Election fraud from 2004 again

[TayTay]

So, who made the decision to concede:

http://www.votersunite.org/article.asp?id=4548M

COUNTING EVERY VOTE
Boston Globe, THIRD, Sec. Op-Ed, p A11 01-06-2005
By BY CAMERON F. KERRY

SO NOW THE VOTES IN OHIO HAVE BEEN RECOUNTED, AND IT'S TIME FOR CONGRESS TO TALLY THE ELECTORAL COLLEGE. BUT WHILE THE ELECTION IS OVER, A FIGHT GOES ON TO PROTECT EVERYONE'S RIGHT TO VOTE AND MAKE SURE EVERY VOTE IS COUNTED.
I wish it weren't so, but the final facts look like the picture on the morning of Nov. 3 when my brother, John Kerry, ended his campaign for president. As campaign leaders sat in a Boston war room overlooking a dwindling Election Night rally in the plaza below, on the phone was a team of smart, tough veterans who know how to count votes and how votes get counted. All were veterans of Florida in 2000 who would have jumped at a rematch with Karl Rove and James Baker III.

In the room was Deval Patrick, former assistant attorney general for civil rights. In Washington was Michael Whouley, the never-say-die loyalist who stopped Al Gore from conceding; Jack Corrigan, who helped fight Bush v. Gore in the courts and the precincts; and Robert Bauer and Marc Elias, leading election lawyers and Kerry campaign counsel.

On the phone from Ohio was the chief of the legal team there, David Sullivan, longtime election counsel for the Massachusetts secretary of state, who himself was a plaintiff more than 30 years ago in a lawsuit to register college students and - with me - a defendant in unsuccessful lawsuit brought against us for properly challenging vote fraud.

They were backed by 3,300 lawyers on Ohio's election protection team, part of more than 17,000 Kerry-Edwards lawyers nationwide. They were joined by 8,000 lawyers with the nonpartisan Election Protection Coalition of the NAACP, the Lawyers Committee for Civil Rights, People for the American Way, and other organizations and thousands more lay volunteers and observers.

There are all these shadowy conspiracy theories as to why Kerry conceded and who was in the room. This is the most complete article I have as to who was there at that time. That is an impressive list of talent and quite a few were veterans of the 2000 debacle in Florida. One is a current candidate for Gov of Mass and has had a distinguished record that includes working for Clinton's Civil Rights division.

It really pisses me off when people argue without any facts at all. These are the people who decided that Kerry should concede. (And notice a prominent name that is NOT on the list.)

[whometense]

1. Wow.

Deval was there? Whouley? That is an impressive list.

[karynnj]

2. That was my reaction too - I wouldn't have known either

name in 2005 when this was written. This was a great team. Sad that it came down to them cheating "legally".

[TayTay]

3. I am so tired of the 'he conceded too early' meme.

Let them tell Deval Patrick that, to his face. Let them tell Jack Corrigan and Michael Whooley that, espeically when they were part of the team that advised Gore not to concede in '00.

So tired of it. That was an all-star line-up in there that night. They knew what they were doing.

[sandnsea]

4. Link is broken Tay

Yes that is most surely an impressive list.

Ya' know, as much as I hate to give any credence to bad campaign bla bla, if we/they can't even get the correct info out about the concession - well cripes. I don't think this is just a Kerry campaign problem, it's all Democrats. Why can people like Hackett push an image, even if it doesn't necessarily match the reality of what they believe on issues - and Democrats can't push the truth. Real problem when our own grassroots don't know, don't believe, what party leaders have to say.

[TayTay]

5. Try this one

My work machine is slowly breaking down.

http://www.boston.com/news/politics/president/articles/2005/01/06/counting_every_vote?mode=PF

[karynnj]

7. The truth is often more complicated

Hackett didn't try to push a complicated message - just Bush is a chicken hawk.

In this case, the message was and is clear and out there:
- Kerry conceded.
- Ohio was close
- There were irregularities, but no proof that Kerry won the the votes cast. You can't claim those not cast for various reasons - which is what RFK jr claims to say Kerry would have won a fair race. (Kerry needed to make a case in a court. The descrepancy was far too great for a recount to change. RFKjr's analysis is not bound by the same constrainsts. His is a study to show that the known ways of voter supression likely cost Kerry Ohio and the Presidency. He can and does count estimated votes not cast.
- The fact that irregularities existed on the scale they did and that it is technically possible to hack the machines means major reforms are needed.

The third point is the only one people here have problems with. I agree that it seems unfair that there is no remedy if we show that targeted irregularities that throw the margin of victory in jeopardy. In a way, 2004 was worse because in Ohio, it was a Republican who determined the number of machines in each location - this was wrong - it is provable - but because no one ever thought to make a law saying you can't do that, he isn't even in legal jeopardy and his party was rewarded by the the Presidency because of him cheating.

[ginnyinWI]

8. what gets me is that they (the bushies) were able to discredit exit polls

All over the world, exit polls are relied upon to verify election results. Even here. But suddenly it's "oops, the exit polls didn't work right!" Huh?

Saw Steven Freeman on Book tv last night--he said rather than Bush winning by 3 million votes, Kerry should have won by 6 million. That's a pretty big shift! But the RW noise machine was able to poke holes in the validity of those polls and the networks and everybody quickly "corrected" them to match the "official" results. Since when is it okay to do this??

Even TODAY, Al Franken referred to exit polling and then said, "but we know now not to rely on them..."

Freeman said that Kerry should have won Florida, Ohio, New Mexico, and Nevada!

[blm]

13. I absolutely would include Nevada, too. And add NC.

.

[sandnsea]

9. Who managed the PR?

Cam Kerry says they knew:

how many provisional, overseas, and absentee ballots were left to count.

there were up to 94,000 "undervotes" or "spoiled ballots," punch card ballots rejected by machines (a far lower percentage than in Florida in 2000 due to education about punching carefully).

The distribution of these uncounted votes across Ohio

they would not be enough to dent the margin.

I know they've said this repeatedly, but perhaps a press conference with all those heavy hitters just days after the election would have been helpful. Maybe they didn't expect the backlash from conceding. But it would seem like after all this time if they fully understood how bad this election was conducted, whether conspired illegalities or just conspired routine vote suppression, that they would be launching some sort of campaign to really make it clear what they did in those days and weeks after to learn more and hold people accountable.

[karynnj]

11. I think the problem is that

for people on liberal web sites, the problems are well known and probably a majority believe Kerry won and a significant proportion of those are convinced it is provable. In the non-liberal blog world, it splits between those who accurately know it was close and many who think that Bush won easily. (Remember that within a week of the election cable tv was speaking of a big victory.)

[TayTay]

12. I have the funny feeling that this is going somewhere

But I'm not sure where. These 'heavy hitters' all moved on to something else. Jack Corrigan was adamant in March when I saw him that there wasn't enough of a margin for Ohio to swing to Kerry in the provisionals and that's why they conceded. They have never budged from that position.

The other stuff took time to come out. (I never believed the election would be overthrown. This kind of thing takes years to prove. It just does, especially with an entrenched power structure like that of Ohio.) The best we can hope for is a win for Strickland in Ohio this fall that is far above the margin at which it can be stolen. (So far, it looks good.)

I still think the Dems will launch a massive law suit, but I don't think it will come until late in the year, after the midterms. (It makes sense to do it this way, sort of. I wonder just how many poll watchers they will put in place this fall and what those folks will be told to watch for that would stand up in a court of law.)

[Blaukraut]

6. thanks, Tay. That's a pretty impressive list

I'm glad you posted this article.

[ProSense]

10. Great find! Thanks Tay!

There aren't appropriate words to describe the people who just make stuff up!