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Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (01/01/06 through 01/22/2007) Donate to DU
 
IselaB Donating Member (235 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 09:22 PM
Original message
JESUS CHRIST PEOPLE
Because you don't want something to be true does not mean it isn't true! Because something is frustrating or inconvenient does not make it untrue!

This whole thing we're involved in at this desperate point in the history of our country is about people who can confront reality on its own terms versus people who ignore reality when it contradicts ideology.

It's a battle between people who believe facts matter and people who will dismiss "biased facts."

And because you can see how something might benefit a partisan cause, that is not sufficient evidence - it's not evidence at all - that something has been falsified.

You got evidence that Scotland Yard manufactured this plot, I'm all ears. Otherwise, DEAL WITH IT. DEAL WITH IT LIKE A LIBERAL WHO RESPECTS REALITY.

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ClusterFreak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 09:24 PM
Response to Original message
1. K&R'd!!
Right the fuck on my friend!
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Malikshah Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 09:25 PM
Response to Original message
2. Hey-- cut w/ the all caps
Plot found. Plot wouldn't have been such had it not been for the regime's disregard for human life.

They do not care about us. We are fodder for them.

If you're wondering who "they" is-- the terrorists, *, and his poodle Blair.

So calm the f*&* down.
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greguganus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 05:33 AM
Response to Reply #2
80. DEAL WITH THE CAPS. DEAL WITH IT LIKE A LIBERAL WHO
RESPECTS LARGE LETTERS.
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mhatrw Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 03:19 PM
Response to Reply #80
103. LOL.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 09:26 PM
Response to Original message
3. Deleted sub-thread
Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
soothsayer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 09:26 PM
Response to Original message
4. Just wait until you learn more about how this 'insider' to the terra
cell ended up CREATING the terra cell and feeding it ideas on how to take down airplanes. Just like our miami guys, the toronto kids, etc.
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ObaMania Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 05:48 AM
Response to Reply #4
83. I'll wait until I see photos of the 23..
.. that were arrested then pass judgement.
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Child_Of_Isis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 09:00 AM
Response to Reply #4
90. This has been my thought.
It hasn't been brought up much on DU.

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ShortnFiery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 09:27 PM
Response to Original message
5. Yes, I remember that meme "Deal with it!"
And no, I will NOT!

With all due respect, if you don't like those of us who question the veracity of some of the PsyOps possible M$M reporting, then kindly, DON'T READ, RECOMMEND or support it in any way.

But to preach to us is NOT going to help anyone make sense of what we are being FED within the Corporate M$M. :(
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Vincardog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 09:27 PM
Response to Original message
6. Did you ever notice they ask us to provide the evidence they hide?
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Roland99 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 09:27 PM
Response to Original message
7. Where's the evidence that there *was* a plot?!
All we have are the word of US officials and some British intelligence.

Now, Bush and Blair are not the most credible persons on earth, right? And British intel was quoted by Bush re: the Saddam buying uranium from an African nation.

Pakistan seems to be the home or base of these people and isn't the US about to supply Pakistan some nuclear technology? What a nice quid pro quo.

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ShortnFiery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 09:31 PM
Response to Reply #7
14. Yes, Ahhh, British Intelligence Ops?
Edited on Thu Aug-10-06 09:32 PM by ShortnFiery
What can we say about a government who is PROMOTING one of the guys that popped 7 rounds into the brain of an INNOCENT citizen from Brazil?!?

UK is like Our Executive Branch, the more crass, cruel and incompetent you are, the more promotions and accolades you're given. :puke: :grr:
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Roland99 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 09:38 PM
Response to Reply #14
28. And remember the Brits dressed as Arabs in southern Iraq that got caught
and the subsequent breaking them out of Iraqi jail?

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ShortnFiery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 09:40 PM
Response to Reply #28
32. Thanks it's hard to keep up ...
Keeping up with the corruption is like reading a really bad spy novel. :hi:

I feel like Captain Willard (Apocalypse Now) when asked "You don't approve of my methods?"

"Sir, I see NO METHOD at all." :(
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Child_Of_Isis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 09:38 PM
Response to Reply #7
29. KO said the only evidence that the MSM has...
came from the two governments.

I posted this elsewhere but feel it needs repeating.



The only evidence the MSM has is the word of the two governments.
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bananarepublican Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 03:20 AM
Response to Reply #29
76. As Stephen Colbert said, "The administration tells you things and you...
Edited on Fri Aug-11-06 03:21 AM by bananarepublican
... write them down." He was of course addressing the White House Correspondents Dinner attendees.

So what we are really trying "to deal with" is separating the truth, if any, out of what is being reported. Assuming that any particular government entity tells the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth is ridiculous.

It is about time everyone deals with the fact that all governments are compulsive liars.



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Zhade Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 05:52 AM
Response to Reply #29
84. And have those two governments lied? HELL YES THEY HAVE!
So why in the world should the default position to something told to us by KNOWN FUCKING LIARS be to believe it? That would be insane!

(Sorry for the caps, I'm just pissed at the short memory of some people.)

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Child_Of_Isis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 08:56 AM
Response to Reply #84
89. The question is...
Have they ever told the truth?
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Zynx Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 09:06 AM
Response to Reply #7
92. Pakistan is a country of 163 million people and a weak government.
Do you really think the government has control over all the whackos in their country?
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MoseyWalker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 09:27 PM
Response to Original message
8. what exactly is the evidence you've seen so far
that makes this true?

A lot of words spoken by a lot of people in a lot of places.

That's what I've seen.

I might not even believe it if they come out three days from now with "evidence" proving that someone of English Pakistani descent had a bottle of vodka and some lipstick in a bag.

The whole thing just sounds crazy. And I don't mean conspiracy crazy, I mean msm government psyops crazy.
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Kajsa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 09:28 PM
Response to Original message
9. Well stated! Kicked and
recommended!

Thank you for posting this.

:kick:
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 09:29 PM
Response to Original message
10. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Roland99 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 09:29 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. Don't let the door hit ya
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Philosoraptor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 09:31 PM
Response to Reply #11
15. we hardly knew ye
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greguganus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 05:35 AM
Response to Reply #11
82. I always miss the posts before they get deleted!! :( n/t
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Philosoraptor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 09:30 PM
Response to Reply #10
12. bye
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Der Blaue Engel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 09:31 PM
Response to Reply #10
16. Nice.
I just love it when people storm out like a child as if this is going to somehow be hurtful to those they couldn't win an argument with.
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Individualist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 09:35 PM
Response to Reply #10
21. Don't forget to buy duct tape!
We're all gonna dieeeee! :crazy:
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zeemike Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 09:35 PM
Response to Reply #10
22. Cowards cut and run
So why are you going?
Can't stand the heat?
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Philosoraptor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 09:37 PM
Response to Reply #22
26. JESUS CHRIST ISELAB
Edited on Thu Aug-10-06 09:37 PM by Philosoraptor
slash and burn and keep on truckin
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adriennui Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 09:36 PM
Response to Reply #10
24. don't fret
anyone who doesn't agree with their bizarre theories is quickly demonized. you're in good company.
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ShortnFiery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 09:44 PM
Response to Reply #24
37. Feel free to find a new place where one's views are readily accepted
There's a lot of FUN cheer leading sites ... Hannity has one, so does Lucy ... you can all believe what is told to you by the M$M and RushBo ... all cheer together. How boring is that? :(
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ShortnFiery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 09:36 PM
Response to Reply #10
25. I regret that - honestly.
However, counseling people about their basic values and intellectual curiosity as being WRONG, is not the ideal way to change our minds.

Yes, we should be objective. Understood. However, when you've been LIED to as much as The Executive Branch has lied to The American People, our initial disbelief is only an natural reaction.

IF more facts are revealed that points to the legitimacy of this plot, then yes, I'll buy into. It's often more appropriate to be skeptical of Our Dear Leaders in This Administration.

Hope you return soon. :hi:
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saigon68 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 03:29 AM
Response to Reply #10
77. Au Revoir Enjoy your stay on this thread
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NRaleighLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 09:30 PM
Response to Original message
13. Exactly what is the basis for you to believe anything that the MSM
or the misadministration reports or says? Trust needs to be earned. Credibility needs to be earned. They have earned nothing except the need to be very, very cynical.
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fooj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 02:20 AM
Response to Reply #13
73. I guess we should just "DEAL WITH IT"...
Isn't that what they said after they stole TWO elections? I knew that sounded familiar.
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ClassWarrior Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 09:33 PM
Response to Original message
17. Thanks for the lecture.
Deal with it like a Progressive who respects diversity of thought. Because we know THAT's reality.

NGU.


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Dover Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 09:33 PM
Response to Original message
18. Bushco manipulates 'reality'..............deal with THAT!
Edited on Thu Aug-10-06 09:37 PM by Dover
You talk about 'reality' and 'facts' as if they are something set in stone. Hardly.
If the science on global warming, health, WMD in Iraq, political polls, etc. doesn't suit them, they dismiss or change it. They manipulate with language and imagery and use the news networks, radio and the internet handily.
I'm worried about ya if you haven't figured out how these things are tools for the this regime.
I know it's disconcerting not knowing what's an illusion and what is real, but at least face THAT fact.......that's what the science of propaganda is all about....manipulation of perception.
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KAZ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 09:33 PM
Response to Original message
19. Oh Pulease. We're supposed to accept everything...
.. at face value? We've got 6 years of this crap honey. And thanks for telling us how to be good Liberals.

Most of us are dubious until we see some FACTS.
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Rose Siding Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 09:34 PM
Response to Original message
20. Here's some reality
A similar plot, hatched by Ramsey Usef, to take down airplanes over the Pacific Ocean with liquid explosives was thwarted ten years ago. Our aviation system was attacked by al Qaeda five years ago on September 11. The 9/11 Commission recommended improving security screening to detect explosives at the checkpoint four years ago. And knowing of al Qadeas affinity for repeating patterns like this, we have had ample reason to screen for these threats. Its time for a new direction in homeland security which includes next generation technologies at our airport screening checkpoints that detect liquid explosives and plastic explosives.

Its also time to assess how much progress weve made in the war on terrorism. With resources diverted to an ongoing civil war in Iraq, Osama bin Laden still at large, a nuclear arms race in Iran and North Korea, the Taliban regaining strength in Afghanistan and escalating violence in the Middle East, are we safer than we were five years ago?

http://www.housedemocrats.gov/news/librarydetail.cfm?li...

10 years ago. Similar plot twarted. No countries were invaded. No lives were lost.
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IChing Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 09:46 PM
Response to Reply #20
38. Thanks and it was never really used for such political purposes either
I, myself, never suggested it didn't happen. The border guard in Canada who discovered a plot on the LA airport was never used as such terror politics
that is thrust upon the American psyche for political purposes.

I still question timing, prior use of talking points by Cheney and other ambiguities of the incident.
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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 10:07 PM
Response to Reply #20
39. Are We Safer Today Than We Were Five Years Ago?
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Strelnikov_ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 10:23 PM
Response to Reply #20
45. Demonstrates How Little They Have Really Done
After 9/11, it would seem rolling out security screening measures to address a known tactic would be a top priority.

Guess they could not figure out how to turn a profit on it.
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Freedom_from_Chains Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 09:35 PM
Response to Original message
23. OK, so please tell us what you "absolutely" know about this
terror plot.
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Zhade Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 05:53 AM
Response to Reply #23
85. I can tell you what the OP knows for certain!
........

uh....

...well, two lying governments SAID there was a plot...

...and...


um....

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pooja Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 09:37 PM
Response to Original message
27. Why don't we all just wait a few days. Let the reports come.
Then decide what we think. If anything... nothing bad happened. Why this became the biggest story of the day is beyond me, but whenever its election and the media are tired of showing blown up children, they latch on and run. Let the hype, hype down. Listen, no harm done. Military have not taken to the streets. They aren't invading our homes and disposing of my cleaning supplies yet. Let it die down and this will become like other events, forgotten news.

"Next up, photos of TomKat's baby.... and the drivel goes on.
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Marie26 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 09:39 PM
Response to Original message
30. Woo-hoo!
:rofl:
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Jed Dilligan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 09:39 PM
Response to Original message
31. Why do you care so much?
What harm is it doing for people to question it? I think that blindly dismissing everything that comes out of government/media as a lie can be rather subversive at a grass-roots level. I tend to believe there really was a terror plot, but it heartens me to see the system doubted nonetheless.
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ClassWarrior Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 09:41 PM
Response to Reply #31
34. Oooooh. Well put!
B-) :thumbsup:

NGU.


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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 10:28 PM
Response to Reply #34
47. yes, good post and I like you Bryon Kennedy sign
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ClassWarrior Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 10:44 PM
Response to Reply #47
52. Thanks - borrowed it from another WIDUer.
:hi:

NGU.


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The Straight Story Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 11:02 PM
Response to Reply #31
58. I think people care because they are sick of federal employees being
treated like they are bushbots who lick his feet each morning and asking how they can prop him up more.

Real people, with real jobs, are working their butts off to stop attacks. If they find something some folks here rush to say it is all a farce. It is all tied to bush. Everything and anything.

The 1999 plot was under clinton, it was announced, and folks were glad the perps were caught beforehand. Clinton didn't catch the guy, an alert guard did (IIRC).

Stop a terror plot now - it's propoganda, timing is raised, etc. One happens and we call mihop, or wonder why it wasn't stopped, etc. Seems the blinders are on when it comes to some issues.

Wonder what our elected dems are saying about it, or are they part of the conspiracy of lies as well? I will check the senate sites for dems and see if they feel it is all lies.
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Jed Dilligan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 09:33 AM
Response to Reply #58
96. If we had to respect people because they are employed by the Fed,
or agree with elected Democrats about anything, I and probably most of DU wouldn't be here.
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6000eliot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 09:40 PM
Response to Original message
33. A "real" liberal is skeptical and questions authority.
Let's see some evidence, and then we can talk.
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Rex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 09:42 PM
Response to Original message
35. Welcome to the days of 911. 5 years later.
Same fights, same arguments. World keeps turning and we keep killing each other off. Wash, rinse, repeat.
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raysr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 09:43 PM
Response to Original message
36. I believe NOTHING
Edited on Thu Aug-10-06 09:56 PM by raysr
this adminstrations says! I also don't believe in coinsidences. If EVER there is a coinsidence, this ain't it! This is more political bullshit! Quit being afraid for christsake. These motherfuckers have been lying to us for 6 years, this is no different than the Osama tape right be the 2004 election.

Please, don't fall for this bullshit! The UK in on this scam up to their necks too. Is Saddam responsible for this too? So how does support or non-support for the war in Iraq have anything to do with this? Also, if this shit just keeps happening that's proof that the Iraq war isn't doing any good against the war on terra.

Why are the fundies scared? They want to die anyway!
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Voltaire99 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 10:12 PM
Response to Original message
40. Thank you, IselaB, for injecting what the debate has needed.
I'd noticed a dearth of loud, reckless posts demanding doctrinaire belief in government propaganda.

So had you, apparently.
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niallmac Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 10:14 PM
Response to Original message
41. Who says it aint real? I am sure they really kidnapped two soldiers.
Edited on Thu Aug-10-06 10:16 PM by niallmac
The problem is the messenger. We hear what they want us to hear.
Want to start a war or improve your poll numbers? Alert the media.
Homeland Security should know that the code color system
has been politicized to the point no one believes a thing.

So- This one is real? Can you think of some terror warnings in the recent past that were BS?
I can

Now then, what do I do with this information? Seems like I really didn't need to know.
Isn't this a matter for the security folks? I don't get to know what Cheney and his Big Oil
cronies talk about when national energy policy is being made. Why on earth do I need to
know about this? Oh I am sure it is not because it serves someones propaganda agenda.

Don't lecture DUers for their skepticism. It is well earned. Credibility is pretty damned
important when talking about terrorism isn't it Bushco? Good reason not to
spend it on vote grabbing politics instead of public safety.

I reserve my right to call bull shit.

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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 10:15 PM
Response to Original message
42. I think something went down over there--The facts have yet to come
out (maybe).

It does benefit BushCo which makes me want to debunk it--yet my gut says wait and see. Something happened (foiled plot) that is for sure.
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leesa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 10:21 PM
Response to Original message
43. Ok.Ok. 19 boxcutter wielding Muslims = reality OK. Dealing with reality
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Wheezy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 10:23 PM
Response to Original message
44. you rang?
signed,

Jesus Christ, dealing with it.
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Swamp Rat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 10:26 PM
Response to Original message
46. What are you talking about?

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Just Me Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 10:31 PM
Response to Original message
48. What was "real" ten years ago sure has changed. WHY?!?!?!
"V FOR VENGENCE".

Messing with ya' kid.

Gee, what's changed in the last five or so years?

Well, a whole helluva' lot more of the world HATES US. Gee, I wonder why?

It's more difficult to make a decent living. Gee, I wonder why?

Psyop-type fear-mongering pervades our media. Gee, I wonder why?

CEOs are making a killing while common folks are struggling. Gee, I wonder why?

MILLIONS OF HUMAN BEINGS have had their lives shattered or displaced. Gee, I wonder why?

TENS OF MILLIONS OR MORE HUMAN BEINGS OBJECT TO THE LEADERSHIPS OF THE U.S.A., G.B., ISRAEL,....gee, I wonder why?

"Collective punishment" imposed by oppressors in the past have ALWAYS drawn "collective humanity" against such oppression.

Hitler didn't have the power those neocon/AIPAC types possessed. Imagine,...these people have actually encouraged atrocities against humanity, as a whole (they don't "discriminate" like Hitler) and are perfectly prepared to take down, to RISK their own countries in order to "rule the earth".

Stupid, arrogant, fuckers. I hope,...well, it doesn't matter what I hope. I DEMAND the RULE OF LAW be applied to these "crazies". I'll demand that until the day I die.
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AZBlue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 10:32 PM
Response to Original message
49. Isela - I worship the ground you walk on!!!
I've been beating my head against the same wall all day - and I have quite a headache! And the more I do the more I'm convinced that people claim it's all false as a way to deal with a scary and uncomfortable issue. It's easier to laugh it off as a Bush absurdity than to face the fact that someone might want to blow up the next plane you get on.

I'm so glad to see a voice of reason! Thank you!!!
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KAZ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 10:48 PM
Response to Reply #49
56. Yes, you just now figured that out?
That a good portion of the world wants to "blow us up"? Where have you been? And we're dealing with this how? By blowing other people up? I'm "uncomfortable" with mindless, sophomoric responses. And yes, we have a tendency to distrust that which our government tells us. And you don't? Let me help you with that head banging.
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Quantess Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 11:39 PM
Response to Reply #56
61. B*sh's self-fulfilling prophecy.
It worked.
Terrorists DO hate the the U.S.A.
Heckuva job, Bushie!
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KAZ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 10:34 PM
Response to Original message
50. That's it? Your swan song? So disapointed...
... that's not 6 months worthy.
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quiet.american Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 10:39 PM
Response to Original message
51. I do not buy Bushco rhetoric on this, or that they've done jack --
-- Or that they've done jack to make this country safer. I also am waiting to see how the story progresses over the next few days. If it follows the usual pattern, we will learn that the Bushco TERRA, TERRA, FEAR, FEAR meme was almost 100% hype on Bushco's part. This is not to say that there was/is no actual threat to the safety of airline passengers. It is to say that Bushco's bloviating about the situation probably has very little to do with the actual reality of it. Why would they change their ways now?
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WildEyedLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 10:48 PM
Response to Original message
53. God no kidding
There is as much denial of reality on DU as there is on FR.
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BlueJac Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 10:48 PM
Response to Original message
54. Go back to Rush.............
and drive by media.
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greenbriar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 10:48 PM
Response to Original message
55. this is just another ploy
they knew about this last Friday and did nothing until it would help them
politically


why should we take it seriously?

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RagAss Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 10:51 PM
Response to Original message
57. Kudos to the Brits......so why is the Chimp taking bows????
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earth mom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 11:12 PM
Response to Original message
59. NO-YOU DEAL WITH IT!
YOU DEAL with the criminal corruption that is running rampant in D.C.! You deal with your DENIAL that is so blinding that you can't see that the real terrorists are the ones in charge! Blair and * are best buddies remember?

That is REALITY.

The evidence is mounting against those bastards, only they have a stranglehold on everything from the Corporate Media Whores to the Supreme Court. They've stolen elections and have done a shitload of underhanded and illegal things to remain in control and in power.

That is REALITY.

Why would anyone believe any thing the neocons say or do anymore? It's just common sense to never trust a LIAR after you catch them in a lie!

That is REALITY.

So don't paint any of us as not dealing with reality when TRUTH is first and foremost on our minds! WE HAVE ABSOLUTELY NO ILLUSIONS ANY MORE!

That is REALITY.

Those who are silent and go along with ANY thing the neocons do at this point, have blood on their hands! The blood of the 9/11 victims, the blood of the Iraqi victims, the blood of the Katrina victims. Who's next? Syria?! Iran?!

Hope you can live with that REALITY, because I can't!
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dollydew Donating Member (127 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 11:31 PM
Response to Original message
60. Truth?
Well, I truly hope that they someday find the anthrax killer. People did die from that attack. Why not keep the alert level at maximum until the plotter is caught? Again, if true I'm glad the airline attack was foiled. But if there is such concern for our personal safety and terrorism, again, where is the anthrax killer? Why no regular updates about that?
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ruggerson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 11:42 PM
Response to Original message
62. Right on!
Sometimes I feel towards some of these folks as I imagine a moderate Republican feels about the religious rightwing.
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bloom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 11:46 PM
Response to Original message
63. that works both ways
Edited on Thu Aug-10-06 11:47 PM by bloom
what is your proof that it is true?

Because the Corporate media said so? Because Bush or Blair or some other tool said so? I need more than that.


I never assume any of this crap is true - and don't expect to assume one way or another - for a few days or a week anyway. Usually by that time - the truth actually does come out.

(And it's not what people like you insisted we believe on day one).
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OneBlueSky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 01:58 AM
Response to Reply #63
69. exactly . . . given the BushCo record for truthfulness . . .
anything and everything they say or do is immediately and automatically suspect . . .

the BushCo record is SO bad, it invites not only suspicion, but outright disbelief . . . the opening assumption is always that they're lying -- because that's mostly what they DO . . .
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kentuck Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 11:53 PM
Response to Original message
64. You have no facts and we have no facts..
Therefore the only rational position is to be skeptical.
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spanone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-10-06 11:58 PM
Response to Original message
65. I believe the Bush* POLICIES are responsible for this shit.
that's what I believe. Whether it's true or not really doesn't matter. The truth went out with the 2000 election.
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treestar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 12:02 AM
Response to Original message
66. Baloney. We have good reason to be suspicious
And raising an issue is allowed. It is called thinking. It is stupid to just run in fear because the MSM says something. We know they put on acts, from past experience. We know they exaggerate, just for drama.

We have been played on this before. The right wing USES 911 to gain power. It USES every one of these incidents to gain power. And some of the incidents in the past have turned out to be exaggerated. So suspicion now is the only intelligent response.

And most of us are way above black and white thinking. Being suspicious is not equal to be able to prove a fake. We know that. But we have reason to wonder.

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Eurobabe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 03:35 AM
Response to Reply #66
78. Right on...Question AUTHORITY!
Use your brain. Since when is questioning a bad thing? And why was Tony Poodle teleconferencing * the day after Lieberman lost the Dem primary in CT? Methinks the Repubes see the writing on the wall. No more wars -- boohoo!!! SO let's drag out the boogie man to whip the masses back into constant fear. Blame it on Al Qaeda and let's go after Syria, Iran, etc.

No sorry, I think we're being played again. Six years of these lying bastards and I have become completely cynical of anything they say, do or have done. I don't believe a damn word out of their mouths, either the Brits or the Americans.
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Pastiche423 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 12:24 AM
Response to Original message
67. lol
The Decider's and the Poodle's reality?

No fucking way.

Maybe when you grow up and pay attention, you'll realize what most posters on this thread have known for five+ years.
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leftofthedial Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 12:28 AM
Response to Original message
68. My friends and I have a plot to enable the Cubs to win
the World Series this year


Better call off the rest of the baseball season.
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mtnester Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 09:03 AM
Original message
Doomed to fail too
:) reds fan!
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 02:02 AM
Response to Original message
70. %#WIIO!!@()@!!!!!!!!!1111111
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Freedom_Aflaim Donating Member (745 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 02:08 AM
Response to Original message
71. The threat is real. Our response is ASSINE
I do respect reality, and reality is that you cannot keep the public safe by harrassing the public.

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Zhade Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 05:57 AM
Response to Reply #71
87. How do you know this threat is real? Because proven liars said so?
NT!

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Mandate My Ass Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 11:39 AM
Response to Reply #71
102. asinine?
or rather, I guess, from the general tone of this thread:

ASININE!

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DeepModem Mom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 02:16 AM
Response to Original message
72. Thank you -- K&R.
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mogster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 02:50 AM
Response to Original message
74. OK, I can see your point
And I'm happy that no people died, that's for sure.

I'm also happy that we're liberals. That means we don't buy anything raw, wether it's a terror-plot that seems untrue or the inevitable questioning concerning the terror-plot that seems untrue.
Debate about it is our way to handle the question, and when questions arise this board (and it's users) shows it's true quality by also being devil's advocates. That's appreciated :hi:
I'll deal with it like a liberal that's seen to much to not investigate.
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CJCRANE Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 02:54 AM
Response to Original message
75. NO ONE said
Scotland Yard manufactured the plot. The intelligence comes from MI5/MI6 in association with CIA and ISI.

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GeorgeGist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 05:18 AM
Response to Original message
79. some liberals know it's wiser to suspect reality...
until it's proven true or false.
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Philosoraptor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 05:34 AM
Response to Original message
81. IselaB has LEFT the building, exit stage Right
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Zhade Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 05:55 AM
Response to Original message
86. The onus of evidence rests with the US/UK governments.
Two governments, I might add, infamous for its lies - on Iraq, and many, many other things.

The fact is, we were told there was a plot by known liars. Deal with THAT like a liberal who respects reality, because that's all we have to go on right now - the say-so of proven liars.

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marions ghost Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 06:24 AM
Response to Original message
88. JESUS CHRIST IselaB
DEFINE REALITY

Where is this 'reality' you speak of like you know where it is?

Maybe it's buried somewhere in the desert with those WMD.
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Child_Of_Isis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 09:03 AM
Response to Original message
91. DEAL WITH IT LIKE A LIBERAL WHO RESPECTS NEOCON REALITY.
Everyone is out to kill us.

This is neocon reality.
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qanda Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 09:09 AM
Response to Original message
93. Again, how many of these threads are going to be started?
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AngryOldDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 09:09 AM
Response to Original message
94. Thank you!
Someone who has FINALLY cut through all the bullshit here.

There are just as many on the left as on the right who wear the blinders.

K&R
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praeclarus Donating Member (203 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 09:19 AM
Response to Original message
95. DEAL WITH IT LIKE THE DOG WHO'S BEING WAGGED
by his tail. :)

Catch that movie, it's very good.

Now if anybody happens to be in MIHOP or LIHOP camp
like meself, this latest, if of that nature, would
have been delegated to one of the summer interns
from GWU Political "Management" department.

Believe NOTHING they tell you.
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zanne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 09:37 AM
Response to Original message
97. When somebody has lied to me in the past...
Especially about something VERY important,(like why we should invade a country), I just can't believe them again. Call it what you will; some people would call it cynicism, some would call it realism, but they would NEVER HAVE THE RIGHT TO PUT THE BLAME ON ME! Put the blame for this where it belongs; the GOP and the Bush administration. The boy cried wolf too often; now he's paying the price.
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hedgehog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 09:38 AM
Response to Original message
98. Two Words : Lockerbie, Scotland
Just because I'm paranoid doesn't mean that they aren't out to get me!


Bush may be a jerk, but that doesn't mean that we have cornered the market on jerks.
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Bretttido Donating Member (754 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 09:47 AM
Response to Original message
99. Deal with reality people
It's one thing to be SKEPTICAL, it's quite another to jump to conspiracy conclusions. If you want to be quoted and painted as bat-shit crazy and screw over our chances in November, do it somewhere else... like freeper-land.
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sui generis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 09:53 AM
Response to Original message
100. okay here's a dose of reality for you
Edited on Fri Aug-11-06 09:54 AM by sui generis
the laws of chemistry HAVE NOT CHANGED.

So why did the professionals charged with our security start confiscating toenail clippers after someone stole a plane using boxcutters? An absurd over reaction to cover up the fact that they are idiots.

And so why are we confiscating bottled water as if it is just now suddenly a threat? Because we're trying to cover up more incompetence with an over reaction.

I am truly deeply ashamed of the lack of competence and the basic lack of common smarts of the Department of Homeland Security, and of the TSA, either way. They've had years to confiscate gels and bottled water. All of a sudden it's a national emergency?

Wow.
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Philosoraptor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 03:23 PM
Response to Reply #100
105. A 24 hour cheap trick, that many fell for.
Exactly like the Miami 7 24 hour story, it too was on the bushmedia t.v. show.

A cheap trick, because nothing actually happened, yet millions are amazed and astonished and terrified and annoyed at the airport and millions were lost.

What an odd nation.
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Javaman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 11:31 AM
Response to Original message
101. JESUS CHRIST PEOPLE THE CAPS ARE KILLING ME...
First off I will never ever believe a single thing they* tell us. They lie about everything and they have basically turned half the population into conspiracy theorists.

give me one example where they have told us the truth? just one? you will be hard pressed to find it.

Second, I will always question authority, especially when they say what they are doing "is for my own good". Anyone that gives you that load, is never looking out for your "own good".

and thirdly, the timing of this latest charade is impeccable. has the late summer become the terrorist season? Pul-eeeze.

I don't trust any of this mother fuckers. And that's what they are.

We are now inside the 3 month window of the midterms. I expect more bullshit to be flung in our direction. We Democrats are wearing our slickers, however, the repuke stand there covered in shit and asking for more.
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mhatrw Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 03:22 PM
Response to Original message
104. CODE RED! CODE RED! CODE RED!
Some liberals are not falling for the Chicken Little act anymore!

This is an all-points bulletin to the REALITY-BASED community. We demand that all liberals RESPECT OUR REALITY!
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EstimatedProphet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 03:29 PM
Response to Original message
106. Just because we doubt the media circus doesn't mean we're nuts!
The story about what happened in England may be a reality. However, the story as it was told to us by our lapdog media is nothing more that a panic attack and a cudgel to beat up Democrats. Does believing that the media hyped this to exploit fear mean to you that someone thinks the whole story is a fabrication?
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maddezmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-11-06 03:44 PM
Response to Original message
107. locking
Closing down this hit and run rant.
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