Which Of The Following Statements Are Anti-Semitic?

[DemocratSinceBirth]

Poll question: Which Of The Following Statements Are Anti-Semitic?

Poll result (77 votes)
Jews Control The U S Government	(2 votes, 3%)	Vote
Jews Control The U S Media	(0 votes, 0%)	Vote
Bob Dylan Is A "Heeb"	(2 votes, 3%)	Vote
Mel Gibson Could Solve His Problems By Writing A "Fat Check" To The Jewish Community	(0 votes, 0%)	Vote
Jews Aren't Really Jews But Kazhars	(0 votes, 0%)	Vote
Defacing Property Owned By Jews In Italy Is A Legitimate Form Of Protest	(1 votes, 1%)	Vote
All Of The Above	(60 votes, 78%)	Vote
None Of The Above	(12 votes, 16%)	Vote

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

1. Any statement that says or implies

that everyone in any given group are a "certain way", any statement that puts a demeaning name upon a group shows intolerance and a lack of understanding towards that group.

[dipsydoodle]

5. Anti Semitic and bigot

are in themselves both demeaning names which are bandied about far too - generally just to shut people up.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

7. If I Made Disparaging Remarks About Any Group

If I made disparaging remarks about any group I would expect all right minded people to shun me as a bigot.

[gulfcoastliberal]

14. Uh huh, yeah and racist is used that way, too.

After all, the Japanese have bought Hawaii. And they aren't very good drivers. They terrorize the roads.

[zbdent]

2. Weren't the Righties claiming that the Jews

controlled Hollywood?

[Zynx]

8. That can be lumped under media.

[Michael_UK]

25. I've often thought that ...

the conservative meme of "the secular liberal elite" is basically code for the Jews.

[npincus]

3. I suppose the "Defacing Property..." supporter was also

a big fan of Kristallnacht. Not to mention the pogroms in 19th and 20th-century Russia.

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

4. And there are four of those, at current count.

This should be interesting to watch. Any of the people who voted "None of the above" care to explain their position?

[Lurking Dem]

6. This should be interesting.

[gulfcoastliberal]

15. I'm guessing they have Nazi shrines in their homes.

And listen raptly to old recordings of Goebbels.

[npincus]

16. I'm hoping the "none of the abovers" are Freepers

trying to give DU a bad name. Hope springs eternal.

[Lurking Dem]

23. Up to 9 now.

Simply amazing.

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

24. And still nobody willing to explain their position. n/t

[rock]

9. Truth trumps prejudice

Any statement that is true is automatically NOT anti-Semitic (but a simple statement of fact). On the other hand, many of your examples are very judgemental and therefore hard to pin down as to their truth. They are all designed to inflame.

[Lurking Dem]

11. Black people

have big lips.

[rock]

12. Makes my point dontcha think?

It's objectively false (if you mean ALL black people).

[Lurking Dem]

13. If somebody BELIEVES it to be true

and they are using an "all" they are a frank bigot.

"Truth" does not trump prejudice because truth is subjective.

[rock]

19. "Truth is subjective"

That is correct. Judgemental statements are subjective, and thus my reservation about them. I prefer to think of them as true about the person expressing them (he believes them) but not objectively true. With that disclaimer, I stand by my original statement.

[cali]

17. Every single one of those

has appeared on DU.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

18. I Wanted To Be Subtle.

eom

[Lurking Dem]

20. And more

"Filthy Jew" appeared twice. And "Jew hugger".

Oh. And Holocaust survivors are "overly sensitive".

[DemocratSinceBirth]

21. I Missed Filthy Jew And Jew Hugger

how about big noses?

[Lurking Dem]

22. Haven't seen that one....yet.

I'm wondering if Skinner is having to give the mods amphetamines to keep up with what they're having to delete.

Although the "filthy jew" titles weren't deleted - just renamed. No tombstones. I'm pretty darn sure the "Jew hugger" poster was a CU sock. He got granite.

[in_cog_ni_to]

46. Don't forget

"Zionist Bitch"

[Codeine]

28. Please tell me that's not true.

Somebody actually said Dylan is a "heeb"? People actually claimed Jews run the media and government?

What the fuck, people?! Did I log on to Stalinist Underground on accident?

[jonnyblitz]

33. I saw the Dylan/Heeb one. it's very true!

[Snivi Yllom]

10. you should have added "Israel is a terrorist state" to the poll

and the answer would still correctly be "All of the above."

[Name removed]

34. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Cameron27]

26. So 9 hit and run votes

What the hell kind of a mind does it take to vote THAT?

[DemocratSinceBirth]

27. I'm Curious

I can see some people wanting to mess up polls for shit and kicks but if that's a true reflection of some people's feelings it's frightening and saddening.

[hfojvt]

29. I would have thought that the Khazar statement was partly true

but I just looked it up.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khazars

I still do not see how that statement is anti-semitic, although Wiki says it has been adopted by many anti-Zionists. Is being anti-Zionist also anti-Semitic?
I would like an explanation from the many who answered "all of the above" as to why #1, #2, and #4 are necessarily anti-Semitic. The US government seems to have an irrational devotion to Israel even more so than Canada or Britain and certainly far more than to Deutschland. Is there some strategic or logical reason for this? What do we gain by this except a market for American armaments? Second, the MSM pretty clearly has long had a pro Israel bias. Why?

Why can't a case be made for Jewish control in these matters that is not anti-semitic or based on anti-semitism? Just because an anti-semite would make the same argument, does not mean the argument is anti-semitic. The key to anti-semitism needs to be hatred, not beliefs in conspiracies or questions or cynicism. To me #4 is based on cynicism, more than anti-semitism. Many problems can be 'solved' in our world by writing big checks.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

30. Because They Reinforce Ancient Calumnies Against Jews

eom

[Swamp Rat]

31. Where is the choice: "Are you a Jew?" (said in a condescending tone)?

[TahitiNut]

37. Followed by, "Funny. You don't look Jewish."

[Swamp Rat]

42. GAWD! I have actually heard that MANY times!

I can't believe I left it out of my post! Thx!

[leftofthedial]

32. depending on the context, all may well be anti-Jewish

but none are anti-Semitic, since many (perhaps most) Semites are not Jews.

[Lurking Dem]

35. and there we have it

[Behind the Aegis]

36. This is a recording....

Anti-Semitism (alternatively spelled antisemitism) is hostility toward or prejudice against Jews as a religious, ethnic, or racial group, which can range from individual hatred to institutionalized, violent persecution. The highly explicit ideology of Adolf Hitler's Nazism was the most extreme example of this phenomenon, leading to a genocide of the European Jewry. Anti-Semitism takes different forms:

---snip---

The word antisemitic (antisemitisch in German) was probably first used in 1860 by the Jewish scholar Moritz Steinschneider in the phrase "antisemitic prejudices" (German: "antisemitische Vorurteile"). Steinschneider used this phrase to characterize Ernest Renan's ideas about how "Semitic races" were inferior to "Aryan races." These pseudo-scientific theories concerning race, civilization, and "progress" had become quite widespread in Europe in the second half of the 19th century, especially as Prussian nationalistic historian Heinrich von Treitschke did much to promote this form of racism. In Treitschke's writings Semitic was practically synonymous with Jewish, in contrast to its usage by Renan and others.

German political agitator Wilhelm Marr coined the related German word Antisemitismus in his book "The Way to Victory of Germanicism over Judaism" in 1879. Marr used the phrase to mean Jew-hatred or Judenhass, and he used the new word antisemitism to make hatred of the Jews seem rational and sanctioned by scientific knowledge. Marr's book became very popular, and in the same year he founded the "League of Anti-Semites" ("Antisemiten-Liga"), the first German organization committed specifically to combatting the alleged threat to Germany posed by the Jews, and advocating their forced removal from the country.

---snip---

The term anti-Semitism has historically referred to prejudice towards Jews alone, and this was the only use of this word for more than a century. It does not traditionally refer to prejudice toward other people who speak Semitic languages (e.g. Arabs or Assyrians). Bernard Lewis, Professor of Near Eastern Studies Emeritus at Princeton University, says that "Anti-Semitism has never anywhere been concerned with anyone but Jews."<8>

In recent decades some groups have argued that the term should be extended to include prejudice against Arabs, Anti-Arabism, in the context of accusations of Arab anti-Semitism; further, some, including the Islamic Association of Palestine, have argued that this implies that Arabs cannot, by definition, be anti-Semitic. The argument for such extension comes out of the claim that since the Semitic language family includes Arabic, Hebrew and Aramaic languages, and the historical term "Semite" refers to all those who consider themselves descendants of the Biblical Shem, anti-Semitism should be likewise inclusive. This usage is not generally accepted.

source

[leftofthedial]

39. convenient how that lets off the anti-semitism hook

Jews who hate Palestinians, or Arabs, or Christians, or Muslims . . .

Sem·ite
n.
1. A member of a group of Semitic-speaking peoples of the Near East and northern Africa, including the Arabs, Arameans, Babylonians, Carthaginians, Ethiopians, Hebrews, and Phoenicians.
2. A Jew.
3. Bible. A descendant of Shem.

"1" is better than "2," I believe.

[Lurking Dem]

40. It's not convenient

It's common usage.

[Behind the Aegis]

41. You obviously didn't understand.

"Anti-Semitism" was a falsely created word. However, it has come to mean one thing, and one thing only, hate and discrimination against JEWS! In your very definition, it explains HOW the misnomer got its footing in the late 1800's. The word is what it is. Anyone that hates Muslims for being Muslim is ISLAMAPHOBIC. Anyone who hates Arabs for being Arabs is RACIST or ANTI-ARABIC. Anyone who hates Jews for being Jews is ANTI-SEMITIC!

[High Plains]

38. My favorite anti-semitic code word for Jews: "rootless cosmopolitans"

I'd like to name a band that.

[T Town Jake]

43. All of the above, of course. But I see we already have 12 little...

...Mein Kampf aficionados who've contributed to your poll - and I'll bet not one of them has the courage to come forward in this thread and justify their vote.

[in_cog_ni_to]

47. I really doubt they will come forward.

They're brave as long as they have a computer to hide behind.

[in_cog_ni_to]

44. 12 votes for none of the above?

[DemocratSinceBirth]

48. Here's One

hfojvt (1000+ posts) Thu Aug-03-06 05:09 PM
Response to Original message
29. I would have thought that the Khazar statement was partly true
but I just looked it up.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khazars

I still do not see how that statement is anti-semitic, although Wiki says it has been adopted by many anti-Zionists. Is being anti-Zionist also anti-Semitic?
I would like an explanation from the many who answered "all of the above" as to why #1, #2, and #4 are necessarily anti-Semitic. The US government seems to have an irrational devotion to Israel even more so than Canada or Britain and certainly far more than to Deutschland. Is there some strategic or logical reason for this? What do we gain by this except a market for American armaments? Second, the MSM pretty clearly has long had a pro Israel bias. Why?

Why can't a case be made for Jewish control in these matters that is not anti-semitic or based on anti-semitism? Just because an anti-semite would make the same argument, does not mean the argument is anti-semitic. The key to anti-semitism needs to be hatred, not beliefs in conspiracies or questions or cynicism. To me #4 is based on cynicism, more than anti-semitism. Many problems can be 'solved' in our world by writing big checks.


Have fun ... I'm too tired for a point by point rebuttal though they all play off ancient anti-semitic emotions and all can be emperically disproved.

[cracksquirrel]

45. One question

What in holy hell is a Kazhar? And since when have I been one?

Never mind, was answered above. Yay wikipedia! And did you know that elephant populations have tripled, nay, quadrupled in the last six months? Heard that somewhere, true story.