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As a spiritual/religious person, does this offend you?

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PerpetuallyDazed Donating Member (806 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 01:04 PM
Original message
As a spiritual/religious person, does this offend you?
One poster indirectly related my belief in God to "being drunk." The context of the statement was: "<In regards to religious people>, I feel like the only sober person in a room full of drunks."

This bothers me. Maybe it's because I live by the Golden Rule?

Do these snarky atheists not realize that many who consider themselves "religious" hold the same superiority complex towards the "non-religious"? I never thought I'd encounter this on DU of all places! :(
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GliderGuider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 02:11 PM
Response to Original message
1. No, it doesn't offend me.
I once had the religious wife of my best friend tell my how sad and lonely my life must be because I'm an atheist. I found that somewhat offensive, because she had obviously never tried to see my life from my perspective before passing her parochial judgment on it. The poster you mention didn't attack you directly, however.

People with strong beliefs say insensitive things all the time. You can't control their actions, the only thing that is under your control is your own reaction. Maybe you could turn the flashlight of awareness inward, and inquire as to why you reacted as you did? If you discovered why you got offended, you might not react that way the next time someone says something that is a potential trigger for you.
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PerpetuallyDazed Donating Member (806 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-29-08 02:38 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. But do you consider yourself spiritual or religious?
Glider, I'm sorry for your experience but I would never presume to say to your what your wife's friend did to you. I respect the belief systems of everyone and would never assume to know what path (or non-path) is right for someone else. As a result of her comment (which is in all likelihood a projection of herself onto you, and still not an excuse) you were "somewhat offended" just as I was by this other person's analogy.

I just expected a more sophisticated understanding and sensitivity from the atheists on DU. Instead, I continue to find a fervent (and in most cases illogical) disdain for spiritual matters. It's amazingly ironic to find in this place! :shrug:
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GliderGuider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Aug-30-08 08:52 AM
Response to Reply #2
3. I consider myself spiritual, but not religious -- I still call myself an atheist
DU is a community built around progressive politics, and even on that core interest there is surprisingly little consensus and notable lapses in sensitivity and civility. It's not surprising to me that an emotionally loaded peripheral issue like religion would result in similar spreads of attitude. We're all human, after all -- diversity of thought, word and deed is the name of the game. All any of us can do in the face of that is to be present to our own responses.

I can understand your disappointment, but even King Canute couldn't hold back the tide -- you and I will have just as little luck trying to stem the tide of human nature.
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Maat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-16-08 12:32 PM
Response to Original message
4. I would have been offended also.
Edited on Tue Sep-16-08 12:33 PM by Maat
I was the one who suggested this forum (someone helped me come up with the name). It was supposed to be a place in which the spiritual could retreat from atheists insulting them.

GliderGuider has been most respectful, so I am not attacking him.

I'm merely commenting upon the fact that this type of retreat has been needed for a number of years now.

It was supposed to be a place in which we didn't have to deal with people calling us 'drunk,' 'defensive,' or 'too sensitive,' and in which we could kick around any metaphysical or spiritual idea, without having to defend it 'logically.' We could just explore the idea and imagine the possibilities without experiencing negative behavior.

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sam sarrha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-25-08 02:43 PM
Response to Original message
5. well... the 'Euphoria' felt by many Charismatics..evangelicals, etc is a brain chemical much stronge...
Edited on Sat Oct-25-08 02:44 PM by sam sarrha
than alcohol, which explains the severe Denial if one disagrees with them, I WOULDNT CALL THEL DRUNKS.. more related to drug addicts it seems..

http://cat.inist.fr/?aModele=afficheN&cpsidt=18045085
Hyperreligiosity is a major feature of mania, obsessive-compulsive disorder, schizophrenia, temporal-lobe epilepsy and related disorders, in which the ventromedial dopaminergic systems are highly activated and exaggerated attentional or goal-directed behavior toward extrapersonal space occurs. The evolution of religion is linked to an expansion of dopaminergic systems in humans, brought about by changes in diet and other physiological influences.

http://www.digitaljournal.com/article/102107/How_are_th...

http://gentlemansc.blogspot.com/2007/10/mailbag-monday-...
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Tigress DEM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-25-08 12:44 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. "hyperreligiosity" is part of a mental illness and isn't par for the average Christian.
It's like saying someone with a family history of diabetes is shooting insulin daily, without looking at the facts of the situation. Completely factually inaccurate and a hypothesis without any grounding in the real world application.

This is as bad as calling an atheist or non-religious person a "blood rites sacrificing pagan that listens to little voices telling them to find a child born on May 13th and sacrifice them to the tallest tree in Ohio."

TOTALLY RIDICULOUS.

There are religions, especially those that harken back to caveman days that used "sacred" drugs to have hallucinations and whose medicine men or women were probably prone to mania etc.. but people did what they had to to survive before we knew more about the world around us. Consider it a poor man's Creative Whack Pack. AND some of those religions created systems of tolerance that might be quite useful here, without the drugs.

Why can't non-belivers understand that there are also religions that are thoughtful and search through Christian examples to simply live better and we believe that Christ said what He meant when he went to a death on the cross to teach us about forgiveness.

Christians or non-believers are still people making choices. So talk about their choices and don't lump sum everyone into one catagory and don't shit on my God - even if you believe He's an imaginary friend. I'm sure if I knew you well enough, I could find a couple of screws loose on you that could be tightened as well, but that isn't my job or my priority here on DU.

I won't beat you to death expounding on my religion, because that is also not the focus of DU, but factual analysis is fair game. This post reads like a FAUX News item. PLEASE. It's beneath someone who purports to have a rational mind.

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Tigress DEM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-25-08 12:25 PM
Response to Original message
6. Not as much as when they call God "my imaginary friend".
I've been to a wide range of different religious services and some of the "dancing in the spirit" that looks more like having a seizure made me feel a bit uncomfortable and I'm pretty "out there" in faith myself.

Also, in context of this board, I think we have to look at the group probably being referred to as those right wing religious who are drinking the *ush koolaid and only spouting talking points. As members of the "reality based community," WE probably feel the same way the atheists do, but WE don't assign the insanity to their religious background, but more to their political bent.

THEN when an atheist makes a remark about them WE close ranks a little to defend their beliefs and get a hurt and confused reaction from someone who thought WE were on their side.

IF people would refrain from broad statements in general and stick to specifics, this board would be a lot easier for all of us to handle.

You really can't say, "all women think xyz" or "all religious believe xyz" or "all non-religious think xyz" because there really are too many differences. Look at Ireland, divided still and both sides are religious, but the state at the time got involved and shoved religion down everyone's throat - enough of a reason to object to it by many person's reckoning. How much more differences between people whose very spiritual structure is inherently at odds?

BUT to be here we do believe in Democracy and Tolerance so we will muddle through and get there eventually. I have faith. :)
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