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bonito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 08:28 PM
Original message
Fair tax and privatizing social security
For the new North American union? can't help but putting these things together kinda connects the dots.
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sutz12 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 08:32 PM
Response to Original message
1. Not sure what you mean by "fair tax"
But privatizing SS is a non starter. It is still the most successful social program in history (American, if not world). Most Americans don't want to privatize SS. They don't want to be forced into playing the market against the big boys while their retirements are riding on the outcome.
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magellan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 08:34 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. You can bet if the Repugs are behind it it'll be anything but fair (nt)
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bonito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 08:37 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. Elimination of income tax, paying higher sales tax n/t
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bleedingheart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 08:41 PM
Response to Reply #3
6. and you create a black market for goods
make the sales tax 30%...and you will see people go without...or buy it under the table...

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DefenseLawyer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 08:40 PM
Response to Reply #1
5. The "Fair Tax"
is the name that a group of wingnuts have given to their national sales tax scheme.
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bleedingheart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 08:40 PM
Response to Original message
4. I will tell you some reasons why privatizing Social Security is a bad idea
1. Investing in the Market...IS and HAS ALWAYS been a risk. People should invest, and have other savings but to invest all their money in the market is a stupid idea....especially monies they will need to live on in retirement.

2. People who invest poorly in the market will still need to be taken care of and so we will still have to take care of them....and therefore we will end up double screwed...

3. People don't save now...what makes you think that privatization will be a panacea when in reality, most people either don't make enough to save anything or they are foolishly squandering what they do have...

Social Security is a social contract to make sure that people will be taken care of to at least a minimal degree....destroy it and you will see what it was like before it was enacted.

If anything I think that Pensions were the big fluke...here most pensions (invested in that famous "market"...) have not made money and have been tapped by corporations or not funded....

I think Unions should avoid Pensions and talk about savings in addition to Social Security....even if it is just a lowly CD...
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bonito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 08:56 PM
Response to Reply #4
7. I agree but my point is
both of these things would enable for a smoother transition to a union, not having to centralize a income tax or a social security tax. Not a progressive step at all for the general public, but it smells like the plan to me.
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jdlh8894 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 09:16 PM
Response to Reply #4
8. Who says
The money needs to go in the market? What's wrong with Munis,Bonds(US),Annuities,etc?
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bleedingheart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 09:28 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. Bonds, Municipal Bonds and Annuities are all risky
people lose mone on those all the time.

I had an aunt that lost $17,000 on a "sure" annuity...
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