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I'll admit it....Call me a sap, but I feel sorry for Mark Foley.

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Armstead Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 02:14 PM
Original message
I'll admit it....Call me a sap, but I feel sorry for Mark Foley.
Edited on Mon Oct-09-06 02:15 PM by Armstead
Don't get me wrong. I'm not defending him. His behavior was disgusting. And I detest his hypocracy as one of the leaders of the Bible Thumping Moralists who are attacking everyone else for what they themselves are doing in secret.

And good riddance that he's gone. And I've engaged in my share of schanfreude over it.

However, I have to admit that I feel sorry for him, on a pure gut level of human sympathy.

He obviously has some deep psychological problems. It's beyond kinky to be engaged in the dangerous game he was playing. If he were simply a pervert or excessively horny, he would not have been tempting fate for so long by alternating such sordid behavior while putting himself out from as a leader in the Virtue Brogade. He could have satisfied his hormones in more conventional ways with adults.

Whenever I saw him, I always had a feeling that something was "off" about him. Unlike most other pugs like him, he seemed more sad and pathetic than hateful.

Now that the truth about him has been revealed, I think he got caught in some confused personal Hades in which he could no longer seperate the difference between affection and deeper darker perversion. Watching clips of him being so emotional addressing the pages that he simultaneously wanted to diddle, seems to me to be a sign that he was struggling with some powerful personal demons.

Now his life is ruined to a degree that most people can't imagine. He's not only disgraced in a way that selfish people like Newt have overcome. He has been totally ruined on a national level -- and his personal ruin has seriously damaged his friends and former allies. He will never, ever be able to change that.

What happened to him was not in the same ballpark as someone like Delay getting caught gaming the system for power and greed.

Call me a sap if you want. Part of it's just my nature. Sometimes my sense of human symnpathy clouds my judgement. I also feel bad when I catch a mouse in a mousetrap. Maybe I really am one of those bleeding-heart liberals that conservatives like to make fun of. O8)

Again, I'm not defending the guy or his behavior. But I do think too many people have a tendency to wag too many fingers, while forgetting such adages as "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone."









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Javaman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 02:15 PM
Response to Original message
1. You're a better person than me...
He could rot in a hell for I care.
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SammyWinstonJack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 02:16 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. I agree.
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Kahuna Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 02:17 PM
Response to Original message
3. You're a sap.
}(
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Armstead Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 02:18 PM
Response to Reply #3
6. I admitted that
Sappy like a maple tree in spring, I guess.

Even my mother tells me I'm too nice sometimes.

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Aristus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 02:17 PM
Response to Original message
4. Well, you're soft on pedophilia and all the other perverted things
that threaten our kids...and...wait!...Foley is a Republican?...well, then he need our prayers and sympathy and support during this difficult time. He's obviously been influenced by them dang Democrats. :sarcasm:
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Armstead Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 02:20 PM
Response to Reply #4
9. I'm not saying he should get away with it.
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Catherine Vincent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 02:18 PM
Response to Original message
5. Same here.
I feel sorry for him with all the media attention. Just like with that Condit guy.
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ThomCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 02:19 PM
Response to Original message
7. Me too. But I often feel bad for people who make bad choices
and have to live with them.

If he had not chosen to stay in the closet he might have developed some healthy attachments to men his own damned age and none of this would have happened.


However, dispute any sympathy I might feel, he is a predatory bastard and still needs to be kept away from kids. He is still responsible for what he has become.
x(
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Little Star Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 02:20 PM
Response to Original message
8. Don't waste your sympathy with the predator....
Use it on the victims who were stalked by him. He is a selfish bastard!
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Armstead Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 02:21 PM
Response to Reply #8
12. I'm not wasting anything...Sympathy is not a limited resource
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MuseRider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 02:40 PM
Response to Reply #12
23. Thank you for stating that.
I feel exactly the same way you do.
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BlooInBloo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 02:56 PM
Response to Reply #12
30. No, but *time* is - and time you spend sympathizing for Foley...
is time spent not sympathizing for someone who more deserves sympathy.
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maxsolomon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 02:21 PM
Response to Original message
10. that's normal
i feel sorry for John Walker Lindh.

www.freejohnwalker.net
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Irreverend IX Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 02:21 PM
Response to Original message
11. I hope he sucks on a Glock, myself. nt
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beyurslf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 02:21 PM
Response to Original message
13. I don't feel sorry for any gay republicans. Ever. Period. They deserve
anything that happens. I actually hate them more than I hate other republicans.
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cynatnite Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 02:22 PM
Response to Original message
14. hmm...do I feel sorry for him?....nope, I don't. n/t
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flpoljunkie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 02:22 PM
Response to Original message
15. Read Carl Hiassen's column in Miami Herald, and you won't.
http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/news/columnists/ca...

Posted on Sun, Oct. 08, 2006

Foley contrite, but only after he got caught

CARL HIAASEN

<>Now unmasked and disgraced, Foley has rabbited off to rehab, where he is said to be remorseful, shattered, etc. Meanwhile, his lawyer spins a woeful tale of an unnamed clergyman who supposedly abused Foley in his youth.

Whatever. It's not as if the West Palm Beach Republican voluntarily marched forward and confessed to making lewd passes at high school boys. He got contrite only after he got caught.

Even if Foley really has an alcohol problem, which would be news to many of his friends, it doesn't alter the unforgivable fact that he used his position as a congressman to troll for teenaged sex partners.

A congressman who bragged about his high marks from the Christian Coalition and American Conservative Union, a congressman who co-chaired the caucus on missing and exploited children, railing against Internet pedophiles . . .

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acmavm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 02:23 PM
Response to Original message
16. I don't have pity for predators.
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libnnc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 02:23 PM
Response to Original message
17. I don't. There are plenty of "hunky" young LEGAL guys in DC
All he had to do was troll the college bars in the city.

I'm sure Georgetown U. has a Rugby team.
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enuffs_enuffs Donating Member (201 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 02:23 PM
Response to Original message
18. I would feel sorry for them IF...
They had actually cleared the air about this years ago. If and only if they had done the right thing INITIALLY, YEARS AGO.

All the current bullshit is containing the flood, which has been gathering for YEARS. Period.

And yes, Hastert and all others who had knowledge should resign POST HASTE!

If your going to be a hypocrit... get used to the PROBABLE hell storm.
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Ex Lion Tamer Donating Member (445 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 02:23 PM
Response to Original message
19. My thoughts:
Edited on Mon Oct-09-06 02:28 PM by Ex Lion Tamer
I'm glad he and his hypocrisy are gone.

Having said that, I can also sympathize with his anguish right now. He's obviously a sex addict, and he hit bottom in a spectacularly public way.

As a recovering addict myself (many different substances and behaviors), I can remember as if it were yesterday (and it was a long time ago) how horrible it was to face the fact of my addiction and the devastation I had created. I was suicidal; I'm sure he has also contemplated that.

The good news for Mr. Foley is that he can--IF HE CHOOSES TO DO SO--work a recovery program that will give him his life back. And it probably won't be the hypocritical, holier-than-thou life he used to have, either--but one of compassion and empathy.

At least, that is my prayer for him. We all benefit if that happens.

I heard a good piece about this on NPR last week. Here's the link: http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=62...

On edit: And everything everybody else has said about him facing consequences, etc. is also true. There are no "get out of jail free" cards just because of an addiction. Consequences are a necessary part.
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Botany Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 02:28 PM
Response to Original message
20. The man was a predator
and he supported the Defense of marriage act too.

But Armstead ...... "I disagree w/ what you say but I will defend to your death
your right to say it." Cheers!

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Hav Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 02:30 PM
Response to Original message
21. .
Hey thx Armstead, so I'm not alone ;).
He himself is responsible for that, still his live will never be the same again. Everytime he looks into the face of any relative, he knows that they see him differently, now and that they judge him. That must be the worst penealty.

When there was his emotional cspan speech, I mentioned that he isn't pure evil. He's sick but still human. He seems to be someone who still tried to belong to the youth, I think that's why he talked like them. Maybe someone who tried to make up for the lost opportunities of his own youth and childhood. I also think he had a real interest in protecting children.
He is an unnormal person that definately needs medical help, but a tragic one.

But I'm sure that he belonged to those Repubs whose vote record shows a strong bias against gays and whenever I think about that, there is a little bit less sympathy.
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lumberjack_jeff Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 02:35 PM
Response to Original message
22. You feel sorry for him because you're a conscientious person...
... and it's the reason you're a democrat.

Now, I mean this with the utmost humanity, compassion and understanding, it's also why, sadly, you need your ass kicked.
:hide:

I'm sure as hell not sinless, but I'm gonna cast stones till I'm blue in the face. He's one of the fuckers who fucked up my country. He deserves to be stomped, ridiculed and his perversion smeared as far and wide upon his colleagues as possible. I want every Republican painted with the Mark Foley brush. I want the GOP to be forever known as the Groddy Old Pedophiles.

I don't care what mechanism is used to return the reins of power to those with the skill and conscience to use it for the benefit of the people, I just know it needs to happen.
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salin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 02:42 PM
Response to Original message
24. okay, 'you're a sap'
:D
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stepnw1f Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 02:43 PM
Response to Original message
25. Your a sap (nt)
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endarkenment Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 02:43 PM
Response to Original message
26. I've got two teen aged sons: not much sympathy in this corner.
They interact with adults all the time and I want to trust that those relationships are honest and aboveboard. Foley is a creep of worst sort. His actions create fear uncertainty and doubt about all sorts of programs, not just the HR page program.
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B Calm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 02:46 PM
Response to Original message
27. Speaking as a grandfather, no sympathy here for the bastard, or
for Hastert for covering it up and letting it go on for 11 years!
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skypilot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 02:48 PM
Response to Original message
28. I don't exactly feel bad for him but...
...I do kinda get embarrassed for him when I read those text messages. I've never been able to read an entire one of them that's been posted. I just cringe at the adolescent quality of them. It's just incredibly pathetic that a man his age would adopt such a horny adolescent "voice". But having said that, good riddance.
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driver8 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 02:50 PM
Response to Original message
29. Nope...no sympathy here. You reap what you sow...
He is a hypocrite who used his power to prey on young men.

Fuck him.

He got off easy, as far as I'm concerned.
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Ino Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 02:56 PM
Response to Original message
31. The fact he resigned immediately shows he has SOME sense of shame,
but I have no sympathy for him whatsoever. It's not as if he "fell in love" with one particular boy and just couldn't help himself. He was grooming many boys for many years, lying in wait for them to turn 18. He's a gay Repug, denying other gays basic rights. He was on the committee for exploited children while he was exploiting them. It's beyond hypocrisy. He's a predator. He's scum. Everyone who protected him is scum.
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otohara Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 03:02 PM
Response to Original message
32. I Feel Bad About The Gay Bashing
Edited on Mon Oct-09-06 03:03 PM by otohara
that's going on because of this.

I don't feel bad for repressed republican's who choose to deny & suppress who they are just to stay in a party who rejects their lifestyle. Their hypocrisy astounds me.

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