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Meanwhile, Israel is still bombing the shit out of Lebanon

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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-03-06 08:39 AM
Original message
Meanwhile, Israel is still bombing the shit out of Lebanon
They're bombing the southern suburbs of Beirut and they're bombing Southern Lebanon today. How many more dead civilians will it take before the U.S. finally pushes for a ceasefire? The silence from the administration and Congress is deafening. And it won't stop until the U.S. forcefully tells Israel, in no uncertain terms, that it has to stop.
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-03-06 08:42 AM
Response to Original message
1. Make that the US and Britain
I noticed on BBC that they are now making the Security Council the scapegoat because Bush and Blair refuse to budge. Word is that France insists on an immediate cease fire before agreeing to provide troops.
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Lerkfish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-03-06 08:45 AM
Response to Original message
2. The PNAC has no desire to stop, the entire plan is working well
in their minds.
By completely destroying the country of lebanon, they hope to draw in Syria and Iran, justifying their attack on Iran.
The attack on Iran has been planned for over a year now, and its why they are warehousing the troops in baghdad, behind protective walls, gearing up for the invasion.

Once Syria and Iran are drawn in, mission accomplished.

What's taking so long is both Syria and Iran realize this, and are holding out as long as possible.


This has been your lesson in sneaky underhanded politics 101. Please use a number two pencil.
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ShortnFiery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-03-06 08:52 AM
Response to Reply #2
5. It won't work ... the patience for the Iraqi Quagmire is running out
Edited on Thu Aug-03-06 08:53 AM by ShortnFiery
AND there's NO desire on the American Populace's part for ANY CONFLICT with IRAN. Those bastards better have plenty of Mercs, otherwise all they will be able to do is Aerial Bombing of Iran.

They're certifiably insane if they believe that ANY manipulations - even another (Heaven Forbid) Terror Attack here - would motivate Americans to sacrifice their children to the Middle East.

It's close to the end game ... their war profiteering and LIES have played out to granting the Neo-Cons ZERO Credibility with both The World Community AND The American Populace.
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Lerkfish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-03-06 08:53 AM
Response to Reply #5
6. foolhardiness of their plans has yet to stop them
unfortunately.

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ShortnFiery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-03-06 08:54 AM
Response to Reply #6
7. The People will stop THEM. Of that I'm sure. :-)
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leftchick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-03-06 09:02 AM
Response to Reply #5
11. they have given the go ahead to Israel for a Syria attack...
rational thought oand logical consequences have not stopped them yet.....

<snip>

The IDF was also concerned about a possible Syrian attack in response to the ongoing IDF operations in Lebanon. It was also known that Syria had increased its alert out of fear in Damascus that Israel might attack.

Defense officials told the Post last week that they were receiving indications from the US that America would be interested in seeing Israel attack Syria.

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=115329203296...
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ShortnFiery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-03-06 11:05 AM
Response to Reply #11
27. Then the Neo-Cons are going to be Rudely awakened at the
lack of recruits to fill in the ranks.

Americans will NOT go over to the Middle East for a NEW war.

The Will of The People will stop The War Machine, AGAIN.

It was not ever our blessed representatives, democratic or republican that stopped these contrived wars of aggression ... it stops only when the people stop sending their Children to fight and die. It will NOT work because The People will NOT fight for a lie that they NOW fully realize.
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bluedog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-03-06 08:57 AM
Response to Reply #2
8. 3 weeks* still hasn't called Israels' PM
hows that for leadership? and this just shows that * supports the murders of children in Lebanon......sick SOB.....
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-03-06 09:00 AM
Response to Reply #8
10. That's to be expected, but
Congress? So far out of all 500+ members, only four have called for a ceasefire; Hagel, Kucinich, Leahy and Murtha.
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Virginia Dare Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-03-06 09:03 AM
Response to Reply #8
12. Oh, he'll get around to it...
maybe after his 9 day vacation. :mad:
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earth mom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-03-06 03:20 PM
Response to Reply #12
33. But first he must eat cake and strum a guitar and oh yeah, cut brush.
:grr:
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leftchick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-03-06 08:48 AM
Response to Original message
3. Southern Beruit
bomb the shit out of is right....



Destruction caused by Israeli air strikes in the southern suburbs of Beirut. Israel has launched fresh air strikes on Beirut after a lull of several days in its onslaught which Lebanese officials say has killed more than 900 nationals and wounded over 3,000 others in three weeks.(AFP/Patrick Baz)
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Eurobabe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-03-06 08:51 AM
Response to Original message
4. Too busy, either going on vacay or getting ready for it
WTF?? This is unbelievable.
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Violet_Crumble Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-03-06 09:00 AM
Response to Original message
9. It's been such a resoundingly successful tactic...
The only thing Israel's been successful with is causing the deaths of so many Lebanese civilians. When it comes to military aims, I noticed this morning that they've downgraded from 'destroying Hezbollah' to 'disarming Hezbollah'. And fast on the claim from the Israeli govt that they'd gotten the best of Hezbollah, over 200 rockets were fired into Israel. If there weren't Israeli and Lebanese civilians bearing the brunt of this, it'd almost be laughable. Israel tried to destroy Hezbollah around ten years ago and you'd think they'd have learnt after that time that bombing the shit out of things just doesn't achieve anything but the needless deaths of innocent civilians and quite understandable international anger....
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-03-06 09:07 AM
Response to Reply #9
13. Hasn't it been,
Nearly a thousand dead, and the mideast in more of a crisis than it's been in years. Olmert's doing a bang up job.
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Violet_Crumble Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-03-06 09:19 AM
Response to Reply #13
16. Olmert's a huge disappointment...
I had been hoping when he was elected that he'd be okay, but now I'm thinking it's a case of a lack-lustre political personality trying to fill the huge shoes left by Sharon (as much as I detested Sharon, he did have great charisma) by doing what he figures will get him auto-hero status. He's gotten to trot out a few almost Churchillian speeches, but doesn't seem to be aware (or if he is, he isn't admitting it) that Israel's actions are causing the opposite of what he wants. Hezbollah now enjoys hero-like status across the Arab states, Nasrallah is a household name, and central Israel has now been shown not to be beyond the reach of rockets. And that latter fact feeds into the existential fears of the Israeli population and just makes them more insecure and scared than they already were. He's got a lot to answer for, as have Hezbollah and the US...
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stray cat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-03-06 09:17 AM
Response to Original message
14. Isn't a cease fire available if the soldiers are returned
and firing missles at civilians in Israel is stopped? It looks to me like the only people who want a ceasefire are the lebanese civilians while Hezbollah and Israel are intent on finishing their job. Israel wants to wipe out the threat from Hezbollah and Hezbollah wants to destroy Israel - meanwhile its the civilians who suffer.
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-03-06 09:29 AM
Response to Reply #14
17. It's simple.
There are too many civilians dying, and it has to stop. Lebanon is being destroyed, and that takes precedence over anything else.
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BillZBubb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-03-06 09:57 AM
Response to Reply #14
21. No, a cease fire isn't available because Israel said NO!
The conditions you suggest were brought up and rejected totally by Olmert and Israel. Either you know that, have forgotten it, or don't have the facts. Hezbollah had earlier agreed to a cease fire along those lines. They offered to negotiate.

When asked about those very conditions for a ceasefire, Olmert said Israel will not stop until "Hezbollah has been eliminated".
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mom cat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-03-06 02:21 PM
Response to Reply #14
32. Actually, Hezbolla does not want this to continue and agreed to the EU
Peace Plan last Saturday. Israel and the US have said NO!
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Jacobin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-03-06 09:18 AM
Response to Original message
15. Why do you hate Israel, err, Murka?
:sarcasm:
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-03-06 09:31 AM
Response to Reply #15
18. Actually, it's kind of funny
I've been called an apologist for Israel on several occasions.
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BillZBubb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-03-06 09:59 AM
Response to Reply #18
22. By me at least once! I confess.
I'm starting to reconsider. Either you've seen the light or I caught you in one unenlightened moment.
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-03-06 10:02 AM
Response to Reply #22
23. Actually,
I've been consistent in my opinions for a long time. I've posted in I/P for quite a while. You might consider, at least for a moment, that you're the one who may have some unenlightened ideas.
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BillZBubb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-03-06 10:08 AM
Response to Reply #23
24. No, my ideas are always enlightened.
That is not a problem.
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GreenArrow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-03-06 09:32 AM
Response to Original message
19. "nits make lice"
:sarcasm:
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-03-06 09:52 AM
Response to Reply #19
20. Frankly,
I see statements such as yours, as adding nothing to the debate but fuel for flame wars.
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GreenArrow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-03-06 12:24 PM
Response to Reply #20
30. ah yes, "flame wars"....
because "the debate" is so productive of...of...of...what, exactly?

Nits make lice. The players are different, the play is the same.

http://community.livejournal.com/unitarian_jihad/98322....

<Haditha, Atrocity and a Poem

The other day one of the apparently dozens of readers of this blog asked me why I had not written about the war for a while. More particularly he was concerned that I had not said anything about the atrocity apparently committed by Marines in Haditha. Of course, in confronting the reality of the current regime (in America, I mean) there are so many daily outrages that it is hard to maintain that laser like focus on Iraq. It is easy to be distracted.

But you cannot keep your head turned forever. The screaming and anguish will eventually penetrate any other preoccupation and demand attention.

So it is with Haditha. An atrocity. Again.

War itself, even when it can be justified on some level of self defense or noble sacrifice to higher ideals, is always an ongoing atrocity. The purpose of war is to kill, maim and destroy, to sap the will of the enemy to resist in any way. Even if conducted by the set-piece rules and traditions that respect civilian and non-combatants it is a brutal business. Modern warfare hardly pretends there is a distinction.

Some historians trace the modern trend to the British when they loosed the Royal Navy to bombard Copenhagen during the Napoleonic wars simply because they had the power to do so and the Danes would not side with them. But of course in North America the Red Coats had used Indian allies and axillaries to depopulate French colonies and later the American frontier. But that was far away and the nobles of the court and the Commons need hardly to acknowledge the bloody business. <snip>

"Somewhere in Africa a small boy lies,

his mothers reedy arm stretches over him

the perfect picture of sweet repose

until a closer look reveals his spilling brains

and is mothers head, half severed,

stares backward at her crumpled feet.

The horror of that dead child shakes us,

taps well springs of pity

and of blank incomprehension

at alien ferocity.



Yet



Nits make lice, the old hero said

when some irksome scribe inquired

about the latest massacre on the plains

about the private parts of mere squaws

cut out and stretched over troopers pommels,

about limp and tattered ragbag babes

tossed from saber tip to saber tip

in a macabre game of polo.



Nits make lice.



And in the relentless logic of war,

it is utter and irrefutable truth

that todays laughing toddler may,

in fifteen years or so, draw a bead

upon your own beloved child.



Nits make lice.



Better, after all, much better

to kill him now to save lives later,

to cast off foolish sentiment,

that useless relic of Victorian ladies

swooning with the vapors

over the lost innocence of youth.



Nits make lice.



And so our resolve firms

and our method, honed by enlightened science

far out-strips the stumbling, drunken troopers

wild careen against a sleeping village

until whole cities of breeding, pestilential vermin

may efficiently be incinerated.



Nits make lice.



Yet



Something in us stirs still at that

dead Hutu child, yearning to save his life,

or failing that, to end the carnage

before the play of others is macheteed away.



Nits make lice.



Impossible, impossible to save that child alone

the mother, too, aunts and grandmas,

brothers, cousins, fathers

even the wild-eyed ones who first

wet their knives on Tutsi babes

and opened Pandora Box of sweet revenge

all, all must be as valued as the boy,

to save one all must be saved.



Nits make lice.



To save the nit,

we must even love the louse."

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Tierra_y_Libertad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-03-06 10:11 AM
Response to Original message
25. It's for their own good. Birth pangs. Collateral damage. Regrettable.
Such things happen.
Sad.
We do everything possible to prevent civilian casualties.
It will be investigated.
Tragic accidents happen.
Tsk, tsk.
You must look at the bigger picture.
What else could we do?
We have a right to defend ouselves.
War is hell.
They should have left after being warned.
We had to destroy the village in order to save it.
We received fire from the village.
They brought it upon themselves.
They did it first.

The murderers always have justifications for their murders.
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theHandpuppet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-03-06 10:36 AM
Response to Original message
26. Was listening to An Aussie news correspondent...
... who said the whole of South Beirut now looks like something you'd see in a grainy, B&W photo from WWII. People are so afraid to go near bombed out areas of Tyre they won't even try to retrieve the bodies of their dead, so the stench of rotting corpses is everywhere. Who knows the true death count in this bloody dance of madness?

The Israeli govt are fools if they think the slaughter if Lebanon will make them safer. They have only fanned the fires of hatred and created new generations of terrorists around the Arab world.
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ShortnFiery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-03-06 11:12 AM
Response to Reply #26
28. And our Dear Leader is heading off to Crawford later today for
his Summer V A C A TION! :puke: :thumbsdown:

Could this Neo-Con ghoul Executive Branch behave any more ANTI-DIPLOMATIC? No! Don't answer that. :P :blush:
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Beelzebud Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-03-06 11:13 AM
Response to Original message
29. The Neo-Conservatives don't want that.
Weather they be Republican Neo-Cons, or Democratic Neo-Cons.
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bigtree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-03-06 12:28 PM
Response to Original message
31. how many more is the question
how many more Lebanese lives? this notion of overwhelming force conquering all has been demonstrated false more than once in history. Besides, the Israelis aren't hitting their stated target with their airstrikes as much as they are slaughtering innocents. There has to be some accounting of their assaults.
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