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The Searl Effect Generator. Is this thing just an elaborate scam?

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EnviroBat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-18-08 09:11 AM
Original message
The Searl Effect Generator. Is this thing just an elaborate scam?
I've been researching this thing for the past few days. Just Google "Searl Effect Generator", and you'll find lots of information. But your not likely to find anything conclusive or promising.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Searl_Effect_Generator

It's somewhat disheartening to me, because in theory, this thing could solve many of the worlds energy problems. Not to mention the anti-gravity levitation part, (still conjecture). I hate the think that John Searl is just a charlatan who is out to dupe investors out of money. the only working prototype of this thing only has one ring, although it is claimed that they are still working on a complete version somewhere in Asia. Anyone else have any insight in to this?
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Tandalayo_Scheisskopf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-18-08 09:27 AM
Response to Original message
1. There is also a group in Russia...
That says Searl is a fraud and that they have a working version. Lots of chaff in the air on this one. Times like these are when you see fraud.
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Occulus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-18-08 09:55 AM
Response to Reply #1
3. The Wiki on this thing meantions that it is a
"perpetual motion machine of the second kind"

I think that's about all we need to hear, full stop.
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edgetech Donating Member (4 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-02-08 10:00 PM
Response to Reply #3
8. Searl Effect Generator
I have read the topic extensively, the SEG is actually described as conversion of natural energy sources such as temperature which makes sense because at the atomic scale is energy in a random state. Why not take advantage of all this free energy as we do with wind and hydroelectric energy that nature has to offer without pollution?
I think the problem with Wikipedia is that is can only see matter from conventional viewpoint and just slaps labels such perpetual regardless of the info that says clearly otherwise. A good place to know more about I have found is the searlsolution.com and the good news is that they are posting updates and working to build a prototype, so at least this matter is being investigated and not just ignored.
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Random_Australian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-04-08 02:47 AM
Response to Reply #8
15. Correction: You said "free energy"
however, "free energy" is the name given to the energy which one can possibly extract from a system, which is to say, it's total internal energy minus the stuff that is locked up in atoms in a way that it is impossible to get back.

Not the stuff you can't get back.

Also: "A good place to know more about I have found is the searlsolution.com" No, anything place where you can write whatever the hell you feel like is not a sound information source.
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Realityhack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-08-08 12:07 AM
Response to Reply #8
22. LOL apparently it is also an anti-gravity device (according to your link). I call BS n/t
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edgetech Donating Member (4 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-02-08 09:44 PM
Response to Reply #1
7. Searl Effect Generator
There is actually is a Russian group funded by an american
group of investors now building their version of the SEG; as
they say money talks B.S walks. They must know something the
skeptics dont know which is not a hard matter to understand
since everyone is free make their opinions.  Is it not
strange to hear someone saying they have a working model of
the SEG and Searl is supposed to be a fraud... it does not
make sense, unless they are trying to grab the technology for
themselves.   
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Random_Australian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-04-08 02:49 AM
Response to Reply #7
16. "there must be something the skeptics don't know"
is a fallacy made of equal parts "common" and "stupid"

Seriously, we are trying to work out whether or not it is a con. Do you think "making it look like there really is something there, despite what skeptics say" is against the notion that it is a con?
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gordianot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-18-08 09:35 AM
Response to Original message
2. There have been many claims of similar devices to the days of Tesla.
This device would create some powerful enemies. It would shake world economies and Governments to their core.
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enki23 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-18-08 10:07 AM
Response to Original message
4. whether you hate to think of him as a charlatan or not, he's a charlatan
Edited on Fri Jul-18-08 10:11 AM by enki23
a bleedingly obvious charlatan, at that.
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EnviroBat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-18-08 11:20 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. Ahh well. Another of my dreams shattered in the name of fake science.
bummer...
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edgetech Donating Member (4 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-02-08 10:08 PM
Response to Reply #5
9. Searl Effect Generator
Edited on Tue Sep-02-08 10:32 PM by edgetech
Cheer up EniroBat; these guys really dont know what they are talking about. Have you noticed they only make negative blank statements and avoid the technical merits of the SEG concept? Why you ask? Simple, it is a much easier way out for them and saves their ego from the burden of having to understanding it; in other word there education has failed them on this one because it is too far ahead of its time. The truth is it can be explained as I have found out, it requires a bit of science and physics a step ahead of the text books.
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caraher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-03-08 11:36 PM
Response to Reply #9
14. Ego?
There are good reasons there's a powerful burden of proof on the shoulders of someone claiming huge "breakthroughs" at odds with the picture painstakingly built over decades by thousands of very smart people. Few of them have anything whatsoever to do with egos. My day has 24 hours in it, and I only get to use maybe 18 of them while awake. And some of those I fritter away showering, eating, etc.

Every scientist is a human being and faces, as does every person, choices about how to spend time. If the claims of everyone who asserts the "scientific establishment" has something "all wrong" were examined as exhaustively as the True Believers (TM) would demand, normal science would screech to a halt. That's not ego. That's doing what everyone does, making an informed choice about how to spend a limited lifespan.

When someone comes along and points out that some "free energy" device violates the laws of thermodynamics and therefore is very unlikely to pan out, they're not trying to quash the miracle breakthrough the world needs. Instead, they are explaining that they've applied a filter that has never been wrong historically to sort out which things are possible and which are not. Once I, and most others who know what it means, are satisfied that a claim is inconsistent with the laws of thermodynamics (for instance), we have made the assessment that betting our time and effort on deeper investigation is probably a losing proposition. And for similar reasons we'd recommend against betting money on it, too.

Could we be wrong? Of course. But the odds are long. Very long. Meanwhile, if the True Believers want to press on in their own labs, by all means, go ahead. But spare us all the "Lone Genius rejected by a clique of blind egotistical scientists" posturing. Someday, when you've saved the world and become fabulously rich, you'll have that last laugh at the expense of the thousands of fools who wasted all those years earning worthless degrees, and that should be more than adequate recompense for the frustration you might feel today.

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FiveGoodMen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-04-08 02:17 PM
Response to Reply #14
21. That was very well stated!
Wish I could recommend your post to the front page.

:applause:
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Random_Australian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-04-08 02:56 AM
Response to Reply #9
17. Right. You posess special knowledge of advanced science that no-one else does.
I'll believe that just about as soon as I believe the EM force is hard to understand with a little linear algebra, and I'll believe this Searl stuff at about the same time.

Go ahead. Show me a shred of evidence for your super-duper science and physics "a step ahead of the textbooks"
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caraher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jul-18-08 11:47 AM
Response to Original message
6. Rule of thumb:
If you find yourself asking, "Is this thing just an elaborate scam?" chances are the answer is "yes."
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edgetech Donating Member (4 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-02-08 10:15 PM
Response to Reply #6
10. Searl Effect Generator
Edited on Tue Sep-02-08 10:20 PM by edgetech
Here is a better rule of thumb: where there is smoke there is fire, so you see it cant be all about nothing, not when there is so much information released about it these days and interest is growing critical. At least no one has proven it cannot be done, so I say lets find out for crying out loud, we need solutions like this now! Why wait till the World is almost environmentally death for the lack of such technologies.
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Orsino Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-03-08 10:13 AM
Response to Reply #10
13. An even better rule of thumb:
A half-century with nothing to show for it, and a complete lack of supporting science, mean this is just another free-energy scam.

There's no theory to justify all the alleged experimentation. There's no there there to "find out" about.
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Random_Australian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-04-08 02:59 AM
Response to Reply #10
18. Another rule of thumb: Where it is profitable for conmen to make smoke,
you'll find smoke and conmen.

"At least no one has proven it cannot be done, so I say lets find out for crying out loud"

.... you mean lets give lots of money we are currently using on real solutions to various problems to people who provide no evidence that any of their crap works? Sounds great to me.

as for "interest is growing critical" ..... naw, too easy. Like shooting fish in a barrel.
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The Night Owl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-02-08 10:38 PM
Response to Original message
11. Crackpottery {EOM}
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edhopper Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-03-08 08:48 AM
Response to Original message
12. Well,
he only seems to violate two of Newton's three Laws. :-)
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Random_Australian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-04-08 03:00 AM
Response to Original message
19. "Scam" says thermodynamics. "Scam" says an understanding of how energy is stored
and moved in electric and magnetic fields. "Scam" says the whole 'no evidence at all' thing.
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Canuckistanian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-04-08 10:41 AM
Response to Original message
20. Working prototype first. Selling shares in the company second.
Any violation of the above order means FRAUD.
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rayofreason Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-08-08 09:26 PM
Response to Original message
23. It is a scam...
...bullshit, hoax, and all such related things.

The funny thing is the troll (edgetech) who keeps on posting positive, "open-minded" views of this nonsense. The sad thing is that some fools will fall for this, and a fool and his money are soon parted.

Hey edgetech - you wouldn't also happen to be a Bank President in Nigeria sitting on an unclaimed account with $20 million that only needs a few "transfer fees" to move it into an American bank account, would you?

After all, the "Searl effect Generator" is just a pseudoscience version of the Nigerian advance fee scam, which nets many people each year.


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