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liberal N proud Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-09-06 08:12 AM
Original message
9/11 conspiracy theorists multiply
Many Americans suspect U.S. government involvement or complicity


It was a year before David Ray Griffin, an eminent liberal theologian and philosopher, began his stroll down the path of disbelief. He wondered why Bush listened to a child's story while the nation was attacked and how Osama bin Laden, America's Public Enemy No. 1, escaped in the mountains of Tora Bora.He wondered why 110-story towers crashed and military jets failed to intercept even one airliner. He read the 9/11 Commission report with a swell of anger. Contradictions were ignored and no military or civilian official was reprimanded, much less cashiered.

"To me, the report read as a cartoon." White-haired and courtly, Griffin sits on a couch in a hotel lobby in Manhattan, unspooling words in that reasonable Presbyterian minister's voice. "It's a much greater stretch to accept the official conspiracy story than to consider the alternatives."



A recent Scripps Howard/Ohio University poll of 1,010 Americans found that 36 percent suspect the U.S. government promoted the attacks or intentionally sat on its hands. Sixteen percent believe explosives brought down the towers. Twelve percent believe a cruise missile hit the Pentagon.



http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14723997 /

Scripps Howard poll: http://newspolls.org/story.php?story_id=55

Vote in MSNBC Poll: Do you believe any 9/11 conspiracy theories? http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14727720 /

Yes. The government has left many questions unanswered about that day.
55%

No. These theories are absurd and disrespectful -- especially to those who lost their lives on 9/11.
39%

I'm not sure.
6%



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gademocrat7 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-09-06 08:19 AM
Response to Original message
1. Done
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Wretched Refuse Donating Member (105 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-09-06 08:53 AM
Response to Reply #1
10. The long and winding Path to 9/11
Well, could not we go further back in our time machine and ask:
What the hell did George Bush I do to stop Osama? I mean why not do that? He had the whole middle east in his grubby little hands back in 1991, so why not take Osama out right then either?

Now HERE is a concept for y'all,

It has struck me that this "non-issue" (really if you think about all the treason this admin is doing, this is a non-issue) is REALLY the DLC re-asserting itself as the controller of ALL things Democrat.
I mean it is all a Clinton (+administration) face saving thing that now supposedly ALL good Dems come to the aid of their "fearless leader." Well, it really is sapping our "momentum" on other more important issues, and the corporate controlled DLC KNOWS THAT.

So, I have stayed outside the blogosphere on this one, except for the few phone calls to ABC radio to gnash my teeth on the air, with the likes of Levin (the Zionist) and the new idiot (Jerry) last night taking over Laura Ingram's 8-10 slot in the NY ABC market.

Screw Disney and ABC, they were the next to fall to the nazis after Fox anyway, everyone knew that. I believe that ABC is also stirring the pot to get all good Dems back into the DLC fold, as Hilary was starting to get REALLY antsy at the calls to debate Tasini and with Lamont, and the Screw the DLC push happening as of late, I feel this is the motive for the over-hype of this non-issue.

This all just another Corporate-control of our sense of "what is important."
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snappyturtle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-09-06 08:22 AM
Response to Original message
2. Done. nt
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Joanne98 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-09-06 08:26 AM
Response to Original message
3. Loose Change Two number 10 on google's most popular videos
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berni_mccoy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-09-06 08:29 AM
Response to Reply #3
4. #10!!! Holy Cow!
:woohoo:
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porphyrian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-09-06 08:31 AM
Response to Original message
5. It's just not that crazy to believe, once you understand them.
And the truth is slowly bleeding out.
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GreenPartyVoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-09-06 08:31 AM
Response to Original message
6. Done
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keepCAblue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-09-06 08:33 AM
Response to Original message
7. The word is spreading...with help from yesterday's METRO front page
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NYC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-09-06 08:55 AM
Response to Reply #7
11. Recommendation #5.
:)
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keepCAblue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-09-06 06:17 PM
Response to Reply #11
24. Thanks!!!! n/t
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neoblues Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-09-06 08:48 AM
Response to Original message
8. Secret investigation; opposition to independent investigation...
and either keeping all the evidence hidden or allowing (or arranging) for it to be destroyed... All by itself, this is enough to justify suspicion and suggest the Bush Administration is hiding something.
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Hailtothechimp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-09-06 08:49 AM
Response to Original message
9. This was the spark they needed to go into Iraq.
And they'll use in again in Iran before too long. Without 9/11, they would have been stymied in their warmaking. THAT's why they (Bush's people, not al Qaeda) planned and carried it out.
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Cessna Invesco Palin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-09-06 08:57 AM
Response to Original message
12. I thought you meant "multiply" in the sense of having children.
And that would be impossible, as it'd require them to leave the computer and their mothers' basements for a while.
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Junkdrawer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-09-06 09:01 AM
Response to Reply #12
13. What took you so long?
You're slipping....
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Cessna Invesco Palin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-09-06 09:04 AM
Response to Reply #13
14. Sorry.
Occasionally I have a life outside of DU.
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il_lilac Donating Member (756 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-09-06 09:07 AM
Response to Original message
15. done
here's hoping the truth comes out in my lifetime.
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mirrera Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-09-06 09:24 AM
Response to Original message
16. Get the Left Wing defending the 9/11 report: Mission Accomplished
They are trying to bring the people back in the fold of THEIR conspiracy theory. The untruths keep popping up and the Oligarchs play wack a mole.

Reading list:
Overthrow
All the Shah's Men
Crossing the Rubicon
Exception to the Rulers
Armed Madhouse
Best Democracy Money can Buy
Vote Scam
(9/11 Synthetic Terror: still reading)





http://NoBullshiRt.com

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Joanne98 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-09-06 09:43 AM
Response to Reply #16
18. Exactly. Beat those strawmen to death.
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JohnyCanuck Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-09-06 09:42 AM
Response to Original message
17. A Grieving Mother Wonders What Really Happened on 9/11

A Grieving Mother Wonders What Really Happened on 9/11

by Marion Kminek, mother of Mari-Rae Sopper, who was killed on American Airlines Flight 77 on September 11, 2001.

On September 11, 2001, our daughter had her life cut short at the age of 35. After practicing law in the Navy JAG Corps and then with a corporate law firm in Washington, D.C., she accepted her dream job to become the head womens gymnastics coach at UCSB. Her condo was up for sale, the movers had picked up her furniture, her car had been shipped, and then she boarded American Airlines Flight 77 to begin her new life.

As we approach the fifth anniversary of her death, more and more unanswered questions have surfaced regarding the events of 9/11. Here are just a few of the questions that bother me most:
When President Bush learned of the second plane hitting the South Tower, he seemed puzzled, but not particularly upset or surprised. He continued reading to the children. The Secret Service is trained to act quickly and decisively to protect the president  why did they let him remain in a public place for more than seven minutes when our country was under attack?

According to radar data, American Airlines (AA) 77 was flying at 400 mph at 9:35 a.m. and passed over the Pentagon at 7,000 feet. The plane then made a very difficult high-speed descending turn in a downward spiral, dropping 7,000 feet in two-and-a-half minutes. How could the terrorists have done this difficult turn when their flight instructors have stated they were incompetent as pilots of even a small plane?

SNIP

Just prior to 9/11, there was unusual stock activity related to short-selling and put options, which are both high-risk bets that a stocks value will depreciate. Early in September 2001, there was a 40 percent increase in short-selling of American and United Airlines stock on the New York Stock Exchange. On September 10, trading ratios on United Airlines were 25 times greater than normal on the Pacific Exchange. The firm used to buy many of the put options on United Airlines stock between September 6 and 10 was headed until 1998 by A.B. Buzzy Krongard, who was the CIA executive director on 9/11. During the same period of time, the Chicago Board Options Exchange saw suspicious trading on Merrill Lynch and Morgan Stanley, two of the largest World Trade Center (WTC) tenants. Who were these investors and how did they know to make these particular investments?

http://www.independent.com/opinion/2006/09/unanswered_q...
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liberal N proud Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-09-06 09:51 AM
Response to Reply #17
19. I have asked this question for the last 6 years
"why did they let him remain in a public place for more than seven minutes when our country was under attack?"

Under those circumstances with any other president, the SS would have literally picked up the President and hauled him to a secure location. Yet people are stupid and don't question why he continued to read. He knew!
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blue cat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-09-06 10:14 AM
Response to Reply #19
20. I am a RN
and my ass would have been fired and sued if I sat for 7 minutes during an emergency, because my patient could be dead in that time.
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liberal N proud Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-09-06 10:28 AM
Response to Reply #20
21. With the President it is more than having him available to deal with
the emergency.
The reason the Secret Service would have rushed him to a secure place would be to protect the President from any harm. They had to know that he was safe or they would have picked him up and hauled him out of that room without telling him why and with no regard to what the kids thought about it. That is the Secret Services job.
They didn't bother moving him during the attacks, WHY? The only explanation my mind can come up with is, "He Knew/They Knew"
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Arugula Latte Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-09-06 11:03 AM
Response to Original message
22. What gets me is: Why did WTC #7 collapse?
I never heard a good explanation for that one.
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misanthrope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-09-06 11:11 AM
Response to Original message
23. Occam's razor...
...The most realistic answer to both the questions posed above is "incompetence."

As Joan Walsh said, "They can't get the lights on in Baghdad. They can't rebuild New Orleans. But you want to believe they pulled this off?"
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JohnyCanuck Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-09-06 06:31 PM
Response to Reply #23
26. And you want to believe
they want the lights back on in Baghdad and to rebuild New Orleans.
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mhatrw Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-10-06 08:42 PM
Response to Reply #23
28. Careful with that razor, Eugene.
It slices both ways.
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chat_noir Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-09-06 06:18 PM
Response to Original message
25. MSNBC
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Taxloss Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-09-06 06:41 PM
Response to Original message
27. There you have it, straight from David Ray Griffin, the #1 MIHOP lie.
Edited on Sat Sep-09-06 06:42 PM by Taxloss
As I wrote elsewhere:

The thing that you have to keep repeating to people - and yourself - is that these conspiracy theories are most often defended using a false dichotomy: "You either believe the conspiracy theory, or you believe the official story. The official story is flawed, so the conspiracy theory must be the case." That will always be the first line of defence, and casual sceptics don't often get past it.

Note how the MIHOP crowd calls its opponents "OCTers" - believers in the "Official Conspiracy Theory". It's one vast strawman, and at least three-quarters of them know that it is, but they repeat it in the knowledge that they are lying because it deters sceptics from tackling them. No one wants to be associated with the political whitewash that is the official version.


And there it is: "It's a much greater stretch to accept the official conspiracy story than to consider the alternatives."

Balls.

Believing that MIHOP is rubbish does not mean you believe the official version. But MIHOPers just continue to recycle that lazy, dishonest myth. :eyes:

On edit: Even the bloody MSNBC poll recycles it! :eyes: :eyes: :eyes:
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AntiFascist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-10-06 09:06 PM
Response to Reply #27
29. and as I posted in thread that got sent to the dungeon.....

there is one thing we can all agree on: 9/11 was not an accident and there was a conspiracy behind it. One theory that does add up: who was aiding and ultimately funding the terrorists?

Taxloss: Well, the whole operation cost about $200,000, so it was spectacularly economical.

Antifascist: Certainly well worth the investment for Buzzy Krongard and his firm:

http://www.fromthewilderness.com/free/ww3/10_09_01_kron...



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Taxloss Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-11-06 06:06 PM
Response to Reply #29
31. Not such a brilliant investment if you consider the other part of the
Edited on Mon Sep-11-06 06:08 PM by Taxloss
devilish 6 September trade - the purchase of more than 100,000 shares in American Airlines on the same day. A somewhat stupid move if he knew what was about to happen.

So - the operation required little outlay, and thus does not need wealthy backers*, and the "insider trading" based on it involved huge losses. Not exactly Ponzi material.

* I daresay al-Qaeda has wealthy backers, but not the ones you imagine.

On edit: as I remember, didn't a 9 September financial tip sheet put AA as a "buy"? I'm sure their editorial staff were in on it ...
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AntiFascist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-11-06 06:27 PM
Response to Reply #31
32. I believe it is a fact that wealthy Saudis have backed...
al Qaeda at various times, including after the point at which they began attacking American targets. Recall that bin Ladin has historically been on the side of the anti-communists.

The purchase of 100,000 shares of AA could be nothing more than covering the purchase of the PUT options, in case something went wrong and 9/11 didn't go through as planned, suddenly the stock might rise causing the options to lose a lot of value. Also, after the stock took a nosedive, profit taking occured on the options, then the stock would eventually recover allowing the shares to recover some of their value.
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Coloradan4Truth Donating Member (360 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-10-06 09:11 PM
Response to Original message
30. Done and a kick! n/t
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