thanks!
;)
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bluedogyellowdog Donating Member (338 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-20-06 05:05 AM
Response to Original message
15. It gets better
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ryanus Donating Member (511 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-20-06 03:35 PM
Response to Reply #15
29. Oh man, I hadn't thought of this.
Bombs that go off when they detect an American walking by. Sigh. Maybe I'll become a Luddite.
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JCMach1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-20-06 12:27 PM
Response to Original message
21. Stick a magnet over the chip and leave it!!!
and enjoy the results...
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cosmicdot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-20-06 01:44 PM
Response to Original message
22. knr
just like with other citizen concerns ... HAVA voting going forward; 30% default finance charges on credit balances; privacy invasions, etc. ... one hears crickets over any Hill dissent over this

like the WashPost article, which the link, links to ends:

"You don't want to be a guinea pig on this one."

If sanity ever returns to DC, and the RFID-chipped passports end, everyone issued one should be able to have it replaced at no cost.




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Maraya1969 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-20-06 03:23 PM
Response to Original message
24. A friend in the army told me the same thing
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survivor999 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-20-06 03:39 PM
Response to Original message
30. So, if the chip is defective
How can I know it's defective, before I go on a trip? Would I find myself stranded? What if one intentionally slams the passport hard enough to break the chip?
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cobalt1999 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-20-06 03:42 PM
Response to Original message
32. The reader would have to be VERY close though.
The smallest RFID tags don't transmit with enough power to be read unless the reader is almost in contact with it.

Also, don't think you can get away from RFID technology. It won't be forever before they are embedded into almost every product you buy.


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Scout1071 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-20-06 05:07 PM
Response to Original message
34. The chip includes a digital photo for facial recognition
Edited on Fri Oct-20-06 05:07 PM by Scout1071
that can be used by governments worldwide to track you. From their own website:

The U.S. Electronic Passport


The proposed U.S. Electronic Passport is the same as a regular passport with the addition of a small contactless integrated circuit (computer chip) embedded in the back cover. The chip will securely store the same data visually displayed on the photo page of the passport, and will additionally include a digital photograph. The inclusion of the digital photograph will enable biometric comparison, through the use of facial recognition technology at international borders. The U.S. “e-passport” will also have a new look, incorporating additional anti-fraud and security features.

Passports without chips will still be valid for the full extent of their validity period.

The Department of State Starts Issuing Tourist E-Passports

Electronic Passport Frequently Asked Questions

Security and Privacy of the e-Passport

Public Comments in the Federal Register on the Proposed Rule for the e-Passport

New Design for the U.S. e-Passport

This webpage will be updated as more information becomes available.


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jberryhill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-20-06 05:36 PM
Response to Original message
36. ANY ELECTRONICS SUPPLY HOUSE

Sells the conductive poly-bags that your EZ-PASS RFID toll unit is mailed in.

Think for half a second people - they MAIL you the EZ-PASS. The MAIL TRUCKS travel on the roads.

Do you think it is some kind of mysterious magic that keeps five dozen EZ-PASSes in a mail truck from charging tolls on the road?

No.

They are called "Faraday bags". They are metallized plastic bags from which you can form a simple and convenient passport holder.


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Hawkeye-X Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-20-06 05:40 PM
Response to Original message
37. When I go renew my passport
I'm gonna smash it with a hammer.

Fuck the government.

Hawkeye-X
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Phrogman Donating Member (940 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-21-06 01:13 AM
Response to Original message
39. It doesn't matter, DHS will require a chip in your head next year....
Persons without one will be considered enemy combatants, and you know what that means.
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upi402 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-21-06 01:18 AM
Response to Reply #39
40. I don't care, I have my special hat
:tinfoilhat:
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Phrogman Donating Member (940 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-21-06 07:45 AM
Response to Reply #40
41. Special hats can save your life!
I've lined my helmet just in case.
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