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Singular73 Donating Member (999 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 01:42 AM
Original message
On the ABC Movie: What do you fear?
I really don't get it.

As if the issue was 9/11. Long ago, the American public made it clear they blamed noone for 9/11, as a whole. We had video of Condi saying "Bin Laden determined to attack", etc.., and it had no impact.

For Christ's sake, an entire movie came out on how horrible a president Bush was (not to mention blaming him for 9/11), and it had little impact.

Whats this movie going to do?

Nothing. It may mobilize the radical right, but hell, they're mobilized anyways.

They tried to sell fear, they tried to sell terror, and it hasn't worked. Certainly, neither will this. The best move is to let it go away. Giving it this much attention gives it credibility, and gives the MSM something to talk about.

Do what the Rethuglicans did with F9/11. Ignore it. Don't make it an issue.

Hell, I don't even know anyone that watches ABC/NBC/CBS except for sports.

Chill.
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renate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 01:46 AM
Response to Original message
1. for me, it's more the fact that ABC and Scholastic are pushing it
The movie itself would probably just rate a "meh, whatever," but ABC is showing it FOR FREE! Scholastic is disseminating these "educational materials" FOR FREE!

What is going on behind the scenes? And since ABC has a news division and is a major network, WTF? Why are they going out of their way to promote a fictional, anti-Clinton (and apparently pro-Bush) movie FOR FREE?

ABC's agenda is what I fear.
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greyl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 01:48 AM
Response to Reply #1
4. You have a link to any of Scholastic's materials? nt
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LiviaOlivia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 01:50 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. Read this Kos diary
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greyl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 01:59 AM
Response to Reply #5
13. Thanks, there's a very good MediaMatters link there with pdfs.
Thanks for your help. I think I may be beginning to understand the outrage.

The "Student Resource Sheet" also seems to link the war in Iraq to the 9/11 terrorist attacks: "Following the terrorist attacks on September 11, the United States began a global "War on Terror" to stop terrorist groups and state-sponsored terrorism. President Bush has led the United States into Afghanistan and Iraq and reorganized the national government in an attempt to combat terrorist activity."

http://mediamatters.org/items/200609060005


The Scholastic pdfs:


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clmbohdem Donating Member (296 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 01:54 AM
Response to Reply #4
8. It has been removed from their web site.
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greyl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 02:02 AM
Response to Reply #8
15. See post #13 ;) nt
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clmbohdem Donating Member (296 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 01:52 AM
Response to Reply #1
7. You got it correct, propoganda to kids is WAY over the line.
Oliver Stone type movies are okay for entertainment, but NOT for educational material. Someone is either trying to recruit kids for the Republican Party or perculate the propaganda up to their parents.
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Cobalt-60 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 02:18 AM
Response to Reply #1
22. Agreed, it's the thought that counts
I'm done with ABC and Disney.
It's like they've become Pod Companies.
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MessiahRp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 06:55 AM
Response to Reply #1
34. 100% Correct
I am extremely disturbed they are sending this to kids to brainwash them into a new generation of Neo Cons who will see the war mongers as some sort of heroic icons of American History.

I wrote Scholastic a letter about this: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

We need to target ABC, Scholastic and the media and get this thing stopped.

Rp
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greyl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 01:47 AM
Response to Original message
2. I fear the hysteria and mob mentality that's going on
Edited on Thu Sep-07-06 02:12 AM by greyl
with people who haven't even seen the show.

I'd love to see the same energy focused on any of a thousand things that are more important.
Like switching to fluorescent light bulbs!

edit: Please see post #13 before yelling at me.
Oh, and switch to fluorescent light bulbs.
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tuvor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 01:48 AM
Response to Original message
3. What the hell are you smoking?
"Do what the Rethuglicans did with F9/11. Ignore it. Don't make it an issue."

And can I have some? :rofl:
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Robbien Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 01:50 AM
Response to Original message
6. I do not like a network openly pushing propaganda
No advertisor is paying for it.
No one left of the far right has had any imput.
ABC calls it a impartial documentary drama.
Network TV routinely declines to air liberal/left advertisements.
Network TV routinely declines to air movies which rile the right.


Plus I strongly suspect the money behind this movie comes from taxpayer pockets. Someone is paying for it and BushCo routinely pays people to air propaganda which favors right wingers.
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Singular73 Donating Member (999 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 01:55 AM
Response to Reply #6
9. But it just doesn't matter.
Yes, yes, I know, the *Voter* is supposed to make this tenuous connection that Bill Clinton, aka All Democrats can't fight Terra, therefore vote Republican, etc.., or we all die, etc.., burning flames, commie pinko, appeaser, etc...

BUT IT ISN'T WORKING.

And it won't work.

For Gods sakes, they apprehended 21, wait 20, no actually 15, err 11? people that were going to blow up planes a month ago, and its completely forgotten about.

You think this is going to make a difference?

You don't understand the lack of attention span of the American voter.

All they know, is that the economy sucks for them, and that Iraq has been monopolizing the news for the last 4 years.

Again, For Gods Sakes, 50% of Americans believe Iraq had something to do with 9/11, and they STILL think invading was a mistake. That shows me a lot.
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Robbien Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 02:07 AM
Response to Reply #9
21. Who paid for this film? Did you and I pay for this? Yes it matters.
ABC does nothing without looking for dollar signs. They are collecting nothing from advertisors. Was ABC contracted by the WH to produce and air this film with the cost being picked up by the taxpayers?

I believe so because ABC quickly retreats from running anything controversial. They also quickly dropped many Democratic ads because of right wing complaints.

But this time they are refusing to even consider their viewers. Is it because this time the viewers are not rightwingers or is it because they are being told to air the film?
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LynneSin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 06:47 AM
Response to Reply #9
30. Are you smoking CRACK
Edited on Thu Sep-07-06 06:48 AM by LynneSin
I don't need money to see this movie
I don't even need to pay for cable to see this movie
If you own a TV set and some decent reception this is free for no charge to you
And it's free because Disney and their sponsors are paying for this movie in hoes you'll watch it

Aren't you a bit disturbed over there?

There once was something called a "Fairness Doctrine" I guess you find that a load of crap too
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 01:57 AM
Response to Original message
10. How old are you?
Seriously. Do you not understand that this is what the right has been doing for 20 years? They've completely revised history in so many areas that a whole generation believes Reagan was an economic genius and single-handedly ended the Cold War. I've actually had people tell me that the Clinton economic boom was due to Reagan's policies. And now they're trying to do it with 9/11. I don't get how you could not understand why this is a problem. You may not understand the 80's and 90's, but how could you not understand what's happened since Cleland, Kerry and Murtha??
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Singular73 Donating Member (999 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 02:01 AM
Response to Reply #10
14. Heh
Reagan bled the poor in this country to get the economy back in shape, and YES, it did work, though the boom during Clinton's term had nothing to do with it.

Regardless, the talking points of the right with regards to Reagan don't make the history books in any greater falacy than the rest of American history.

For Gods sakes, how old are you? Are you going to sit here and promote the fact that democrats should waste their time fighting this...at the time where we are the brink of taking over one or both houses of Congress?

Are you frikken serious?

Write history later. Lets win now.
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 02:56 AM
Response to Reply #14
23. Ah, well, that explains a lot
If you think there was a booming economy in the 80's, that says more than anything else you could possibly say. We had the same economy then that we've had the last 5 years, and neither one of them is a boom.

If we don't deal with reality NOW, then not only will history be written wrong, but people won't have any reason to believe Democrats can do any better job than Republicans - which is exactly what the Bushies have to do in order to retain control.

Are you frikken serious? Do you not get how they play the game???
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Oeditpus Rex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 03:42 AM
Response to Reply #10
24. Correction: SOME people from a whole generation
And those people would believe whatever the RW spoon-feeds them because it's their predilection. Rational people do not tune into O'Hannibaugh and suddenly come to the realization that the right is right. Freepers stubbornly, ignorantly believe this and many here believe the opposite, in the same way.

Neither the GOP nor ABC nor the Swift Boat Veterans nor anyone else you care to name has "rewritten" history. All they've done is write their own version of it, and the only people who believe it are their legions which are shrinking, according to every poll in existence, because the bullshit has become too deep.

The only people who'll buy into ABC's propaganda are those who believe in *, Reagan, et al. The 30 percent on either side cannot be influenced. It's the 40 percent in the middle we have to worry about, and I doubt they'll give the movie much credence if they even watch.

I don't advocate ignoring it, though. The more fuss we make, the more likely the media is to do stories on the controversy, and thus raise awareness even further.
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 04:23 AM
Response to Reply #24
25. No no no no
There isn't two adequate versions of history depending on which political ideology you adhere to. The right has absolutely written their own version of history and they've been doing it for generations. I don't know why the Democrats don't do it, but they don't. When was the last time you heard any Democratic leader remind the public that Republicans were the ones who fought entry into WWII?? Yet Republicans continue to demonize FDR and do everything possible to remove him from the public memory, why do you think they want to get him off the dime? Calling Democrats communists isn't new, they did it to FDR too.

No, I completely disagree. We've let them get away with telling a false version of so many historic events, how many people know that 2-4 million were killed in Vietnam and more bombs were dropped there than in WWII?? Enough already. If that 40% didn't have their heads filled with this drivel, no Republican would ever get elected.
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ThomWV Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 06:40 AM
Response to Reply #10
28. The Lessons Of History Define Our Future - Inaccuracy Predefines Failure
Wise men and women learn from mistakes. In a well informed world wise people are elected to office more often than bufoons.

If we teach children that 2+2=5 will our engineers ever design rockets able to reach the moon? How about the engineers who designed the brakes on our cars or our children's schoolbusses? Of course you wouldn't. The reason is clear; a misrepresented past breeds a failed future.
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LaPera Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 01:57 AM
Response to Original message
11. Republicans yelled and screamed about Fahrenheit 9/11-Disney caved
into the right-wing assholes. But then so is Disney.
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skids Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 01:59 AM
Response to Original message
12. Fear? No. This is an offense manuvre.
Edited on Thu Sep-07-06 02:02 AM by skids
This thing is obviously being financed somehow. It reeks. The objective is to get to the bottom of it and bring the ugly truth to the American people, hopefully before the 2006 midterms.

(EDIT to add: in case I wasn't clear enough -- the story here is not 9/11. The story is the movie itself and the shady dealings that are no doubt behind it. Do you really think this has been payed for honestly? At best, it was payed for with tax dollars.)
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evlbstrd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 02:05 AM
Response to Original message
16. News reports are whitewashed and buried quickly.
Documentary films cost money and a concerted effort to attend. Network teevee is right there in front of everyone. And you know how they love to tout a "very special" episode/special/two-night mini-series. They're good at it, too.
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tuvor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 02:06 AM
Response to Original message
17. MAN, your post is rife with WTFs.
Edited on Thu Sep-07-06 02:09 AM by tuvor
As if the issue was 9/11. Long ago, the American public made it clear they blamed noone for 9/11...

:wtf:

They tried to sell fear, they tried to sell terror, and it hasn't worked.

:wtf:

Do what the Rethuglicans did with F9/11. Ignore it. Don't make it an issue.

:wtf:

Hell, I don't even know anyone that watches ABC/NBC/CBS except for sports.

:wtf:

Chill.

(No, thanks.)
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City Lights Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 07:11 AM
Response to Reply #17
38. Great response, tuvor!
:yourock:
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me b zola Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 02:06 AM
Response to Original message
18. Walt, is that you?
Thanks, but if you don't mind I'll pass on Mr. Toad's ride.
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Psephos Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 02:07 AM
Response to Original message
19. Sensible post
As I understand it, nobody comes out looking very good in this film, which means that its impact will be exactly as you stated it. Nothing.

But that's not as fun to contemplate for some. Heh heh.

Peace.
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The_Casual_Observer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 02:07 AM
Response to Original message
20. It's a matter of principle, fair play and good taste.
It's one thing to have rw AM radio nitwits rant on for years about these false claims, it's quite another for them to dress up actors as the real guys and have them portray the substance of the rants, calling it "docu-drama" and also distribute literature to children expressing the same defective claims and call it "educational". It's your basic abomination.
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wavesofeuphoria Donating Member (204 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 06:11 AM
Response to Original message
26. There is an election this year ..
and this amounts to free political advertising for several hours. You don't think the GOP will insinuate talking points from this in the coming weeks before the elections?? Media/dramas are powerful tools/images that ... even full of misinformation .. will have an impact on those seeing it. To think this isn't outright political propaganda ("Its all Clintons/the democrats fault") is a bit naive.
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Vinca Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 06:36 AM
Response to Original message
27. I fear the dimwitted people who cannot name a member
of the Supreme Court will watch this and absorb it as literally as they do the Bible. They'll blame Democrats for 9/11 and rush to vote for Republicans in November. That's reason to be fearful.
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Justice Is Comin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 07:21 AM
Response to Reply #27
39. ..
Edited on Thu Sep-07-06 07:31 AM by Justice Is Comin

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LynneSin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 06:44 AM
Response to Original message
29. ABC is mainstream middle american Free TV, not for $10 at my theater
And the ABC movie claims it's on 'dramatization' based on the 9/11 Commission report even though several people on that commission have said that the movie has been greatly distorted.

And how about the fact that ABC tried to push this movie into our classrooms? Why wasn't Michael Moore offered that same opportunity. Oops, wait, Moore was a progressive movie whereas the ABC movie is packed with lies distorting the truth like Bush didn't do any wrong
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Cobalt Violet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 06:52 AM
Response to Reply #29
33. But what's the big deal?
:sarcasm:
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LynneSin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 07:02 AM
Response to Reply #33
35. I was gonna kick yer ass
:pals:

:loveya:
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JHB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 06:48 AM
Response to Original message
31. It's a matter of standing up to them when they try to spread their lies.
Sure, they'll do it anyway, but unless it's countered -- hard and effectively -- their spin and propaganda of today has a way of becoming the baseline "conventional wisdom" of tomorrow.
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Cobalt Violet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 06:49 AM
Response to Original message
32. Indoctrination, Historical Revisionist, Propaganda...
And BTW there is an election coming up and this is a political move by a Corporation. I could go on but somehow I still don't think you'll get it.



Maybe you should watch something other than sports.
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LynneSin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 07:06 AM
Response to Reply #32
36. here is an election coming up & this is a political move by a Corporation
You just summed this all up.

It's the Disney CORPORATION using it's freely distributed TV channel to anyone with a TV & Rabbits ears about how we'll still be terrorized unless we elected republicans in the fall

If anyone can't see that obvious issue then seriously, let me book the room for those people now in the Betty Ford clinic. Whatever drug you're taking is clearly fucking up the brain

Both sides have been doing the Movies, DVDs even some cable specials but this is available for anyone and everyone AND being pushed into our schools.

And folks don't see the issue - yikes
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seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 07:06 AM
Response to Original message
37. i hate lies. so tired of lies. but biggest, sending lies out to teach
our children across the nation. there is NO greater irresponsible act than to manipulate a child in lie. that we would do this to our academic environment is the worst
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moondust Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 07:28 AM
Response to Original message
40. Deception.
Blending truth, truthiness, and propaganda into a story about a historical event (or anything else) is dishonest and misleading.


But you're right. Occasional sports is all I ever watch on ABC.
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spanone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 07:29 AM
Response to Original message
41. It;s FAKE history. Pull it.
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newportdadde Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-07-06 07:49 AM
Response to Original message
42. Because for the next 20 years this will be told as fact by Joe Average.
Lies presented this way just fester themselves in the public TV viewer. It becomes to people talking in the coffee shop saying "Hey remember when Clinton could have killed Osama but didn't do it? I think I saw that on the news a few years ago."

Nasty lies that find their ways into the BS forwarded emails and converstations all across the US.
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