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AlCzervik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-21-06 11:40 PM
Original message
Is polygamy like a huge problem in America?
Anderson Cooper is spending an awful ot of time covering it. I read the newspaper this morning and i saw nothing at all about it.
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The Velveteen Ocelot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-21-06 11:41 PM
Response to Original message
1. Not sure. I'll check with one of my husbands.
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madmusic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-22-06 12:00 AM
Response to Reply #1
10. LOL! Thanks for the laugh.
No problem for me, either. If someone doesn't like it, change the channel.
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mcscajun Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-21-06 11:42 PM
Response to Original message
2. Not a problem for me...
...not in the slightest.
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BlueCaliDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-22-06 01:04 AM
Response to Reply #2
16. As a Christian, I'm personally against polygamy. As a Liberal, I say...
...people have the right to make their own choices just as long as it doesn't burden society---or entail marrying off 13-14 year old girls to 50-60 year old men.

Some (mature) women really do want to be in a polygamist relationship. It makes them feel happier. So, why not?

I just don't think that people who choose a polygamist relationship should burden the welfare system, since their situation is a chosen one, and welfare benefits are for those who have found themselves destitute by circumstances beyond their control.
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mcscajun Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-22-06 08:19 AM
Response to Reply #16
30. I agree with your position on abuse of polygamy and the welfare system
No way do I condone the power trips these Mormon radicals embrace, where some leader decides who marries whom, and young men are thrown into the streets so that the elders can marry all the young girls, children really.

If someone can support those they choose to include in their household/family, fine; not if we all have to support them. NFW.
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Subdivisions Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-21-06 11:47 PM
Response to Original message
3. No, it's not a huge problem...
Edited on Mon Aug-21-06 11:48 PM by Texas Explorer
it's questionable whether it's a religion or a cult, but it's isolated to mostly Utah and few other small pockets in other states.
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Dems Will Win Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-21-06 11:58 PM
Response to Reply #3
7. Incorrect. It is estimated that 3% of 14 million Mormons
are polygamists. That makes 420,000 polygamists in the states where there are regular Mormons. Then there are the fundamentalist Mormon cults like the one Warren Jeffs is the tyrant of. That's about another 50,000. Usually only the fundamentalists are counted but within regular Mormon temples there are polygamy families who are quietly tolerated as long as it does not come out in the open.

So the real figure is closer to half a million and they are in at least half the states

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Dems Will Win Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-22-06 12:07 AM
Response to Reply #7
14. Here is more, from Polygamy FAQs
Typically polygamists are only excommunicated if they are vocal about their polygamy. I know faithful Latter-day saints that practice plural marriage in the privacy of their own homes and hearts which are never X'd by the church. It's not really the practice of polygamy that is punishable, but the flaunting of it to the rest of the world. Course, I walk on the fringes of the LDS church, and see many things that are not evident to the more mainstream LDS members.

Based on the polygamists that I have known over the years, I estimate that about 3% of those you see in an LDS church on Sunday are practicing polygamy.

Next time one of the brethren at a ward picnic introduces you to his sister, or his mother, or his aunt, who happens to live in his home, or introduces you to his single next door neighbor, you might wonder about what relationship they really have...

It is very common for polygamists to rent or buy a duplex, and for the families to live side by side. It is an excellent way of being discrete.


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FreeState Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-22-06 02:29 AM
Response to Reply #14
18. Link?
As someone who was a member for almost 30 years I have a hard time believing what you posted. Its nearly impossible if you fully understand Mormonism. Got a link for that?
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KatyMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-22-06 04:11 AM
Response to Reply #7
23. But...
So the real figure is closer to half a million and they are in at least half the states


Yes but if they're all married to each other, doesn't that make the number smaller? Just askin'...

:P
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ToeBot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-22-06 06:10 AM
Response to Reply #7
28. Sorry, not a chance.
There may be ten's of thousands of polygamist's in splinter groups, but there are not hundreds of thousands of polygamists in the Mormon church.
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Bill McBlueState Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-21-06 11:50 PM
Response to Original message
4. not to me it isn't
In general, people should be allowed to marry whomever they want to marry.
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Breeze54 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-22-06 04:02 AM
Response to Reply #4
22. 60 year old men should be allowed
to marry nine year old girl's? :wtf:

I don't agree!
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Bill McBlueState Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-22-06 08:45 AM
Response to Reply #22
31. who said that?
I don't agree, either.
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mrdmk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-21-06 11:52 PM
Response to Original message
5. Gee, I really need a consensus from the wives, then again I am the head
of the household and do not need a consensus. No problem here!
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Sparkle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-21-06 11:55 PM
Response to Original message
6. Why is it always the men that get to have more than one spouse?
n/t
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mcscajun Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-21-06 11:59 PM
Response to Reply #6
8. That's only in these outcast Mormon sects.
Poly families in the US also accomodate women with more than one husband.

Some people really ARE "High-maintenance".
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gatorboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-22-06 12:00 AM
Response to Reply #6
9. And have the guys try to outman one another for the wife's affections?
It would turn into a Popeye/Bluto cartoon!
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Renew Deal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-22-06 12:01 AM
Response to Reply #6
11. Because men can impregnate multiple women at the same time.
:thumbsup:





:evilgrin:
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pinto Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-22-06 12:03 AM
Response to Original message
12. No. I'm sure it's a pressing and important issue for those involved, but
Edited on Tue Aug-22-06 12:05 AM by pinto
otherwise, it's a good story for cable shows. Voyeurism is always big in the cable line up.
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OwnedByFerrets Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-22-06 12:05 AM
Response to Original message
13. Neither is a 10yr old murder case.....
but an inordinate amount of time is being spent on that also. :sarcasm:
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Bozita Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-22-06 12:11 AM
Response to Original message
15. Romney's a good guy -- Isn't that what they want to hear?
Why else all this polygamy stuff?

Is it because the 2008 pres run to the primaries is starting in 87 days?

Sorry, ... I've got more questions than answers.
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alittlelark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-22-06 01:15 AM
Response to Original message
17. One husband says yes, another hubby says no.....
I'm not sure, I'll ask my third hubby for a tie breaking answer.
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silverojo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-22-06 02:50 AM
Response to Original message
19. It is for the teen girls being forced into polygamous marriages
Protecting our children and young people should be a top priority. Letting polygamists get away with their kidnapping and abuse has stayed under the national radar for too long. I live in a Mormon area, so we often see on our local news these girls who risk their lives to run away and expose the horrors they've endured.

No civilized society should put up with this. It's an abuse of power against young girls, pure and simple.
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don954 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-22-06 03:22 AM
Response to Reply #19
21. thats just pedos looking for an excuse
and a talking point that repubs use to demonize mormans and gays and everyone else they dont like...
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Breeze54 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-22-06 04:19 AM
Response to Reply #19
24. Yeah, and "The Lost Boys"
might be having a problem with it too! :grr:

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

http://www.childrenshealthcare.org/polygamous.htm

Lost boys expelled as surplus

Most of the world first heard of the lost boys in 2004 when dozens came to the Utah
Capitol and spoke. All said they were forced out by the current prophet, Warren Jeffs.
They said more than 400 males, ages 13 and older, have been banished from the FLDS
community since Jeffs became supreme ruler in 2002.

They were banished for such infractions as watching movies, ogling girls,
wearing short-sleeved shirts, or listening to popular music.
Their real sin, most critics say, was being surplus males in a polygamous community.

Many of the boys are taken out of school before they reach eighth grade and forced
to do hard labor in the sects construction and other businesses on the promise that
the prophet will give them the three wives they need to get into heaven.

They are taught from the cradle up that the prophet must be obeyed as Gods representative,
that the outside world is evil, and that anyone leaving the FLDS will be ground to dust on
earth and damned in the after-life.

Then after years of work for little or no compensation, they are expelled from the only
community they have ever known.
Several have been dumped out on the side of the road by their own fathers or church elders.

Several of the lost boys have committed suicide. Many are homeless. Many use drugs or steal.

They live every day like its their last day and they dont care about anything.
Theyre told they wont have three wives, and theyre doomed.
But they all want to go back to their mums, said Dave Bills, who runs a foundation to help the boys.

Lost boy Gideon Barlow told of trying to give his mother a Mothers Day present,
but she ordered him to stay away.
When he tried to obtain a Medicaid card, he learned that his 73-year-old father was drawing
Social Security funds in Gideons name. Social Security allows retirement-age parents to
collect money to help support children ages 16 or younger who are living at home.

Why no criminal charges?

These are shocking abuses of hundreds of children, and some legislators have asked why
parents have not been charged with child abandonment or neglect. Utah Attorney General
Mark Shurtleff says the boys do not want to testify against their parents.
He points out that child abandonment is only a misdemeanor in Utah.
He feels that prosecution for a misdemeanor would not change the behavior of parents
who are willing to cast out their own children on orders from a man they regard as
Gods representative on earth.

There are also practical considerations. If I charge one, do I charge 800?
Do I have the resources? Shurtleff asked

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

More at link....cripes!!

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don954 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-22-06 03:20 AM
Response to Original message
20. only as much as gay marriage....
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FormerOstrich Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-22-06 04:37 AM
Response to Original message
25. What consenting adults do is really none of my business...
However, I think it is questionable if the children that are born into these cults really understand what they are consenting to. Young girls are given away and they raise young girls to be given away. Boys are frequently ran off because they become competition. The most horrific are the multiple accounts of "babyland" by the various compounds.


http://www.counterpunch.org/mazur03022005.html
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w4rma Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-22-06 05:36 AM
Response to Original message
26. Unequal relationships. Master/near-Slave relationships.
Edited on Tue Aug-22-06 05:39 AM by w4rma
Elitist relationships that only the very very wealthy could afford without cheating the social service system.

Corrupt relationships as they usually toss extra males out onto the streets with nothing to their names. Or they kill the male babies outright:
Some of the unmarked Babyland graves.

The submissive partners in the relationship only relatively rarely get to spend time with their "masters" and must spend the rest of their time doing the things that the "master" doesn't have the extra time for such as raising the children, keeping the house, taking an extra job, and basically being a reproductive machine to churn out more "wives".
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skids Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-22-06 05:53 AM
Response to Original message
27. Now there's a problem I probably wouldn't mind having :-) n/t
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NMMNG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-22-06 06:29 AM
Response to Original message
29. Only according to the control-freak fundies
If you talk to them polygamy and gay marriage are huge problems that are tearing the very fabric of America apart, and won't somebody please think of the children!?! :eyes:

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aikoaiko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-22-06 09:02 AM
Response to Original message
32. I say let em legally marry, but they must be held to the same standards

...as monogamists.

Same rules about welfare, same rules about abandoning children, same rules about killing their children, same rules about marrying minors, etc.
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OffWithTheirHeads Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-22-06 09:57 AM
Response to Original message
33. To paraphrase a line from a movie
Bigamy is having one wife too many...same as monogomy
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Fierce Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-22-06 10:14 AM
Response to Original message
34. Since the relationship itself is inherently unequal,
because it's always polygyny, and almost never (to the point of being statistically insignificant) polyandry, I'm against it. Since it often involves underage children, I'm against it. I reject it as a cultural or religious right.

Of course, I just read "Under the Banner of Heaven," and that put me in a fightin' mood.
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