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leftofthedial Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 11:24 AM
Original message
The bad news behind the polls.
More and more people are disaffected with the repukes. They are tired of the lies, the incompetence, the corruption and the decline in America's fortunes across the board.

BUT

they are not enthusiastic about the Democrats, who have failed to effectively communicate a compelling alternative.

The collapse of rpeuke support is good news, but the news of declining voter registration and the number of people who plan to vote Democratic not because they are passionate about the Democratic agenda, but rather because they are sick of the criminal repukes is NOT.

These are the seeds of even greater apathy in the electorate. In the long run, apathy favors the repukes and is the enemy of progressives.
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trumad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 11:25 AM
Response to Original message
1. Not this time
War will get us up our asses.
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jobycom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 11:29 AM
Response to Original message
2. The apathy is more from the Republican voters than the Dem voters
Those who have been furious at the Repubs aren't any less furious. Those who have been voting Republican aren't as excited about doing so now. Some may vote Dem, many will stay home. Both help us. The Dems may not be exciting the masses, and I agree that's their failing, but they also aren't angering them. They aren't doing anything to make their angry voters from the last two elections stay home. Given how close many elections were, that bodes well for us.
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leftofthedial Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 11:37 AM
Response to Reply #2
6. fury is a limited agenda
the polls bode well for the short-term, but we still have not energized the American people behind a positive plan for the future.

The Democrats may have a good plan (personally, I think they have a laundry list of vaguely progressive but still mainly corporate-driven concepts). But that message is not what people are excited about. It's all focused on how awful, degenerate, crooked, untrustworthy and ineffective the repukes are. That may work for this election. I hope it's enough to overcome the ruling junta's death grip on power and the Dieboldification of the electoral process. I think we need to be leading polls by an overwhelming margin in order to beat the cheat machines.
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jobycom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 11:42 AM
Response to Reply #6
10. I agree, but the polls are only talking about this election
so that's all I was commenting on.
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mazzarro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 11:30 AM
Response to Original message
3. Dems have to wake up somehow.
The lackluster affection for the Democratic party is probably an opportunity for true liberals/progressives to take the initiative, redouble the effort to wrest back control of the party from the blowhard DLC that has sos emasculated the party leadership and its response to the repuglicon party. The Democratic party's muffled message and fear of b*shCo need to be fully addressed after the election - IMHO.
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leftofthedial Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 11:39 AM
Response to Reply #3
8. I agree. The Democratic party needs a makeover.
BUT, if the party "wins" in November, that will entrench the current pro-corporate repuke-lite "leadership," won't it?
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Jane Austin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 11:50 AM
Response to Reply #8
12. Will a Dem win in Nov further entrench corporatist Dems?
That part is up to us.

WE are the party. WE have to hold these people's feet to the fire more often than just the four months before an election.

WE have to support progressives in our town, county and state legislatures, with money, bumperstickers and letters to the editor.

The worst of those corporatist Dems are from red states, Joe Lieberman being a notable exception. There's not much a Dem from Massachusetts can do about who Louisiana or Nebraska elects to the Senate.

Supporting Howard Dean's 50-state strategy can help, but the people of LA, NE, and FL choose their own Senators.

Thinking about this problem as being solvable from the top down (How do we change the behavior of alread-elected Dem Senators?) is frustrating because the only lasting progress we can make is from the precinct level up.
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leftofthedial Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 12:34 PM
Response to Reply #12
13. If a corporatist wins in November
our job of remaking the party gets harder.
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Hugin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 11:31 AM
Response to Original message
4. The only reason the Democrats may have failed to communicate...
Is because the other guys were hogging the megaphone.
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leftofthedial Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 11:42 AM
Response to Reply #4
9. that's been a major issue
but the Democrats do occasionally get coverage and they still do not come across as having a clear message on any issue.
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Caution Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 11:31 AM
Response to Original message
5. that's fine
democratic voters will come out enthusiastically while republican voters stay home. independents certainly wont be voting republican in the same way they had been in the last few elections. It doesnt matter if people are excited about the democrats as long as the simply dont vote for the republicans.
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leftofthedial Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 11:47 AM
Response to Reply #5
11. that's great!
until November 8.

We need to destroy the repukes. Bury them. Eliminate them from the political future of America. They are insane, degenerate criminals who hate this country, its Constitution and its people. They have hurled us to within an inch of disasters from which we will never recover. We may never recover as it is.

I am not confident of the outcome in November. I think the Democrats will win just enough to allow the repukes to share the blame for their disastrous rule come 2008. They'll wriggle off the hook and continue to inflict their sick agenda on us.

Unless a leader emerges who truly unites the country behind a positive, forward-looking agenda, we will face growing apathy and continuing chaotic political inaction for the future. That is the objective of the anti-progressive corporate oligarchical owners of this country. They will win.
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gully Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 11:38 AM
Response to Original message
7. I've not seen evidence that they are not enthusiastic about Dems?
Where are you getting this info? From what polls?
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DaveJ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 12:49 PM
Response to Original message
14. There is a Simple Reason...
Edited on Sun Oct-08-06 12:49 PM by djohnson
...and a Simple Solution:

Neocons have been successfull due to their blind and ignorant enthusiasm. They have had a simple message -- eliminate the Democratic party.

But Democrats have been more docile, only wanting to win by a few votes. I am not docile though; I think the Republican party needs to go entirely. They are a danger to the world and civilization. That message needs to be communicated. It may sound nuts to some but it is indeed the best answer. Unfortunately, that message has backfired in the past when we opened ourselves to third party competitors. I think third parties will continue to backfire on us until the Republican party is so low in popularity not to matter.
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Lexingtonian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 03:28 PM
Response to Original message
15. no, that's normal pattern

We don't want temporary converts, for one thing. The Reagan Democrats are a good example.

The usual pattern during true changes of partisan majorities is that a big bloc walks away from their Party and doesn't vote for an election and/or votes Third Party. The next election, they're fairly committed voters for the other party and start changing registration.

That's what the Dixiecrats did- voted LBJ in 1964, stayed home in November 1966, voted for Nixon in 1968, were unabashed Republicans by 1970 or 1972.

That's what happened with the remaining FDR Democrats; they split between Bush Sr and Dukakis, voted Perot in 1992, stayed home in 1994, and were/are safe Republican votes from then until now. They were old folks even in 1990 and are near dying out now.

Right now the flaky bloc in the Republican coalition is the so-called Moderate Republicans. They voted Bush and Republican in 2004, it seems they're going to stay home this November and let Democrats carry the day. (Bush and Rove are trying to make up for them by maximizing turnout of hardliners, i.e. Christian Right- and the Foley affair has badly torpedoed that effort.)

What the Moderate Republicans do in 2008 seems fairly wide open; the Bush people will probably fully disqualify the hardline GOP that remains after this election from governance in their eyes and that of Independents. I think we have realignment a la 1966/68 here in 06/08.
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