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tocqueville Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-03-06 09:20 PM
Original message
Book: Bush told reporter Jews are 'all going to hell'
Larisa Alexandrovna
Published: Saturday September 2, 2006

An upcoming book about presidential advisor Karl Rove reports allegations of anti-semitism by President George W. Bush, RAW STORY has learned.

In The Architect: Karl Rove and the Master Plan for Absolute Power, Austin-based journalist James Moore and Wayne Slater, senior political reporter for the Dallas Morning News, will allege that Bush once made anti-semitic comments to a reporter.

"You know what I'm gonna tell those Jews when I get to Israel, don't you Herman?" a then Governor George W. Bush allegedly asked a reporter for the Austin American-Statesman.

When the journalist, Ken Herman, replied that he did not know, Bush reportedly delivered the punch line: "I'm telling 'em they're all going to hell."

http://www.rawstory.com/news/2006/Book_Bush_told_report...
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Hubert Flottz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-03-06 09:22 PM
Response to Original message
1. That's the way you'd expect some damned Nazi appeaser to act!
Edited on Sun Sep-03-06 09:40 PM by Hubert Flottz
Not a president of the United States of America...land of the free and home of the brave!
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Drewskie Donating Member (465 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-03-06 09:43 PM
Response to Reply #1
14. ...
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Hubert Flottz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-03-06 09:49 PM
Response to Reply #14
16. "jawohl"
LMAO!
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bridgit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-03-06 09:22 PM
Response to Original message
2. it has all been a lie, if the bfee told you what was really on & in...
theirs minds no one would EVER have voted for them
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jeff30997 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-03-06 09:22 PM
Response to Original message
3. What?
St George is an anti-semite? Noooooooooooo!
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ikojo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-03-06 09:24 PM
Response to Original message
4. Fundie Christians do believe that those Jews who
do not accept Jesus as the messiah during the Tribulation period will die and be sentenced to hell for eternity.

It's the old Christian formula...convert or die.

The thing is Bush holds his fundie base in utter contempt as well.

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Fredda Weinberg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-03-06 09:25 PM
Response to Original message
5. How is this anti-semitic? It's his religion
and applies to everyone who hasn't accepted Christ as a personal savior.
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LostinVA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-04-06 06:33 AM
Response to Reply #5
25. Because it is anti-semitic
And I am fricking gobsmacked that YOU of all people aren't considering this anti-semitic.
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bluestateguy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-03-06 09:26 PM
Response to Original message
6. Isn't this old news?
It came and went (like so many Bush scandals) in the 2000 campaign.
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BlooInBloo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-03-06 09:27 PM
Response to Original message
7. Just makin shit up until source is known.
Another test for DUers - Do we require evidence of claims, or not?
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Hubert Flottz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-03-06 09:32 PM
Response to Reply #7
10. Do you have proof that it is made up?
I'd like to see that too if you have a link. Has this been debunked?
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BlooInBloo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-04-06 06:45 PM
Response to Reply #10
29. And with that question, we're back to the idiotic...
.... don't-need-no-stinkin-evidence jackass-ery.
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MercutioATC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-03-06 09:27 PM
Response to Original message
8. I wish there was some way to confirm this.
My brother-in-law is a diehard Republican. He's involved in the Blackwell campaign here in Cleveland.

He's also an observant Jew.


I know what he'll say if I send this link to him...and he'd be right. It's a liberal writer with no proof making accusations. I might believe Bush could have said that, but my BIL never will without some evidence.


It's a damn shame.
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tocqueville Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-03-06 09:41 PM
Response to Reply #8
12. Here is an independent link
Edited on Sun Sep-03-06 09:43 PM by tocqueville
http://www.jewishworldreview.com/1298/bush1.asp

(JWR) ---- (http://www.jewishworldreview.com ) TEXAS GOV. GEORGE W. BUSH has clarified remarks he made in 1993 which seemed to indicate that he believed only Christians had a place in heaven.

Bush, a leading contender for the Republican presidential nomination in 2000, first caused controversy when he told a story about his religious faith in an interview published in The Houston Post during his 1994 campaign for governor, and he recounted that story in a New York Times Magazine profile this September.

Bush said he was visiting his parents in the White House and, having at that time recently recommitted to religion, began to discuss who goes to heaven with his mother, Barbara. Bush pointed to a passage in the Christian Bible which said that only Christians had a place in heaven.

Barbara disagreed, saying, Surely, God will accept others, but Bush said, Mom, heres what the New Testament says. So Barbara called Billy Graham, and, said Bush, Billy said, From a personal perspective, I agree with what George is saying, the New Testament has been my guide. But I want to caution you both. Dont play God. Who are you two to be God?

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MercutioATC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-03-06 09:49 PM
Response to Reply #12
15. Thanks! It's kinda wishy-washy on the issue, but it's a good find.
I really do respect my BIL for the strength of his convictions. We have major political differences, but he's not a stereotypical "Repub drone". He doesn't just believe what he believes...he can tell you WHY he believes what he believes. That puts him ahead of 80% of the people I know right off the bat.

I don't think I'm going to change his mind...but it's possible that I could get him to question how compatible his religion and his politics are. That's all I'm going for.

Thanks again :)
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tocqueville Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-03-06 10:15 PM
Response to Reply #15
18. Frankly when you check the background....
it's quite astonishing in a way

Probably it isn't so that George goes around thinking "I hate Jews". But the discussion in itself is very revealing for his state of mind. What would you expect from a Governor with Presidential aspirations going to Israel ? Well some kind of answer like "I'll ask them to inform me on the current situation" or whatever is at least politically correct. But his answer is based on a religious belief and a minor one in itself. I cannot find any other explanation that at that time it was important for him to tell the Jews they were "wrong". What kind of priority is that ? What would he had answered if the question was about Muslims ?

All this sounds to me like the urge of telling others with not the "right faith" that there are doomed and in quite a harsh way, since Bush cannot have been unaware of the double meaning of "going to hell"...

such thinking is based in bigotry, and bigotry can lead to racial implications...
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bluestateguy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-03-06 09:43 PM
Response to Reply #8
13. Raw Story is often unreliable
I still like the one they put up last year about one of Dick Cheney's aides having "left the country", supposedly fleeing some big scandal. They haven't said much about that one in a long time.

But then again I have heard this Bush on Christ story before from more reliable places.
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tocqueville Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-03-06 10:25 PM
Response to Reply #8
19. Here is another link
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ikojo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-04-06 06:20 AM
Response to Reply #8
24. What my orthodox Jewish friends say
when presented with quotes such as this is the following: "Israel needs all the friends she can get. They will see they're wrong when Moshiach comes."

I think my orthodox friends are able to dismiss quotes such as that because they don't hold much respect for Christianity (one converted from Catholicism to Judaism) and believe it to be untrue.

That is a verbatim quote.

Judaism does not hold that it is the one true way as does Christianity, it is the one true way FOR JEWS. According to traditional Judaism all the righteous have a share in the world to come.

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TahitiNut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-03-06 09:29 PM
Response to Original message
9. For Junior, 'Hell' is any place where nobody pays attention to him.
:shrug:

Sounds like Heaven to me, though.
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mnhtnbb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-03-06 09:32 PM
Response to Original message
11. That's a fundie response
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Kagemusha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-03-06 09:55 PM
Response to Reply #11
17. He probably said it with a wink and a laugh and thought it was cute.
But whatever, either way.
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napi21 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-03-06 10:27 PM
Response to Reply #17
20. I'm not sure about that! I had an argumenta few years ago with
arelative who is a minister. He said the same thing, and even quoted the bible. I can't recall the exact quote, but the bible really does say unless you acknowledge Jesus as our savior you shall not be saved. Myargument with him was that I can't believeGod would have createda large group of people who he knew would be damned. The argument ended...finally...with both of us agreeing that we disagree on this subject.

I'm not sure that Shrub really is a reborn Christian, but if he really is, I can see him saying that and believing it too.

Does that make him an anti semite? Probably not.
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Kagemusha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-03-06 10:37 PM
Response to Reply #20
21. Well, I said what I said because...
Bush would obviously be familiar with people who would say that, and mean it seriously. And therefore, he could say it as what a real nut would say when visiting Israel. I don't think he's a 'real nut' in that sense, but he can play one for a laugh and knows plenty of real ones.

I think crude humor does fit him. But, hey, I could be wrong about all this too. Doesn't bother me if I am.
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CJCRANE Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-04-06 07:30 AM
Response to Reply #21
27. Yes
Edited on Mon Sep-04-06 07:30 AM by CJCRANE
the last time this came up on DU, the consensus seemed to be that * actually said this, but that it was a joke (in very bad taste of course).
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daleo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-03-06 11:19 PM
Response to Original message
22. If this is religious bigotry (anti-semitism), then it is widespread
Most religions claim that their's is the One True Way. Usually there is a "agree to disagree" deal about it, so it doesn't get talked about publicly. It is one of the main reasons that many of us don't care for institutional religion.
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LostinVA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-04-06 06:34 AM
Response to Reply #22
26. Not all Christians believe this at all
The Catholic Church doesn't even believe it anymore.
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daleo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-04-06 06:42 PM
Response to Reply #26
28. I think a lot of religions are ambiguous on the topic
I don't know what the latest Catholic dogma on this is, though. I have heard my share of fire breathing Christian preachers claiming that only their brand of Christianity is the path to salvation - many of the more mainstream denominations do take a more nuanced position.
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lumberjack_jeff Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-03-06 11:25 PM
Response to Original message
23. ... followed by a creepy "he, he, he" no doubt. n/t
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