"Traditional American Values" . . . what are they? . . .

[OneBlueSky]

and shouldn't we basing our party's platform on them? . . .

thinking back to what I learned in school and from my parents, I tried to identify some of the "Traditional American Values" (what Americans believe) that I was actually taught . . . (as opposed to those that today's neocons TELL us are traditional American values) . . .

if I remember my lessons correctly, "Traditional American Values" (or beliefs) include . . .

- The United States is the greatest country on Earth.

- The United States stands as a model of democracy to all other nations.

- The United States doesn't start wars -- it finishes them.

- The United States would never attack another country unprovoked.

- Ultimate power in the United States resides with the American people.

- All Americans are entitled to "liberty and justice for all."

- All Americans should be afforded equal opportunities to succeed.

- Americans respect and care for the planet and the environment.

- Americans respect and care for each other.

- That the United States is comprised of immigrants from all over the world should be a unifying strength, not a dividing weakness.

- That "Government of the People, By the People, and For the People" is the American way -- and "shall not perish from the Earth" . . .

- Truth is essential to a functioning democracy.

there are many more that could be added to the list (feel free) . . . but there are also values that I was NOT taught that neocons are trying to pass off as "Traditional American Values" today . . . among them . . .

- Free market capitalism works best when completely unregulated.

- Being a true American means being a "good Christian."

- Education should focus on the "three R's" -- things like music and art are unaffordable luxuries.

- Poor prople are poor because they don't try hard enough.

- "Success" means earning as much money as possible, by whatever means are available (including illegal means -- as long as you don't get caught).

again, many more could be added (feel free), but you get the idea . . .

my question is -- Shouldn't Democrats be articulating the TRUE traditional American values that everyone remembers learning in school? . . . and be pointing out how BushCo's actions -- and even their legislation -- almost always directly undermine these values? . . .

I still believe that, by and large (70% or more), Americans are a fair-minded and compassionate people . . . they just need someone at the top to articulate that for them and remind them who they really are . . . as Americans . . .

I hope that our 2008 candidate can do that . . . and will do that . . .

[sandnsea]

1. Well, what they say

Is that they stand for the top group - and Democrats...

Want a socialist government
Want to take half your wages to pay for that socialist government
Aren't willing to fight to defend this country
Put saving trees over human lives
Think people should be able to have sex in the streets
Would let murderers out of prison after a therapy session

And probably a bunch more stuff I haven't though of. Until we answer this stuff and re-brand ourselves, we're going to have a hard time in any national election.

[Mythsaje]

2. I'd respond

by saying

They consider anything that doesn't involve reverse Robin Hood tricks to be "socialist."

Why should the people pay through the nose when the corporations that exploit them barely pay anything at all?

Fighting smart isn't a bad thing. Fighting blindly is stupid. The repugs fight blindly and are losing the wars they started.

It would be nice for our grandchildren to be able to enjoy the legacy of the natural world, rather than nothing more than a concrete jungle.

Who wants to watch the ugly naked guy and his girlfriend have sex ANYWHERE? Common decency, folks. What's so hard to understand about that?

We'd like to be able to punish murderers and rapists and like, but without having to house all the non-violent types for years and years because we don't have our priorities straight.

[sandnsea]

5. Those are arguments, not values

Anybody can argue anything, pulling social and economic theories into an national identity based on shared values is something else again.

[Mythsaje]

6. Just refuting the attitudes you illuminated...

The problem is that we're divided...we see the manifestation of American values in a totally different way than they do, and I'm not sure there's any room for a middle ground anymore.

[sandnsea]

7. Those were examples

Just like the OP had examples of what he views the right wing believes. The specifics aren't the biggest problem, it's an overall statement of common ground built on shared values that we have to portray. They say Democrats are weak, and then apply it to a whole bunch of individual policies like the ones I listed. We don't have an answer to "Democrats are weak", we keep trying to answer each individual charge which is like trying to fight a wildfire with a shovel and nothing else. We don't have a broad "manifestation" that even WE agree on, let alone one that might appeal to rural and moderate voters.

[Mythsaje]

8. Well, I guess it's how you look at it.

I agree that we're not quite as facile at bullshit as the Repugs, but we can operate by illustrating negatives. We can easily show that certain things are unAmerican. We might also remember that "Speak softly and carry a big stick" wasn't necessarily a bad philosophy. With this current administration, that seems to have been converted into "yell like a dumbshit and wave a chopstick around."

[sandnsea]

9. rotflmao

"yell like a dumbshit and wave a chopstick around."

Yeah, that would be these fuckolas, no doubt about it.

Sure, we can keep hammering away on specifics and label things like privatization and pre-emptive war and spying as unAmerican. But I still think in order to really shred their chopstick into tiny pieces we need to have a clear Democratic identity that people will be proud to glom onto.

[Rosemary2205]

3. IMHO one of the biggest

though informal value - is the idea of creating something from nothing - the little guy doing something enormous

Las Vegas - rising out of the desert.

Atlanta - rising from the Civil war ashes.

it's parapalegics playing murderball or being a 4 term President.

it's Rosie the Riveter.

It's backwoods, self educated Abe Lincoln becoming, well, Abe Lincoln.

It's ingrained in our culture. We can do anything. Be anything. Become anything. All we have to do is dream it up. From what I understand that is a uniquely American trait.

[radfringe]

4. moral/traditional/family values

is a warm and fuzzy term. I've been writing about this on/off since 2000 campaign...

yeah, there may be some broad words/ideas on which we agree -- but without action behind it - they are just words

the Dems can get out there and throw their own words about values into the crowds just like the repubs do - it's a whole lotta wheel spinning

Since Reagan - the repubs have been beating dems over the head with the 'values' issue.

the dems need to reframe the values issue - it's not about FAMILY values - it's about VALUEING FAMILIES. This puts action to words

how are the dems VALUEING FAMILIES compared to the repubs? what programs have repubs cut/dismantled that actually helped (Valued) families - and what are the ones the dems support?

ennywhoo - the dems need to draw a contrast between blathering about "family values" and actually doing something to VALUE the Families. Warm and Fuzzy rhetoric doesn't put food on the table

[MelliMel]

10. I agree. Value all families.

Gay or straight, all families have a lot of the same concerns and issues. We all worry about our kids, our finances, our family everything. Dems need to pounce on that!

[greekspeak]

11. Depends on what one considers "traditional." Its a mixed bag at best

Is it that slaves are 3/5 of a person, and then only for voting purposes?

Is it that the unpropertied classes really should have no say in running the country?

Or do we go later in time?

Seperate but equal...a good thing!

We are the railroads...we own you!

A hanging tree in every town square?

The whole idea of "traditional" has become warped. It has positive connotations for people who live in dream worlds. Warm kitchens with mom holding a big apple pie on a cold winters' evening. Currier and Ives paintings, or Norman Rockwells depicting "slices of life" as a norm. Such times as those in the picture last anywhere from nano-seconds to an afternoon of play at best. The painters of such scenes painted them because of their NOVELTY. They aren't every day life; its as if life is an apple tree and the painters have merely plucked off the two or three best apples, leaving the treee and the rest of the apples behind.

"Tradiional" is a warm fuzzy, a security blanket that Pukes have knitted and spread over America. Why? Americans who are cozy under that nice blankie don't seem to care about all the evils the knitters of the blankie are perpetrating outside of it. Blankies like "traditional" don't feed starving children, nor keep people safe in disasters. They do not cure cancer, they do not eliminate unwanted pregnancies, they do not bring the rapture.

[Philosoraptor]

12. Invade nations, kill their people, take their stuff, it's a tradition.

And a valuable tradition.