We're pretty tough, you know that

[LittleClarkie]

All the abuse we've taken. And we're still here.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=1744257&mesg_id=1744674

If you can't take the heat, stay outta the kitchen, I say.

[JI7]

1. i have no idea what that's about

what site is the person referring to ?

[JohnKleeb]

3. This one, btw that poll was flame bait but this site isnt anti clark at al

all*.

[LittleClarkie]

4. No it isn't

His post calling someone an asshole got deleted, so now he wants his money back from this anti-Clark site we call DU.

[JI7]

8. i think Kleeb was referring to the poll in the original post, not the

reply where that person called someone an asshole.

but i agree, the poll is flame bait.

[JI7]

7. wow, it totally went over my head

i didn't even realize it was about Clark.

i thought it was meant to try to get an understanding of the type of people who voted for those Republicans and why they vote for them.

but now that you mention it, i agree it is flame bait if it was meant about Clark.

interestingly that person is someone who likes Dean and Kerry equally but doesn't like Clark. you don't see much of that around here.

[JohnKleeb]

9. I dont really feel anything for Clark but that poll was flame bait

It makes us look like assholes, and I admit, I have concerns about Clark's past votes for those guys but thast not my primary concern with him, my concern is how he would do with no experience in a government office.

[JI7]

11. i agree , if someone had a serious problem with it

they would have put it another way.

maybe said something like "i like what clark has to say about things right now, but i just can't get past the fact he voted for republicans before. can those who support him tell me how you are able to do it and how or why i shouldn't let those votes affect my view of him now" .

but the way that was put was just flamebait.

[karynnj]

16. I agree, but it is a fair subject to question Clark on

He has never held elected office so he's never had to be on record. It's lots easier saying what you would have done after the fact (esp when asked about IWR in 2004 when everyone else had to vote in OCT 2002) With the votes for Nixon,Reagan,the Bushes and Ford, I can't just take his positions at face value as I can say Kerry's. Kerry's positions made sense given his past and he seems to have basically been who he says he is. I find it hard to believe that someone could vote as Clark did and to suddenly claim he is not only a Democrat, but a liberal Democrat. What bothers me about the voting record is that he was in VN when he voted for Nixon and probably was aware of the Iran/Contra issues when he voted for Reagan, then Bush. He may be a very smart guy, who would make a good Secretary of Defense, but from this record I really don't see him as the Democratic Presidential candidate. (I almost get the feeling he wanted to run, Bush was the Republican choice, so he decided he was a Democrat.)

[politicasista]

21. Shhh! Don't tell the Clark people that

They like to eat the rest of us alive.

[karynnj]

33. You are right about that

I posted something much weaker on the thread because I know they don't want to hear or think about this. I do think that Clark needs to get his story out and one thing it must include is some logic that explains how he evolved from a life long Republican, career military person to a liberal Democrat. Moderate Republicans becoming conservative Democrats can be explained as simply a shift to the right of both parties - but Clark's shift (as perceived by the DUers) is greater. It's important to push this, because the next few years give Clark the chance to explain this change - if he doesn't and becomes the candidate, I think it could hurt us, because some people will question who he really is.

The fact that he lavishly praised GWB in the pre-911, 2001 period makes this harder to explain, because it was after Bush's tax cuts and as Bush broke with several international agreements. So, this shift to the left is of very recent vintage. Hence my suspicion that he may not be highly ideological, but ambitious and there was more of an opening on the Democratic side in 2004. My concern here is that with other candidates, you can look at their vision vs their past and see if it is out of line and if it is be very suspicious. In his case, their is no track record other than these votes which are very out of whack for a Democrat, much less a liberal Democrat.

Think of Bill Clinton's campaign video of his life - his background is explained as leading him to become the person he is and it was successful because it held together. Kerry's views today are consistent with those he expressed as a young man, influenced by his time as a prosecutor and government official. Al Gore's views became more liberal over his career, but this happened gradually and seem believable. Even GWB's STORY holds together (even though it steals the theme of the prodigal son story).

Even if Kerry doesn't run, I personally would not support Clark in the primaries, even though I think he was one of the best surrogates in 2004, a good speaker and a very likable person, unless there is some kind of biography that explains the shift. I would definitely support him over any mentioned Republican in the general election - and promise to whine less than the far left did last year when they were faced with the most liberal candidate since McGovern.

[LittleClarkie]

14. Even as a former Clark supporter I've tried to bring that up

but they insist he got political experience as General, dealing with political types. I'm not convinced.

But I don't like it when someone goes gunning for a fellow Dem in such a way, and even less so when it's one of our own Kerrycrats.

For shame (finger shake).

[JohnKleeb]

15. Its not the same

He really should take advantage of the opening we got in his state of Arkansas and prove himself, thats not to diss him but I want to see him prove himself as a politican, maybe I am just skeptical but I like experience. But yes it was flame bait and youre right.

[LittleClarkie]

17. He didn't have much time on the campaign trail

I think it helped him to campaign for Kerry. Gave him good experience. And now he's all but announced, which may not turn out to have been smart either. But now he'll have all the time in the world. If he can't prove himself in THIS election, he never will.

[JohnKleeb]

18. too early to even informally announce

I dont hate or love the man but I want to see him do well so I thought his best course of action would be to run for governor of arkansas.

[karynnj]

34. Agree, plus it will put him on record in a very real way

[Pirate Smile]

24. I think they would find things from his long military career and tie them

around this neck.

He has a much longer military history and I think the Republicans would play just as nasty (or worse) with him as they did with the SwiftLiars.

[LittleClarkie]

27. They started to, but he dropped out before they really got rolling

They made it sound like Clark got kicked out of NATO for some reason. They had some person or other testifying to that.

Not matter who we put up, they were toast. And it would have been the same disorganized party trying to support whoever it was. So I don't think the ending would have been much different. I really don't.

[Pirate Smile]

28. I think Frist is going to get Rove in 2008. First, he will get to smear

Hagel and McCain in the Primaries, then on to the Democratic nominee.

I figured it would be George Allen or Frist who would get KKKarl but it is looking like Frist.

[LittleClarkie]

12. I asked outright what it was about

because I was almost certain it was about Clark. OP was good enough to confirm that suspicion, so I proceeded to address just Clark's voting record. But yeah, it was meant as an anti-Clark poll. But geez, we don't get alot of that. Those who say things against Clark are few and far between and very repetative.

[TayTay]

2. You are great, you know that!

LittleClarkie wrote on the other thread in response to a Clark supporter who was complaining of DU treatment of Clark:

Meanwhile, it appears the good General is tougher than his supporters.

Kerry supporters eat this shit for lunch and then ask for more. "Please sir, may I have another?" Twack!

Wow! You rule!:applause:

[LittleClarkie]

5. Thanks

:blush:

[TayTay]

13. This was so funny:

Kerry's wife voted for Republicans too.....

Based on that fact....Should she be sleeping with Kerry now?


Couldn't help myself. Replied:


Loaded question

I know several people who would take her place!


:evilgrin: :evilgrin:

[karynnj]

35. Saw that - you and little Clarkie were good on this

It's weird that they would equate Teresa being a moderate to liberal Republican to Clark himself being a Republican. Teresa was married to a Republican, but she seemed pretty liberal. Also, until he met them weren't both his wives' families Republican - though they all seemed to be Democrats now. Doesn't he deserve credit for this. :)

[sandnsea]

19. You didn't say that, omg

lolololol

:yourock:

[New Earth]

6. random pic!

that i made on Kerry's birthday (one day before mine)




:bounce: :)

[JI7]

10. that's really nice, i bet he would love it if sees it

[politicasista]

20. Save cesta.

:hi:

[LittleClarkie]

23. I fear for cesta

He's not being a good boy at the moment.

[Name removed]

25. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[LittleClarkie]

26. I didn't before but I sure do today

I've spent half the evening defending Clark because of him. Gained some Clarkie friends from the deal though, one of whom said she's defend Kerry in the name of unity the next chance she got.

[JI7]

29. i think it's the whole continuity of it

it's like, ok, we know you don't like this person. and you don't have to like them or support them in the primary.

but how many fucking times do we need to hear the same negative crap.


btw, i can't figure out why YOUR post in that thread was banned.

[LittleClarkie]

30. Actually the one I linked wasn't me

and mine is still there regarding DU being pro-Clark and that Clark is tougher than his supporters.

[JI7]

31. no, i'm talking about another one in another thread

the one where you defended Clark and called for that person to stop with the bashing.

[LittleClarkie]

32. Oh I see it now

Dang, I liked that one too.

I think it had to do with speculating that he was about to be banned. They don't like that sort of calling out. But I got 4 good responses from Clarkies who aren't likely to forget the favor, so that's good, anyway.

I probably should have PMed instead.

[GRLMGC]

22. That was flamebait

I don't want to hear about how certain supporters are victims and that kinda gives them ammo. I love how they had to bring Kerry into it. Bastards.