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At the Nuremburg trials, Nazi war criminal Wilhem Keitel....

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marmar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 10:54 PM
Original message
At the Nuremburg trials, Nazi war criminal Wilhem Keitel....
called the Geneva Convention "obsolete."....

In 2002, then-White House Council Alberto Gonzales wrote: "As you have said, the war against terrorism is a new kind of warIn my judgment, this new paradigm renders obsolete Geneva's strict limitations on questioning of enemy prisoners and renders quaint some of its provisions."

Is everything old new again? :scared:
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mmonk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 11:20 PM
Response to Original message
1. When like minded people follow previous persons
who think the same, history repeats.
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Mnemosyne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 11:24 PM
Response to Original message
2. Each act, each occasion, is worse than the last, but only a little worse.
They Thought They Were Free

by Milton Mayer

"You see," my colleague went on, "one doesn't see exactly where or how to move. Believe me, this is true. Each act, each occasion, is worse than the last, but only a little worse. You wait for the next and the next. You wait for the one great shocking occasion, thinking that others, when such a shock comes, will join with you in resisting somehow. You don't want to act, or even to talk, alone; you don't want to "go out of your way to make trouble." Why not? - Well, you are not in the habit of doing it. And it is not just fear, fear of standing alone, that restrains you; it is also genuine uncertainty.

"Uncertainty is a very important factor, and, instead of decreasing as time goes on, it grows. Outside, in the streets, in the general community, "everyone is happy. One hears no protest, and certainly sees none. You know, in France or Italy there will be slogans against the government painted on walls and fences; in Germany, outside the great cities, perhaps, there is not even this. In the university community, in your own community, you speak privately to you colleagues, some of whom certainly feel as you do; but what do they say? They say, "It's not so bad" or "You're seeing things" or "You're an alarmist."

"And you are an alarmist. You are saying that this must lead to this, and you can't prove it. These are the beginnings, yes; but how do you know for sure when you don't know the end, and how do you know, or even surmise, the end? On the one hand, your enemies, the law, the regime, the Party, intimidate you. On the other, your colleagues pooh-pooh you as pessimistic or even neurotic. You are left with your close friends, who are, naturally, people who have always thought as you have.

"But your friends are fewer now. Some have drifted off somewhere or submerged themselves in their work. You no longer see as many as you did at meetings or gatherings. Informal groups become smaller; attendance drops off in little organizations, and the organizations themselves wither. Now, in small gatherings of your oldest friends, you feel that you are talking to yourselves, that you are isolated from the reality of things. This weakens your confidence still further and serves as a further deterrent to to what? It is clearer all the time that, if you are going to do anything, you must make an occasion to do it, and then you are obviously a troublemaker. So you wait, and you wait.

much more at link:

http://www.thirdreich.net/Thought_They_Wer ...



We need to pay very close attention to this resolution. It gives * a free ride on his crimes, backs him in anything he wants to do to fight terra, muffles the press and silences leakers and whistle-blowers.


H. Res. 895

more at link:

http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/D?c109 ... ::

H.RES.895
Title: Supporting intelligence and law enforcement programs to track terrorists and terrorist finances conducted consistent with Federal law and with appropriate Congressional consultation and specifically condemning the disclosure and publication of classified information that impairs the international fight against terrorism and needlessly exposes Americans to the threat of further terror attacks by revealing a crucial method by which terrorists are traced through their finances.
Sponsor: Rep Oxley, Michael G. (introduced 6/28/2006) Cosponsors (None)
Related Bills: H.RES.896, S.RES.524
Latest Major Action: 6/29/2006 Passed/agreed to in House. Status: On agreeing to the resolution Agreed to by the Yeas and Nays: 227 - 183 (Roll no. 357).

Resolved, That the House of Representatives--

(1) supports efforts to identify, track, and pursue suspected foreign terrorists and their financial supporters by tracking terrorist money flows and uncovering terrorist networks here and abroad, including through the use of the Terrorist Finance Tracking Program;

(2) finds that the Terrorist Finance Tracking Program has been conducted in accordance with all applicable laws, regulations, and Executive Orders, that appropriate safeguards and reviews have been instituted to protect individual civil liberties, and that Congress has been appropriately informed and consulted for the duration of the Program and will continue its oversight of the Program;

(3) condemns the unauthorized disclosure of classified information by those persons responsible and expresses concern that the disclosure may endanger the lives of American citizens, including members of the Armed Forces, as well as individuals and organizations that support United States efforts; and

(4) expects the cooperation of all news media organizations in protecting the lives of Americans and the capability of the government to identify, disrupt, and capture terrorists by not disclosing classified intelligence programs such as the Terrorist Finance Tracking Program.



I don't know what happens to this res. now, but I don't expect them to just forget about it.

Sad state of affairs isn't it.

k and r
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marmar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-10-06 08:34 AM
Response to Reply #2
5. "Sad state of affairs isn't it."
Yes it is. I thought I'd never see the day.... :cry:
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Mnemosyne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-10-06 09:56 AM
Response to Reply #5
6. Me either marmar,
me either. :cry: :hug:
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midnight Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-10-06 12:11 AM
Response to Original message
3. This idea that a law to preserve humanity is considered
quaint seems obscene to me.
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mom cat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-10-06 05:08 AM
Response to Original message
4. Imperialist fascist all think alike!
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sweetheart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-10-06 10:02 AM
Response to Reply #4
7. There are no rules in war
really. The winner makes the rules. The Corporatist-west believes it is the winner,
and has won and unconditional surrender of all of humanity to its machinations.

And it has no rules over what civil structures it will undermine to squeeze a profit,
then the gloves are off, the civil consensus is undone.
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